That becomes a potential stocking problem however. You don't know what stores will run through the USB cables or firewire cables first.
I support Apple's decision on this. I think it makes financial sense. The iPod is responsible for Apple actually being able to ship a $500 Mac without going into the red. Anything they can do to get the revenue and profits rising without shafting users too much is ok with me. Fact is 2 weeks ago you would have spent $249 on a mini with 10hrs less battery time and %50 less storage space for the same money. The USB cable does everything that the firewire cable does albeit a tad slower. This is such a non issue but then again Mac users have become a rather whiny lot in the last few years.
hmmm some salient points there. i'm gonna add fuel to fire, albeit on a new thread based on TMO's latest post...
"Apple Admits USB Dominance Too Big to Ignore; Experts See it as Right Move"
edit: too lazy to start new post, will stick to whining on this one, well, and also calming some people down, reminding them that Firewire is not going anywhere...
remember also now that there will be a firesale over next few weeks on the 1st gen iPod minis... you get
-4gb
-silver or colors
-firewire cable, usb cable, charger
-belt clip
all of this, for a much reduced price as dealers clear their "old" stock of 1st gen iPod minis...
in australia for example, 1st gen iPod mini with all that stuff included cost AUD$399 (i know, i bought it for that), now, you can get it firesale for AUD $259
edit: too lazy to start new post, will stick to whining on this one, well, and also calming some people down, reminding them that Firewire is not going anywhere...
So they save a dollar, and it costs me $19!? Oh, goody, that makes me feel better.
They save 4 million dollars. Mac customers pay $19,000,000 dollars extra (assuming we're twenty-five percent of iPod sales.) I repeat, "Oh, goody."
What's good for Apple Corp is not always the same as what's good for their customers. I guess I hadn't realized they were loosing money on iPods.
Ok, Ok lets let this go already. To help you, close your eyes and pretend the iPod didn't just drop in price, buy the stupid cord and lets go back to complaining about other Apple inefficiencies; like the lack of a decent graphics card in the iMac, no G5 PowerBooks, no professional graphic cards, no 3Ghz Powermacs, slow surfing with Safari, buggy finder, no cell technology yet, no intergraded cappuccino maker, the list goes on. I think what pisses me off the most is the cost of their ram; want to talk about cheating the user. See it?s easy; just close your eyes, mmmmm sleepy time, uuughghg ughghg ughghg.
What's good for Apple Corp is not always the same as what's good for their customers. I guess I hadn't realized they were loosing money on iPods.
None of those potential new 4 million iPods owners has to give a shite about your desire to use firewire.They will simply see a USB cable and use it. Your rebutal lacks teeth as only a small fraction of buyers will not meet the required USB 2.0 thus 19 million FW cable would not need to be purchased.
Basically it boils down to selfishness which humans have in abundance.
First off, anyone with a 3G or 4G iPod (most iPod owners according to sales figures) already has a perfectly capable firewire cable. So you'd have to subtract all the people who already know they have a cable that works and thus won't purchase a new cable. That's likely to be a significant slice of your $19,000,000 pie.
Then you have to figure that anyone who has purchased an eMac in the last year or any other Mac in the last 18 months has USB 2.0. Assuming a modest 25% of those people are also running 10.3.4, you've got another slice of people that won't feel the need to shell out money for a firewire cable.
When you couple those thoughts with the idea that many people also have docks that they can leave on their desk and just keep plugging new iPods into them, I think you'll find that the vast majority of Mac people buying new iPods will in fact not require the purchase of the separate cable and thus the $19,000,000 fable doesn't hold much water.
Look at it from Steve Jobs' point of view. Apple can:
a) keep bundling firewire and thus screw over most iPod buyers (PC people) by making them purchase a separate USB cable just to make their iPod operable while taking a hit on the cost of all those useless firewire cables
b) bundle a USB and firewire cable and take a manufacturing hit on even more cables being thrown away
c) bundle the ugly ass dual USB firewire cable (will never happen)
d) just go ahead and bundle an iPod+USB that will work out of the box with every single Mac manufactured in the last 12 months, every Mac save the eMacs manufactured in the last 18 months (OS upgrade set aside for now), Mac buyers who already own a 3G or 4G iPod sans USB 2.0, and PCs to boot. Less wasteful bundling of disposable cables and out of the box functionality for the majority of future iPod purchasers.
At some point Apple has to make the decision that they've been on the USB 2.0 train long enough for a move like this to be smart. And I would say that since PCs have USB, every Mac made in the last year has USB 2.0, every 3G and 4G iPod sold came with firewire, the imminent release of Tiger... now is the time. The Mac "faithful" are going to bitch, as always and right on queue, no matter when the decision gets made anyway.
None of those potential new 4 million iPods owners has to give a shite about your desire to use firewire.They will simply see a USB cable and use it. Your rebutal lacks teeth as only a small fraction of buyers will not meet the required USB 2.0 thus 19 million FW cable would not need to be purchased.
Basically it boils down to selfishness which humans have in abundance.
And Apple's desire to make a profit also comes from selfishness. It's kind of the basis of this whole capitalism thing.
And obviously, since I am a potential iPod owner--and in fact was looking forward to a new one--then at least one of those 4 million gives a shit. Certainly, I'm not the only one that has noticed the lack of firewire, or that own old macs without USB2. (Old, in this case, being about 6 months old.)
Whether there are enough of us to sway Apple, I don't know. Whether it bothers me enough that I wait to buy a new iPod, I don't know. But I am considering just buying a new battery for my 10 gig model. And I certain that it within the bounds of proper behaviour to let Apple know I'm displeased, and even to complain about it here.
Eh, Wasn't Apple one of the companies that helped to develop USB as faster standard compared to SCSI and parallel ports? If not, weren't they of the early adopters. I remember as a sophmore in college walking into the campus store and one of the selling points the Mac guy was talking about was USB.
Are the current gen ipods Firewire 800 or 400?
Also, firewire is cooler to say than USB. Let's change the the name of USB 2.0 to Icewire.
It was kind of a joke. The problem is that mac was doing b) which I thought was the right thing. And I still think you could pull off a c) that wasn't that bad.
"The Mac "faithful" are going to bitch, as always and right on queue, no matter when the decision gets made anyway."
This hurts, because I'm usually not one of those that complains. I understand the laws of physics precludes a 4 ghz G5 Powerbook, and usually understand Apple's tradeoffs. I just disagree with this one, is all.
I'll stop posting on this, but it still seems Apple defenders tend to get more touchy sometimes than the complainers. I'm not saying I'm leaving Apple for Dell, or that Apple is doomed. Just that I wished they put the $1 cable in the box instead of charging me $19 plus shipping.
Comments
Originally posted by hmurchison
That becomes a potential stocking problem however. You don't know what stores will run through the USB cables or firewire cables first.
I support Apple's decision on this. I think it makes financial sense. The iPod is responsible for Apple actually being able to ship a $500 Mac without going into the red. Anything they can do to get the revenue and profits rising without shafting users too much is ok with me. Fact is 2 weeks ago you would have spent $249 on a mini with 10hrs less battery time and %50 less storage space for the same money. The USB cable does everything that the firewire cable does albeit a tad slower. This is such a non issue but then again Mac users have become a rather whiny lot in the last few years.
hmmm some salient points there. i'm gonna add fuel to fire, albeit on a new thread based on TMO's latest post...
"Apple Admits USB Dominance Too Big to Ignore; Experts See it as Right Move"
http://www.macobserver.com/article/2005/02/25.4.shtml
edit: too lazy to start new post, will stick to whining on this one, well, and also calming some people down, reminding them that Firewire is not going anywhere...
-4gb
-silver or colors
-firewire cable, usb cable, charger
-belt clip
all of this, for a much reduced price as dealers clear their "old" stock of 1st gen iPod minis...
in australia for example, 1st gen iPod mini with all that stuff included cost AUD$399 (i know, i bought it for that), now, you can get it firesale for AUD $259
and that's a good thing...
Originally posted by sunilraman
hmmm some salient points there. i'm gonna add fuel to fire, albeit on a new thread based on TMO's latest post...
"Apple Admits USB Dominance Too Big to Ignore; Experts See it as Right Move"
http://www.macobserver.com/article/2005/02/25.4.shtml
edit: too lazy to start new post, will stick to whining on this one, well, and also calming some people down, reminding them that Firewire is not going anywhere...
So they save a dollar, and it costs me $19!? Oh, goody, that makes me feel better.
Originally posted by D.J. Adequate
So they save a dollar, and it costs me $19!? Oh, goody, that makes me feel better.
Apple is likely going to ship 4 million ipods.
Thus they save closer to 3-4 million dollars.
Originally posted by hmurchison
Apple is likely going to ship 4 million ipods.
Thus they save closer to 3-4 million dollars.
They save 4 million dollars. Mac customers pay $19,000,000 dollars extra (assuming we're twenty-five percent of iPod sales.) I repeat, "Oh, goody."
What's good for Apple Corp is not always the same as what's good for their customers. I guess I hadn't realized they were loosing money on iPods.
Originally posted by D.J. Adequate
They save 4 million dollars. Mac customers pay $19,000,000 dollars extra (assuming we're twenty-five percent of iPod sales.) I repeat, "Oh, goody."
What's good for Apple Corp is not always the same as what's good for their customers. I guess I hadn't realized they were loosing money on iPods.
Ok, Ok lets let this go already. To help you, close your eyes and pretend the iPod didn't just drop in price, buy the stupid cord and lets go back to complaining about other Apple inefficiencies; like the lack of a decent graphics card in the iMac, no G5 PowerBooks, no professional graphic cards, no 3Ghz Powermacs, slow surfing with Safari, buggy finder, no cell technology yet, no intergraded cappuccino maker, the list goes on. I think what pisses me off the most is the cost of their ram; want to talk about cheating the user. See it?s easy; just close your eyes, mmmmm sleepy time, uuughghg ughghg ughghg.
What's good for Apple Corp is not always the same as what's good for their customers. I guess I hadn't realized they were loosing money on iPods.
None of those potential new 4 million iPods owners has to give a shite about your desire to use firewire.They will simply see a USB cable and use it. Your rebutal lacks teeth as only a small fraction of buyers will not meet the required USB 2.0 thus 19 million FW cable would not need to be purchased.
Basically it boils down to selfishness which humans have in abundance.
Oops wait, that's a reactionary number.
First off, anyone with a 3G or 4G iPod (most iPod owners according to sales figures) already has a perfectly capable firewire cable. So you'd have to subtract all the people who already know they have a cable that works and thus won't purchase a new cable. That's likely to be a significant slice of your $19,000,000 pie.
Then you have to figure that anyone who has purchased an eMac in the last year or any other Mac in the last 18 months has USB 2.0. Assuming a modest 25% of those people are also running 10.3.4, you've got another slice of people that won't feel the need to shell out money for a firewire cable.
When you couple those thoughts with the idea that many people also have docks that they can leave on their desk and just keep plugging new iPods into them, I think you'll find that the vast majority of Mac people buying new iPods will in fact not require the purchase of the separate cable and thus the $19,000,000 fable doesn't hold much water.
Look at it from Steve Jobs' point of view. Apple can:
a) keep bundling firewire and thus screw over most iPod buyers (PC people) by making them purchase a separate USB cable just to make their iPod operable while taking a hit on the cost of all those useless firewire cables
b) bundle a USB and firewire cable and take a manufacturing hit on even more cables being thrown away
c) bundle the ugly ass dual USB firewire cable (will never happen)
d) just go ahead and bundle an iPod+USB that will work out of the box with every single Mac manufactured in the last 12 months, every Mac save the eMacs manufactured in the last 18 months (OS upgrade set aside for now), Mac buyers who already own a 3G or 4G iPod sans USB 2.0, and PCs to boot. Less wasteful bundling of disposable cables and out of the box functionality for the majority of future iPod purchasers.
At some point Apple has to make the decision that they've been on the USB 2.0 train long enough for a move like this to be smart. And I would say that since PCs have USB, every Mac made in the last year has USB 2.0, every 3G and 4G iPod sold came with firewire, the imminent release of Tiger... now is the time. The Mac "faithful" are going to bitch, as always and right on queue, no matter when the decision gets made anyway.
Originally posted by hmurchison
None of those potential new 4 million iPods owners has to give a shite about your desire to use firewire.They will simply see a USB cable and use it. Your rebutal lacks teeth as only a small fraction of buyers will not meet the required USB 2.0 thus 19 million FW cable would not need to be purchased.
Basically it boils down to selfishness which humans have in abundance.
And Apple's desire to make a profit also comes from selfishness. It's kind of the basis of this whole capitalism thing.
And obviously, since I am a potential iPod owner--and in fact was looking forward to a new one--then at least one of those 4 million gives a shit. Certainly, I'm not the only one that has noticed the lack of firewire, or that own old macs without USB2. (Old, in this case, being about 6 months old.)
Whether there are enough of us to sway Apple, I don't know. Whether it bothers me enough that I wait to buy a new iPod, I don't know. But I am considering just buying a new battery for my 10 gig model. And I certain that it within the bounds of proper behaviour to let Apple know I'm displeased, and even to complain about it here.
Are the current gen ipods Firewire 800 or 400?
Also, firewire is cooler to say than USB. Let's change the the name of USB 2.0 to Icewire.
Originally posted by rageous
Yeah, Mac people pay $19,000,000.
Oops wait, that's a reactionary number.
It was kind of a joke. The problem is that mac was doing b) which I thought was the right thing. And I still think you could pull off a c) that wasn't that bad.
"The Mac "faithful" are going to bitch, as always and right on queue, no matter when the decision gets made anyway."
This hurts, because I'm usually not one of those that complains. I understand the laws of physics precludes a 4 ghz G5 Powerbook, and usually understand Apple's tradeoffs. I just disagree with this one, is all.
I'll stop posting on this, but it still seems Apple defenders tend to get more touchy sometimes than the complainers. I'm not saying I'm leaving Apple for Dell, or that Apple is doomed. Just that I wished they put the $1 cable in the box instead of charging me $19 plus shipping.
1.) Go to the house next door.
2.) Knock.
3.) Ask politely if you can have their FireWire cable.
It works, and it's free!
End of discussion.
Originally posted by geekdreams
Here's the solution:
1.) Go to the house next door.
2.) Knock.
3.) Ask politely if you can have their FireWire cable.
It works, and it's free!
Man, I need better neighbors. I could probably borrow hunting rifles around here, but if I asked for a firewire cable, they'd hand me jumper-cables.