Kuo reiterates 120 mm tetraprism camera coming to iPhone 16 Pro

AppleInsider

A supply chain report says the smaller iPhone 16 Pro will have Apple's tetraprism 120 mm camera, driving demand for the technology in 2024.

iPhone 15 Pro Max

The iPhone 15 Pro Max may have only released in September, but there are already plenty of rumors about the iPhone 16 Pro inheriting its tetraprism camera. The 120 mm focal length is currently exclusive to Apple's biggest pro model, but that is expected to change in 2024.

Suppy chain analyst Ming-Chi Kuo shared a short report about tetraprism supplier Largan and Apple's orders for 2024. Apple is expected to include the new camera in its smaller pro models in 2024, which would lead to a 160% year-over-year growth in iPhones with the technology.

Kuo's earlier report suggested iPhones using tetraprism would increase by only 110%, but that was due to lower yield rates from Largan. Apple has worked with Largan to increase the yield from 40% in 3Q23 to 70% or more in 4Q23.

That change has made the component more profitable to assemble. Largan also supplies periscope lenses to Huawei, which will also increase its use of the component in 2024.

Kuo's report is sourced from supply chain orders. His history of accuracy and supply chain reporting make this report more likely.

Apple will reveal the iPhone 16 Pro in September 2024. Rumors suggest it will have larger displays, new camera systems, and Wi-Fi 7.

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Ofer

Any chance of the periscope lens technology being evolved within the next couple of years to enable an adjustment of the distance between the lens elements so that you have a true variable zoom lens in an iPhone?

timmillea

Ofer said:

Any chance of the periscope lens technology being evolved within the next couple of years to enable an adjustment of the distance between the lens elements so that you have a true variable zoom lens in an iPhone?

No. The whole point of using a 48MP sensor is to enable flexible use between resolution, dynamic range and digital zoom between the different fixed optical focal lengths. The mechanics of an optical zoom would be complex, take up more space, delicate and liable to be a major source of warranty claims. 

A photographer would tell you to not to be so lazy and move position instead. 

mrstep

timmillea said:

A photographer would tell you to not to be so lazy and move position instead. 

Which isn’t always an option both in terms of where you may be able to walk and for timing and also gives different perspective in photos - so while I’ve also seen “photographers” who say to use your feet, it’s not entirely equivalent.

Having seen those sawtooth charts of resolution vs zoom between the 0.5x, 1x and 5x, if you really want the quality and a variable zoom, you still may be looking at a real camera since that’s not Apple’s approach to the zoom.  (And a DSLR/mirrorless is better for a number of reasons  - real depth of field. low light performance, swappable lenses with better optics, ergonomics… Just not convenience.)

beowulfschmidt

I've taken some really, really, good pictures with my phone.  And for spontaneously capturing those fleeting moments of children playing, it can't be beat.

But there are still uses for a larger, more powerful, more flexible camera.

tmay

beowulfschmidt said:

I've taken some really, really, good pictures with my phone.  And for spontaneously capturing those fleeting moments of children playing, it can't be beat.

But there are still uses for a larger, more powerful, more flexible camera.

I happened to see this yesterday;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPVHVtQClp8

Fuji GX680III

Beast...

charlesn

I consider the 120mm lens to be a real step backward for iPhone photography. The telephoto bragging rights battle among phone makers reminds me of the megapixel wars in which a bigger number trumps all, regardless of whether it's actually useful or better. This new iPhone lens forces the 24mm main lens to cover the extremely wide range from 25-119MM via digital zoom cropping of the sensor and computational photography. And inevitably quality suffers. This might be a reasonable trade-off if your photography is heavily skewed towards sports/wildlife/nature, since you now have the extra reach of a 120mm fixed focal length lens--not to mention better digital zoom beyond 120mm--and you'll likely get a lof of use from this lens. But most photographers will be better served by the 77mm lens carried over to the 15 Pro, since the vast majority of photographs are shot in the 24-85mm range. In this case, the 24mm main lens is only handling the 25-76mm range with digital zoom, so the quality compromise isn't as great. Nor is the quality compromise as great from 78-119mm, since you're digital zooming from a 77mm lens. It's only at 120mm and beyond that the new lens offers any advantages. 

Spencer314

Gawd I hope this isn't the direction Apple is going. I don't mind a 120mm lens, though I'm seriously not going to use it that often. But, killing off the 72mm lens to get that 120mm is insane. If the max simply had a better lens and camera for the 72mm, I might have bought the 15 Pro Max (the 15 Pro's 72mm camera quality is a bit underwhelming, particularly when compared with the excellent main camera even at a 50% crop), but there is no way that I would want to sacrifice having a 12MP camera nowhere between 48mm and 120mm. The 70mm to 90mm range is just way more useful. Heck, 120mm isn't even telephoto enough to be that interesting, as a telephoto, so it really is nothing more than bragging rights. I have talked a few people out of getting the 15 Pro Max for this very reason, and all have realized I was absolutely right. 

charlesn

Spencer314 said:

Gawd I hope this isn't the direction Apple is going. I don't mind a 120mm lens, though I'm seriously not going to use it that often. But, killing off the 72mm lens to get that 120mm is insane. If the max simply had a better lens and camera for the 72mm, I might have bought the 15 Pro Max (the 15 Pro's 72mm camera quality is a bit underwhelming, particularly when compared with the excellent main camera even at a 50% crop), but there is no way that I would want to sacrifice having a 12MP camera nowhere between 48mm and 120mm. The 70mm to 90mm range is just way more useful. Heck, 120mm isn't even telephoto enough to be that interesting, as a telephoto, so it really is nothing more than bragging rights. I have talked a few people out of getting the 15 Pro Max for this very reason, and all have realized I was absolutely right. 

That's a great observation about the 120mm. It's "too telephoto" to be useful in most photo situations and not telephoto enough for times that really demand a longer lens. It's the worst of both worlds, all in one lens!

sloaah

Agreed on all the comments about 120mm not being useful. 70-90mm is the ideal portrait range; even up to 105mm in some situations. 120mm is too tight for portraits but also not useful for wildlife etc.

i actively chose the 15 Pro over the Pro Max to avoid the 120mm. Initially marketing was persuading me in the other direction, but having used the Pro Max, the 120mm is just an underwhelming camera - too tight and (to my eyes) quite noisy.

beowulfschmidt

tmay said:

beowulfschmidt said:

I've taken some really, really, good pictures with my phone.  And for spontaneously capturing those fleeting moments of children playing, it can't be beat.

But there are still uses for a larger, more powerful, more flexible camera.

I happened to see this yesterday;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPVHVtQClp8

Fuji GX680III

Beast...

Definitely a beast.  I have absolutely no use for that kind of equipment.  But I want it anyway. 🤣

kmarei

Just curious about this
will there ever be an advance on next generation iPhones that doesn't involved better/more cameras

Or smaller nanometer so more efficient cpu?
it's hard to get excited for new iPhone when the only advance is better and better cameras
how much more quality do you really need on a phone that used to take drunken selfies

muthuk_vanalingam

kmarei said:

Just curious about this
will there ever be an advance on next generation iPhones that doesn't involved better/more cameras

Or smaller nanometer so more efficient cpu?
it's hard to get excited for new iPhone when the only advance is better and better cameras
how much more quality do you really need on a phone that used to take drunken selfies

Apple adopting foldable form-factor is one major advance, waiting to happen. With A series processors becoming powerful enough to run MacOS, switching between iOS and MacOS (depending on the peripherals connected) is another major functionality that should eventually come to iPhones (may be in another 3-5 years).

chadbag

muthuk_vanalingam said:

kmarei said:

Just curious about this
will there ever be an advance on next generation iPhones that doesn't involved better/more cameras

Or smaller nanometer so more efficient cpu?
it's hard to get excited for new iPhone when the only advance is better and better cameras
how much more quality do you really need on a phone that used to take drunken selfies

Apple adopting foldable form-factor is one major advance, waiting to happen. With A series processors becoming powerful enough to run MacOS, switching between iOS and MacOS (depending on the peripherals connected) is another major functionality that should eventually come to iPhones (may be in another 3-5 years).

While we’ll probably see foldable for some reason, we probably won’t see a single device that switches between iOS and macOS.  That’s not the Apple Way and probably not useful to the great majority of their userbase. 

kmarei

muthuk_vanalingam said:

kmarei said:

Just curious about this
will there ever be an advance on next generation iPhones that doesn't involved better/more cameras

Or smaller nanometer so more efficient cpu?
it's hard to get excited for new iPhone when the only advance is better and better cameras
how much more quality do you really need on a phone that used to take drunken selfies

Apple adopting foldable form-factor is one major advance, waiting to happen. With A series processors becoming powerful enough to run MacOS, switching between iOS and MacOS (depending on the peripherals connected) is another major functionality that should eventually come to iPhones (may be in another 3-5 years).

hope so, anything to make them exciting again
its the same story every time now
faster cpu,  same battery life, better camera
end result is pretty much the same experience as each ios is more bloated than the one before
so that extra cpu speed doesn't really improve the experience
i think the camera quality was more than enough for 90% of users around iphone 12

as for folding displays
i've used microsoft surface duo, surface duo 2, and google pixel fold (currently)as work phones
yes its a nice feature, but unless you rely on your phone for media consumption
doesn't really add much, other than bulk
surface duo 2 was the nicest since it had 2 screens, so when you launch an app it maximizes to the screen you launched it from
and you still had access to home screen on the other, where you could open another app
i loved doing video calls on one screen, and had word or excel open on the other to see the numbers etc during the call
it would just always randomly reboot at various times of the day
microsoft for you

StrangeDays

kmarei said:

muthuk_vanalingam said:

kmarei said:

Just curious about this
will there ever be an advance on next generation iPhones that doesn't involved better/more cameras

Or smaller nanometer so more efficient cpu?
it's hard to get excited for new iPhone when the only advance is better and better cameras
how much more quality do you really need on a phone that used to take drunken selfies

Apple adopting foldable form-factor is one major advance, waiting to happen. With A series processors becoming powerful enough to run MacOS, switching between iOS and MacOS (depending on the peripherals connected) is another major functionality that should eventually come to iPhones (may be in another 3-5 years).

hope so, anything to make them exciting again
its the same story every time now
faster cpu,  same battery life, better camera
end result is pretty much the same experience as each ios is more bloated than the one before
so that extra cpu speed doesn't really improve the experience
i think the camera quality was more than enough for 90% of users around iphone 12

It’s in your head, man. Early phones enjoyed rapid improvements until all the ha gong fruit was captured. Recall the first iPhone lacked copy and paste. Video didn’t come until a few generations in. It’s now a mature, feature-rich device. If that makes it boring, ok, but that’s you looking for the dopamine hits you got yesteryear. 

Incremental, iterative improvement is the name of the game. Gruber wrote about this fact over a decade ago:

 https://daringfireball.net/2010/05/this_is_how_apple_rolls