The performance better be improved over the current shit. I can't stand to use the Finder search right now. I type in a couple of letters, and before I'm done, it comes to a stand still, searching through my hard drive, and I can't finish typing the search string. They market it like iTunes, but it's nothing like iTunes. iTunes is instantaneous. This search in Panther brings the computer to a dead stop for many seconds.
With Spotlight, I see the Finder becoming just another app...like iTunes. The Finder will become an app to physically move files around and store them in a spatial (semi-spatial) environment or group them using Smart Folders.
I'm a little surprised it isn't part of the Finder. What's such a big paradigm shift is that when you open a window with the search results, it doesn't open a Finder/Find window, it opens its own type of window, with a sidebar on the right (sort of NeXT-ish, sort of un-Windows XP-ish also). It's truly another app.
Hmm? can you save your searches in other apps or in the spotlight menu item to a Finder smart folder?
Ah, but he's asking if you can save searches entered directly into the Spotlight search bar... to a smart folder in the Finder.
It's not clear yet, but it would make sense. That window that opens up to show more search results from the Spotlight search button sure is odd. I think it's a special window that does exist in the Finder... but very specialized indeed. But who knows, it could belong to a dedicated Spotlight application. It's hard to tell from the preview pages.
Ah, but he's asking if you can save searches entered directly into the Spotlight search bar... to a smart folder in the Finder.
It's not clear yet, but it would make sense. That window that opens up to show more search results from the Spotlight search button sure is odd. I think it's a special window that does exist in the Finder... but very specialized indeed. But who knows, it could belong to a dedicated Spotlight application. It's hard to tell from the preview pages.
I think it's a dedicated Spotlight window not tied to any app. I'd imagine you could essentially remove the Finder completely and still be easily able to find your files.
Like I said, the Finder is now an app like iTunes. Except instead of handling only music files, it handles all files. You get iTunes-like filter capabilities in the new Finder now so it's actually very powerful...but essential? Not anymore.
The Finder will probably remain the only unquittable app and remain in the Dock but I'd imagine this changing by 10.5 or 10.6. The Finder will probably just become a launchable app that doesn't need to be open all the time.
I'm really psyched at what Spotlight will bring. Anyone who doesn't grab 10.4 either can't afford it or are kidding themselves over the idea that they wouldn't need this.
I think this coupled with the Finder for spatial organizing is close to the end-all file browsing method.
Of course, this is probably Apple's last chance to grab a significant amount of marketshare using the OS as a way to drive people over to Macs. Once Longhorn catches up with the search capabilities, it'll be over...no amount of software will ever make people switch.
I thought iLife would open people's eyes but it didn't. Most are still content using shitty unintegrated apps on PCs to try and achieve what can be done on Macs.
Think iChat's U+3 is going to make people switch? Nope, they'll keep using MSN for their slideshow video conferencing needs...and talk to their contacts separately.
The world is ignorant about computers.
I hate everyone for using MSN...if I knew enough people that used AOLIM or enough people that used Macs and iChat, I'd use it all the time. But people are only ready to evolve when MS is ready to evolve. And that's always 2 years after Apple does.
That's the sad truth, MS (and AOL) really does drag down advances in technology and user experience for most consumers anyway.
I waited forever for someone to do a cell phone and get the plan right, but people don't know what they're missing, so there's no push to do it right in that arena either.
Anyway, Hobbes is articulating what I meant better. Can you, for example, use a spotlight search from the system-wide menu item and create a smart folder for the Finder there? Can any app that pulls the spotlight API into itself create smart folders/groups/playlists/thingies as part of that API?
My one concern with the Finder vs Spotlight is user confusion. It might be more of a naming thing than a functional problem, but those two plus Sherlock all are search/find/general organizing apps and I think Apple has to be as clear as possible about how they are distinct and how they can and should communicate with one another. For this reason, I think Tiger's successor might go one further than what kim kap sol is saying and possibly alter what we know as the Finder, relocate some aspects of it to Spotlight, etc. to better fit its new, more limited role. The Finder isn't a one-stop shop for finding and organizing your stuff any more.
Couldn't this open up some privacy issues? I mean, obviously if someone can get to your desktop, they can find anything they wan't ... but this makes walking away from your computer for 5 minutes a potential problem.
What if your boss walks by and quickly types his wifes name in the search field, and all those emails, pictures and movies pop up of her?
Couldn't this open up some privacy issues? I mean, obviously if someone can get to your desktop, they can find anything they wan't ... but this makes walking away from your computer for 5 minutes a potential problem.
What if your boss walks by and quickly types his wifes name in the search field, and all those emails, pictures and movies pop up of her?
LOL. So because it's now easy to find stuff on the computer, your computer info is less safe? I suppose so. Set your screensaver to 1 minute with a password lock.
Couldn't this open up some privacy issues? I mean, obviously if someone can get to your desktop, they can find anything they wan't ... but this makes walking away from your computer for 5 minutes a potential problem.
What if your boss walks by and quickly types his wifes name in the search field, and all those emails, pictures and movies pop up of her?
What if a user is so stupid as to keep anything sensitive not in a protected disk image...hmm, I suppose they would be caught by the boss/missus etc.
Applications: Utilities: Disk Utility: New Image
Name it
Choose location to save it to.
Choose size.
Choose encryption (AES-128 Bit)
Format: Read/Write disk image
Press "Create"
Enter Password at prompt (Don't add password to Keychain)
Double click it
Enter password
Copy pictures of your naked wife to it.
"Eject"/Unmount the disk image.
Now no one can search within it. Not as hard as my line by line description makes it sound.
Just don't forget the password and make sure it is one that isn't already used in a Keychain or website.
Now, should I tell him about EXIF Untrasher?
Psst, hey can I borrow your digital camera for a second?
what the nerds over at ars dont get, is that if this stuff works and appears to the user the same way, it doesnt matter what the underlying technology is.
Don't you presume to know what the nerd(s) at Ars do and don't "get" :-P
When Spotlight finally arrives, I can just throw everything in the Documents folder (I'll be nice and throw music in the Music folder and video in the Video folder...although file location really just doesn't matter anymore) and let Spotlight find the files I want.
I think when you download a file, the finder should automatically place it in an appropriate location. For instance if i download a movie file, it should recognize the extension (.mov or whatever) and just throw it in the movie folder. I don't know if the new metadata system will help this or not
Couldn't this open up some privacy issues? I mean, obviously if someone can get to your desktop, they can find anything they wan't ... but this makes walking away from your computer for 5 minutes a potential problem.
What if your boss walks by and quickly types his wifes name in the search field, and all those emails, pictures and movies pop up of her?
Incorportate biometric security into the mouse. or next to the tracpad. Grab the mouse and you are authenticated.
Incorportate biometric security into the mouse. or next to the tracpad. Grab the mouse and you are authenticated.
I don't know if this is too extreme or not, or how big of a problem it is, but idealy, you should have the option of having to enter an admin password before doing a system wide search.
I think when you download a file, the finder should automatically place it in an appropriate location. For instance if i download a movie file, it should recognize the extension (.mov or whatever) and just throw it in the movie folder. I don't know if the new metadata system will help this or not
no way, as it is you can be asked where you want it to be downloaded and your movie folder is one click away. i dont want it automatically organizing my downloads.... even with the search capabilities.
Siracusa, what's your take on all of this? Is it metadata or not?
I am withholding final judgement until I know more about the system. I'm not at WWDC, so I'm forced to wait for the session streams and/or DVDs...or any scraps that make it to the web from WWDC.
Just happened to think about a future version of iTunes that has lyrics with each song and how you could use Spotlight to find the song you just can?t remember the name of.
Comments
Originally posted by kim kap sol
With Spotlight, I see the Finder becoming just another app...like iTunes. The Finder will become an app to physically move files around and store them in a spatial (semi-spatial) environment or group them using Smart Folders.
I'm a little surprised it isn't part of the Finder. What's such a big paradigm shift is that when you open a window with the search results, it doesn't open a Finder/Find window, it opens its own type of window, with a sidebar on the right (sort of NeXT-ish, sort of un-Windows XP-ish also). It's truly another app.
Hmm? can you save your searches in other apps or in the spotlight menu item to a Finder smart folder?
Yes, you can save your SMART searches in finder's sidebar and more. You can see a demo of all this in the video.
It's not clear yet, but it would make sense. That window that opens up to show more search results from the Spotlight search button sure is odd. I think it's a special window that does exist in the Finder... but very specialized indeed. But who knows, it could belong to a dedicated Spotlight application. It's hard to tell from the preview pages.
Originally posted by Hobbes
Ah, but he's asking if you can save searches entered directly into the Spotlight search bar... to a smart folder in the Finder.
It's not clear yet, but it would make sense. That window that opens up to show more search results from the Spotlight search button sure is odd. I think it's a special window that does exist in the Finder... but very specialized indeed. But who knows, it could belong to a dedicated Spotlight application. It's hard to tell from the preview pages.
I think it's a dedicated Spotlight window not tied to any app. I'd imagine you could essentially remove the Finder completely and still be easily able to find your files.
Like I said, the Finder is now an app like iTunes. Except instead of handling only music files, it handles all files. You get iTunes-like filter capabilities in the new Finder now so it's actually very powerful...but essential? Not anymore.
The Finder will probably remain the only unquittable app and remain in the Dock but I'd imagine this changing by 10.5 or 10.6. The Finder will probably just become a launchable app that doesn't need to be open all the time.
I'm really psyched at what Spotlight will bring. Anyone who doesn't grab 10.4 either can't afford it or are kidding themselves over the idea that they wouldn't need this.
I think this coupled with the Finder for spatial organizing is close to the end-all file browsing method.
Of course, this is probably Apple's last chance to grab a significant amount of marketshare using the OS as a way to drive people over to Macs. Once Longhorn catches up with the search capabilities, it'll be over...no amount of software will ever make people switch.
I thought iLife would open people's eyes but it didn't. Most are still content using shitty unintegrated apps on PCs to try and achieve what can be done on Macs.
Think iChat's U+3 is going to make people switch? Nope, they'll keep using MSN for their slideshow video conferencing needs...and talk to their contacts separately.
The world is ignorant about computers.
I hate everyone for using MSN...if I knew enough people that used AOLIM or enough people that used Macs and iChat, I'd use it all the time. But people are only ready to evolve when MS is ready to evolve. And that's always 2 years after Apple does.
I waited forever for someone to do a cell phone and get the plan right, but people don't know what they're missing, so there's no push to do it right in that arena either.
Anyway, Hobbes is articulating what I meant better. Can you, for example, use a spotlight search from the system-wide menu item and create a smart folder for the Finder there? Can any app that pulls the spotlight API into itself create smart folders/groups/playlists/thingies as part of that API?
My one concern with the Finder vs Spotlight is user confusion. It might be more of a naming thing than a functional problem, but those two plus Sherlock all are search/find/general organizing apps and I think Apple has to be as clear as possible about how they are distinct and how they can and should communicate with one another. For this reason, I think Tiger's successor might go one further than what kim kap sol is saying and possibly alter what we know as the Finder, relocate some aspects of it to Spotlight, etc. to better fit its new, more limited role. The Finder isn't a one-stop shop for finding and organizing your stuff any more.
What if your boss walks by and quickly types his wifes name in the search field, and all those emails, pictures and movies pop up of her?
Originally posted by the cool gut
Couldn't this open up some privacy issues? I mean, obviously if someone can get to your desktop, they can find anything they wan't ... but this makes walking away from your computer for 5 minutes a potential problem.
What if your boss walks by and quickly types his wifes name in the search field, and all those emails, pictures and movies pop up of her?
LOL. So because it's now easy to find stuff on the computer, your computer info is less safe? I suppose so. Set your screensaver to 1 minute with a password lock.
2 column menus, with labels on the left (which would otherwise be dividers within the list)
Logical collapsible dividers for item types as well as nice horizontal rules for each line (coming to the finder finally???)
Nice to see Apple improving the UI to better handle data presentation (Which Windows lately has gotten better at than us).
Originally posted by the cool gut
Couldn't this open up some privacy issues? I mean, obviously if someone can get to your desktop, they can find anything they wan't ... but this makes walking away from your computer for 5 minutes a potential problem.
What if your boss walks by and quickly types his wifes name in the search field, and all those emails, pictures and movies pop up of her?
What if a user is so stupid as to keep anything sensitive not in a protected disk image...hmm, I suppose they would be caught by the boss/missus etc.
Applications: Utilities: Disk Utility: New Image
Name it
Choose location to save it to.
Choose size.
Choose encryption (AES-128 Bit)
Format: Read/Write disk image
Press "Create"
Enter Password at prompt (Don't add password to Keychain)
Double click it
Enter password
Copy pictures of your naked wife to it.
"Eject"/Unmount the disk image.
Now no one can search within it. Not as hard as my line by line description makes it sound.
Just don't forget the password and make sure it is one that isn't already used in a Keychain or website.
Now, should I tell him about EXIF Untrasher?
Psst, hey can I borrow your digital camera for a second?
EXIF Untrasher = blackmailer's best friend.
what the nerds over at ars dont get, is that if this stuff works and appears to the user the same way, it doesnt matter what the underlying technology is.
Don't you presume to know what the nerd(s) at Ars do and don't "get" :-P
Originally posted by kim kap sol
When Spotlight finally arrives, I can just throw everything in the Documents folder (I'll be nice and throw music in the Music folder and video in the Video folder...although file location really just doesn't matter anymore) and let Spotlight find the files I want.
I think when you download a file, the finder should automatically place it in an appropriate location. For instance if i download a movie file, it should recognize the extension (.mov or whatever) and just throw it in the movie folder. I don't know if the new metadata system will help this or not
Originally posted by the cool gut
Couldn't this open up some privacy issues? I mean, obviously if someone can get to your desktop, they can find anything they wan't ... but this makes walking away from your computer for 5 minutes a potential problem.
What if your boss walks by and quickly types his wifes name in the search field, and all those emails, pictures and movies pop up of her?
Incorportate biometric security into the mouse. or next to the tracpad. Grab the mouse and you are authenticated.
Originally posted by TednDi
Incorportate biometric security into the mouse. or next to the tracpad. Grab the mouse and you are authenticated.
I don't know if this is too extreme or not, or how big of a problem it is, but idealy, you should have the option of having to enter an admin password before doing a system wide search.
Originally posted by John
Don't you presume to know what the nerd(s) at Ars do and don't "get" :-P
translation to english please?
Originally posted by PURE
I think when you download a file, the finder should automatically place it in an appropriate location. For instance if i download a movie file, it should recognize the extension (.mov or whatever) and just throw it in the movie folder. I don't know if the new metadata system will help this or not
no way, as it is you can be asked where you want it to be downloaded and your movie folder is one click away. i dont want it automatically organizing my downloads.... even with the search capabilities.
Originally posted by John
Don't you presume to know what the nerd(s) at Ars do and don't "get" :-P
Siracusa, what's your take on all of this? Is it metadata or not?
translation to english please?
I was scolding him, as in "Don't you touch that!"
Siracusa, what's your take on all of this? Is it metadata or not?
I am withholding final judgement until I know more about the system. I'm not at WWDC, so I'm forced to wait for the session streams and/or DVDs...or any scraps that make it to the web from WWDC.