Will the Power Mac line be revised concurrently with the new iMac?

Posted:
in Future Apple Hardware edited January 2014
As most of you know the Power Mac we all know and cant afford has the same specs as it did a year ago aside from the processor speed increases. What better time to revise it than September?



My biggest concern is that the new iMac new processor, mobo advantage will be destroyed because Apple will solder in a nVidia 5200. Now Apple would need to put some killa cards in the Power Macs to even think of putting something better than the 5200 in the iMac.



I have a sinking feeling we're gonna get a 1.6 Ghz G5, 100 GB HD, 256 MB DDR and a '5200 for $1499 \
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 28
    banchobancho Posts: 1,517member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by MajorMatt

    As most of you know the Power Mac we all know and cant afford has the same specs as it did a year ago aside from the processor speed increases. What better time to revise it than September?



    My biggest concern is that the new iMac new processor, mobo advantage will be destroyed because Apple will solder in a nVidia 5200. Now Apple would need to put some killa cards in the Power Macs to even think of putting something better than the 5200 in the iMac.



    I have a sinking feeling we're gonna get a 1.6 Ghz G5, 100 GB HD, 256 MB DDR and a '5200 for $1499 \




    No, the 2.5's are barely reachng buyers so there is exactly 0 chance of update concurrent with iMacs.



    As for the iMac relax. I think we will be pleasantly surprised.
  • Reply 2 of 28
    davegeedavegee Posts: 2,765member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by MajorMatt

    I have a sinking feeling we're gonna get a 1.6 Ghz G5, 100 GB HD, 256 MB DDR and a '5200 for $1499 \



    As one if it's founding members, let me be the first to welcome you to the 'Jaded Mac Clan' MajorMatt! We've been waiting for you.



    All kidding aside, your insights are well founded and make sense. I couldn't very well see Apple putting anything better than the NVIDIA 5200 Ultra w/64MB into/onto the iMac mobo. Unless as you point out they quietly bump up the default video card in the existing PM models at the same time. Given Apple just recently changed the PowerMac line and didn't do squat to the bottom 2 configs (just moved them down a peg to make room for the 2.5GHz box) it would seem strange for them to make the video card switch a mere 40 days (less?) after their introduction.



    Not that they wouldn't do it - they've done strange things before. It'll just be that many more people pissed off at Apple for pulling "a fast one" changing machine configs right after 'they' ordered one of the "new" G5 models and are now stuck with the 5200 config instead of 'whatever' Apple replaces it with.



    Even with Apple doing a 'stealth video card upgrade' I have a question... Has the iMac and the PowerMac ever had video card parity? - If not, then the new iMac might still be getting the 5200 anyway.



    Dave
  • Reply 3 of 28
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,408member
    THey would have to update the g5 and I see absolutely no chance of doing that this early in the game. They are barely shipping dual 2.0's!! and Getting a dual 2.5 is about impossible. I upgraded my card to 9600xt in my dual 2.0... why doesn't anyone else do this? Its cheap.



    But either way it will be AT LEAST January before we see another powermac and I still HIGHLY doubt that. I believe we will see the next speed bump around march 2xth.
  • Reply 4 of 28
    is anyone aside from me excited about the new nVidia 6800? I have read up a good bit on this card and am not the least bit dissappointed. I have said this before and I'll say this again to everyone crying for Quadro's...There is not enough of a performance enhancment using these $1000 video cards over the high end consumer cards even in 3D packages with heavy models. If there was Apple would have already offered this as an option. I can tell you first hand however that the additional $500+ that you would spend on an Fire GL, Quadro, or Wildcat will not show you the enormous performance differences you might expect over a card like the 6800 (actually I cant speak for the Fire GL but we use the other two in house).
  • Reply 5 of 28
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,268member
    Playmaker



    It depends on the drivers. I don't think anyone will argue with you about the relative speed of the 6800 versus even the top of the line Quadro. But it's driver issues which will make or break its use in Pro settings. IMO Quadros are still needed just for the the validity the name brings to DCC.
  • Reply 6 of 28
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,408member
    Yah good points play,



    The 6800 is a great card. It really is. I was very excited to see it at WWDC. I almost fell out of my chair. This guy I barely knew there, I kept elbowing him... he was like WTF . I was so excited.



    And the best part is its not that much more than the 9800xt... the price difference is WELL worth it. But I don't do much of that on a mac. I would only use it for 3d stuff and games. Which I do on my PC. I do all of the editing on the pc then render it on my dual g5 with cinema or maya. But if I were hardcore into 3d animation I would have upgraded teh card passed a 9600xt. I only do cocoa, perl, and web development on this machine.



    I got so excited cause there has been a lot of complaints on these forums about the lack of graphics cards... mainly when the g5 first came out. I was like screw off all of you nay sayers. They can't bitch a whole bunch about it any more. I personally think they just wanted something other than ATI... After witnessing the driver fiasco with ATI on the pc's... I will never buy another again.
  • Reply 7 of 28
    kupan787kupan787 Posts: 586member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by emig647

    They are barely shipping dual 2.0's!!



    ???



    I ordered mine (a dual 2) a couple of days after the Rev B's were anounced, and got it 6 days later (and that is with a graphic card change to 9600). My roommate ordered one the same day as me, and got his a week after me, and he ordered his with a 9800. So I don't know what you mean by "they are barley shipping dual 2.0s", they apear to be flowing just fine out of Apple.
  • Reply 8 of 28
    playmakerplaymaker Posts: 511member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by hmurchison

    Playmaker



    It depends on the drivers. I don't think anyone will argue with you about the relative speed of the 6800 versus even the top of the line Quadro. But it's driver issues which will make or break its use in Pro settings. IMO Quadros are still needed just for the the validity the name brings to DCC.




    I guess my point is mostly related to the price justification. If apple were to carry a top-of-the-line 3D card like the quadro I would hate to see someone here fork out an additional 5 c-notes to see magic that just isnt going to be there. It is certainly a superior card but let it be known that these cards (the upper tier 3D cards) wont make you see Jesus. You do have a good point hmurch.
  • Reply 9 of 28
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,268member
    Playmaker of you were crystal clear in your post and I agree with you. A 6800 would suit my needs just fine since I'm just a hobbyist. I just worry about Technical Directors or whoever runs purchasing looking at the lack of Quadros as a negative to the Mac platform. Some people have more money than sense LOL.
  • Reply 10 of 28
    Quote:

    Originally posted by emig647

    They are barely shipping dual 2.0's!!



    Uh, go config a 2.0 with a 6800. Shipping in 5-7 business days. The 1.8 is 7-10 days, and the 2.5 is 4-6 weeks.
  • Reply 11 of 28
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,408member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by kupan787

    ???



    I ordered mine (a dual 2) a couple of days after the Rev B's were anounced, and got it 6 days later (and that is with a graphic card change to 9600). My roommate ordered one the same day as me, and got his a week after me, and he ordered his with a 9800. So I don't know what you mean by "they are barley shipping dual 2.0s", they apear to be flowing just fine out of Apple.




    I'm not going to find the url right now because i dont' feel good, but I believe I saw an announcement about a week ago saying that. I have to agree wtih you though. I got my CTO dual 2.0 with 9600xt 3 days after the order was put in through ADC... and the suggested ship time was 10 days. So maybe maybe not. I certainly didn't witness it.
  • Reply 12 of 28
    onlookeronlooker Posts: 5,252member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by hmurchison

    Playmaker of you were crystal clear in your post and I agree with you. A 6800 would suit my needs just fine since I'm just a hobbyist. I just worry about Technical Directors or whoever runs purchasing looking at the lack of Quadros as a negative to the Mac platform. Some people have more money than sense LOL.



    I guess that would be me, (although I saved for 3 years for it, and I'll charge the rest) but time was a crucial factor in deciding I was going to get a Quadro when I was ready. I have a bunch of smaller parts of my demo spaced out in separate scenes because there is just too much to move anymore. If I try, and open a few they just crash Maya now. I also need more memory, but some of us see serious need for such products to be available to us.
  • Reply 13 of 28
    macroninmacronin Posts: 1,174member
    I have always been under the impression that (since Apple actually writes the drivers for the nVidia products they use) there was a parity in features between the consumer cards and the professional cards...



    And as far as I know, the hardware overlay plane is the main thing that the pro drivers deliver...
  • Reply 14 of 28
    onlookeronlooker Posts: 5,252member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by MacRonin

    I have always been under the impression that (since Apple actually writes the drivers for the nVidia products they use) there was a parity in features between the consumer cards and the professional cards...



    And as far as I know, the hardware overlay plane is the main thing that the pro drivers deliver...




    I've heard that too, and probably repeated it from time to time, but I think Apple writes the Mac drivers from the driver source code that Nvidia provides them. If Nvidia is providing them with a Quadro specific driver set, or if there is one I don't know.
  • Reply 15 of 28
    kurtkurt Posts: 225member
    OT

    Will the introduction of the new iMacs be Steve's triumphant return to work?



    Let's hope he recover soon.
  • Reply 16 of 28
    leonardleonard Posts: 528member
    There is a 0% chance of a PowerMac update before January. I haven't even got my hand on the G5 DP2.5 I ordered on June 9, 2004 after they were announced - heck it's not even shipping until later this month. IBM is still having yield problems with the 90nm 970fx. Nope you won't see an Apple PowerMac announcement until January at least...



    And Discsticker, I wouldn't believe any of those delivery times... Just look at all the G5 2.5 orders Apple delayed from 7/30/2004 to 8/20/2004. Hell there are people that ordered a G5 2.5 in July and aren't going to receive it until some time in September... if they're lucky...
  • Reply 17 of 28
    beigeuserbeigeuser Posts: 371member
    I'm hoping that they will add a Dual-layer DVD-RW as a BTO option soon.
  • Reply 18 of 28
    kupan787kupan787 Posts: 586member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by BeigeUser

    I'm hoping that they will add a Dual-layer DVD-RW as a BTO option soon.



    While I might agree, Apple would probably be better off adding a 16x DVD+r (8xdvd-r) drive. Dual layer media is still pretty expensive. The cheapest I have found is some SONY stuff at $9.99 per disk. Almost all other vendors are charging between $13-20 per disk. But then again, about the time Apple would do a tower update, dual layer media might be $1-5 per disk, and reasonable (and they might even have a 4x dual layer burner...)



    I just recently purchased a sony 8xdvd+-r drive (it also does dual layer) for $85 (newegg). I just plugged it into my G5, and it works great. I configed my G5 with a combo drive (saved $100), so basicly I neted $15 and a combo drive to get a better "superdrive" than Apple wanted me to buy. Good deal
  • Reply 19 of 28
    I'm not at all technical - just know the difference between a G4 and G4 to the point where I'm waiting for the G5 iMac. (I did upgrade the graphics card when I worked out my PB order in April).



    The one point that does stick in my mind was a comment that Tiger was going to shift more processing to the graphics card. If I am correct in this then it is logical that the iMac will have cards that will work with the shift - either in the stock package, or BTO orders. Mine is going to be a BTO so it will get any graphics card available as long as the price is reasonable!



    So the question is: what cards would be best suited for Tiger's transfer of processing it?
  • Reply 20 of 28
    onlookeronlooker Posts: 5,252member
    They may add the dual layer burner, but someone in here said that the DVD's burned by dual layer burners are only playable on 1% of home DVD players. It's almost unlike Apple to add something that isn't going to be compatible with your home viewing.



    At Least the single layer DVDs are still burnable on them which gives it a glimmer of hope. I wouldn't doubt it if it became a BTO option though. The Pioneer DVR-108 Dual Layer Burner is Available now, and Pioneer is who has always made the Superdrive.
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