God bless ya, THT! That'd be wonderful, and hit the spot. One thing-- no AGP. PCI Express or bust...
Quote:
$ 399 15" aluminum 3:2 LCD (the Powerbook one)
$ 599 17" aluminum 16:10 LCD (the iMac/Powerbook one)
This I disagree with. A 15" LCD should be no more than $300, and closer to $200 (around $225-$250 would be good). A 17" should be less than $500, too. At those prices, they'd compete well with offerings from other companies.
This I disagree with. A 15" LCD should be no more than $300, and closer to $200 (around $225-$250 would be good). A 17" should be less than $500, too. At those prices, they'd compete well with offerings from other companies.
This I disagree with. A 15" LCD should be no more than $300, and closer to $200 (around $225-$250 would be good). A 17" should be less than $500, too. At those prices, they'd compete well with offerings from other companies.
You're not touching a 15" LCD from a well known vendor for $200 for even analog. Apple wouldn't use analog so now you must price 15" DVI models and you're looking at about an average of $349 for companies like Viewsonic, Samsung and other Tier 1 and 2 vendors.
Apple Apple 15" DVI at $399 would be about where Apple would be considering the premium for exemplarary design. THT is spot on. Asking for an Apple 15" below $300 is a pipe dream.
You're not touching a 15" LCD from a well known vendor for $200 for even analog. Apple wouldn't use analog so now you must price 15" DVI models and you're looking at about an average of $349 for companies like Viewsonic, Samsung and other Tier 1 and 2 vendors.
Yeah, you're right... I didn't look too closely at the bottom feeder 15" LCDs I was checking out at Newegg. It would be nice if Apple had a 15" closer to $300 than $400, though.
Yeah, you're right... I didn't look too closely at the bottom feeder 15" LCDs I was checking out at Newegg. It would be nice if Apple had a 15" closer to $300 than $400, though.
I know. I did notice that either Cook or Oppenheimer said that memory, LCDs and other components decreased in price over the year. It's really hard to gauge how much because it seems there are articles claiming "rising LCD costs" every other week. LCDs won't get really expensive until there are more companies in the mix. LG, Sharp and a few other larger vendors seem to be controlling the market prices.
In case anyone has not gotten a close look at the new xServe G5, here is a little info on the processor itself:
We just received a new one for a customer, so I decided to pop open the cover to see how they did it.
The 2.0 Ghz processor and its cooling block is about the size of a hard drive, about 1.5" thick and maybe a little longer - much smaller than I expected compared to our dual 1.8 PM. It gets hot but not any hotter than our dual 1.2 G4 xServe.
They must be cramming it into a small space if they are having cooling problems.
I really think the new iMac will be optional headless in light of adoption of the VESA mounting standard.
Make the big purchase the monitor and keep the CPU under $1200. Make the CPU the option and thus increase CPU sales.
It will as usual be something that blurs the line between utility and art, you will want it on your desk and you will want the Cinema Display to compliment it. Anything else will look silly. I know I look for things that look good with my computer. I bought a whole new desk just for my iBook.
My .02
Edit: Or they may be cramming a lot into that small space, may be an argument for that graphics slot. That would impede airflow a bit, no?
or is there more than a few steps. And which programs are configured to be helped by the cluster?
We are talking imac.
computers for the rest of us-
we can obviously cluster G5's and xserves
imac and a powerbook and maby throw in an emac then run some cool (killer) app <read game here> and off you go!
something that windows can't even get close to.
ebay would be dry of all the used mac's in no time and apple backordered for months.
BUZZ galore! stock prices BOOM!
can you see my thinking here!
everybody gets a supercomputer. the ghz debate is rendered moot.
people will be talking in teraflops.
then i can get my cute little Knowledge Navigator!
What the heck are you going off about here? I cant follow your psycho babble.
You know what - forget I asked.
Clustering in panther is not a problem. Go get the book Mac OS X Unleashed. I read it at a friends in a few hours one day. Here is a link to the product. Good Luck to you, and your ""BUZZ galore! stock prices BOOM!"" UNLEASHED 3RD EDITION
In case anyone has not gotten a close look at the new xServe G5, here is a little info on the processor itself:
...
The 2.0 Ghz processor and its cooling block is about the size of a hard drive, about 1.5" thick and maybe a little longer - much smaller than I expected compared to our dual 1.8 PM. It gets hot but not any hotter than our dual 1.2 G4 xServe.
...
The trouble with considering the xServe when speculating about the new iMac design is that you don't mention the fact that the server is loud. I can't imagine that Apple would okay an iMac design that didn't require it to be ultra-quiet. I don't see the heat-sink in the new iMac being at all similar to the one in the xServe.
The conference call clearly pointed to availability of IBM's 970FX as the reason for the iMac3's delay. Heat issues were not mentioned. This definitely makes the IA front page story about the iMac3 dubious.
A new design, as rumored by the IA story, with the CPU behind the screen would definitely create heat issues with a G5. It would also mean no 17" Apple display, once the current (I own one) 17" is cleared from the channel.
Sales for the eMac were triple that of the iMac2 for the quarter, even with full availability. 60,000 unit sales for the iMac2. The eMac outsold the towers for the past Quarter. The eMac has one more rev. (1.5 G4) and then, by 2005, it is toast, unless they continue it as an "education" Mac.
So this leads us to speculate on what will be the replacement for the iMac2 in September, and also what will be the entry level Mac going into 2005. A side issue is what display will fill the gap that the current 17" will cause when supplies run out.
Like it or not, the eMac will continue to be the entry level Mac. It's surprising numbers solidify that position. The new iMac3 will NOT hit the $999 "sweet spot". G5 heat issues will prevent it from being plastered on the back of a display, and likely prevent it from being placed in a "pizza box" as well, not without a howling blower inside to cool it. (half an Xserve?).
So what options are left? Some volume is needed to dissipate the G5 heat, We've had a Cube (twice if you count NeXt). We've had the hemisphere (iBoob), and whatever Apple comes up with, it will have to be inexpensive to manufacture and service.
We are all guessing here, and I could be way off "BASE" (get it?) here, but I'm still going with a pyramid shape. You could search up my prediction of this many months ago in this forum, but I'll repeat some of my reasons for this thinking:
Cheap to build: Wrap a piece of flat aluminum around a square base and that's it. No expensive molds (plastic fantastic?) to make. I wonder what the Cube case cost to build, or the iBoob, especially with it's round motherboard. Formed aluminum is very cheap these days (see iPod mini).
Easy to service: The rear facing quadrant (the back) could be a ventilated access panel. The components inside would be stacked in a modular manner with the square mobo (from the next Powerbook) at the bottom, an optical drive would be next, and the hard drive stacked on top of that. Replacing/upgrading either would just be a matter of sliding it out and sliding in the new one.
A design that Lasts: This form factor would be a timeless design statement that might last for decades, with Mr, Ives doing the spiffing, it would be awesome. It could float on hidden legs, providing massive airflow from the "cheese grater" bottom panel, speakers could be downward fireing from the front corners, completely hidden, but very efficient.
It just makes too much sense for Apple to do it before someone else does. Of course that doesn't mean they will, but I for one think they should.
So what options are left? Some volume is needed to dissipate the G5 heat, We've had a Cube (twice if you count NeXt). We've had the hemisphere (iBoob), and whatever Apple comes up with, it will have to be inexpensive to manufacture and service.
The conference call clearly pointed to availability of IBM's 970FX as the reason for the iMac3's delay. Heat issues were not mentioned. This definitely makes the IA front page story about the iMac3 dubious.
A new design, as rumored by the IA story, with the CPU behind the screen would definitely create heat issues with a G5. It would also mean no 17" Apple display, once the current (I own one) 17" is cleared from the channel.
Sales for the eMac were triple that of the iMac2 for the quarter, even with full availability. 60,000 unit sales for the iMac2. The eMac outsold the towers for the past Quarter. The eMac has one more rev. (1.5 G4) and then, by 2005, it is toast, unless they continue it as an "education" Mac.
So this leads us to speculate on what will be the replacement for the iMac2 in September, and also what will be the entry level Mac going into 2005. A side issue is what display will fill the gap that the current 17" will cause when supplies run out.
Like it or not, the eMac will continue to be the entry level Mac. It's surprising numbers solidify that position. The new iMac3 will NOT hit the $999 "sweet spot". G5 heat issues will prevent it from being plastered on the back of a display, and likely prevent it from being placed in a "pizza box" as well, not without a howling blower inside to cool it. (half an Xserve?).
So what options are left? Some volume is needed to dissipate the G5 heat, We've had a Cube (twice if you count NeXt). We've had the hemisphere (iBoob), and whatever Apple comes up with, it will have to be inexpensive to manufacture and service.
We are all guessing here, and I could be way off "BASE" (get it?) here, but I'm still going with a pyramid shape. You could search up my prediction of this many months ago in this forum, but I'll repeat some of my reasons for this thinking:
Cheap to build: Wrap a piece of flat aluminum around a square base and that's it. No expensive molds (plastic fantastic?) to make. I wonder what the Cube case cost to build, or the iBoob, especially with it's round motherboard. Formed aluminum is very cheap these days (see iPod mini).
Easy to service: The rear facing quadrant (the back) could be a ventilated access panel. The components inside would be stacked in a modular manner with the square mobo (from the next Powerbook) at the bottom, an optical drive would be next, and the hard drive stacked on top of that. Replacing/upgrading either would just be a matter of sliding it out and sliding in the new one.
A design that Lasts: This form factor would be a timeless design statement that might last for decades, with Mr, Ives doing the spiffing, it would be awesome. It could float on hidden legs, providing massive airflow from the "cheese grater" bottom panel, speakers could be downward fireing from the front corners, completely hidden, but very efficient.
It just makes too much sense for Apple to do it before someone else does. Of course that doesn't mean they will, but I for one think they should.
... edit: Oh wait, somebody already has:
[IMG]ugly machine[/IMG]
That sort of design would make people stick pencils in their eyes. Space inefficient and just...bad. I am sure even in aluminum it would lack appeal
That pyramid has to be the single worst computer design ever. It's the exact opposite of the iMac. It's a perfect example of space inefficiency. And it really couldn't be worse looking. When Apple makes a computer like that, the apocalypse will be upon us.
I think the upgradeable video card is worth some extra cost and heat dissipation, besides as OSX continues to lean on the GPU for QExtreme speed and Jobs convincingly has shown that GPU's are advancing faster than CPU's, it is an obvious upgrade path that would also take some of the heat off Apple. People would be sending comments and complaints to ATI and nVidia instead.
But if for some reason upgradeability is anathema to the iMac line, then at least make it a dual monitor card so people can use their old PC monitor ... so out of the box Apple could make every consumer a "dual monitor cool prosumer" for the about the same price as a Dell. An All-in-One plus One.
It would also give advantage to all of the media iApps that people will hopefully be using...spread over lots of real estate.
"That pyramid has to be the single worst computer design ever... And it really couldn't be worse looking. When Apple makes a computer like that, the apocalypse will be upon us."
If by "That" you mean the image I posted, it was an extreme example of a Macintosh case mod~er's work ~ sort of a "chopper" of a Pyramac
I think Johnathan Ives could do a better industrial design on a pyramid form factor than the dude that built the design I linked to.
As far as the pyramidal form factor and internal heat dissipation: It's an ideal shape. The heat rises and is densely collected in the top where it can be vented very efficiently. The Venturi Effect It might not even need a fan.
...
Quote:
Venturi effect is what happens when a fluid, such as liquids or gases, increases velocity due to contricted flow.
Venturi effect is basically taking advantage of heated air as it rises and "funneling" it. It is used in aspirators and injectors to produce a vacuum... the pressure on the walls in the restricted area is reduced and a venturi effect is produced.
Comments
I just wish Apple would come to their senses and have a headless consumer desktop and an all-in-one.
$ 999 15" 3:2 iMac LCD AIO 1.6GHz G5
$1499 17" 16:10 iMac LCD AIO 1.8GHz G5
$1999 20" 16:10 iMac LCD AIO 1.8GHz G5
$ 999 1.8 GHz G5 headless desktop, 1 AGP 4x slot, 1 PCI slot
$1299 2.0 GHz G5 headless desktop, 1 AGP 4x slot, 1 PCI slot
God bless ya, THT!
$ 399 15" aluminum 3:2 LCD (the Powerbook one)
$ 599 17" aluminum 16:10 LCD (the iMac/Powerbook one)
This I disagree with. A 15" LCD should be no more than $300, and closer to $200 (around $225-$250 would be good). A 17" should be less than $500, too. At those prices, they'd compete well with offerings from other companies.
Originally posted by Gamblor
This I disagree with. A 15" LCD should be no more than $300, and closer to $200 (around $225-$250 would be good). A 17" should be less than $500, too. At those prices, they'd compete well with offerings from other companies.
It's the cost of Apple Aluminum.
This I disagree with. A 15" LCD should be no more than $300, and closer to $200 (around $225-$250 would be good). A 17" should be less than $500, too. At those prices, they'd compete well with offerings from other companies.
You're not touching a 15" LCD from a well known vendor for $200 for even analog. Apple wouldn't use analog so now you must price 15" DVI models and you're looking at about an average of $349 for companies like Viewsonic, Samsung and other Tier 1 and 2 vendors.
www.froogle.com
15" LCD DVI were the search terms.
Apple Apple 15" DVI at $399 would be about where Apple would be considering the premium for exemplarary design. THT is spot on. Asking for an Apple 15" below $300 is a pipe dream.
I just wish Apple would come to their senses and have a headless consumer desktop and an all-in-one.
$ 999 15" 3:2 iMac LCD AIO 1.6GHz G5
$1499 17" 16:10 iMac LCD AIO 1.8GHz G5
$1999 20" 16:10 iMac LCD AIO 1.8GHz G5
$ 999 1.8 GHz G5 headless desktop, 1 AGP 4x slot, 1 PCI slot
$1299 2.0 GHz G5 headless desktop, 1 AGP 4x slot, 1 PCI slot
$ 399 15" aluminum 3:2 LCD (the Powerbook one)
$ 599 17" aluminum 16:10 LCD (the iMac/Powerbook one)
Dream.
Lemon Bon Bon
You're not touching a 15" LCD from a well known vendor for $200 for even analog. Apple wouldn't use analog so now you must price 15" DVI models and you're looking at about an average of $349 for companies like Viewsonic, Samsung and other Tier 1 and 2 vendors.
Yeah, you're right... I didn't look too closely at the bottom feeder 15" LCDs I was checking out at Newegg. It would be nice if Apple had a 15" closer to $300 than $400, though.
Originally posted by Gamblor
Yeah, you're right... I didn't look too closely at the bottom feeder 15" LCDs I was checking out at Newegg. It would be nice if Apple had a 15" closer to $300 than $400, though.
I know. I did notice that either Cook or Oppenheimer said that memory, LCDs and other components decreased in price over the year. It's really hard to gauge how much because it seems there are articles claiming "rising LCD costs" every other week. LCDs won't get really expensive until there are more companies in the mix. LG, Sharp and a few other larger vendors seem to be controlling the market prices.
We just received a new one for a customer, so I decided to pop open the cover to see how they did it.
The 2.0 Ghz processor and its cooling block is about the size of a hard drive, about 1.5" thick and maybe a little longer - much smaller than I expected compared to our dual 1.8 PM. It gets hot but not any hotter than our dual 1.2 G4 xServe.
They must be cramming it into a small space if they are having cooling problems.
I really think the new iMac will be optional headless in light of adoption of the VESA mounting standard.
Make the big purchase the monitor and keep the CPU under $1200. Make the CPU the option and thus increase CPU sales.
It will as usual be something that blurs the line between utility and art, you will want it on your desk and you will want the Cinema Display to compliment it. Anything else will look silly. I know I look for things that look good with my computer. I bought a whole new desk just for my iBook.
My .02
Edit: Or they may be cramming a lot into that small space, may be an argument for that graphics slot. That would impede airflow a bit, no?
Originally posted by Lemon Bon Bon
Dream.
Don't pinch me because it's a nice dream!
Originally posted by TednDi
is is as easy as rendevous?
or is there more than a few steps. And which programs are configured to be helped by the cluster?
We are talking imac.
computers for the rest of us-
we can obviously cluster G5's and xserves
imac and a powerbook and maby throw in an emac then run some cool (killer) app <read game here> and off you go!
something that windows can't even get close to.
ebay would be dry of all the used mac's in no time and apple backordered for months.
BUZZ galore! stock prices BOOM!
can you see my thinking here!
everybody gets a supercomputer. the ghz debate is rendered moot.
people will be talking in teraflops.
then i can get my cute little Knowledge Navigator!
What the heck are you going off about here? I cant follow your psycho babble.
You know what - forget I asked.
Clustering in panther is not a problem. Go get the book Mac OS X Unleashed. I read it at a friends in a few hours one day. Here is a link to the product. Good Luck to you, and your ""BUZZ galore! stock prices BOOM!"" UNLEASHED 3RD EDITION
Originally posted by NaplesX
In case anyone has not gotten a close look at the new xServe G5, here is a little info on the processor itself:
...
The 2.0 Ghz processor and its cooling block is about the size of a hard drive, about 1.5" thick and maybe a little longer - much smaller than I expected compared to our dual 1.8 PM. It gets hot but not any hotter than our dual 1.2 G4 xServe.
...
The trouble with considering the xServe when speculating about the new iMac design is that you don't mention the fact that the server is loud. I can't imagine that Apple would okay an iMac design that didn't require it to be ultra-quiet. I don't see the heat-sink in the new iMac being at all similar to the one in the xServe.
The conference call clearly pointed to availability of IBM's 970FX as the reason for the iMac3's delay. Heat issues were not mentioned. This definitely makes the IA front page story about the iMac3 dubious.
A new design, as rumored by the IA story, with the CPU behind the screen would definitely create heat issues with a G5. It would also mean no 17" Apple display, once the current (I own one) 17" is cleared from the channel.
Sales for the eMac were triple that of the iMac2 for the quarter, even with full availability. 60,000 unit sales for the iMac2. The eMac outsold the towers for the past Quarter. The eMac has one more rev. (1.5 G4) and then, by 2005, it is toast, unless they continue it as an "education" Mac.
So this leads us to speculate on what will be the replacement for the iMac2 in September, and also what will be the entry level Mac going into 2005. A side issue is what display will fill the gap that the current 17" will cause when supplies run out.
Like it or not, the eMac will continue to be the entry level Mac. It's surprising numbers solidify that position. The new iMac3 will NOT hit the $999 "sweet spot". G5 heat issues will prevent it from being plastered on the back of a display, and likely prevent it from being placed in a "pizza box" as well, not without a howling blower inside to cool it. (half an Xserve?).
So what options are left? Some volume is needed to dissipate the G5 heat, We've had a Cube (twice if you count NeXt). We've had the hemisphere (iBoob), and whatever Apple comes up with, it will have to be inexpensive to manufacture and service.
We are all guessing here, and I could be way off "BASE" (get it?) here, but I'm still going with a pyramid shape. You could search up my prediction of this many months ago in this forum, but I'll repeat some of my reasons for this thinking:
Cheap to build: Wrap a piece of flat aluminum around a square base and that's it. No expensive molds (plastic fantastic?) to make. I wonder what the Cube case cost to build, or the iBoob, especially with it's round motherboard. Formed aluminum is very cheap these days (see iPod mini).
Easy to service: The rear facing quadrant (the back) could be a ventilated access panel. The components inside would be stacked in a modular manner with the square mobo (from the next Powerbook) at the bottom, an optical drive would be next, and the hard drive stacked on top of that. Replacing/upgrading either would just be a matter of sliding it out and sliding in the new one.
A design that Lasts: This form factor would be a timeless design statement that might last for decades, with Mr, Ives doing the spiffing, it would be awesome. It could float on hidden legs, providing massive airflow from the "cheese grater" bottom panel, speakers could be downward fireing from the front corners, completely hidden, but very efficient.
It just makes too much sense for Apple to do it before someone else does. Of course that doesn't mean they will, but I for one think they should.
... edit: Oh wait, somebody already has:
Originally posted by Aphelion
OK then, let's have a reality check ...
So what options are left? Some volume is needed to dissipate the G5 heat, We've had a Cube (twice if you count NeXt). We've had the hemisphere (iBoob), and whatever Apple comes up with, it will have to be inexpensive to manufacture and service.
uh,uh...huh.. he said boob.
Originally posted by Aphelion
OK then, let's have a reality check ...
The conference call clearly pointed to availability of IBM's 970FX as the reason for the iMac3's delay. Heat issues were not mentioned. This definitely makes the IA front page story about the iMac3 dubious.
A new design, as rumored by the IA story, with the CPU behind the screen would definitely create heat issues with a G5. It would also mean no 17" Apple display, once the current (I own one) 17" is cleared from the channel.
Sales for the eMac were triple that of the iMac2 for the quarter, even with full availability. 60,000 unit sales for the iMac2. The eMac outsold the towers for the past Quarter. The eMac has one more rev. (1.5 G4) and then, by 2005, it is toast, unless they continue it as an "education" Mac.
So this leads us to speculate on what will be the replacement for the iMac2 in September, and also what will be the entry level Mac going into 2005. A side issue is what display will fill the gap that the current 17" will cause when supplies run out.
Like it or not, the eMac will continue to be the entry level Mac. It's surprising numbers solidify that position. The new iMac3 will NOT hit the $999 "sweet spot". G5 heat issues will prevent it from being plastered on the back of a display, and likely prevent it from being placed in a "pizza box" as well, not without a howling blower inside to cool it. (half an Xserve?).
So what options are left? Some volume is needed to dissipate the G5 heat, We've had a Cube (twice if you count NeXt). We've had the hemisphere (iBoob), and whatever Apple comes up with, it will have to be inexpensive to manufacture and service.
We are all guessing here, and I could be way off "BASE" (get it?) here, but I'm still going with a pyramid shape. You could search up my prediction of this many months ago in this forum, but I'll repeat some of my reasons for this thinking:
Cheap to build: Wrap a piece of flat aluminum around a square base and that's it. No expensive molds (plastic fantastic?) to make. I wonder what the Cube case cost to build, or the iBoob, especially with it's round motherboard. Formed aluminum is very cheap these days (see iPod mini).
Easy to service: The rear facing quadrant (the back) could be a ventilated access panel. The components inside would be stacked in a modular manner with the square mobo (from the next Powerbook) at the bottom, an optical drive would be next, and the hard drive stacked on top of that. Replacing/upgrading either would just be a matter of sliding it out and sliding in the new one.
A design that Lasts: This form factor would be a timeless design statement that might last for decades, with Mr, Ives doing the spiffing, it would be awesome. It could float on hidden legs, providing massive airflow from the "cheese grater" bottom panel, speakers could be downward fireing from the front corners, completely hidden, but very efficient.
It just makes too much sense for Apple to do it before someone else does. Of course that doesn't mean they will, but I for one think they should.
... edit: Oh wait, somebody already has:
[IMG]ugly machine[/IMG]
That sort of design would make people stick pencils in their eyes. Space inefficient and just...bad. I am sure even in aluminum it would lack appeal
Chrome curb feelers, blinking air stem caps, fake bullet hole stickers, who invents that stuff.
Originally posted by NaplesX
Some people like the flashy stuff, look at the their cars.
Chrome curb feelers, blinking air stem caps, fake bullet hole stickers, who invents that stuff.
So Apple should design a machine like that pyramid with a "Calvin pissing on a Windows logo" decal on it?
But if for some reason upgradeability is anathema to the iMac line, then at least make it a dual monitor card so people can use their old PC monitor ... so out of the box Apple could make every consumer a "dual monitor cool prosumer" for the about the same price as a Dell. An All-in-One plus One.
It would also give advantage to all of the media iApps that people will hopefully be using...spread over lots of real estate.
Originally posted by Michael Wilkie
"That pyramid has to be the single worst computer design ever... And it really couldn't be worse looking. When Apple makes a computer like that, the apocalypse will be upon us."
If by "That" you mean the image I posted, it was an extreme example of a Macintosh case mod~er's work ~ sort of a "chopper" of a Pyramac
I think Johnathan Ives could do a better industrial design on a pyramid form factor than the dude that built the design I linked to.
As far as the pyramidal form factor and internal heat dissipation: It's an ideal shape. The heat rises and is densely collected in the top where it can be vented very efficiently. The Venturi Effect It might not even need a fan.
...
Venturi effect is what happens when a fluid, such as liquids or gases, increases velocity due to contricted flow.
Venturi effect is basically taking advantage of heated air as it rises and "funneling" it. It is used in aspirators and injectors to produce a vacuum... the pressure on the walls in the restricted area is reduced and a venturi effect is produced.