Apple's got the swagger....

Posted:
in General Discussion edited January 2014
I was just reading a report of the analyst meeting yesterday and it occurred to me that Apple's got a lot of confidence right now. I don't remember it being like this in the past few years. I LIKE IT. Some choice quotes:



"There's no reason to make IPod work with other [online music] services right now. It's the number one-selling MP3 player in the world, even compared to little cheap devices like flash MP3 players that hold seven songs,"



"Why should IPods work with another music store when they work with the Microsoft of music stores?"



"Apple is as good or better a manufacturer as Dell," Jobs said. "We beat them every quarter on operational metrics. We aren't worried on being beaten on manufacturing or operational efficiency."



"They hope to be in 2006 where we were with Jaguar,"



I realize that this was an analyst meeting and it's all about puffing out your chest but this is more swagger than I've seen in a long time. Apple's feeling pretty invulnerable right now. The iPod has been a huge hit and it's accounting for 7% of the company's revenue. With iTunes for Windows out, I'd expect that to be in the low teens this quarter.



Can they maintain this momentum?
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 26
    applenutapplenut Posts: 5,768member
    confidence is good, cockiness and overconfidence is not....and that has hurt apple in the past.





    apple is doing well, but they are also doing very poorly in many areas.



    good to see, but there is still a lot to be done.



    Jobs is a genius, it's taking a long time for his "vision" of Apple to play out but I think we are beginning to see what he has been shaping for several years now. and it's pretty effing cool.
  • Reply 2 of 26
    Quote:

    Originally posted by applenut

    confidence is good, cockiness and overconfidence is not....and that has hurt apple in the past.





    apple is doing well, but they are also doing very poorly in many areas.



    good to see, but there is still a lot to be done.



    Jobs is a genius, it's taking a long time for his "vision" of Apple to play out but I think we are beginning to see what he has been shaping for several years now. and it's pretty effing cool.




    I was thinking the same thing about the cockiness issue. I don't think that they are being cocky right now. I hope they don't start any time soon. That means continuing to push the iPod like there's no tomorrow and for fvck's sake hype OS X. It's the best thing that's happened to a consumer OS in recent memory. Why is it that no one knows about it???
  • Reply 3 of 26
    ipeonipeon Posts: 1,122member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by applenut

    Jobs is a genius, it's taking a long time for his "vision" of Apple to play out but I think we are beginning to see what he has been shaping for several years now. and it's pretty effing cool.



    He basically had to rebuild Apple. He knows how to get it done. Had he been with Apple all along, the Mac OS would be the #1 OS and not Windows. It takes a LOT of work to undue what has been done, or should I say, not been done at Apple.
  • Reply 4 of 26
    amorphamorph Posts: 7,112member
    Jobs was a terrible manager the first time around. There were all kinds of horror stories. The decade he spent wandering in the wilderness gave him some badly needed experience and perspective.



    The analyst's meeting gave me the impression of confidence, not cockiness (example: Jobs crowed about iPod's and iTunes' market position as a reason not to make them more broadly compatible right now. That's confidence. Had he been cocky, he'd have dismissed the possibility that compatibility would ever be needed). They know they're executing well, they know they've pulled off some serious accomplishments, and they know this because they keep their eyes firmly on the factual data. So they also know where they're not strong, and they can say with some confidence that they know how to address those areas. In education, for example, they're taking the long view by addressing the fastest growing and most effective trend, even though it's not giving them results now. This is the kind of patience that confidence allows.



    As long as they continue to invest conservatively, research heavily, and keep their eyes on the road, they'll be able to sustain their current momentum. Their apparent ruthlessness in logistics and manufacturing won't hurt either.
  • Reply 5 of 26
    ipeonipeon Posts: 1,122member
    Steve may have been a bit rough around the edges back then, however at the same time I can see his frustration at trying to lead people that just don't get it. Visionaries are at odds with the rest who aren't there yet. They may even seem rude and crazy to the average person, but to such visionaries, the average person is always getting in their way - it takes great patience having to always explain what you clearly see to someone that will never see it until it's done.
  • Reply 6 of 26
    smirclesmircle Posts: 1,035member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by iPeon

    Steve may have been a bit rough around the edges back then, however at the same time I can see his frustration at trying to lead people that just don't get it. Visionaries are at odds with the rest who aren't there yet. They may even seem rude and crazy to the average person, but to such visionaries, the average person is always getting in their way - it takes great patience having to always explain what you clearly see to someone that will never see it until it's done.





    One of the key problems back then was not the way he interacted with employees and colleagues, but how he tried to boss the market around. And we know how that ended.
  • Reply 7 of 26
    ipeonipeon Posts: 1,122member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Smircle

    One of the key problems back then was not the way he interacted with employees and colleagues, but how he tried to boss the market around. And we know how that ended.



    Not sure what you mean by "boss the market around", my take on it was that he was backstabbed by a few people within Apple who wanted to take control of Apple. They where successful in doing that, but not so successful at taking Apple to greater heights. Apple was almost dead when Steve reentered the scene. This time around Apple's Board of Directors didn't much object to Steve's ideas. Many disagree with his policies, but history shows that he knows what he's doing. Apple had to nearly die so Steve could have free reign over the company he created. Hence my dislike for "group thinkingness." If you want to ruin a company, elect a bunch of "experts" to run it.
  • Reply 8 of 26
    progmacprogmac Posts: 1,850member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by iPeon

    Not sure what you mean by "boss the market around", my take on it was that he was backstabbed by a few people within Apple who wanted to take control of Apple. They where successful in doing that, but not so successful at taking Apple to greater heights. Apple was almost dead when Steve reentered the scene. This time around Apple's Board of Directors didn't much object to Steve's ideas. Many disagree with his policies, but history shows that he knows what he's doing. Apple had to nearly die so Steve could have free reign over the company he created. Hence my dislike for "group thinkingness." If you want to ruin a company, elect a bunch of "experts" to run it.



    During the "dead" period of Apple is when their OS was the most useable. Kind of odd, no?
  • Reply 9 of 26
    Quote:

    Originally posted by progmac

    During the "dead" period of Apple is when their OS was the most useable. Kind of odd, no?



    Most useable? Hmm. I beg to differ. While OS X isn't as user-friendly, it's infinitely more useable now than it ever was. On a daily basis, I've got more going on than ever could have been handled by the classic OS. That's more usability in my book. Just because it's not as "friendly" or "nice" doesn't make it any less useable. But that's another thread entirely.
  • Reply 10 of 26
    progmacprogmac Posts: 1,850member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by pensieve

    Most useable? Hmm. I beg to differ. While OS X isn't as user-friendly, it's infinitely more useable now than it ever was. On a daily basis, I've got more going on than ever could have been handled by the classic OS. That's more usability in my book. Just because it's not as "friendly" or "nice" doesn't make it any less useable. But that's another thread entirely.





    let's keep it this way
  • Reply 11 of 26
    amorphamorph Posts: 7,112member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Smircle

    One of the key problems back then was not the way he interacted with employees and colleagues, but how he tried to boss the market around. And we know how that ended.



    The way he treated employees and colleagues got him in a lot of trouble as well. Employees who built products he didn't like got treated like dirt; employees who built products he liked - note built, not designed; I'm talking about assembly line workers - got massages and other luxuries. And these people worked in the same plants, often on opposite sides of the same line. That's not impatience with people who don't share your vision, it's just petulance.



    Apple's most egregious abuse of the market came after Steve was gone. Gassée did a tremendous amount of damage, for one, and then there's Spindler...



    Anyway, thanks to some clever boffins who reverse-engineered IBM's BIOS, the PC market was sent lurching in a direction that has left most people with shriveled and defeated expectations for what a personal computer should be, how it should behave, and what it should be capable of. Sometimes - no, frequently - the market is stupid, and you just have to let it find out the hard way before it comes back around to a sensible solution. In this case, it's beginning to come around to the realization that you can't divorce operating systems from hardware without both becoming either stagnant or fragmented, and ill-fitting in any case. And Steve's showing them all how it's done.
  • Reply 12 of 26
    powerdocpowerdoc Posts: 8,122member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Amorph

    The way he treated employees and colleagues got him in a lot of trouble as well. Employees who built products he didn't like got treated like dirt; employees who built products he liked - note built, not designed; I'm talking about assembly line workers - got massages and other luxuries. And these people worked in the same plants, often on opposite sides of the same line. That's not impatience with people who don't share your vision, it's just petulance.



    .




    Yes it was pretty lame. Even if Jobs is a genius, i will never been a fan of him. I can share his vision, but i can't love the man.
  • Reply 13 of 26
    stoostoo Posts: 1,490member
    Quote:

    During the "dead" period of Apple is when their OS was the most useable. Kind of odd, no?



    Well, the Classic Mac OS had been about for 16ish years before Mac OS X came along.
  • Reply 14 of 26
    Quote:

    Originally posted by pensieve

    I was just reading a report of the analyst meeting yesterday and it occurred to me that Apple's got a lot of confidence right now. I don't remember it being like this in the past few years. I LIKE IT. Some choice quotes:



    "There's no reason to make IPod work with other [online music] services right now. It's the number one-selling MP3 player in the world, even compared to little cheap devices like flash MP3 players that hold seven songs,"



    "Why should IPods work with another music store when they work with the Microsoft of music stores?"



    "Apple is as good or better a manufacturer as Dell," Jobs said. "We beat them every quarter on operational metrics. We aren't worried on being beaten on manufacturing or operational efficiency."



    "They hope to be in 2006 where we were with Jaguar,"



    I realize that this was an analyst meeting and it's all about puffing out your chest but this is more swagger than I've seen in a long time. Apple's feeling pretty invulnerable right now. The iPod has been a huge hit and it's accounting for 7% of the company's revenue. With iTunes for Windows out, I'd expect that to be in the low teens this quarter.



    Can they maintain this momentum?




    Basically, analysts are very stupid people, I have dealt with them, very very stupid, and they also ask stupid questions and make stupid statements, so thats kinda how you have to talk to them,be kinda tough and cocky, because they are the ones that actually are wrong 99.7% of the time, yet tell people what to do... IE, he was answering stupid questions from analysts and kinda answering them in a way like "What? are you stupid??!"
  • Reply 15 of 26
    Has anyone actually listened to the audio stream for this call? Steve doesn't sound arrogant at all. He seems very level-headed, yet confident (what do you expect?)



    It was a different Steve than you often hear tale of.
  • Reply 16 of 26
    ipeonipeon Posts: 1,122member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by progmac

    During the "dead" period of Apple is when their OS was the most useable. Kind of odd, no?



    Most usable? To what exactly are you referring to? That OS was set in motion by Steve, Woz and a few others at Apple. The Mac. It was that seed that kept Apple going up until it ran out of steam. The lack of innovative spirit will kill even the greatest of things.



    I read and hear many complaining about it all, but see few actually doing something that makes a difference. That's the problem with this planet, people support those that further enslave everyone.
  • Reply 17 of 26
    All I have to say:



    Everyone I know who is buying a new computer is buying a mac, and I know a lot of people. The G5, the powerbooks, and OS X have really impressed a lot of people. It's to the point where the guys at the office -- the engineers, no less -- see me working on my powerbook (with large LCD panel sonnected to it as well) and say "I really want a mac." And that's all because of OS X. . . these engineering types I'm talking about don't think about design too much.
  • Reply 18 of 26
    I think that we're seeing a big transition from the old days of the mac when it was nice and user-friendly but unstable and lacking in certain increasingly important features to days when the mac is going to start being perceived as a powerful, stable system that can be hard (gasp!) to get.* It reminds me of that thread in the OS X forum "I've never seen a mac crash!" in that way. But there's still a lot of work to be done getting that new mac image out there to those who are making computer purchasing decisions (the adults who are a little older than me and remember the mac as the unstable mess that it was back when we were growing up).



    *I blame MS for this perception. They've got the vast majority of people doing things in ways that the old mac OS taught us. When making the transition to OS X, it could seem hard because THEY'VE got to relearn how to use a computer after being taught the "MS" (read: cheap knock-off of the classic Mac OS) way. This wasn't such a problem for the classic Mac OS because Windows had a lot of the same conventions.



    I further blame MS for the animosity many people feel towards computers. My non-techie friends view their computers with disdain and they have a hard time understanding why I love my computer the way I do. But, yet that's another thread....
  • Reply 19 of 26
    screedscreed Posts: 1,077member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Chris Cuilla

    Has anyone actually listened to the audio stream for this call? Steve doesn't sound arrogant at all. He seems very level-headed, yet confident (what do you expect?)



    It was a different Steve than you often hear tale of.




    Nope. In independent test it's been proven that the RDF(tm) can be transmitted even over compressed audio.



    He's that charming.



    Screed



    BTW, I just saw the Virginia Tech "Big Mac" cluster get a mention on the CNN ticker. Woo, five whole seconds of free advertisement.
  • Reply 20 of 26
    ipeonipeon Posts: 1,122member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by pensieve

    I think that we're seeing a big transition from the old days of the mac when it was nice and user-friendly...



    Haaa, I see. So your frustration is with OS 9 vs OS X. I will tell you, I was one of the loudest complainers on these boards when I first experienced OS X Beta. Man, for me the Mac had been killed. But I trusted it would be made right and toke a proactive approach by sending Apple what I wanted to see in OS X. They listened to us all and they fixed it. With 10.2 I was finally happy. I now LOVE OS X. I'm a guy who has used Macs every since version 1.
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