Sony refuses to increase Vision Pro screen production capacity for Apple

Posted:
in Apple Vision Pro

Even as analysts predict limited supplies of the Apple Vision Pro at launch, Apple has apparently asked Sony to make more of the headset's eye screens -- and Sony has said no.




It had been expected that a small number of Apple Vision Pro headsets might be on sale for the holidays, until Tim Cook quashed that by saying they'll go on sale early in 2024. Whenever the headset is available to buy, though, it's believed that Apple will start by making a limited number of under 100,000 devices in its first year.

Apple is already looking to the future though, and not only with the rumors of a lower-cost second edition of the headset. According to The Elec, Apple has asked Sony to be ready to make more.

The Elec does not specify where this news originates, nor does it report why Sony is believed to have refused. However, it does say that Sony already has the capacity to make 900,000 of the OLEDos (OLED On Silicon) screens used in the Vision Pro, the screens that users watch.

Contradicting its own figures, however, The Elec also states that Sony is only able to supply Apple with between 100,000 and 200,000 per quarter. That would mean a total of 800,000 panels.

Presuming that the count is of one panel per eye in the headset, this means The Elec's sources conclude Apple can only make a maximum of around 400,000 Vision Pro headsets in 2023.

This does also presume that only Sony can manufacture them. The Elec repeats previous reports that Sony is the sole supplier at present, and also claims without substantiation, that it is unlikely Apple will take on more.

That may of course change, and perhaps it will in time for the second generation model.

Read on AppleInsider

Comments

  • Reply 1 of 12
    radarthekatradarthekat Posts: 3,891moderator
    Maybe there’s an unacceptable defect rate that Sony needs to rectify first.  That would be reason to decline to ramp production.  
    coolfactorwatto_cobrabyronlAlex1N
  • Reply 2 of 12
    danoxdanox Posts: 3,213member
    They are pulling an Intel maneuver remember them? If this is true then Apple may need to make long range plans, seems like the perfect excuse to bring it on home. In the short term hopefully Apple and Sony can work it out, but……… Apple may need to go more vertical at home in the USA, buyback money maybe needs to be reallocated.
    edited June 2023 watto_cobraspock1234
  • Reply 3 of 12
    chutzpahchutzpah Posts: 392member

    Contradicting its own figures, however, The Elec also states that Sony is only able to supply Apple with between 100,000 and 200,000 per quarter. That would mean a total of 800,000 panels.

    What do you mean "a total"?  Per year presumably?  In which case, no it doesn't mean that, it means between 400,000 and 800,000 a year.  Up to.  Not "a total".
    watto_cobrafred1byronlAlex1N
  • Reply 4 of 12
    coolfactorcoolfactor Posts: 2,314member

    Next Up — Apple manufacturing its own parts. That would dramatically simplify logistics, lower costs, and allow them to prioritize on their own schedule.
    watto_cobraAlex1N
  • Reply 5 of 12
    coolfactorcoolfactor Posts: 2,314member

    Maybe there’s an unacceptable defect rate that Sony needs to rectify first.  That would be reason to decline to ramp production.  

     Yes, wasn't it already reported that the success rate is only like 20% or something? 80% of screens were defective? That definitely needs to improve, as it likely generates a LOT of e-waste.
    watto_cobraFileMakerFellerbyronlAlex1N
  • Reply 6 of 12
    Seems like "..is unable to..." rather than "refuses to..." might be more accurate.
    lolliverwatto_cobrafred1byronlAlex1N
  • Reply 7 of 12
    XedXed Posts: 2,777member
    Maybe there’s an unacceptable defect rate that Sony needs to rectify first.  That would be reason to decline to ramp production.  
    This rumor could be completely false, but it has an air of truth for me. There are probably a lot of defects at this point, and just because Sony thinks they can produce 900k units they think are acceptable, Apple's quality control may not deem them as good enough for their product, which could be how a source might get 400k to 800k units for Apple, which is 200k to 400k Vision Pro headsets.

    Additionally, no company should commit to contracts they can't be sure they can follow through with—especially when Apple is drawing up the contracts. I have some detailed knowledge of what it would be like to miss contractual obligations with Apple, and since Sony is the source for these panels they aren't really going to hurt themselves  by erring on the side of caution.
    byronlAlex1N
  • Reply 8 of 12
    humbug1873humbug1873 Posts: 154member
    The interesting question would be: Who owns the Patents needed to produce these panels? Can only Sony produce these things (due to legal reasons) or do they have a choice (and I doubt Apple would be that stupid).
    The usual way (invented by Tim Cook) Apple works in these circumstances, just to drop a few billion dollars to pay for the manufacturing plants being built, and then get precedence on the manufactured items at a reduced price as a payoff for the loan. Worked wonders multiple times and makes perfect sense for a company that acutally has a war chest worth talking about. (Most companies are stripped of all cash reserves and have to run into debt to make such an offer. Which would make it financially too expensive)
    kurai_kagebyronlAlex1N
  • Reply 9 of 12
    williamhwilliamh Posts: 1,041member
    I am surprised that availability is already considered a problem for a $3,500 device that won't be available for many months and is widely considered too expensive for mass adoption.

    My own assumptions:  It's awesome and too expensive for me.  Just like the Apple Watch, iPhone, etc. and I caved on all of them.  I think it will be easier to hold out on this one but eventually (when the price comes down) I will love it.
    kurai_kagebyronlAlex1N
  • Reply 10 of 12
    danoxdanox Posts: 3,213member
    The interesting question would be: Who owns the Patents needed to produce these panels? Can only Sony produce these things (due to legal reasons) or do they have a choice (and I doubt Apple would be that stupid).
    The usual way (invented by Tim Cook) Apple works in these circumstances, just to drop a few billion dollars to pay for the manufacturing plants being built, and then get precedence on the manufactured items at a reduced price as a payoff for the loan. Worked wonders multiple times and makes perfect sense for a company that acutally has a war chest worth talking about. (Most companies are stripped of all cash reserves and have to run into debt to make such an offer. Which would make it financially too expensive)
    Appleinsider had an article published a few years ago. I don’t think Apple gives them money and lets them do entirely what they want. I think Apple has prototypes-mockups designed at home long beforehand? And if it was true that they get to do their own thing, LG and Samsung would be using Apple’s internal monitor designs in their products.

    This comes up from time to time but every time Apple wants to make an Apple monitor. Apple always wants something more than what LG and Samsung are making for their monitors, usually a lot more. Apple must have something similar set up for monitor displays. They always seem to know what they’re doing at a design and engineering level.

    https://appleinsider.com/articles/16/04/29/exclusive-apples-top-secret-athena-chip-fab-gets-new-delicate-equipment


    edited June 2023 byronlAlex1N
  • Reply 11 of 12
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,517member
    danox said:
    They are pulling an Intel maneuver remember them? If this is true then Apple may need to make long range plans, seems like the perfect excuse to bring it on home. In the short term hopefully Apple and Sony can work it out, but……… Apple may need to go more vertical at home in the USA, buyback money maybe needs to be reallocated.
    I don't know that Apple could take over the production of their own headset displays even if they wanted to. I had assumed it was an Apple invention that they contracted Sony to produce, but it is not. Apple is using a Sony-engineered and developed display tech, which is no doubt heavily protected with patents. 

    Sony actually revealed the product over a year ago. We just didn't know Apple was buying it for their Vision Pro




    edited June 2023 muthuk_vanalingamroundaboutnowbyronlAlex1N
  • Reply 12 of 12
    byronlbyronl Posts: 371member
    gatorguy said:
    danox said:
    They are pulling an Intel maneuver remember them? If this is true then Apple may need to make long range plans, seems like the perfect excuse to bring it on home. In the short term hopefully Apple and Sony can work it out, but……… Apple may need to go more vertical at home in the USA, buyback money maybe needs to be reallocated.
    I don't know that Apple could take over the production of their own headset displays even if they wanted to. I had assumed it was an Apple invention that they contracted Sony to produce, but it is not. Apple is using a Sony-engineered and developed display tech, which is no doubt heavily protected with patents. 

    Sony actually revealed the product over a year ago. We just didn't know Apple was buying it for their Vision Pro




    Interesting! i would assume they have some exclusivity contract since Apple is the only one to use the technology? 
    Alex1N
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