Apple underclocking MacBook Pro graphics cards

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 86
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,334member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by ecking

    That'd be cool but if someone overclocked too much and screwed up their computer think of all the warranty and tech support issues apple would have.



    A simple normal and maximum like nagromme said would be perfect if it was possible to do that while still keeping the machines safe.



    I mean yeah sure people haven't had problems with this but no one has done it for a long time, who knows how much life that might take out of the components, or future damage it could do.




    This is why I read through the posts first. This is exactly what I would have said.
  • Reply 22 of 86
    chagichagi Posts: 284member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Robin Hood

    Correct me if I am wrong here, but I believe that the CPU has very specific features that allow it to dynamically adjust its speed.



    The GPU, however, DOES NOT. As such, it would be impossible for Apple to implement the feature you suggest.




    There is a program called "RivaTuner" for Windows that allows you to change both the clock speed of your GPU and the GPU's video memory without rebooting. Many enthusiasts use this type of program to run the graphics card(s) in their gaming machines a bit faster than shipping specs.
  • Reply 23 of 86
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,448member
    This isn't the first time apple has pulled this stunt.



    Back in the Rev B g5 days they had a 9800xt and 9600xt (so they said). When this ati program was run on these cards, it was found that these cards were actually running at 9600pro and 9800pro speeds. The next rev... they completely dropped the xt and pro titles because people were bitching.



    Why they underclocked them for the g5's is unbeknownced to me... but they did.



    I'm actually for a sliding scale for a laptop... kinda... sorta. I mean these laptops get hot enough as it is! I run my powerbook on a cooler 24/7. Course it's my work machine.



    But it would be nice to get a little extra umph when u needed it.
  • Reply 24 of 86
    bengt77bengt77 Posts: 45member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by ascii

    The iMac is also underclocked. By default it is set at 400/400 instead of 470/470. I upped the frequency using ATI Tool and Far Cry was noticably smoother.



    Ah! Does the iMac get much hotter by turning it all the way up? And how much does it do for framerates? Can you give some benchmarks for the default settings and for the 'upped' settings? I would really like to know the difference there. And is the difference in Far Cry 'between the ears' or is it really noticeable?
  • Reply 25 of 86
    messiahmessiah Posts: 1,689member
    I'm not sure that's entirely lawful (at least in the UK).



    If you've crippled something then you should be selling it as the full-on product. By hiding the fact that you have crippled the product, this is effectively what you are doing.



    I should imagine that there have been a number of customers out there who have based their purchasing decision based on the performance of the X1600.



    Unless Apple makes it perfectly clear that what it's selling isn't the full-on X1600, but a crippled version, then I think it is perfectly understandable that MBP purchasers who visit a retailer should expect full-on X1600 performance AND the low noise level that they experienced in the shop when they get home.



    When they find out that they haven't received the full-on X1600 they are immediately entitled to a full cash refund and can insist that Apple stop selling the product (in this manner) in the UK. Not sure how this works in the US.



    It's the same as Intel selling an 955 chip as a 965. Intel can't get away with it so why should Apple?



    I can't believe how underhand Apple are sometimes...
  • Reply 26 of 86
    chuckerchucker Posts: 5,089member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Messiah

    Unless Apple makes it perfectly clear that what it's selling isn't the full-on X1600, but a crippled version



    They are. The specs page clearly references as mobility version, not a regular version.
  • Reply 27 of 86
    smirclesmircle Posts: 1,035member
    So Apple is selling people castrated GPUs, but charging full price, just so the can brag with their x1600? Nice move - not.



    I am no gamer myself, but if I shelled out the money for the MBP expecting to get great gaming performance, I'd be severely pissed now.



    I suppose with the slow-ass clocking, Apple could have as well used a X800 in there. But it is always nice to see how some people find excuses for Apple even if they are outright duped...
  • Reply 28 of 86
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Messiah

    I can't believe how underhand Apple are sometimes...



    May I suggest actually doing some research, before spouting off? Apple is selling you the full X1600 mobility graphics card. By default, they have optimised its clock rate in software to enhance battery life, and make the MacBook Pro run as quietly and as cool as possible.



    You can of course get ATI's beta utility to "overlock" it, though obviously this will hurt battery life and make your MacBook Pro a lot noisier and hotter. It's up to you.
  • Reply 29 of 86
    On the other hand, if they advertised the X1600 mobility card, but gave you a different card, or a version which can't even clock as high, THAT would be a problem. However, this is NOT what Apple are doing.



    It amazes me how {personal attack removed - JL} some people are, reaching conclusions before even doing some very basic research. Or maybe it's just laziness.
  • Reply 30 of 86
    By the way, since it apparently is possible to adjust the GPU speed without rebooting, I do fully agree that Apple should look into the viability of adding some GPU speed options to the Energy Saver control panel, e.g. "Normal" and "Highest".



    Until than, anybody who wants to change the clock speed of their GPU will need to download the official ATI tool, or something like ATIccelerator II. Both of which appear to adjust it on the fly: "On-the-fly ATI overclocking tool" from http://mapage.noos.fr/campahunta/index.html
  • Reply 31 of 86
    lundylundy Posts: 4,466member
    Did anybody check ATI's Specifications page for the x1600 Mobility?



    http://www.ati.com/products/mobility...600/specs.html





    Quote:

    Performance, technologies and features listed above can vary with specific notebook implementations.

    Please consult with Notebook vendor for a complete list of supported features.



  • Reply 32 of 86
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,334member
    What I find to be amazing is that all the people who crab about how they want a thinner, lighter laptop here, will also crab because said laptop can't cool enough, and that a bigger heavier battery can't be cramped in, so that these power hungry, and HOT chips can run at full speeds.



    If the MBP were a half inch thicker, and a half pound heavier, then there wouldn't be a problem.



    Life is a compromise. Get over it.
  • Reply 33 of 86
    But, but, melgross , I want my 30" MacBook Pro with SLI graphics and quad core. It must weigh no more than 3 pounds, and have at least 8 hours of battery life. It must also be completely silent, and not generate any heat of any kind.



    I hope Apple does not screw up again by not releasing this product. Apple keep screwing up. And I, for one, am tired of it! We must demand satisfaction!
  • Reply 34 of 86
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,334member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Robin Hood

    But, but, melgross , I want my 30" MacBook Pro with SLI graphics and quad core. It must weigh no more than 3 pounds, and have at least 8 hours of battery life. It must also be completely silent, and not generate any heat of any kind.



    I hope Apple does not screw up again by not releasing this product. Apple keep screwing up. And I, for one, am tired of it! We must demand satisfaction!






  • Reply 35 of 86
    My question is: wouldn't this be considered false advertising? If they are marketing that they have a specific GPU that has a published set of features/speeds, then they are modifiying these speeds without telling the consumer, isn't that illegal. It's obvious they want to APPEAR to have a fast GPU when in reality they do not. A consumer making a purchasing decision would see this GPU and another computer with the same GPU and consider them equivalent, when in fact Apple's is not capable of performing at advertised speeds.



    I see this as a blatent violation of consumer trust and Apple should be called on it. If I had purchased a new MacBook, I would be furious!
  • Reply 36 of 86
    Quote:

    melgross\tWhat I find to be amazing is that all the people who crab about how they want a thinner, lighter laptop here, will also crab because said laptop can't cool enough, and that a bigger heavier battery can't be cramped in, so that these power hungry, and HOT chips can run at full speeds.



    If the MBP were a half inch thicker, and a half pound heavier, then there wouldn't be a problem.



    Life is a compromise. Get over it.



    Sure you are right melgross, life is a compromise. But a consumer should be the one who chooses to make the compromise. Apple should be clear that you are not getting what is 'in the box' so to speak. It should be very clear what you are compromising to get your thin, long-life-ed sleek MacBook. I love Apple computers but I am not a hacker and must rely on trusting apple's published specs as true.
  • Reply 37 of 86
    flounderflounder Posts: 2,674member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by makkystyle

    My question is: wouldn't this be considered false advertising? If they are marketing that they have a specific GPU that has a published set of features/speeds, then they are modifiying these speeds without telling the consumer, isn't that illegal. It's obvious they want to APPEAR to have a fast GPU when in reality they do not. A consumer making a purchasing decision would see this GPU and another computer with the same GPU and consider them equivalent, when in fact Apple's is not capable of performing at advertised speeds.



    I see this as a blatent violation of consumer trust and Apple should be called on it. If I had purchased a new MacBook, I would be furious!




    Did you even read Lundy's post?
  • Reply 38 of 86
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,448member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by makkystyle

    My question is: wouldn't this be considered false advertising? If they are marketing that they have a specific GPU that has a published set of features/speeds, then they are modifiying these speeds without telling the consumer, isn't that illegal. It's obvious they want to APPEAR to have a fast GPU when in reality they do not. A consumer making a purchasing decision would see this GPU and another computer with the same GPU and consider them equivalent, when in fact Apple's is not capable of performing at advertised speeds.



    I see this as a blatent violation of consumer trust and Apple should be called on it. If I had purchased a new MacBook, I would be furious!




    In a way I agree with you. When I found out my ATI 9800xt in my g5 wasn't a real 9800xt I was pretty upset. I mean I paid extra money for it.



    Graphics card manufacters advertise the speeds of the GPU core and the memory rate. Even if it's slower, they always advertise. I'm curious as to why apple does NOT advertise these speeds and makes it difficult to find them out.



    Can someone PLEASE give us speeds of an x1600 mobile GPU? I'd imagine they are different than a x1600... perhaps apple isn't underclocking them at all?
  • Reply 39 of 86
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,448member
    Quote:

    The Mobility Radeon X1600 GPU is essentially identical to the desktop Radeon X1600, save for its lower clock speeds and potentially smaller compliment of frame buffer memory. Whereas the desktop Radeon X1600 family of products will have their GPU's clocked at speeds ranging from 500MHz - 590MHz, with 128MB-256MB of memory clocked at 780MHz - 1.38GHz, the Mobility Radeon X1600 as it was configured in the Asus A7G notebook we used for testing had both its core and memory clocked at 470MHz. Clock speeds will likely vary based on the particular notebook design, however.



    Off of hothardware.com...



    So the macbook pros actually have a crippled x1600 mobility gpu. What a shame.



    Can someone confirm the iMac's speeds?
  • Reply 40 of 86
    andersanders Posts: 6,523member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by lundy

    Did anybody check ATI's Specifications page for the x1600 Mobility?



    http://www.ati.com/products/mobility...600/specs.html




    And that page doesn´t even state anything about the speed.



    Looks like graphics cards for laptops is an accepted custom fit and you cannot claim that someone cheated you from certain specs if the manufactor of the computer didn´t claim them.
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