As for OS X apps disappearing because we'll be able to boot Windows on a Mac, that's just...insane. Why do Mac users spend hundreds of dollars extra to use computers that are usually slower than Wintels and have less compatibility with work and friends? Well there's lots of reason, but the primary one is OS X! Mac users buy Macs because they don't want to use Windows, and it's not an idle choice, it's a costly sacrifice to go the route of using OS X.
Who said existing OS X apps, and developers would dissapear because of it?
The linked opinion piece--I am loath to call it an editorial--bases its thesis on the use of the rumored, but non-existent, Red Box. The functionality of the Red Box will be brought to MacOS X/Intel by numerous third-parties. It makes no sense for Apple to devote any resources at all to supporting Windows apps on MacOS X when others will do it for free.
The fact is that a lot of developers make money catering to Mac users and a lot of other developers lose money catering to Windows users.
I am not aware of any Windows+OSX developers who loose money on the Windows version of a product and make money on the OSX version of the same product. Can you identify some for me? Can you identify any developers who used to be Windows+OSX and went to OSX only due to lack of demand on the Windows side? If a product bombs on the Windows side I would also expect it to bomb on the OSX side. That shouldn't be surprising because Windows users and OSX users use their computers to do the same tasks, so their software needs are similar.
You need to understand that the larger the OS market share the easier it is to find enough customers to cross the break even line with a product for that OS. If you make a product for dentists, you are likely to find 50 times more dentists on the Windows side than on the OSX side. In some software categories the difference isn't as extreme, but you can find a lot more buyers on the Windows side than on the OSX side for any product category I can think of. Not surprising when you consider that only 2% of all computer users run OSX.
If an OSX port barely breaks even you can say it is "making money", but is that justification enough to do the port? You normaly want to achieve a certain minimum profit margin with your product before you would bother with it. Most developers have limited resources and they can't afford to waste them on products that barely make it.
Quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Me
If you identify a need and satisfy it, you win.
I would say that if you satisfy a need and make enough money doing it, you win.
Who said existing OS X apps, and developers would dissapear because of it?
There's been lots of talk of Apple losing developers as they choose drop OS X support and focus on Windows versions of apps, which will supposedly be able to run on the MacIntels.
Too many people are looking at his from an outdated Mac vs Windows angle.
Blizzard's World of Warcraft shows a glimpse of the future.
Dual release - single disc.
However, Blizzard would have preffered to release single version that would have run on both OSX and windows - less cost and quicker to market.
I play the game, and I don't care if it was originally coded for Windows, OSX, a toaster, or even the ZX Spectrum, as long as it runs on my iMac, and gives me experience I want.
I think the future lies with a strong position for OSX in the marketplace, boosted by superb iLife / iWork apps and stability / security benefits. But, with the ability to run Windows apps either natively, or over a THIN emulation layer (but you cannot call them Windows apps any longer, since they can now run on OSX).
These apps will run with the Aqua interface, so no-one will tell the difference, or even care.
Apple sell more computers, developers cut costs, and consumers have more software choice.
There's been lots of talk of Apple losing developers as they choose drop OS X support and focus on Windows versions of apps, which will supposedly be able to run on the MacIntels.
Am I responding in the wrong thread?
I believe the talk was more along the lines that new to Mac developers would not see the need to bother bringing their apps to OS X because Macs will be running windows now, and they will be able to sell their software to Mac buyers without porting it. I don't think anyone said they would loose existing Mac developers.
I am not aware of any Windows+OSX developers who loose money on the Windows version of a product and make money on the OSX version of the same product. Can you identify some for me? ...
You need to understand that the larger the OS market share the easier it is to find enough customers to cross the break even line with a product for that OS. If you make a product for dentists, you are likely to find 50 times more dentists on the Windows side than on the OSX side. In some software categories the difference isn't as extreme, but you can find a lot more buyers on the Windows side than on the OSX side for any product category I can think of. Not surprising when you consider that only 2% of all computer users run OSX.
Been a Macintosh and a Windows developer (for more than 15 years) I can say you that it's not because a market is much more important that you will make more money. You say it yourself: you can find 50 times more dentists on the Windows side. You will find 50 times more dentists software. And so it is more costly to be recognize in the Windows world.
Yes there is more buyers in the Windows side but Macintosh users are more easy to reach (through the Made4Mac Apple site or through particular relation with Apple) and because your are in a small number on the street to do Mac software your are more incline to be known in your area by the buyers.
And a thing that is really important on the Mac side of the business: the quality of the user interface. There is a lot of program for windows that offer no UI consistency. That do not follow Windows guidelines. They will sell more easily on Windows than on Mac where users tend to be more concern with this.
It's really what we have feel in our software development company.
Comments
Originally posted by Junkyard Dawg
As for OS X apps disappearing because we'll be able to boot Windows on a Mac, that's just...insane. Why do Mac users spend hundreds of dollars extra to use computers that are usually slower than Wintels and have less compatibility with work and friends? Well there's lots of reason, but the primary one is OS X! Mac users buy Macs because they don't want to use Windows, and it's not an idle choice, it's a costly sacrifice to go the route of using OS X.
Who said existing OS X apps, and developers would dissapear because of it?
Originally posted by COS
Here's an editorial which summarizes the situation quite nicely:
http://www.osviews.com/modules.php?o...ticle&sid=4759
The linked opinion piece--I am loath to call it an editorial--bases its thesis on the use of the rumored, but non-existent, Red Box. The functionality of the Red Box will be brought to MacOS X/Intel by numerous third-parties. It makes no sense for Apple to devote any resources at all to supporting Windows apps on MacOS X when others will do it for free.
Now all that remains to be seen is whether or not the real intel Macs will do the same.
Originally posted by Mr. Me
You never quit, do you?
Correct.
Originally posted by Mr. Me
The fact is that a lot of developers make money catering to Mac users and a lot of other developers lose money catering to Windows users.
I am not aware of any Windows+OSX developers who loose money on the Windows version of a product and make money on the OSX version of the same product. Can you identify some for me? Can you identify any developers who used to be Windows+OSX and went to OSX only due to lack of demand on the Windows side? If a product bombs on the Windows side I would also expect it to bomb on the OSX side. That shouldn't be surprising because Windows users and OSX users use their computers to do the same tasks, so their software needs are similar.
You need to understand that the larger the OS market share the easier it is to find enough customers to cross the break even line with a product for that OS. If you make a product for dentists, you are likely to find 50 times more dentists on the Windows side than on the OSX side. In some software categories the difference isn't as extreme, but you can find a lot more buyers on the Windows side than on the OSX side for any product category I can think of. Not surprising when you consider that only 2% of all computer users run OSX.
If an OSX port barely breaks even you can say it is "making money", but is that justification enough to do the port? You normaly want to achieve a certain minimum profit margin with your product before you would bother with it. Most developers have limited resources and they can't afford to waste them on products that barely make it.
Originally posted by Mr. Me
If you identify a need and satisfy it, you win.
I would say that if you satisfy a need and make enough money doing it, you win.
Originally posted by onlooker
Who said existing OS X apps, and developers would dissapear because of it?
There's been lots of talk of Apple losing developers as they choose drop OS X support and focus on Windows versions of apps, which will supposedly be able to run on the MacIntels.
Am I responding in the wrong thread?
Blizzard's World of Warcraft shows a glimpse of the future.
Dual release - single disc.
However, Blizzard would have preffered to release single version that would have run on both OSX and windows - less cost and quicker to market.
I play the game, and I don't care if it was originally coded for Windows, OSX, a toaster, or even the ZX Spectrum, as long as it runs on my iMac, and gives me experience I want.
I think the future lies with a strong position for OSX in the marketplace, boosted by superb iLife / iWork apps and stability / security benefits. But, with the ability to run Windows apps either natively, or over a THIN emulation layer (but you cannot call them Windows apps any longer, since they can now run on OSX).
These apps will run with the Aqua interface, so no-one will tell the difference, or even care.
Apple sell more computers, developers cut costs, and consumers have more software choice.
Everyone is happy.
I've seen the future, and it IS garlic bread.
Think about it.
Originally posted by Junkyard Dawg
There's been lots of talk of Apple losing developers as they choose drop OS X support and focus on Windows versions of apps, which will supposedly be able to run on the MacIntels.
Am I responding in the wrong thread?
I believe the talk was more along the lines that new to Mac developers would not see the need to bother bringing their apps to OS X because Macs will be running windows now, and they will be able to sell their software to Mac buyers without porting it. I don't think anyone said they would loose existing Mac developers.
Originally posted by Tidris
Correct.
I am not aware of any Windows+OSX developers who loose money on the Windows version of a product and make money on the OSX version of the same product. Can you identify some for me? ...
You need to understand that the larger the OS market share the easier it is to find enough customers to cross the break even line with a product for that OS. If you make a product for dentists, you are likely to find 50 times more dentists on the Windows side than on the OSX side. In some software categories the difference isn't as extreme, but you can find a lot more buyers on the Windows side than on the OSX side for any product category I can think of. Not surprising when you consider that only 2% of all computer users run OSX.
Been a Macintosh and a Windows developer (for more than 15 years) I can say you that it's not because a market is much more important that you will make more money. You say it yourself: you can find 50 times more dentists on the Windows side. You will find 50 times more dentists software. And so it is more costly to be recognize in the Windows world.
Yes there is more buyers in the Windows side but Macintosh users are more easy to reach (through the Made4Mac Apple site or through particular relation with Apple) and because your are in a small number on the street to do Mac software your are more incline to be known in your area by the buyers.
And a thing that is really important on the Mac side of the business: the quality of the user interface. There is a lot of program for windows that offer no UI consistency. That do not follow Windows guidelines. They will sell more easily on Windows than on Mac where users tend to be more concern with this.
It's really what we have feel in our software development company.