uhoh Kickaha I am going under 1 gig daily now!! My music folder is over 30 gigs eek I have to start burning some of it. :eek:
I remember one time back in Jag when I went to around 100 megs of free disk space left I got a message that said "Available disk space is getting low. If you don't free up some space your computer will have problems." I'm certain of that last sentence. I love it. "Problems." That's just awesome. Sounds menacing, like something a mob boss like Tony Soprano would say. "Hey, delete somethin' or we'll have "problems. *waves icepick menacingly*" I hurried up and deleted some stuff.
Note that if you use the "top" commandline utility, it may show foo.app as using 600MB of virtual memory. Catch is though, that might be 10MB real memory, 50MB worth of disk space and *all the rest* doesn't exist *anywhere* - and it won't be allocated (in RAM or on disk) unless the application tries to use that memory.
Well, virtual memory doesn't necessarily equate to "used disk space" (although it did pre-OS X) so in that sense it's not "broken". It would be more helpful, though, if it did report disk usage numbers.
It is indicating the total memory that is being used, be it real, file mapped, swapped, or other.
How is that useful to the user? Dunno... how useful is it to know how much swap space each application is using on disk? \ (Not very.) The actual amount is rarely useful - the *change* can be. "Oh, this app is continually asking for more and more VM - probably a runaway thread with a leak. Time to kill it."
If you want to know how much total VM your system is using on disk, check the size of the /var/vm/ folder.
I suppose not that much unless you are gauging the necessity for a memory upgrade based on your working set of applications (granted, even then it isn't exactly clear just by observing the listed numbers). I guess it is more of a curiosity to check them out, possibly noting how some programs use just a medium amount of resources while certain others take it to a whole different level. It makes you wonder if they are broken (given what they do vs. how much resources they are pulling), sloppy, or they simply do need that much memory to do what they do.
I think another interesting question to come from this, given that the way OSX handles memory vs your typical Windows machine, just how far can you lean on VM with more applications running and more extensive applications running while keeping things snappy with the given physical memory amount? Assuming you have enough to keep the OS happy and then some, can you push further into VM before things start getting bogged down by page faults? ...or is it pretty much the same as you would expect from a Windows machine, it's just reported differently in the Activity Monitor, so it appears that you are leaning into VM harder than you really are? Just thinking out loud, mostly. If anybody can relate on these ponderings, please do feel free to post.
For example, if you have say 256-378 MB of RAM installed, has anybody here had experiences where they had so many applications open that the HD would start protesting with lots of thrashing? ...or is it pretty much "boundless" considerably beyond what 256/378 should take you? I have yet to experience this, but then again, I wouldn't expect to hit that limit easily given the extent I push my machine (not that hard) with respect to the amount of installed RAM (pretty much bottomless compared to my previously configured machines).
I'd say that the most important numbers in terms of upgrading memory are the pagein/pageout numbers in top. The first part of the number is the total number, and the number in brackets is the amount in the last second or so. If the bracketted number is non-zero most of the time, you'll be faster with more RAM.
Back in the early days of X, I noticed that with my standard use (~10 apps open permanently) that X was paging in/out all the time with 384 MB, and even still with 512 MB. With 1 GB, paging in/out is virtually eliminated (no pun intended).
my system folder for 10.3.4 is only 737.3MB, becaue I got rid of all the .lproj files that were not english, there like 100's of them...from a tip like a yr ago in mac addict mag, to help free up HD space. plus my HD is only 12GB partitioned in 2 with X on one and 9 on the other.
So I can just throw out all of these foreign language .lproj files w/o causing problems?
Damn, my VM size readout (from activity monitor) reached 8.25 GB today. Now you're not gonna tell me that when it grew from 4 GB to 8 GB, these were mapped resource files? Das a lotta mapped files, right?
I had a bit of a revelation reading over the responses here again. Maybe another "virtual" thing being represented in this VM thing could be "reserved memory space"? ...sort of like a "hold" on your credit card? It's already waiting on deck if needed, but not in the active heap of virtual memory operation? Well, just thinking out loud. This is all weird stuff!
Also, the characteristic 100-ish MB of VM that seemingly every app is grabbing is the shared system files/mapped resources? Excess above that is the memory space that exists in the swap files? Just contemplating that maybe there is some significance to the "100 MB figure".
yep, you can trash em with no problems what so ever.
Quote:
Originally posted by Randycat99
So I can just throw out all of these foreign language .lproj files w/o causing problems?
Damn, my VM size readout (from activity monitor) reached 8.25 GB today. Now you're not gonna tell me that when it grew from 4 GB to 8 GB, these were mapped resource files? Das a lotta mapped files, right?
I had a bit of a revelation reading over the responses here again. Maybe another "virtual" thing being represented in this VM thing could be "reserved memory space"? ...sort of like a "hold" on your credit card? It's already waiting on deck if needed, but not in the active heap of virtual memory operation? Well, just thinking out loud. This is all weird stuff!
Also, the characteristic 100-ish MB of VM that seemingly every app is grabbing is the shared system files/mapped resources? Excess above that is the memory space that exists in the swap files? Just contemplating that maybe there is some significance to the "100 MB figure".
So I can just throw out all of these foreign language .lproj files w/o causing problems?
Damn, my VM size readout (from activity monitor) reached 8.25 GB today. Now you're not gonna tell me that when it grew from 4 GB to 8 GB, these were mapped resource files? Das a lotta mapped files, right?
I had a bit of a revelation reading over the responses here again. Maybe another "virtual" thing being represented in this VM thing could be "reserved memory space"? ...sort of like a "hold" on your credit card? It's already waiting on deck if needed, but not in the active heap of virtual memory operation? Well, just thinking out loud. This is all weird stuff!
Yup, apps can pre-allocate memory and say "I'm going to need this much later... just so you can be ready with it when necessary."
Quote:
Also, the characteristic 100-ish MB of VM that seemingly every app is grabbing is the shared system files/mapped resources? Excess above that is the memory space that exists in the swap files? Just contemplating that maybe there is some significance to the "100 MB figure".
Yup, nailed it again. You're getting the hang of it.
Is it sort of like each of these apps has its own "system folder", or is that taking the analogy a bit too far? What are the benefits of this sort of strategy?
System libraries are read only - so there's really no point in having each app have to load in it's own version of them, is there? They are loaded once, then mapped to each application's memory space... and the VM system is reporting the *mapping* as that 100MB overhead.
Instead of 14 applications all having their own copy, there's just one... but to the VM system, and to the applications, they may as well have their own private copies. Getting the VM stats doesn't show you the overlap between applications, in general.
Comments
I remember one time back in Jag when I went to around 100 megs of free disk space left I got a message that said "Available disk space is getting low. If you don't free up some space your computer will have problems." I'm certain of that last sentence. I love it. "Problems." That's just awesome. Sounds menacing, like something a mob boss like Tony Soprano would say. "Hey, delete somethin' or we'll have "problems. *waves icepick menacingly*" I hurried up and deleted some stuff.
That's the folder that the vm system uses for swap files.
If it's large, simply reboot. it gets reset to zero.
Moral of the story, /var/vm is the only way to go
How is that useful to the user? Dunno... how useful is it to know how much swap space each application is using on disk?
If you want to know how much total VM your system is using on disk, check the size of the /var/vm/ folder.
I think another interesting question to come from this, given that the way OSX handles memory vs your typical Windows machine, just how far can you lean on VM with more applications running and more extensive applications running while keeping things snappy with the given physical memory amount? Assuming you have enough to keep the OS happy and then some, can you push further into VM before things start getting bogged down by page faults? ...or is it pretty much the same as you would expect from a Windows machine, it's just reported differently in the Activity Monitor, so it appears that you are leaning into VM harder than you really are? Just thinking out loud, mostly. If anybody can relate on these ponderings, please do feel free to post.
For example, if you have say 256-378 MB of RAM installed, has anybody here had experiences where they had so many applications open that the HD would start protesting with lots of thrashing? ...or is it pretty much "boundless" considerably beyond what 256/378 should take you? I have yet to experience this, but then again, I wouldn't expect to hit that limit easily given the extent I push my machine (not that hard) with respect to the amount of installed RAM (pretty much bottomless compared to my previously configured machines).
Back in the early days of X, I noticed that with my standard use (~10 apps open permanently) that X was paging in/out all the time with 384 MB, and even still with 512 MB. With 1 GB, paging in/out is virtually eliminated (no pun intended).
Damn, my VM size readout (from activity monitor) reached 8.25 GB today. Now you're not gonna tell me that when it grew from 4 GB to 8 GB, these were mapped resource files?
I had a bit of a revelation reading over the responses here again. Maybe another "virtual" thing being represented in this VM thing could be "reserved memory space"? ...sort of like a "hold" on your credit card? It's already waiting on deck if needed, but not in the active heap of virtual memory operation? Well, just thinking out loud. This is all weird stuff!
Also, the characteristic 100-ish MB of VM that seemingly every app is grabbing is the shared system files/mapped resources? Excess above that is the memory space that exists in the swap files? Just contemplating that maybe there is some significance to the "100 MB figure".
Originally posted by Randycat99
So I can just throw out all of these foreign language .lproj files w/o causing problems?
Damn, my VM size readout (from activity monitor) reached 8.25 GB today. Now you're not gonna tell me that when it grew from 4 GB to 8 GB, these were mapped resource files?
I had a bit of a revelation reading over the responses here again. Maybe another "virtual" thing being represented in this VM thing could be "reserved memory space"? ...sort of like a "hold" on your credit card? It's already waiting on deck if needed, but not in the active heap of virtual memory operation? Well, just thinking out loud. This is all weird stuff!
Also, the characteristic 100-ish MB of VM that seemingly every app is grabbing is the shared system files/mapped resources? Excess above that is the memory space that exists in the swap files? Just contemplating that maybe there is some significance to the "100 MB figure".
Originally posted by Randycat99
So I can just throw out all of these foreign language .lproj files w/o causing problems?
Damn, my VM size readout (from activity monitor) reached 8.25 GB today. Now you're not gonna tell me that when it grew from 4 GB to 8 GB, these were mapped resource files?
I had a bit of a revelation reading over the responses here again. Maybe another "virtual" thing being represented in this VM thing could be "reserved memory space"? ...sort of like a "hold" on your credit card? It's already waiting on deck if needed, but not in the active heap of virtual memory operation? Well, just thinking out loud. This is all weird stuff!
Yup, apps can pre-allocate memory and say "I'm going to need this much later... just so you can be ready with it when necessary."
Also, the characteristic 100-ish MB of VM that seemingly every app is grabbing is the shared system files/mapped resources? Excess above that is the memory space that exists in the swap files? Just contemplating that maybe there is some significance to the "100 MB figure".
Yup, nailed it again. You're getting the hang of it.
Instead of 14 applications all having their own copy, there's just one... but to the VM system, and to the applications, they may as well have their own private copies. Getting the VM stats doesn't show you the overlap between applications, in general.
I've been running a stock powerbook 1.33GHz with 256MB ram and its just PAINFUL to run this OS as a power user like this.
More than three-4 apps open, and its crawl city.
When I hav more than 4 downloads going (Bittorrent) everything gets reaaaaly slow.
BTW, does anyone have problems with Azareus? Its been COMPLETELY LOCKING UP my computer. Im back on stupid Tomato Torrent again... so far so good.