Uninstalling programs
I'm a recent PC-to-Mac convert, and I'm not sure I'm figuring out the whole uninstallation thing. First, I'll recap on how the PC does it, and then ask if what I'm doing on my iBook G4 is right.
So when you install a program on a PC, it dumps files and crap EVERYWHERE on your hard drive. That's why it is necessary to have uninstallers, because they *supposedly* know where everything is and how to remove it safely.
HOWEVER, on my mac, many of the programs I've downloaded (i.e. poisoned) tend to not even have an uninstaller that I can find, or even a directory of files in the applications folder. So I've been just deleting the programs and any associated folders, because I think they don't have an uninstaller.
Is it really just this simple?
Thomas
So when you install a program on a PC, it dumps files and crap EVERYWHERE on your hard drive. That's why it is necessary to have uninstallers, because they *supposedly* know where everything is and how to remove it safely.
HOWEVER, on my mac, many of the programs I've downloaded (i.e. poisoned) tend to not even have an uninstaller that I can find, or even a directory of files in the applications folder. So I've been just deleting the programs and any associated folders, because I think they don't have an uninstaller.
Is it really just this simple?
Thomas
Comments
See Uninstalling Apps on Mac OS X.
Yup, it's really THAT simple.
Mac OS X differs from Windows in how applications work on a couple of levels.
For one, Mac OS X doesn't have a registry. There's nothing even closely analogous to it. Applications do not have to register their location or anything like that to work. Application settings and preferences are stored individually per app as "Property List" files in the user's Library/Preferences folder. Sometimes apps may keep additional support files in the user's Library folder, but these are completely inert. They are only accessed by the parent app itself.
Second, Mac OS X apps are almost *always* stored in what Apple calls "bundles" or "packages". The user never sees any more to the app than just the icon itself (unless he intentionally starts digging around for info). That icon for the application is actually a special type of folder, but the system treats it as a single whole application. Inside that bundle icon, applications store everything from the executable code to graphics, sounds, icons, interface files, multiple language support files, and any additional resources the app may need. This eliminated the confusion and danger of storing other essential data files that are part of the app anywhere else on the drive. Now, everything the app needs to run is tucked nicely away within the app's icon itself.
(If you're curious about this, take any app like iTunes or Safari, control-click or right-click it, and choose Show Package Contents. Feel free to peek around in the app. Just be sure not to change anything unless you know what you're doing!)
The best way I have found of explaining the difference between uninstalling apps on a Mac versus on Windows is by showing how to uninstall Internet Explorer from a Mac. Here's a video detailing the process:
http://brad.project-think.com/movies/uninstalling.mov (~835 KB)
Try doing that with IE on a Windows machine.
The only things an app may leave behind after you've trashed it are its preferences and support files in one of the Library folders. However, as I mentioned above, this will not impact your system's performance with the exception of taking up a small bit of hard drive space. These files are inert and will not affect other programs or the system software itself. In the top-level Library are support files that would affect all users. In your home Library folder are the support files that affect only your user.
In the Library's Preferences folder is where most apps will stick their single preference file. The names of these files may be intimidating at first, but they're all logically done. An example:
com.apple.AddressBook.plist
The first part is like an internet address's ".com"; this example is from a business. Other common ones are org and country codes like uk or de. The second part is the software maker's name. The third is the software's title. The fourth is the filename extension, showing that this is a "Property List" file.
I usually leave any Library files where they are in case I ever decide to reinstall that program. Keeping them does no harm to the system and gives me the added benefit that the program will remember its settings if I reinstall later.
So, in summary: No registry mess, no "dll hell", no hidden files strewn across your drive. Just drag to the trash and be done with it.
I'd venture to say that literally as much as 99% of Mac software doesn't need an uninstaller. Apps that truly need a special uninstall process are in the extreme minority.
Originally posted by torifile
Perhaps a sticky on this topic would be apropos? It seems to come up with great regularity. Brad, maybe you can put your little movie up on the AI server so that it doesn't disappear if you decide to clean house?
I was gonna say... brad, do you keep a copy of your above post as an rtf somewhere? Or do you really type it out anew every few days
Yeah, I have been answering this question quite frequently these days. It's enough, in fact, that I've even made my own web page "Uninstalling Apps on Mac OS X" from which I can copy-and-paste information or just as a place I can send new users like Thomas.
Don't worry about the movie file going anywhere.
I mean, It's sort of weird. I know how to navigate my way out of .dll hell. I understand how to search the registry and remove all of those horrible files!
It's refreshing to know that I don't even need to do that now.
Maybe formatting and reloading will be just that simple.
Thomas
I just trashed the app, then used Find File and typed in AOL and everything that showed up I trashed.
You can catch them by just doing a finder search for the application's name, highlighting everything you see in the results, and pressing Command-Delete, as Steve666 pointed out.
Drive / Library / Application Support
Home / Library / Application Support
Home / Library / Preferences
For commercial apps, there can be one or two files floating about, or a single folder to add to the trash. Then, just delete and you're done. MS of course, breaks from this convention and stores crap in a fourth location (Home / Documents / MS User Data). Mo-rons. Another exception is Unsanity stuff. I always "uninstall" the last version before installing the new version, but that uninstall basically does exactly what is noted above....
Now if only font management were even easier than the above (like it should be), we'd be all set. Although FontBook gets most users to that point I realize.
If I EVER tried searching for x application and highlighting everything that came up and deleting it, I would be toast on my windows box.
It's good to know that I can just do that. No shared files, nothing. I love it.
Thanks!
Thomas
Frameworks are the MacOS X equivalent of DLLs. In other words, better.
No, seriously, they provide a strong method for getting around/fixing that versioning hell DLLs seem to end up in, and can be used by several apps at once. However, when that happens you'll rarely find the framework named after the app you're trying to delete - possibly named after the company that produced them all, but that's about it. And they are *rare* to find outside third party application bundles... but I thought I'd at least mention them.
Originally posted by Kickaha
...with one caveat.
Frameworks are the MacOS X equivalent of DLLs. In other words, better.
No, seriously, they provide a strong method for getting around/fixing that versioning hell DLLs seem to end up in, and can be used by several apps at once. However, when that happens you'll rarely find the framework named after the app you're trying to delete - possibly named after the company that produced them all, but that's about it. And they are *rare* to find outside third party application bundles... but I thought I'd at least mention them.
Good point, kick. The safest way to delete a program is to just drag it to the trash. If you want to more spring cleaning, searching through *your* home folder is the way to go. If you get outside your home folder and into /Library or (god-forbid and shoot the developers) /System, proceed with caution.
You can prevent this from happening by clicking on your home folder in the finder sidebar and entering your search in the toolbar and search selection. This way you can be sure only safe files show up.
Uninstallers should be available for things that add more than preference files to your system. Some companies do a great job of uninstallers, and Unsanity is an example. As much as I like dragging a folder to the trash, uninstallers are nice to have.
Originally posted by jwill
As much as I like dragging a folder to the trash, uninstallers are nice to have.
Are they really? We've all been programmed through years of exposure to Windows that applications have to be "uninstalled" to be completely gone. That there's some sort of voodoo and magic that occurs when we reboot our computers to get the ghosts out. Personally I think twice about installing an application that requires an uninstaller or my password to install. Many of my day to day use apps should do NOTHING to my system that requires some sort of intricate uninstall procedure.
Give me a nicely packaged .app that I can just drag whereever the hell I want it over a an app with a good uninstaller any day.
This is not Windows. There is no ghost in the machine.
Originally posted by torifile
Personally I think twice about installing an application that requires an uninstaller or my password to install. Many of my day to day use apps should do NOTHING to my system that requires some sort of intricate uninstall procedure.
Same here!
If I come across some new software title that uses a package or installer, I usually leave it sitting untouched on my desktop for a day or two and then it just goes straight to the trash. I don't trust 'em. If they're package installers, I might just use Pacifist to break them open and to extract the contents manually, but otherwise they're a total waste of electrons and get wiped from my drive.
For the vast majority of Mac OS X software, there is no excuse for using an installer. It simply is not necessary and it obfuscates the way the system works.
This is not Windows. There is no ghost in the machine.
Best quote of the day! Almost good enough to replace my current signature.
Originally posted by jwill
Uninstallers should be available for things that add more than preference files to your system.
Agreed.
As much as I like dragging a folder to the trash, uninstallers are nice to have.
If an OS makes you end up needing an uninstaller for every app, it is Windows. There is nothing good in uninstallers.
In fact, there are several ways of distributing software. Most common are:
Originally posted by torifile
This is not Windows. There is no ghost in the machine.
nO KIDDING my mom called aoHELl tech 'support' once in like '97 and they said we couldnt connect because "we had a ghost in our system, he sayd it meant that some unknown problem occoured and it is called a ghost because it is so random, like casper." for a few weeks after that our sad little compaq was called casper
gotta love aol
Now, when an application has an installer, I look for an uninstaller. If it is there, I save the installer/uninstaller for future needs in a special folder. During installation I watch for the dialog box that asks for administrative permissions. This is a sign to me it plans to install stuff into the system. If an installer asks for such permission and does not provide an uninstaller, it may violate the guidelines set down by Apple. I haven't run into this situation yet, but would proceed with extra caution if I did.
Maybe someday all developers will do what many do, which is so simple. They tell me to drag the application to the Applications folder. Nice.