Maybe some of you should understand the physiology before so strenuously slamming something or another. Especially you Powerdoc.
It looks like none of you know the family of drugs which has Ritalin as a member is not a depressant or depressant, but actually a stimulant. Nobody who needs ritalin gets "doped up", quite the opposite, they get more spun up, but now have enough resources to practice self control without thinking about it. The stimulant allows a brain which usually under-produces dopamine, to maintain normal dopamine levels. If you are short on dopamine you cannot properly concentrate.
Who in this thread has suggested anything even remotely resembling the idea that ritalin is a depressant, or anything but a stimulant, which I think everyone knows?
The dopamine hypothesis is the current, very tentative theory, but the fact is, neither the physiological underpinnings of ADHD nor the mechanisms through which ritalin relieves its symptoms are really understood. Not nearly as well as anti-depressants or anti-psychotics for example.
Pretty close to 100% of American parents spank their children. Do you have any evidence that spankings have decreased? And all the evidence I've seen demonstrates that spanking is associated with lack of self-control in children, not increased self-control.
Maybe some of you should understand the physiology before so strenuously slamming something or another. Especially you Powerdoc.
I just say this :
Quote:
ritilin is good for real cases, cases who are in fact extremely rare. Kids are wonderful but really annoying some times : it's not reason to drug them with pills
I say it was good for real cases. I do not have precise statistics in mind, but ADD/ADHD only concern far less than 1% of the kids. It means that in a school, they should be not more than 2 or 3 kids under ritilin.
One of my wife's patient was in real trouble in class, and was a real case of ADD/ADHD. After seeing a specialised doctor, he was put under Ritilin, and now life is much better for him.
I will even say that parents refuse to put a child who really suffer from ADD/ADHD under ritilin are silly : the child will lose all chances to sucess in life, due to a very bad course of study.
But putting nearly a whole class under ritilin is a shame. Taking let's say morphin because you have huge pains, is different from taking morphin just for the fun of it. I am not against drug, i am against unnecessary use of drugs.
When the chemistry of someone is abnormal, try to reequilibrate it is good, when this chemistry is good, try to enhance it is doping.
For the stimulation, no one said that ritilin was depressant, and act like a neuroleptic who tend to calm people.
If a member of your family is put under ritilin for a good reason, there is no absolutely reason to be ashame of it (in fact just the contrary),but if it's simply for personal convenience you should be ready to face negative comments.
Pretty close to 100% of American parents spank their children. Do you have any evidence that spankings have decreased? And all the evidence I've seen demonstrates that spanking is associated with lack of self-control in children, not increased self-control.
And capitol punishment down?
Close to 100%? I seldom hear of children being spanked. What is the definition of spanked in that survey? Is it have you ever spanked, even one time?
For American parents, 94% say they have spanked their pre-school age child. The average that spankers spank is 1-2 times per month.
If you're interested in a comprehensive parent-report survey on spanking that gets into all the details, here's the best:
Strauss, M. A. & Stewart, J. H. (1999). Corporal punishment by American parents: National data on prevalence, chronicity, severity, and duration, in relation to child and family characteristics. Clinical Child and Family Psychology Review, 2, 55-70.
That's where I got those data above, but I couldn't find a copy of the full paper online.
I just find it interesting that Americans are more punitive than any other industrialized country, and yet what is our response to our higher rate of social problems? It must be to get even more punitive still! It really makes no sense. Violence is up? Increase capital punishment even further, and let's get even less careful about making sure we don't execute the innocent! That'll change our culture for the better!
In my view, spanking is like meds. Parenting is hard; there is no quick and easy fix. You can get an immediate, visible reaction out of your child with spanking, and yet in the long-run it may backfire. Same with meds. Meds will fix 'em, and yet we don't really know what the long-term consequences of these drugs are for children. And like spanking, children on psychiatric meds is virtually unheard of in countries that have much fewer behavior problems than the US.
This page has a debate among research psychologists about whether spanking is harmful. The anti- side has a ton of evidence that spanking is at least correlated with increased aggression and less internalization - spanking teaches the child to try to avoid punishment, but not much else.
The pro- side says "well, if it's done infrequently and not very severely, it really doesn't have any negative consequences." Hardly a ringing endorsement. And that's from the pro- side.
Comments
hrmmm maybe there's a corrolation (sp?)
too much of ANYTHING is a bad thing whether it be spankings, sex, pills, or ice cream.
here in america its either balls to the wall or nothing at all... things just got to change, people need to slow down.
Originally posted by AirSluf
Maybe some of you should understand the physiology before so strenuously slamming something or another. Especially you Powerdoc.
It looks like none of you know the family of drugs which has Ritalin as a member is not a depressant or depressant, but actually a stimulant. Nobody who needs ritalin gets "doped up", quite the opposite, they get more spun up, but now have enough resources to practice self control without thinking about it. The stimulant allows a brain which usually under-produces dopamine, to maintain normal dopamine levels. If you are short on dopamine you cannot properly concentrate.
Who in this thread has suggested anything even remotely resembling the idea that ritalin is a depressant, or anything but a stimulant, which I think everyone knows?
The dopamine hypothesis is the current, very tentative theory, but the fact is, neither the physiological underpinnings of ADHD nor the mechanisms through which ritalin relieves its symptoms are really understood. Not nearly as well as anti-depressants or anti-psychotics for example.
Originally posted by kraig911
spankings, capitol punishment down... crazy kids, child attributed crime ( school shootings ) up...
hrmmm maybe there's a corrolation (sp?)
Pretty close to 100% of American parents spank their children. Do you have any evidence that spankings have decreased? And all the evidence I've seen demonstrates that spanking is associated with lack of self-control in children, not increased self-control.
And capitol punishment down?
Originally posted by AirSluf
Maybe some of you should understand the physiology before so strenuously slamming something or another. Especially you Powerdoc.
I just say this :
ritilin is good for real cases, cases who are in fact extremely rare. Kids are wonderful but really annoying some times : it's not reason to drug them with pills
I say it was good for real cases. I do not have precise statistics in mind, but ADD/ADHD only concern far less than 1% of the kids. It means that in a school, they should be not more than 2 or 3 kids under ritilin.
One of my wife's patient was in real trouble in class, and was a real case of ADD/ADHD. After seeing a specialised doctor, he was put under Ritilin, and now life is much better for him.
I will even say that parents refuse to put a child who really suffer from ADD/ADHD under ritilin are silly : the child will lose all chances to sucess in life, due to a very bad course of study.
But putting nearly a whole class under ritilin is a shame. Taking let's say morphin because you have huge pains, is different from taking morphin just for the fun of it. I am not against drug, i am against unnecessary use of drugs.
When the chemistry of someone is abnormal, try to reequilibrate it is good, when this chemistry is good, try to enhance it is doping.
For the stimulation, no one said that ritilin was depressant, and act like a neuroleptic who tend to calm people.
If a member of your family is put under ritilin for a good reason, there is no absolutely reason to be ashame of it (in fact just the contrary),but if it's simply for personal convenience you should be ready to face negative comments.
Originally posted by BRussell
Pretty close to 100% of American parents spank their children.
Is he serious? In Australia there's serious talk of any physical punishment being explicitly banned. It's rare enough here now.
Barto
Originally posted by BRussell
Pretty close to 100% of American parents spank their children. Do you have any evidence that spankings have decreased? And all the evidence I've seen demonstrates that spanking is associated with lack of self-control in children, not increased self-control.
And capitol punishment down?
Close to 100%? I seldom hear of children being spanked. What is the definition of spanked in that survey? Is it have you ever spanked, even one time?
Nick
If you're interested in a comprehensive parent-report survey on spanking that gets into all the details, here's the best:
Strauss, M. A. & Stewart, J. H. (1999). Corporal punishment by American parents: National data on prevalence, chronicity, severity, and duration, in relation to child and family characteristics. Clinical Child and Family Psychology Review, 2, 55-70.
That's where I got those data above, but I couldn't find a copy of the full paper online.
I just find it interesting that Americans are more punitive than any other industrialized country, and yet what is our response to our higher rate of social problems? It must be to get even more punitive still! It really makes no sense. Violence is up? Increase capital punishment even further, and let's get even less careful about making sure we don't execute the innocent! That'll change our culture for the better!
In my view, spanking is like meds. Parenting is hard; there is no quick and easy fix. You can get an immediate, visible reaction out of your child with spanking, and yet in the long-run it may backfire. Same with meds. Meds will fix 'em, and yet we don't really know what the long-term consequences of these drugs are for children. And like spanking, children on psychiatric meds is virtually unheard of in countries that have much fewer behavior problems than the US.
This page has a debate among research psychologists about whether spanking is harmful. The anti- side has a ton of evidence that spanking is at least correlated with increased aggression and less internalization - spanking teaches the child to try to avoid punishment, but not much else.
The pro- side says "well, if it's done infrequently and not very severely, it really doesn't have any negative consequences." Hardly a ringing endorsement. And that's from the pro- side.
Originally posted by Giaguara
1-3 kids per year, you say. i'm not pro behaviour changing meds either, but how many adults use similar pills too? too many.
take a pill and be happy.
learn to deal. and teach your kids to deal...
i disagree. i guess you've never been depressed. Zoftloft,Paxil etc work
these drugs don't solve your problems, but they make them easier to deal with.
i agrree that they 'might' over prescibe for children but some children need these drugs
maybe if parents didn't let there kids play violent video games, they'd be better off too