my guess is that there are a lot of homes like this one in which one person (the SO) needs windows to access work (can do it with a Mac but they keep changing the firewall/access and their Mac support sucks etc etc) so dual boot machines look good (windows cost doesn't matter since her work has a site license)-- so we'll use OSX for everything (photos/music etc) except that pesky Citrix (no more syncing between Macs and Windows- yay!)
My iBook is the only laptop I have owned so all my Windows development is done on my desktop. If Windows can be installed on an Intel powered Mac then I will be getting a new laptop. I will wait until both Powerbooks and iBooks have Intel inside so I can see what features each model offers before I make the decision. If I had no intention to dual boot then the iBook would be a no-brainer, but I will be loading XP Pro, Office 2003, VS2005, IIS, and SQL Server Express so I might have to shell out the extra money for a PowerBook.
I have heard of viruses that can trash a partition making it unusable so if I got one of these while using Windows could it trash the partition that OS X is using? If only the partition Windows is installed on is affected then that is no big deal. I am not saying viruses are a minor inconvenience, if that, but what Windows user doesn't know about "ctrl-alt-del" and "reinstall"?
I wonder if it will be possible to somehow configure a setup to allow a 'fast user switching' style, where one session is OS X and the other session Windows. That would be pretty cool, if running Windows inside of OS X isnt possible.
dual boot sucks... the best is just virtual PC as it is now, but 100x faster!
it's so easy! drag and drop between the two desktop, launch windows in 5sec, switch from one to the other very easily, etc...
that's all I want : a better VPC!
See, I like this idea on the surface. I agree that it's real easy to switch back-n-forth between both environments. Windows starts up quicker & easier and generally works better on a Mac than on a pc. Go figure.
But (and it's a big BUT), 3D graphic acceleration still isn't supported - that leaves out any gaming (which is all I wanted out of it), because everything else I get from the Mac does me very nicely, thank you.
Gaming under VPC is fine, just as long as I'm not looking for anything more taxing than Dig Dug.
I run VMWARE virutal machine on my PC. Host OS is Windows XP and I have multiple guest OSes (Windows XP, Windows 2000, Redhat Fedore Core 2, Mandrake 10.1). From the speed point of view, the virtual machine is VERY efficient. Windows XP runs about 15-20% slower in VM mode than in native mode.
I would expect very similar results for Windows running in a VM inside OSX.
The main limitation of the VM at this point is the peripheral driver limitation inside the VM. Currenly 3D acceleration og graphics is slow and the things like USB2 are glitchy. However, this is purely a software limitation and I'm sure it will addressed if the VM technology enters mainstream use.
True, but on the other side, Microsoft making it easy to use Windows on a Mac encourages PC users to switch to a Mac since most do want to switch. Does Microsoft really want to encourage PC to use Mac OS X?
I expect them to try it and see what happens and react in a way that's most to their advantage.
They must have all kinds of scenario's for all kinds of situations ready.
They hold all the cards. They're going to be the ones who are balancing out the prices and features of Windows, VPC, Office for Mac and Office for Windows.
Still, I think every party is going to benefit somehow if Windows runs on a Mac. The user for having the Windows option, Apple for selling more hardware and Microsoft for selling more software.
But (and it's a big BUT), 3D graphic acceleration still isn't supported - that leaves out any gaming (which is all I wanted out of it), because everything else I get from the Mac does me very nicely, thank you.
[/B]
but it may be in a next VPC! When you imagine how complicated it should be to emulate a X86 on a PPC, it must be much easier to "emulate" a X86 on a X86!
what about the speed of Virtual PC for windows? can you play a game in 2000 while running XP?
And even if it was not possible, a dual boot mode for gaming is still OK... (and you could have OS X in emulation on your XP desktop!)
You guys are forgetting one major demograph: gamers.
I don't know how aquianted you all are with the Mac gaming scene, but it has recently descended into a black hole, with no major releases for the past few months besides WoW, and all games running pretty poorly on the Mac.
If Windows can be booted onto a MacTel, within a few months every Mac game porting studio will close it's doors and most gamers will be booting to Windows to run PC games. Native commerical Mac gaming will be completely obliterated.
This is a good thing if you ask me though, thanks to Gamespy and HAVOC we have had nthing good to play for literally years. I'm buying an Intel Mac for the sole purpose of running games on Windows.
Because I don't want to waste my money on poorly designed hardware and have to put up with working in the horrendous Windows interface. I will only use Windows for games, but always for games, and when I do I won't be interacting with the OS at all. Whenever I do anything else I'll be in OS X.
When mactels come out, it is likely that they will use EFI firmware. Windows XP cannot boot from EFI, but windows XP 64bit edition can. The Yonah processor is not 64bit, so my guess is that we will have to wait for either Merom (or Conroe) in a mac, or the release of Vista (which will be able to boot from EFI) to boot windows on a mactel... Wine or Virtual PC are likely going to work much sooner.
Because I don't want to waste my money on poorly designed hardware
Well then, what computer do you buy? I haven't seen many companies (including Apple) that can design and build hardware better than Intel themselves! If you find one, let me know.
You can certainly get hardware in a PC that is of design and build quality that Apple never dreamed of in years.
If you want to run games, buy a good PC and play your games.
Well then, what computer do you buy? I haven't seen many companies (including Apple) that can design and build hardware better than Intel themselves! If you find one, let me know.
You can certainly get hardware in a PC that is of design and build quality that Apple never dreamed of in years.
If you want to run games, buy a good PC and play your games.
Huh?
Intel builds chips. Dell, Sony, etc. are the ones who decide what hardware to use. To get a PC with has good hardware as the Mac you will pay the same if not more.
Intel builds chips. Dell, Sony, etc. are the ones who decide what hardware to use. To get a PC with has good hardware as the Mac you will pay the same if not more.
So... what are you talking about?
Perhaps he was referring to the MBs, which Intel does make some of those. You can see them at: www.newegg.com
Comments
it's so easy! drag and drop between the two desktop, launch windows in 5sec, switch from one to the other very easily, etc...
that's all I want : a better VPC!
I have heard of viruses that can trash a partition making it unusable so if I got one of these while using Windows could it trash the partition that OS X is using? If only the partition Windows is installed on is affected then that is no big deal. I am not saying viruses are a minor inconvenience, if that, but what Windows user doesn't know about "ctrl-alt-del" and "reinstall"?
Originally posted by mania
dual booting has got to be quicker than waiting for VPC to fireup on a G4.
Try it on a G3.
(Set aside an entire afternoon)
Originally posted by Placebo
Well, if the Mactels can't run Windows, I'm buying a PC.
Later, dude. Have fun.
Originally posted by belzebuth
dual boot sucks... the best is just virtual PC as it is now, but 100x faster!
it's so easy! drag and drop between the two desktop, launch windows in 5sec, switch from one to the other very easily, etc...
that's all I want : a better VPC!
See, I like this idea on the surface. I agree that it's real easy to switch back-n-forth between both environments. Windows starts up quicker & easier and generally works better on a Mac than on a pc. Go figure.
But (and it's a big BUT), 3D graphic acceleration still isn't supported - that leaves out any gaming (which is all I wanted out of it), because everything else I get from the Mac does me very nicely, thank you.
Gaming under VPC is fine, just as long as I'm not looking for anything more taxing than Dig Dug.
I would expect very similar results for Windows running in a VM inside OSX.
The main limitation of the VM at this point is the peripheral driver limitation inside the VM. Currenly 3D acceleration og graphics is slow and the things like USB2 are glitchy. However, this is purely a software limitation and I'm sure it will addressed if the VM technology enters mainstream use.
Originally posted by iPeon
True, but on the other side, Microsoft making it easy to use Windows on a Mac encourages PC users to switch to a Mac since most do want to switch. Does Microsoft really want to encourage PC to use Mac OS X?
I expect them to try it and see what happens and react in a way that's most to their advantage.
They must have all kinds of scenario's for all kinds of situations ready.
They hold all the cards. They're going to be the ones who are balancing out the prices and features of Windows, VPC, Office for Mac and Office for Windows.
Still, I think every party is going to benefit somehow if Windows runs on a Mac. The user for having the Windows option, Apple for selling more hardware and Microsoft for selling more software.
[i]
But (and it's a big BUT), 3D graphic acceleration still isn't supported - that leaves out any gaming (which is all I wanted out of it), because everything else I get from the Mac does me very nicely, thank you.
[/B]
but it may be in a next VPC! When you imagine how complicated it should be to emulate a X86 on a PPC, it must be much easier to "emulate" a X86 on a X86!
what about the speed of Virtual PC for windows? can you play a game in 2000 while running XP?
And even if it was not possible, a dual boot mode for gaming is still OK... (and you could have OS X in emulation on your XP desktop!)
I don't know how aquianted you all are with the Mac gaming scene, but it has recently descended into a black hole, with no major releases for the past few months besides WoW, and all games running pretty poorly on the Mac.
If Windows can be booted onto a MacTel, within a few months every Mac game porting studio will close it's doors and most gamers will be booting to Windows to run PC games. Native commerical Mac gaming will be completely obliterated.
This is a good thing if you ask me though, thanks to Gamespy and HAVOC we have had nthing good to play for literally years. I'm buying an Intel Mac for the sole purpose of running games on Windows.
Half Life 1&2
FEAR
System Shock 2
Deus Ex 2
... I can't wait.
Originally posted by Yixian
I'm buying an Intel Mac for the sole purpose of running games on Windows.
... I can't wait.
So why don't you buy a PC?
Originally posted by Yixian
Because I don't want to waste my money on poorly designed hardware
Well then, what computer do you buy? I haven't seen many companies (including Apple) that can design and build hardware better than Intel themselves! If you find one, let me know.
You can certainly get hardware in a PC that is of design and build quality that Apple never dreamed of in years.
If you want to run games, buy a good PC and play your games.
Originally posted by skatman
Well then, what computer do you buy? I haven't seen many companies (including Apple) that can design and build hardware better than Intel themselves! If you find one, let me know.
You can certainly get hardware in a PC that is of design and build quality that Apple never dreamed of in years.
If you want to run games, buy a good PC and play your games.
Huh?
Intel builds chips. Dell, Sony, etc. are the ones who decide what hardware to use. To get a PC with has good hardware as the Mac you will pay the same if not more.
So... what are you talking about?
Originally posted by iPeon
Huh?
Intel builds chips. Dell, Sony, etc. are the ones who decide what hardware to use. To get a PC with has good hardware as the Mac you will pay the same if not more.
So... what are you talking about?
Perhaps he was referring to the MBs, which Intel does make some of those. You can see them at: www.newegg.com