Paul Thurrot's new biased review!

Posted:
in macOS edited January 2014
Although he is being much fairer than usual Paul offers his new comparison between Mac OS X Tiger and Windows Vista Beta 1.



http://www.winsupersite.com/showcase...s_tiger_01.asp



Although Windows does have some good features his criticisms are a little unfair. For example OS X has many new features that Windows has no answer for, Dashboard, Automator, Smart Folder built into everything. One of Paul's criticisms was no automatic Smart Folders - OS X is so intuitive this is not necessary but also different people have different folder needs. He also unfairly criticises the Spotlight Comments box in Get Info, as well as the "show preview" option in Finder which is off by default (I prefer it off as it happens). While none of this is a surprise it is a little disheartening.



At least he doesn't say Windows is more attractive but then with the look Microsoft have produced in Vista, XP looks better - the interface looks very confusing, lack of division between the sections of the explorer window. These images demonstrate my point:















However, I do not wish to criticise Windows too unfairly - the new OS looks a lot better feature wise and they're addressing problems many users are facing.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 36
    Automatic Smart Folders? Apple could whip that up in 2 minutes flat.



    Heck, I could share some of my Smart Folders with the world. I'd be surprised if Apple didn't continue to improve Spotlight and its integration with the Finder (and other apps).



    The difference between Vista and Tiger is the approach. Vista will try to put all the file manipulation in Explorer, while OS X lets other apps handle it.
  • Reply 2 of 36
    maccrazymaccrazy Posts: 2,657member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by kim kap sol

    Automatic Smart Folders? Apple could whip that up in 2 minutes flat.



    Heck, I could share some of my Smart Folders with the world. I'd be surprised if Apple didn't continue to improve Spotlight and its integration with the Finder (and other apps).



    The difference between Vista and Tiger is the approach. Vista will try to put all the file manipulation in Explorer, while OS X lets other apps handle it.




    I like Apple leaving my system alone - i barely appreciate the Pictures/Music folder etc!



    Also files should be organised in their Applications not in the Finder/Explorer - well that's what I and Apple think anyway!



    Vista really is hideous though!
  • Reply 3 of 36
    Quote:

    Originally posted by MacCrazy















    One thing got me by surprise in these images. Where is that menu-bar that is usually on the top of every window in windows ? It seems to be missing in these screenshots!
  • Reply 4 of 36
    a_greera_greer Posts: 4,594member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by MacCrazy

    I like Apple leaving my system alone - i barely appreciate the Pictures/Music folder etc!



    Also files should be organised in their Applications not in the Finder/Explorer - well that's what I and Apple think anyway!



    Vista really is hideous though!




    no no no, Finder/explorer and more importantly, the file system are critical! these virtualizations are great for end users, and as long as they by default save to the conventional places in the file system, that is fine. BUT I dont want everything tied to an app the way you say, i.e.I want to be able to open an MP# in iTunes, but also in protools, play mpg2 in QTP or FCP...media and apps are differant and should always stay that way.
  • Reply 5 of 36
    maccrazymaccrazy Posts: 2,657member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by BoeManE

    One thing got me by surprise in these images. Where is that menu-bar that is usually on the top of every window in windows ? It seems to be missing in these screenshots!



    they're probably done what they've already tried in WMP and MSN and made them invisible. They've finally realised a menu bar on each window is less efficient than one at the top of the screen! And hidden menu bars are awkward - well done MS.
  • Reply 6 of 36
    maccrazymaccrazy Posts: 2,657member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by a_greer

    no no no, Finder/explorer and more importantly, the file system are critical! these virtualizations are great for end users, and as long as they by default save to the conventional places in the file system, that is fine. BUT I dont want everything tied to an app the way you say, i.e.I want to be able to open an MP# in iTunes, but also in protools, play mpg2 in QTP or FCP...media and apps are differant and should always stay that way.



    I don't disagree with you that the finder is important for navigating files - certain things like music and photos are better organised in apps though. It depends on the content but the Finder should be available to all - as it is. I love the slideshow feature in Tiger - really good way to view your pictures easily.
  • Reply 7 of 36
    Reviewing the review...heh...



    As stated earlier incredibly biased; basically stated that many features in OSX are ripped from Vista. Well, I suppose we could ignore the fact that many of the fatures promised for Vista originally have disappeared.



    What really cracked me up was when he said he liked the interface of Windows XP. Sigh...Some people have no taste. That interface is inexcusably ugly, especially given some of the alternate themes out on the net.



    He also forgot to mention viruses, in which OSX wins hands down. But if you really want to see bias, read the OSX review (link in the article).



    Conclusion: Thurrott is full of shit....but then again, we already knew that.
  • Reply 8 of 36
    i didnt read the whole thing, I got bored along the way. But did he mention that 10.5 will be out at around the same time as vista ? He did mention 3-4 times in the part I did read that Vista is still in "early beta" (My observation is that it is in late beta, early beta would have been a year ago and earlier I guess), and that its ok that the UI isn't perfectly polished yet, etc.



    I bet Apple are working HARD at making 10.5 do everything Vista does. a lot more, and a lot better...
  • Reply 9 of 36
    placeboplacebo Posts: 5,767member
    I think that article mentioned Piles/Stacks... doesn't Apple have a PATENT ON THAT?
  • Reply 10 of 36
    Quote:

    Originally posted by mynamehere

    What really cracked me up was when he said he liked the interface of Windows XP. Sigh...Some people have no taste. That interface is inexcusably ugly, especially given some of the alternate themes out on the net.



    Well maybe Thurrott has some kind of nostalgia of the times when he was a kid and played Playskool.
  • Reply 11 of 36
    rara Posts: 623member
    I liked this part the best:
    Quote:

    Nonsensical Thurrot babble

    Unlike with Spotlight, Vista Beta 1's searches are not instantaneous, but this is by design and is arguably a better choice. In Spotlight, as you start typing a search, the search results begin appearing (Figure), which can be both annoying and counterproductive when the first few letters of your search include common letters or words (like "the"). In Vista Beta 1, you need to hit Enter to launch the search (or click the Search button).





    What a comedian.
  • Reply 12 of 36
    maccrazymaccrazy Posts: 2,657member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Ra

    I liked this part the best:

    What a comedian.




    lol



    Incidentally, 10.4 already has most of what Longhorn is promising. Apple need to keep the slick interface of OS X and make it even easier to use - new features are great but improving existing applications would be better.
  • Reply 13 of 36
    smirclesmircle Posts: 1,035member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by mynamehere

    Reviewing the review...heh...



    As stated earlier incredibly biased; basically stated that many features in OSX are ripped from Vista. Well, I suppose we could ignore the fact that many of the fatures promised for Vista originally have disappeared.




    Well, we should not ignore the fact that Apple borrowed some features from Longhorn. Thurrot is right that Spotlight was first discussed roughly a year after MS unveiled its plans to implement WinFS (ironically now pulled from Vista). Similarily, I saw the merged window title-bar that Apple uses in Mail and iTunes first when MS showed the Longhorn UI studies.



    Apple is by far more innovative than MS, but once in a while, they have photocopiers too.



    All in all I like his review - it states pretty clearly that MS is still catching up big time.
  • Reply 14 of 36
    jlljll Posts: 2,709member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Smircle

    I saw the merged window title-bar that Apple uses in Mail and iTunes first when MS showed the Longhorn UI studies.



    Merged window and title-bar has been in brushed metal since it's birth.
  • Reply 15 of 36
    Quote:

    Originally posted by JLL

    Merged window and title-bar has been in brushed metal since it's birth.



    Even OS 9 had a similar look
  • Reply 16 of 36
    Well, if Thurrott is really "fair", he'll have to compare Vista to Leopard when that comes out.



    And I have nothing against him defending windows, but claiming that stuff like non-instantaneous searches are better than Tiger's instant searches, and that MacOS's interface is confusing is just stupid. Then there was the comment about the single click/double click for icons which I just found stupid. When I open a program from the start menu in windows or in the quick launch bar I only click once, whereas an icon on the desktop needs to be clicked twice. And at least, unlike XP, if I doubleclick on a program shortcut, it doesn't open two copies of the program.
  • Reply 17 of 36
    placeboplacebo Posts: 5,767member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Ra

    I liked this part the best:

    What a comedian.




    Yeah, that surprised me. I mean, I barely use my dock anymore, because I can type "I" and have iTunes open with just a command-enter.
  • Reply 18 of 36
    smirclesmircle Posts: 1,035member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by JLL

    Merged window and title-bar has been in brushed metal since it's birth.



    Right, but what I am referring to is not brushed metal but the way iTunes 5 and Mail merge the title bar and a toolbar directly below:







    Basically I don't think copying is such a big deal, but Apple seems to think so - still they do it themselves.
  • Reply 19 of 36
    rara Posts: 623member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Smircle

    Well, we should not ignore the fact that Apple borrowed some features from Longhorn. Thurrot is right that Spotlight was first discussed roughly a year after MS unveiled its plans to implement WinFS (ironically now pulled from Vista).



    To think that Apple has copied things from Longhorn is a little shortsighted. Imagine, if Apple were to copy something from Longhorn, that would mean they didn't start working on it UNTIL AFTER it was publicly displayed by Microsoft. And now, Apple has these copied features in a shipping product but Microsoft is still working on theirs? That would mean either Apple has the best development team in the world, or else Microsoft has one of the worst.



    Just because Microsoft "showed" theirs first, doesn't mean Apple wasn't already working on something of the same sort.
  • Reply 20 of 36
    smirclesmircle Posts: 1,035member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Ra

    To think that Apple has copied things from Longhorn is a little shortsighted. Imagine, if Apple were to copy something from Longhorn, that would mean they didn't start working on it UNTIL AFTER it was publicly displayed by Microsoft. And now, Apple has these copied features in a shipping product but Microsoft is still working on theirs? That would mean either Apple has the best development team in the world, or else Microsoft has one of the worst.



    Or MS is in the process of doing a deep rewrite. If you remember the time when Apple was transitioning from 7.6 (when Apple bought NeXT) till 10.0, nothing really great was introduced in between. This was, like 6 years or something. Apple kept their secrets until they released the software, MS tries to impress the market with what they will eventually release.







    Quote:

    Just because Microsoft "showed" theirs first, doesn't mean Apple wasn't already working on something of the same sort.



    Exactly what Thurott is writing:

    Quote:

    And before you fire up your email client to tell me about Apple patents, ideas from Copland, or other nonsense, relax. I'm not claiming that Microsoft "invented" anything. What I am claiming, however, is that Microsoft legitimatized certain technologies at PDC 2003 by announcing that they will be included in Windows, and that Apple seized on the opportunity to add those features--whether they were previously planned or not--in Tiger, which it knew would ship well before Windows Vista.



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