Well, maybe I SHOULD give them a try before bashing them. Other than the fact that they look so small, I have never really gotten the Ducati thing. I know several people that are deeply in love with them, but I must be missing something. And I AM into racing bikes (so it's not just a Harley Davidson moron talking). De gustibus et coloris...
Put it this way... how do you describe to someone why using a Mac is just smoother, easier, and feels more like you're interacting with a well-built, well-thought out system? Same thing.
Every detail has been thought out, and it makes a unified whole that is just unbelievably nice. It's all the little things adding up to be greater than the sum of the parts.
Fer instance: My Kawasaki 600R had the spark plugs *directly* beneath the frame tubes. It took a special $65 wrench to remove them... after you took off all the fairings, and removed the gas tank (careful not to spill!). Want to work on the engine while it's running, to tune? No problem. Remove all the fairings, remove the gas tank, place it on a stand the same height (within 2") of the level of where it mounts, hook up a longer gas line (not too long, no more than 4'), re-prime, and then you can get to work. The Duc, OTOH, not only had the engine easy to get to, but the gas tank lifted up on a hinge and had its own kickstand for when you needed to get to the few parts under it.
Windows vs. Mac, Kawasaki/Suzuki/Yamaha/<your brand here> vs. Ducati.
They're persnickety at times (Italian engineering, after all), and the dry clutch freaks the crap outta people for no real reason, but they are amazing pieces of machinery. Riding one is more like melding with the vehicle than being an operator.
Every detail has been thought out, and it makes a unified whole that is just unbelievably nice. It's all the little things adding up to be greater than the sum of the parts.
I've heard that about Ducati. My uncle once had one stolen from him (I'm talking 20 years ago) and he's still in pain.
Quote:
Windows vs. Mac, Kawasaki/Suzuki/Yamaha/<your brand here> vs. Ducati.
My brand being Honda (it is, but was that your conscious move? - it's just my first bike, nothing too powerful to start with. Although it's been 23.000 kilometers now). I don't know if I can agree with that comparison. You'll have to admit that the R1 (and Honda's CBR before it), has been on the receiving end of a lot of critical acclaim. Yet, I never rode either of them (well, I do ride an YZF from time to time, from back when that was still Thunder-xxx), so I have no right to mingle. Ducati's do come at a high premium, no? Even in Europe, they outprice most of its Japanese competitors (the Germans are in another category, really). I can only cringe at what that goodness (?!) would cost in the US. How fast can you legally drive it?
I've heard that about Ducati. My uncle once had one stolen from him (I'm talking 20 years ago) and he's still in pain.
As was mine, 6 years ago, and yes, I feel his pain.
Quote:
My brand being Honda (it is, but was that your conscious move? - it's just my first bike, nothing too powerful to start with. Although it's been 23.000 kilometers now). I don't know if I can agree with that comparison. You'll have to admit that the R1 (and Honda's CBR before it), has been on the receiving end of a lot of critical acclaim.
Yep. So have the Alienware Gaming PCs.
Quote:
Yet, I never rode either of them (well, I do ride an YZF from time to time, from back when that was still Thunder-xxx), so I have no right to mingle. Ducati's do come at a high premium, no? Even in Europe, they outprice most of its Japanese competitors (the Germans are in another category, really). I can only cringe at what that goodness (?!) would cost in the US. How fast can you legally drive it?
As long as it's faster than the cop...
Yeah, they're pricey. Yeah, you pay a premium.
You get what you pay for, IMNSHO. I own a Mac. I want another Ducati. I like quality, aesthetics, and holistic products. Call me crazy.
haha, no big deal. just the normal accusation of theft. the moron thought i stole a cd because he didnt see me put it down. i picked it up 5 minutes later and purchased it, but he didnt notice that part. he didnt even notice my mom holding it as we walked to the car, which is where he chased me down to question me. if we hadnt actually purchased it, i would have been arrested for theft. woulda been worth it though--false arrest would have gotten me at least a 100k. oh well...
Back in the day of a retailer named "Blockbuster Music" I had gotten out my wallet to see if I had enough cash to purchase a CD. I looked and indeed I had enough. I put the wallet back in my pocket. I was approached by two employees of the store one being the manager I believe the other one who thought that I was putting a CD in my pocket. I had not done anything wrong and was still inside the building and not even left the building. I believe alliance with all due respect that one day you will go through some difficult times as you had not the capacity to get over your situation with Wal-Mart. I am no fan of wal-mart in any sense but I can say for sure that I realize wal-mart is a target to shop-lifters. For you to to file a lawsuit for any $ amount is less than mature and less than who you could be.
I am very disapointed in you and I realize you do not live to "live up to my standards" I respect that completely but what standards do you live for?
Forgiveness is something lost by our culture and it is really sad.
To directly address your question of the thread I would reply by saying give the money back to wal-mart and move on with your life. That is the best thing you can do with that money.
Back in the day of a retailer named "Blockbuster Music" I had gotten out my wallet to see if I had enough cash to purchase a CD. I looked and indeed I had enough. I put the wallet back in my pocket. I was approached by two employees of the store one being the manager I believe the other one who thought that I was putting a CD in my pocket. I had not done anything wrong and was still inside the building and not even left the building. I believe alliance with all due respect that one day you will go through some difficult times as you had not the capacity to get over your situation with Wal-Mart. I am no fan of wal-mart in any sense but I can say for sure that I realize wal-mart is a target to shop-lifters. For you to to file a lawsuit for any $ amount is less than mature and less than who you could be.
I am very disapointed in you and I realize you do not live to "live up to my standards" I respect that completely but what standards do you live for?
Forgiveness is something lost by our culture and it is really sad.
To directly address your question of the thread I would reply by saying give the money back to wal-mart and move on with your life. That is the best thing you can do with that money.
With respect and peace,
Fellowship
I, for one, enormously appreciate Fellowship's honesty. False-accusations of shoplifting aren't exclusive to Wal-Mart. But I think he's misguided in suggesting Alliance give the money back to a ruthless retailer intent on treating its customers with utmost paranoia and disdain. The bottom-line is that Wal-Mart only cares about two things: its bottom-line and its conservative agenda. It's a non-unionized, sexist retailer convicted of even robbing its own employees of overtime pay. I doubt that giving the money back to Wal-Mart is in anyone's best interests but Wal-Mart.
On the same note, in spite of forgiveness, never shopping at Wal-Mart again is probably the most agreeable solution to those who actually oppose lawsuits.
"Convenience and cheap prices come with hidden costs." -SF Chronicle.
I, for one, enormously appreciate Fellowship's honesty. But I think he's misguided
We are all guided by different things. Some spiratual, some by what they can "blow" $2,000 on and yet others guided by completely different things. I just suggest people find guidence that is lasting and not temporary. Guidence that has real meaning and joy.
We are all guided by different things. Some spiratual, some by what they can "blow" $2,000 on and yet others guided by completely different things. I just suggest people find guidence that is lasting and not temporary. Guidence that has real meaning and joy.
Back in the day of a retailer named "Blockbuster Music" I had gotten out my wallet to see if I had enough cash to purchase a CD. I looked and indeed I had enough. I put the wallet back in my pocket. I was approached by two employees of the store one being the manager I believe the other one who thought that I was putting a CD in my pocket. I had not done anything wrong and was still inside the building and not even left the building. I believe alliance with all due respect that one day you will go through some difficult times as you had not the capacity to get over your situation with Wal-Mart. I am no fan of wal-mart in any sense but I can say for sure that I realize wal-mart is a target to shop-lifters. For you to to file a lawsuit for any $ amount is less than mature and less than who you could be.
I am very disapointed in you and I realize you do not live to "live up to my standards" I respect that completely but what standards do you live for?
Forgiveness is something lost by our culture and it is really sad.
To directly address your question of the thread I would reply by saying give the money back to wal-mart and move on with your life. That is the best thing you can do with that money.
With respect and peace,
Fellowship
haha
first of all, i didnt file a lawsuit, but filed a complaint. this in itself is considered a threat for suit according to their lawyers. second, the kid who approached us outside the store had no validity to even talk to me regarding the issue. these stores have protocals to deal with these situations, you know. this states that the employee must actually SEE the customer put merchandise on the person. now, the employee did not see this, and thus should never have even thought about pursuing me. also, we were carrying the bag, which was shaped like a cd. he was obviously a moron to not notice this. also, he lost track of me for a good 15 minutes while i was in the store until i left it. you cannot lose track of someone and then find them again outside w/ no evidence nor any legal basis for harassing a customer once he leaves the store. what he did was illegal and i have no moral objection for protesting it. he singled me out because i look young, and thus i must be guilty. i have also been singled out while driving numerous times and given many hundreds of dollars where i otherwise would not have been accused if i looked older. i am an easy target: plain and simple. therefore, i do not feel bad about taking back a small sum which walmart will not even notice. someone has to get them to straighten out their employees, just as someone needs to improve the quality of street cops (at least where i live). i can do my part to help keep this kind of thing from happening, but i have no power to stop other problems, so...i am obliged to at least give them a fight. no one else does--most people are spineless and feel this is petty. thats bullsh*t. i dont like being harassed. you insult me because i stand up for myself?? well then screw you.
i appologize for my harsh tone. but i'm just sick and tired of laying down for authority that has no right to make judgements, and equally tired of being harassed for fighting back occasionally.
i appologize for my harsh tone. but i'm just sick and tired of laying down for authority that has no right to make judgements, and equally tired of being harassed for fighting back occasionally.
No sweat man I hope you did not take me wrong either,
I have learned from my own doings in days past and have realized some things. I am by no means the authority on any subject but I see you as a bright young man and I wish the world for you and only tell you what I would hope you can use to your advantage not as insult at all.
I had gone to Boston with my sister not long ago and it was the first time we had each flown since 9/11.
We were leaving Dallas Fort Worth International Airport headed for Boston Logan and when we got to DFW and had the luggage checked in we then made our way to security and had to remove our shoes and be wanded over. My sister had a sour and bitter attitude about "having to remove her shoes" she complained about how unsanitary that is and how unneccessary it is. She was sour about it and quite frankly she was not being reasonable. When it came time to leave Boston after the trip we did the same security but Boston Logan style and it was much more intense. Same shoes off and all but more. This time she thanked the security people for ensuring the safty of passengers.
As we learn we learn.
Understanding and wisdom are worth more than Gold.
The Ducati has that orgasm inducing grunt to it that no rice rocket can match.
But I was going to suggest something a bit different. Drive a uhaul into central pennsylvania and load it up with 150+ cases of Yuengling. That should hold you over.
Comments
Nick
Originally posted by der Kopf
Well, maybe I SHOULD give them a try before bashing them. Other than the fact that they look so small, I have never really gotten the Ducati thing. I know several people that are deeply in love with them, but I must be missing something. And I AM into racing bikes (so it's not just a Harley Davidson moron talking). De gustibus et coloris...
Put it this way... how do you describe to someone why using a Mac is just smoother, easier, and feels more like you're interacting with a well-built, well-thought out system? Same thing.
Every detail has been thought out, and it makes a unified whole that is just unbelievably nice. It's all the little things adding up to be greater than the sum of the parts.
Fer instance: My Kawasaki 600R had the spark plugs *directly* beneath the frame tubes. It took a special $65 wrench to remove them... after you took off all the fairings, and removed the gas tank (careful not to spill!). Want to work on the engine while it's running, to tune? No problem. Remove all the fairings, remove the gas tank, place it on a stand the same height (within 2") of the level of where it mounts, hook up a longer gas line (not too long, no more than 4'), re-prime, and then you can get to work. The Duc, OTOH, not only had the engine easy to get to, but the gas tank lifted up on a hinge and had its own kickstand for when you needed to get to the few parts under it.
Windows vs. Mac, Kawasaki/Suzuki/Yamaha/<your brand here> vs. Ducati.
They're persnickety at times (Italian engineering, after all), and the dry clutch freaks the crap outta people for no real reason, but they are amazing pieces of machinery. Riding one is more like melding with the vehicle than being an operator.
Originally posted by Kickaha
Every detail has been thought out, and it makes a unified whole that is just unbelievably nice. It's all the little things adding up to be greater than the sum of the parts.
I've heard that about Ducati. My uncle once had one stolen from him (I'm talking 20 years ago) and he's still in pain.
Windows vs. Mac, Kawasaki/Suzuki/Yamaha/<your brand here> vs. Ducati.
My brand being Honda (it is, but was that your conscious move? - it's just my first bike, nothing too powerful to start with. Although it's been 23.000 kilometers now). I don't know if I can agree with that comparison. You'll have to admit that the R1 (and Honda's CBR before it), has been on the receiving end of a lot of critical acclaim. Yet, I never rode either of them (well, I do ride an YZF from time to time, from back when that was still Thunder-xxx), so I have no right to mingle. Ducati's do come at a high premium, no? Even in Europe, they outprice most of its Japanese competitors (the Germans are in another category, really). I can only cringe at what that goodness (?!) would cost in the US. How fast can you legally drive it?
Originally posted by der Kopf
I've heard that about Ducati. My uncle once had one stolen from him (I'm talking 20 years ago) and he's still in pain.
As was mine, 6 years ago, and yes, I feel his pain.
My brand being Honda (it is, but was that your conscious move? - it's just my first bike, nothing too powerful to start with. Although it's been 23.000 kilometers now). I don't know if I can agree with that comparison. You'll have to admit that the R1 (and Honda's CBR before it), has been on the receiving end of a lot of critical acclaim.
Yep. So have the Alienware Gaming PCs.
Yet, I never rode either of them (well, I do ride an YZF from time to time, from back when that was still Thunder-xxx), so I have no right to mingle. Ducati's do come at a high premium, no? Even in Europe, they outprice most of its Japanese competitors (the Germans are in another category, really). I can only cringe at what that goodness (?!) would cost in the US. How fast can you legally drive it?
As long as it's faster than the cop...
Yeah, they're pricey. Yeah, you pay a premium.
You get what you pay for, IMNSHO. I own a Mac. I want another Ducati. I like quality, aesthetics, and holistic products. Call me crazy.
Originally posted by _ alliance _
haha, no big deal. just the normal accusation of theft. the moron thought i stole a cd because he didnt see me put it down. i picked it up 5 minutes later and purchased it, but he didnt notice that part. he didnt even notice my mom holding it as we walked to the car, which is where he chased me down to question me. if we hadnt actually purchased it, i would have been arrested for theft. woulda been worth it though--false arrest would have gotten me at least a 100k. oh well...
Back in the day of a retailer named "Blockbuster Music" I had gotten out my wallet to see if I had enough cash to purchase a CD. I looked and indeed I had enough. I put the wallet back in my pocket. I was approached by two employees of the store one being the manager I believe the other one who thought that I was putting a CD in my pocket. I had not done anything wrong and was still inside the building and not even left the building. I believe alliance with all due respect that one day you will go through some difficult times as you had not the capacity to get over your situation with Wal-Mart. I am no fan of wal-mart in any sense but I can say for sure that I realize wal-mart is a target to shop-lifters. For you to to file a lawsuit for any $ amount is less than mature and less than who you could be.
I am very disapointed in you and I realize you do not live to "live up to my standards" I respect that completely but what standards do you live for?
Forgiveness is something lost by our culture and it is really sad.
To directly address your question of the thread I would reply by saying give the money back to wal-mart and move on with your life. That is the best thing you can do with that money.
With respect and peace,
Fellowship
Originally posted by FellowshipChurch iBook
Back in the day of a retailer named "Blockbuster Music" I had gotten out my wallet to see if I had enough cash to purchase a CD. I looked and indeed I had enough. I put the wallet back in my pocket. I was approached by two employees of the store one being the manager I believe the other one who thought that I was putting a CD in my pocket. I had not done anything wrong and was still inside the building and not even left the building. I believe alliance with all due respect that one day you will go through some difficult times as you had not the capacity to get over your situation with Wal-Mart. I am no fan of wal-mart in any sense but I can say for sure that I realize wal-mart is a target to shop-lifters. For you to to file a lawsuit for any $ amount is less than mature and less than who you could be.
I am very disapointed in you and I realize you do not live to "live up to my standards" I respect that completely but what standards do you live for?
Forgiveness is something lost by our culture and it is really sad.
To directly address your question of the thread I would reply by saying give the money back to wal-mart and move on with your life. That is the best thing you can do with that money.
With respect and peace,
Fellowship
I, for one, enormously appreciate Fellowship's honesty. False-accusations of shoplifting aren't exclusive to Wal-Mart. But I think he's misguided in suggesting Alliance give the money back to a ruthless retailer intent on treating its customers with utmost paranoia and disdain. The bottom-line is that Wal-Mart only cares about two things: its bottom-line and its conservative agenda. It's a non-unionized, sexist retailer convicted of even robbing its own employees of overtime pay. I doubt that giving the money back to Wal-Mart is in anyone's best interests but Wal-Mart.
On the same note, in spite of forgiveness, never shopping at Wal-Mart again is probably the most agreeable solution to those who actually oppose lawsuits.
"Convenience and cheap prices come with hidden costs." -SF Chronicle.
Originally posted by ShawnJ
I, for one, enormously appreciate Fellowship's honesty. But I think he's misguided
We are all guided by different things. Some spiratual, some by what they can "blow" $2,000 on and yet others guided by completely different things. I just suggest people find guidence that is lasting and not temporary. Guidence that has real meaning and joy.
Fellows
Originally posted by FellowshipChurch iBook
We are all guided by different things. Some spiratual, some by what they can "blow" $2,000 on and yet others guided by completely different things. I just suggest people find guidence that is lasting and not temporary. Guidence that has real meaning and joy.
Fellows
For $2000 one of the Moonlite Bunny Ranch Ladies (As seen on HBO!) can guide Alliance.
Originally posted by FellowshipChurch iBook
Back in the day of a retailer named "Blockbuster Music" I had gotten out my wallet to see if I had enough cash to purchase a CD. I looked and indeed I had enough. I put the wallet back in my pocket. I was approached by two employees of the store one being the manager I believe the other one who thought that I was putting a CD in my pocket. I had not done anything wrong and was still inside the building and not even left the building. I believe alliance with all due respect that one day you will go through some difficult times as you had not the capacity to get over your situation with Wal-Mart. I am no fan of wal-mart in any sense but I can say for sure that I realize wal-mart is a target to shop-lifters. For you to to file a lawsuit for any $ amount is less than mature and less than who you could be.
I am very disapointed in you and I realize you do not live to "live up to my standards" I respect that completely but what standards do you live for?
Forgiveness is something lost by our culture and it is really sad.
To directly address your question of the thread I would reply by saying give the money back to wal-mart and move on with your life. That is the best thing you can do with that money.
With respect and peace,
Fellowship
haha
first of all, i didnt file a lawsuit, but filed a complaint. this in itself is considered a threat for suit according to their lawyers. second, the kid who approached us outside the store had no validity to even talk to me regarding the issue. these stores have protocals to deal with these situations, you know. this states that the employee must actually SEE the customer put merchandise on the person. now, the employee did not see this, and thus should never have even thought about pursuing me. also, we were carrying the bag, which was shaped like a cd. he was obviously a moron to not notice this. also, he lost track of me for a good 15 minutes while i was in the store until i left it. you cannot lose track of someone and then find them again outside w/ no evidence nor any legal basis for harassing a customer once he leaves the store. what he did was illegal and i have no moral objection for protesting it. he singled me out because i look young, and thus i must be guilty. i have also been singled out while driving numerous times and given many hundreds of dollars where i otherwise would not have been accused if i looked older. i am an easy target: plain and simple. therefore, i do not feel bad about taking back a small sum which walmart will not even notice. someone has to get them to straighten out their employees, just as someone needs to improve the quality of street cops (at least where i live). i can do my part to help keep this kind of thing from happening, but i have no power to stop other problems, so...i am obliged to at least give them a fight. no one else does--most people are spineless and feel this is petty. thats bullsh*t. i dont like being harassed. you insult me because i stand up for myself?? well then screw you.
Originally posted by _ alliance _
you insult me because i stand up for myself?? well then screw you.
I did not intend to insult you as you say. I simply made a case that the best thing you can do with that money is give it back to wal-mart.
If you do decide to keep it that is your business. You did ask a question with your thread and I answered it with my reply.
I never insulted you and I am sorry if you felt I did.
It seems to me you are very particular about things going your way.
I was once young as well.
Peace,
Fellowship
Originally posted by FellowshipChurch iBook
It seems to me you are very particular about things going your way.
hah! arrogance, it seems, does not fade with age.
Originally posted by _ alliance _
hah! arrogance, it seems, does not fade with age.
Touché!
Originally posted by _ alliance _
i appologize for my harsh tone. but i'm just sick and tired of laying down for authority that has no right to make judgements, and equally tired of being harassed for fighting back occasionally.
No sweat man
I have learned from my own doings in days past and have realized some things. I am by no means the authority on any subject but I see you as a bright young man and I wish the world for you and only tell you what I would hope you can use to your advantage not as insult at all.
Best intentions alliance
Fellows
I had gone to Boston with my sister not long ago and it was the first time we had each flown since 9/11.
We were leaving Dallas Fort Worth International Airport headed for Boston Logan and when we got to DFW and had the luggage checked in we then made our way to security and had to remove our shoes and be wanded over. My sister had a sour and bitter attitude about "having to remove her shoes" she complained about how unsanitary that is and how unneccessary it is. She was sour about it and quite frankly she was not being reasonable. When it came time to leave Boston after the trip we did the same security but Boston Logan style and it was much more intense. Same shoes off and all but more. This time she thanked the security people for ensuring the safty of passengers.
As we learn we learn.
Understanding and wisdom are worth more than Gold.
Fellowship
But I was going to suggest something a bit different. Drive a uhaul into central pennsylvania and load it up with 150+ cases of Yuengling. That should hold you over.
Yeah, a Desmodue engine, with two .45L cylinder pistons slamming back and forth at 9kRPM has a beautiful *roar* to it.
But the noise that comes out from a novice trying to baby the dry clutch... *shudder*