Under pressure, Apple will restore Epic Games' developer account in the EU

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 37
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 8,023member
    gatorguy said:
    eeks the EU has done nothing about this. I’ve seen no investigation or even a suggestion of one. Yet this Epic ban apparently needed to be looked at immediately by the EU?

    The fact nothing has been done about Apple’s rules suggests that Apple is, in fact, in compliance with the DMA and these rules are staying.
    It's only been two days, not weeks, since the EU DMA rules went into effect. The commission announced in advance that March 7th was the day that active examinations of the gatekeepers compliance would begin.

     I fully expect a few knocks on doors, and a bit of fine-tuning from the affected big techs, preferably without fines being the driving reason for the requisite changes.

    That’s quite the spin. There’s no stipulation that says the EU has to wait until the DMA comes into effect before they investigate any potential issues. Especially with the complaints from Epic & Spotify.

    If the EU fine tunes the DMA it exposes them as the utter incompetent and idiotic lawmakers they truly are.
    The deadline was set. The EU said that up to 7th March companies had time to sort things out. 

    We don't know when exactly or what exactly has gone on with regards to communication between Apple and the EU. We do know that the EU has asked for feedback from developers on Apple's proposed plans.

    Now we have to wait, but if the EU decides Apple hasn't met the requirements, the directive will be in force and action can be taken.

    As for 'stipulations', well, obviously there was little they could do before it came into force save for talking and we have no information on that.

    We just have to wait. 
    ctt_zhVictorMortimer
  • Reply 22 of 37
    A nice precedent and congrats to EU for standing up against gross monopoly. Hopefully soon that will come to US. 
    VictorMortimerwilliamlondon
  • Reply 23 of 37
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,649member
    gatorguy said:
    eeks the EU has done nothing about this. I’ve seen no investigation or even a suggestion of one. Yet this Epic ban apparently needed to be looked at immediately by the EU?

    The fact nothing has been done about Apple’s rules suggests that Apple is, in fact, in compliance with the DMA and these rules are staying.
    It's only been two days, not weeks, since the EU DMA rules went into effect. The commission announced in advance that March 7th was the day that active examinations of the gatekeepers compliance would begin.

     I fully expect a few knocks on doors, and a bit of fine-tuning from the affected big techs, preferably without fines being the driving reason for the requisite changes.

    That’s quite the spin. There’s no stipulation that says the EU has to wait until the DMA comes into effect before they investigate any potential issues. Especially with the complaints from Epic & Spotify.

    If the EU fine tunes the DMA it exposes them as the utter incompetent and idiotic lawmakers they truly are.
    Spin? Why would the EU Commission investigate any company's compliance with a law that wasn't yet in place? As of March 7th, it is. Prior to that, none of the gatekeepers were obligated by law to change anything, and they had right up to midnight (I assume) on the day of the deadline to make any last-second changes they believed were required before authorities were legally tasked with verifying. 
    ctt_zhmuthuk_vanalingamVictorMortimer
  • Reply 24 of 37
    dee_deedee_dee Posts: 129member
    A nice precedent and congrats to EU for standing up against gross monopoly. Hopefully soon that will come to US. 
    Thankfully most other jurisdictions aren’t socialists so it’s unlikely to spread.  This is why EU policies are so weak and hard to enforce.   
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 25 of 37
    What pressure?  Apple needed Epic to go on record as giving assurance that they won’t violate their agreement again, and that is what happened.  Now, when Epic does violate the agreement, their accounts will be terminated and there will be nothing they or the EU can do about it.
    ericthehalfbeetmaywilliamlondonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 26 of 37
    Apple probably knew all along that they would have to acquiesce and give the dev account back. But at least now the EU is held as responsible as Epic since they publicly came to their rescue/defense. Seems a good strategy in keeping Epic accountable. 
    tmaywilliamlondonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 27 of 37
    nubusnubus Posts: 618member
    socalrey said:
    Apple probably knew all along that they would have to acquiesce and give the dev account back. But at least now the EU is held as responsible as Epic since they publicly came to their rescue/defense. Seems a good strategy in keeping Epic accountable. 
    The contract is written by the gatekeeper. That is not a strong position to hold. If it goes against the DMA then Apple will have to rewrite. The best Apple can do is to keep a low profile before someone decides on a DMA 2.0. If a battle can't be won then don't enter it. There is no way EU politicians will accept Apple doing more of "we're a tiny company with 5 small App Stores", "proprietary connectors are eco-friendly and better for competition", "we have to add 43% on top of all app prices", "we decide what kind of apps are allowed"... in the EU those days are over for Apple.
    muthuk_vanalingamVictorMortimerwilliamlondon
  • Reply 28 of 37
    dee_deedee_dee Posts: 129member
    nubus said:
    socalrey said:
    Apple probably knew all along that they would have to acquiesce and give the dev account back. But at least now the EU is held as responsible as Epic since they publicly came to their rescue/defense. Seems a good strategy in keeping Epic accountable. 
    The contract is written by the gatekeeper. That is not a strong position to hold. If it goes against the DMA then Apple will have to rewrite. The best Apple can do is to keep a low profile before someone decides on a DMA 2.0. If a battle can't be won then don't enter it. There is no way EU politicians will accept Apple doing more of "we're a tiny company with 5 small App Stores", "proprietary connectors are eco-friendly and better for competition", "we have to add 43% on top of all app prices", "we decide what kind of apps are allowed"... in the EU those days are over for Apple.
    To be honest it doesn’t look like those days are over.  Apple can charge what the market will bare, and the App Stire is not even that popular in the EU to begin with.  iMessage didn’t need to integrate with other messaging apps which I think is the real win for Apple. 
    tmaywatto_cobra
  • Reply 29 of 37
    nubus said: There is no way EU politicians will accept Apple doing more of "we're a tiny company with 5 small App Stores", "proprietary connectors are eco-friendly and better for competition", "we have to add 43% on top of all app prices", "we decide what kind of apps are allowed"... in the EU those days are over for Apple.
    Apple has the money to lobby just like Spotify, Epic and Microsoft. IMO, what's over is Apple not spending the bucks on lobbying. 
    williamlondonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 30 of 37
    blastdoorblastdoor Posts: 3,580member
    A nice precedent and congrats to EU for standing up against gross monopoly. Hopefully soon that will come to US. 
    https://appleworld.today/apple-now-has-22-of-the-smartphone-market-in-europe-excluding-russia/amp/

    How is a 22 percent market share a “gross monopoly” — or any kind of monopoly?


    williamlondonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 31 of 37
    The fines Apple is going to be getting for failing to adequately comply with the DMA will be Epic!
    williamlondon
  • Reply 32 of 37
    I don't think this was a calculated move by Apple. They have invited the EU to scrutinize their business practises once again, which could lead to another fine or tougher rules to do business in the EU.
    williamlondon
  • Reply 33 of 37
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    eeks the EU has done nothing about this. I’ve seen no investigation or even a suggestion of one. Yet this Epic ban apparently needed to be looked at immediately by the EU?

    The fact nothing has been done about Apple’s rules suggests that Apple is, in fact, in compliance with the DMA and these rules are staying.
    It's only been two days, not weeks, since the EU DMA rules went into effect. The commission announced in advance that March 7th was the day that active examinations of the gatekeepers compliance would begin.

     I fully expect a few knocks on doors, and a bit of fine-tuning from the affected big techs, preferably without fines being the driving reason for the requisite changes.

    That’s quite the spin. There’s no stipulation that says the EU has to wait until the DMA comes into effect before they investigate any potential issues. Especially with the complaints from Epic & Spotify.

    If the EU fine tunes the DMA it exposes them as the utter incompetent and idiotic lawmakers they truly are.
    Spin? Why would the EU Commission investigate any company's compliance with a law that wasn't yet in place? As of March 7th, it is. Prior to that, none of the gatekeepers were obligated by law to change anything, and they had right up to midnight (I assume) on the day of the deadline to make any last-second changes they believed were required before authorities were legally tasked with verifying. 
    You can’t be this stupid.

    They would investigate because Apple announced their rules 6 weeks early, giving them plenty of time to review them.

    Much better to talk to Apple and fine tune the rules BEFORE the DMA goes into effect then to have a bunch companies build their new third party stores around Apple’s rules and then have to change them later on. This is a lot of wasted effort for everyone.

    The EU could warn Apple of non-compliance and if nothing changes they could hit Apple hard on day one. Given the tone people like Breton have when talking about Apple, I’m convinced there’s nothing they’d like better than to hit Apple hard on day one.

    I think they DID have this conversation since Apple made a few last-minute changes to the terms (like the credit requirement). Which I predict means the rest of their conditions will stay.
    tmaywilliamlondonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 34 of 37
    socalrey said:
    Apple probably knew all along that they would have to acquiesce and give the dev account back. But at least now the EU is held as responsible as Epic since they publicly came to their rescue/defense. Seems a good strategy in keeping Epic accountable. 
    This.

    Where it really comes into play is Apple’s rule that they will approve/sign Apps for third party stores (with a few relaxed rules like not banning Apps with adult content). This provides a huge benefit to consumers in terms of security.

    If the DMA tells Apple they don’t have the right to approve/sign Apps (for example, believing that idiot Sweeney that it’s an antitrust issue), then the EU would be responsible for the flood of malware and other Apps on third party stores without proper vetting,.

    I think Apple is daring them to remove this rule.
    tmaywilliamlondonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 35 of 37
    nubusnubus Posts: 618member
    If the DMA tells Apple they don’t have the right to approve/sign Apps (for example, believing that idiot Sweeney that it’s an antitrust issue), then the EU would be responsible for the flood of malware and other Apps on third party stores without proper vetting,.
    The EU Cyber Resilience Act will come into force late 2025. It will require both hardware and software vendors to deliver security updates for 5 years, report problems, and for 10 years be able to explain how security was part of the product design. Currently some companies do updates late or never. You will get fined if you don't update or don't report bugs. Some products are seen as more essential with higher requirements. Rules for a connected dishwasher won't be the same as for VPN software or routers. Apple could benefit from this as other vendors will have to improve their products. This will make Apple more competitive.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 36 of 37
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,649member
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    eeks the EU has done nothing about this. I’ve seen no investigation or even a suggestion of one. Yet this Epic ban apparently needed to be looked at immediately by the EU?

    The fact nothing has been done about Apple’s rules suggests that Apple is, in fact, in compliance with the DMA and these rules are staying.
    It's only been two days, not weeks, since the EU DMA rules went into effect. The commission announced in advance that March 7th was the day that active examinations of the gatekeepers compliance would begin.

     I fully expect a few knocks on doors, and a bit of fine-tuning from the affected big techs, preferably without fines being the driving reason for the requisite changes.

    That’s quite the spin. There’s no stipulation that says the EU has to wait until the DMA comes into effect before they investigate any potential issues. Especially with the complaints from Epic & Spotify.

    If the EU fine tunes the DMA it exposes them as the utter incompetent and idiotic lawmakers they truly are.
    Spin? Why would the EU Commission investigate any company's compliance with a law that wasn't yet in place? As of March 7th, it is. Prior to that, none of the gatekeepers were obligated by law to change anything, and they had right up to midnight (I assume) on the day of the deadline to make any last-second changes they believed were required before authorities were legally tasked with verifying. 
    You can’t be this stupid.

    They would investigate because Apple announced their rules 6 weeks early, giving them plenty of time to review them.

    Much better to talk to Apple and fine tune the rules BEFORE the DMA goes into effect then to have a bunch companies build their new third party stores around Apple’s rules and then have to change them later on. This is a lot of wasted effort for everyone.

    The EU could warn Apple of non-compliance and if nothing changes they could hit Apple hard on day one. Given the tone people like Breton have when talking about Apple, I’m convinced there’s nothing they’d like better than to hit Apple hard on day one.

    I think they DID have this conversation since Apple made a few last-minute changes to the terms (like the credit requirement). Which I predict means the rest of their conditions will stay.
    I'll wager you that all the remaining Apple conditions WON'T stay as it is on Day One. I think Apple's intent is to push things as far as they can, past the line of expected acceptance, and wait for the EU to tell them to back off or pay penalties.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 37 of 37
    blitz1blitz1 Posts: 451member
    EU 4 - Apple 0
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