I agree that Apple is not eliminating the PB 15". It's a OS9 booting issue and waiting (again!) for moto (the 7457).
The difference between buying a PC notebook and a PB 15" is builtin Airport Extreme & bluetooth, and DDR that doesn't particularly increase performance? If this is true, then even if Apple releases a new PB tomorrow, you'll have some other excuse for not buying it.
As far as Apple bashing, I smell trolls here. Trolls - Get a Life!
I'm not Apple bashing. I'm saying the 15" powerbook in it's current form is far from compelling. I could get a PC with all hardware options similar or better and much faster CPU for the price of the current 15" powerbook model. I like OS X a lot, and I really like the design of the powerbooks, but I'm more than proficient enough to get as much utility out of Linux, possibly dual booting into Windows, as I could out of OS X, it just would be more of a hassle. And I'm only willing to trade so much in terms of performance for design and not having to dual boot. The 17" has a better graphics card, ddr memory, firewire 800, integrated bluetooth and airport extreme and much higher resolution, plus the nicer aluminum enclosure. I just don't like a laptop screen that large, and even if I had no preference between that size screen and the 15", I expect to be able to get a very nice discount on a new 15" model, but probably not a 17". So if a new 15" came out tomorrow I'd be looking for ways to get it as soon as possible, not for reasons not to buy it, unless it was a truely disappointing revision.
I think I am losing my urge to get a Powerbook. It is becomming harder and harder to justify the cost difference..esp now that XP Pro is so stable ( Have not had a crash in 14 months), and the battery life on the new centrinos is so much better. I still prefer the styling of the PB and the Superdrive, I am just bummed about the perfromance differences. Am I Alone?
I think I am losing my urge to get a Powerbook. It is becomming harder and harder to justify the cost difference..esp now that XP Pro is so stable ( Have not had a crash in 14 months), and the battery life on the new centrinos is so much better. I still prefer the styling of the PB and the Superdrive, I am just bummed about the perfromance differences. Am I Alone?
No, I feel the same way, but I'm not in love with XP Pro. I've manage to BSOD it more than once, plus I just don't like Windows anymore for other reasons (not configurable enough, I've grown accustomed to Unix style OSes via Linux, etc). For me though, since I can get a good deal on powerbooks through my school most likely ($2150 for 15" with superdrive was the last deal they offered, before the last Apple price drop I think) it's still worth it for OS X, Super Drive, and just having a sexier computer, assuming they release something new soon.
No, I feel the same way, but I'm not in love with XP Pro. I've manage to BSOD it more than once, plus I just don't like Windows anymore for other reasons (not configurable enough, I've grown accustomed to Unix style OSes via Linux, etc). For me though, since I can get a good deal on powerbooks through my school most likely ($2150 for 15" with superdrive was the last deal they offered, before the last Apple price drop I think) it's still worth it for OS X, Super Drive, and just having a sexier computer, assuming they release something new soon.
and another powerbook thread ends up with:
a. whining about more valuable windows laptops as a reasonable alternative for a powerbook
(where do all these people get the money to buy their software?)
b. and everlasting chit chat about the (next gen) 15" powerbook
btw and very off topic: nice name, julian
[edit]
sorry, i forgot about linux as an alternative free software source for x86 owners
I think this thread is relevent, because of Apple's obvious delay in updating the 15".
I would like to see ALL the PowerBooks speed bumped - along with an Al 15". A 1.3G 7457 would be nice, and at 10W (1GHz), looks like we will see a DP 17".
This will ensure PowerBook sales will not stagnate in sales from customers expecting a G5 PowerBook in the short term.
Ideally though, I would prefer they introduce G5's in the PowerBooks and move the iBooks to G4's with these new 7457's. Since SJ would want to make this HUGE announcement, but he's not due until Paris in September. Im willing to wait another 2 months if its a G5.
Well know by MWNY if this is the case. Must,......... be........ patient........
I think I am losing my urge to get a Powerbook. It is becomming harder and harder to justify the cost difference..esp now that XP Pro is so stable ( Have not had a crash in 14 months), and the battery life on the new centrinos is so much better. I still prefer the styling of the PB and the Superdrive, I am just bummed about the perfromance differences. Am I Alone?
I don't get this because, to me, it's "using a Mac" and I care less about numbers or even outright "speed and muscle" than I do the entire vibe and experience of using Macs.
It would never occur to me to migrate to a PC just because of some MHz differences. I always get curious about what people contemplating "jumping ship" aren't able to do. Some answers have been legit, sure. But some have just been the goofy lustings of spec/number freaks who always feel they gotta have the "biggest and baddest".
Maybe I'm just warped and see it all kinda weird? It ain't about MHz and stuff like that...to me, anyway. If you're better served by Windows XP or whatever, by all means give it a shot and be happy. But I just can't see some people seeing such a HUGE difference in performance (for what they actually do for a living, hobby, etc.) that they'd feel "forced" to abandon the Mac for a platform with higher numbers or whatever.
But I'm a tad biased, so take all the above with the appropriate grain of table seasoning.
I guess what I'm trying to say is "don't let the door hit ya..." and "we don't wanna hear any bitchin' about it at a later date if it doesn't turn out to be 'all that'"
I don't get this because, to me, it's "using a Mac" and I care less about numbers or even outright "speed and muscle" than I do the entire vibe and experience of using Macs.
It would never occur to me to migrate to a PC just because of some MHz differences. I always get curious about what people contemplating "jumping ship" aren't able to do. Some answers have been legit, sure. But some have just been the goofy lustings of spec/number freaks who always feel they gotta have the "biggest and baddest".
Maybe I'm just warped and see it all kinda weird? It ain't about MHz and stuff like that...to me, anyway. If you're better served by Windows XP or whatever, by all means give it a shot and be happy. But I just can't see some people seeing such a HUGE difference in performance (for what they actually do for a living, hobby, etc.) that they'd feel "forced" to abandon the Mac for a platform with higher numbers or whatever.
But I'm a tad biased, so take all the above with the appropriate grain of table seasoning.
I guess what I'm trying to say is "don't let the door hit ya..." and "we don't wanna hear any bitchin' about it at a later date if it doesn't turn out to be 'all that'"
This is not about jumping ship from Mac, it's about climbing on board.
By the by, I am not bitchin!!!! (well, maybe a teeny, tiny bit) I DO want to get a Mac. I probably will because I already have several PC's. You are correct in saying that it's about a lot more than muscle. That is really why I want to get a PB. I want access to iTunes, and I want to do some DV editing and I really like OSX (been trolling the Apple store in Memphis) I geuss I made the mistake of reading the rumor sites and listening to the gossip about this freakin update/speedbump/whatever that was comming 2 months ago! Now, I'm this far into so, I am definitley gonna wait!
pscates, I wonder if it would be any different if Steve hadn't said the words "year of the laptop." (hereafter referred to as "YotL," pronounced "yodle," as in to sing by suddenly changing from the head voice, or falsetto, to the chest voice, and the contrary. Ex. "Steve YotL'ed at the Macworld San Francisco Convention)
Those words were plainly meant to affect the buying decisions of every Mac user and potential switcher. If someone says, "this year I'm going to buy a new Mac" and then employee number one of Apple YotL's with confidence at the beginning of the year - you're going to wait for that 15" PB to update alongside the others to make your final decision.
I can't imagine their marketing department would think they would have a YotL on 12" and 17" models alone. That's just massively ignorant in any industry - to believe your customer base would decide on one of two new extremes, here referring to screen size. So maybe they never did expect a YotL, and they just had to think of something to say that would take attention away from the shabby desktop line.
But would they really risk creating hype that would hold back purchase decisions? All sorts of people are in limbo now because of Steve's YotL'ing, do they want a desktop or a laptop? And many are just confused.
I really wish an interviewer out there could call Apple on this. Anyone know of any instances where this has happened?
a. whining about more valuable windows laptops as a reasonable alternative for a powerbook
(where do all these people get the money to buy their software?)
b. and everlasting chit chat about the (next gen) 15" powerbook
btw and very off topic: nice name, julian
[edit]
sorry, i forgot about linux as an alternative free software source for x86 owners
Thanks for recognizing the name. I use this name on a lot of places and so far I think you're the third to recognize it (and say so anyway).
Anyway, on to more important things.. About the whining about more valuable Windows laptops and where people get money for software... I get free fully licensed copies of Windows XP, Visual Studio .NET, and Microsoft Office just by going to the library at school. I already own a host of games, and anything else I need can be provided by solutions on Linux with varying quality.
A Mac laptop will be more expensive for me for lower powered hardware. Of course lower powered doesn't necessarily mean lower quality, as Apple provides nice hardware packages - they just don't match up performance wise to what I could get for the same price on a PC right now (MHz myth or no MHz myth). I'm weighing that against the improved quality of the operating system (Commercial Unix laptop, Aqua front end, woohoo) and the ability to more easily integrate with my iPod (frankly the solutions for the PC suck in my opinion, but the player makes up for it).
Ah well, don't mean to whine or troll, just my two cents.
If you're considering a laptop, consider the Panasonic W2 toughbook as an alternative to the 12" PowerBook. It's water resistent and comes with a Centrino that will blow a 12" PB's G4 away. Although it's a bit more expensive, it's almost superior in every way to the 12" PB. It's a full 2lbs lighter than the 12" PB and yet comes with a built-in Combo drive!
Yes, and except for that one nagging little issue about NOT BEING A MAC, I'm sure it's a fine machine.
\
Does is occur to you that some of us prefer the Mac OS over Windows, and that no matter how you wrap it up and praise some worthwhile PC laptop, the fact that it's not a Mac actually figures into the equation, and means something to most of us?
Kinda like telling a hardcore, dyed-in-the-wool Fender or Gibson user that some Korean-made Strat or Les Paul knock-off is "just as good" and "you'll like it just as much...".
No...we won't.
I'm willing to bet that most of us who use Macs do so BECAUSE OF THE OS. And all the specs, numbers, prices, features, bells-and-whistles, etc. of a comparable PC simply couldn't matter less to us because it requires changing an entire OS and way of doing things.
You might be barking up the wrong tree and wasting your breath on these buying suggestions. I mean, after all...look we're you're posting them: a Mac-centric site. Does that tell you anything?
Hey, if I didn't give two damns about the whole thing, sure, I'd take you up on your suggestion.
Comments
Originally posted by jwdawso
I agree that Apple is not eliminating the PB 15". It's a OS9 booting issue and waiting (again!) for moto (the 7457).
The difference between buying a PC notebook and a PB 15" is builtin Airport Extreme & bluetooth, and DDR that doesn't particularly increase performance?
As far as Apple bashing, I smell trolls here. Trolls - Get a Life!
I'm not Apple bashing. I'm saying the 15" powerbook in it's current form is far from compelling. I could get a PC with all hardware options similar or better and much faster CPU for the price of the current 15" powerbook model. I like OS X a lot, and I really like the design of the powerbooks, but I'm more than proficient enough to get as much utility out of Linux, possibly dual booting into Windows, as I could out of OS X, it just would be more of a hassle. And I'm only willing to trade so much in terms of performance for design and not having to dual boot. The 17" has a better graphics card, ddr memory, firewire 800, integrated bluetooth and airport extreme and much higher resolution, plus the nicer aluminum enclosure. I just don't like a laptop screen that large, and even if I had no preference between that size screen and the 15", I expect to be able to get a very nice discount on a new 15" model, but probably not a 17". So if a new 15" came out tomorrow I'd be looking for ways to get it as soon as possible, not for reasons not to buy it, unless it was a truely disappointing revision.
That is a very contested point, and many feel the radeon 9000 in the 15" is a better card, and have the benchmarks to prove it.
Originally posted by Beakee
I think I am losing my urge to get a Powerbook. It is becomming harder and harder to justify the cost difference..esp now that XP Pro is so stable ( Have not had a crash in 14 months), and the battery life on the new centrinos is so much better. I still prefer the styling of the PB and the Superdrive, I am just bummed about the perfromance differences. Am I Alone?
No, I feel the same way, but I'm not in love with XP Pro. I've manage to BSOD it more than once, plus I just don't like Windows anymore for other reasons (not configurable enough, I've grown accustomed to Unix style OSes via Linux, etc). For me though, since I can get a good deal on powerbooks through my school most likely ($2150 for 15" with superdrive was the last deal they offered, before the last Apple price drop I think) it's still worth it for OS X, Super Drive, and just having a sexier computer, assuming they release something new soon.
Originally posted by Delphiki
No, I feel the same way, but I'm not in love with XP Pro. I've manage to BSOD it more than once, plus I just don't like Windows anymore for other reasons (not configurable enough, I've grown accustomed to Unix style OSes via Linux, etc). For me though, since I can get a good deal on powerbooks through my school most likely ($2150 for 15" with superdrive was the last deal they offered, before the last Apple price drop I think) it's still worth it for OS X, Super Drive, and just having a sexier computer, assuming they release something new soon.
and another powerbook thread ends up with:
a. whining about more valuable windows laptops as a reasonable alternative for a powerbook
(where do all these people get the money to buy their software?)
b. and everlasting chit chat about the (next gen) 15" powerbook
btw and very off topic: nice name, julian
[edit]
sorry, i forgot about linux as an alternative free software source for x86 owners
I would like to see ALL the PowerBooks speed bumped - along with an Al 15". A 1.3G 7457 would be nice, and at 10W (1GHz), looks like we will see a DP 17".
This will ensure PowerBook sales will not stagnate in sales from customers expecting a G5 PowerBook in the short term.
Ideally though, I would prefer they introduce G5's in the PowerBooks and move the iBooks to G4's with these new 7457's. Since SJ would want to make this HUGE announcement, but he's not due until Paris in September. Im willing to wait another 2 months if its a G5.
Well know by MWNY if this is the case. Must,......... be........ patient........
Originally posted by Beakee
I think I am losing my urge to get a Powerbook. It is becomming harder and harder to justify the cost difference..esp now that XP Pro is so stable ( Have not had a crash in 14 months), and the battery life on the new centrinos is so much better. I still prefer the styling of the PB and the Superdrive, I am just bummed about the perfromance differences. Am I Alone?
I don't get this because, to me, it's "using a Mac" and I care less about numbers or even outright "speed and muscle" than I do the entire vibe and experience of using Macs.
It would never occur to me to migrate to a PC just because of some MHz differences. I always get curious about what people contemplating "jumping ship" aren't able to do. Some answers have been legit, sure. But some have just been the goofy lustings of spec/number freaks who always feel they gotta have the "biggest and baddest".
Maybe I'm just warped and see it all kinda weird? It ain't about MHz and stuff like that...to me, anyway. If you're better served by Windows XP or whatever, by all means give it a shot and be happy. But I just can't see some people seeing such a HUGE difference in performance (for what they actually do for a living, hobby, etc.) that they'd feel "forced" to abandon the Mac for a platform with higher numbers or whatever.
But I'm a tad biased, so take all the above with the appropriate grain of table seasoning.
I guess what I'm trying to say is "don't let the door hit ya..." and "we don't wanna hear any bitchin' about it at a later date if it doesn't turn out to be 'all that'"
Originally posted by pscates
I don't get this because, to me, it's "using a Mac" and I care less about numbers or even outright "speed and muscle" than I do the entire vibe and experience of using Macs.
It would never occur to me to migrate to a PC just because of some MHz differences. I always get curious about what people contemplating "jumping ship" aren't able to do. Some answers have been legit, sure. But some have just been the goofy lustings of spec/number freaks who always feel they gotta have the "biggest and baddest".
Maybe I'm just warped and see it all kinda weird? It ain't about MHz and stuff like that...to me, anyway. If you're better served by Windows XP or whatever, by all means give it a shot and be happy. But I just can't see some people seeing such a HUGE difference in performance (for what they actually do for a living, hobby, etc.) that they'd feel "forced" to abandon the Mac for a platform with higher numbers or whatever.
But I'm a tad biased, so take all the above with the appropriate grain of table seasoning.
I guess what I'm trying to say is "don't let the door hit ya..." and "we don't wanna hear any bitchin' about it at a later date if it doesn't turn out to be 'all that'"
This is not about jumping ship from Mac, it's about climbing on board.
By the by, I am not bitchin!!!! (well, maybe a teeny, tiny bit) I DO want to get a Mac. I probably will because I already have several PC's. You are correct in saying that it's about a lot more than muscle. That is really why I want to get a PB. I want access to iTunes, and I want to do some DV editing and I really like OSX (been trolling the Apple store in Memphis) I geuss I made the mistake of reading the rumor sites and listening to the gossip about this freakin update/speedbump/whatever that was comming 2 months ago! Now, I'm this far into so, I am definitley gonna wait!
It's amazing.
Those words were plainly meant to affect the buying decisions of every Mac user and potential switcher. If someone says, "this year I'm going to buy a new Mac" and then employee number one of Apple YotL's with confidence at the beginning of the year - you're going to wait for that 15" PB to update alongside the others to make your final decision.
I can't imagine their marketing department would think they would have a YotL on 12" and 17" models alone. That's just massively ignorant in any industry - to believe your customer base would decide on one of two new extremes, here referring to screen size. So maybe they never did expect a YotL, and they just had to think of something to say that would take attention away from the shabby desktop line.
But would they really risk creating hype that would hold back purchase decisions? All sorts of people are in limbo now because of Steve's YotL'ing, do they want a desktop or a laptop? And many are just confused.
I really wish an interviewer out there could call Apple on this. Anyone know of any instances where this has happened?
[edited for errors]
Originally posted by gar
and another powerbook thread ends up with:
a. whining about more valuable windows laptops as a reasonable alternative for a powerbook
(where do all these people get the money to buy their software?)
b. and everlasting chit chat about the (next gen) 15" powerbook
btw and very off topic: nice name, julian
[edit]
sorry, i forgot about linux as an alternative free software source for x86 owners
Thanks for recognizing the name. I use this name on a lot of places and so far I think you're the third to recognize it (and say so anyway).
Anyway, on to more important things.. About the whining about more valuable Windows laptops and where people get money for software... I get free fully licensed copies of Windows XP, Visual Studio .NET, and Microsoft Office just by going to the library at school. I already own a host of games, and anything else I need can be provided by solutions on Linux with varying quality.
A Mac laptop will be more expensive for me for lower powered hardware. Of course lower powered doesn't necessarily mean lower quality, as Apple provides nice hardware packages - they just don't match up performance wise to what I could get for the same price on a PC right now (MHz myth or no MHz myth). I'm weighing that against the improved quality of the operating system (Commercial Unix laptop, Aqua front end, woohoo) and the ability to more easily integrate with my iPod (frankly the solutions for the PC suck in my opinion, but the player makes up for it).
Ah well, don't mean to whine or troll, just my two cents.
Here's an Ars discussion on it: http://arstechnica.infopop.net/OpenT...4&m=8400975475
Does is occur to you that some of us prefer the Mac OS over Windows, and that no matter how you wrap it up and praise some worthwhile PC laptop, the fact that it's not a Mac actually figures into the equation, and means something to most of us?
Kinda like telling a hardcore, dyed-in-the-wool Fender or Gibson user that some Korean-made Strat or Les Paul knock-off is "just as good" and "you'll like it just as much...".
No...we won't.
I'm willing to bet that most of us who use Macs do so BECAUSE OF THE OS. And all the specs, numbers, prices, features, bells-and-whistles, etc. of a comparable PC simply couldn't matter less to us because it requires changing an entire OS and way of doing things.
You might be barking up the wrong tree and wasting your breath on these buying suggestions. I mean, after all...look we're you're posting them: a Mac-centric site. Does that tell you anything?
Hey, if I didn't give two damns about the whole thing, sure, I'd take you up on your suggestion.