As for "throwing the pen away".. how are you supposed to input data? a keyboard? Envision the a hard drive, battery, screen, mobo, processor, etc at an incline.. now, before it falls, connect a keyboard.. I donno what physics class you took, but that keyboard better weigh 8 pounds so the thing doesn't fall over!
I'll admit that there are some issues with attaching a keyboard to create a well balancing notebook, but I can imagine a tablet being around 3 lbs or less if flash is used. A keyboard base with most of the weight toward the front would maximize the lever action. Maybe even have it so you moved the battery from the tablet portion to the base.
Oh yeah, and I'm calling BS on those people who say they wouldn't buy a Macbook if it turned into a tablet.
Would these people seriously just throw away their existing Macs if they suddenly, magically acquired the ability to get input from the screen?
Just buy the Macbooks and throw the pens away if you feel that strongly about it. Geeesh...
That's where I have to agree to agree to agree.... They have no idea what Apple can do in making this, and they already say they wouldn't accept a two in one unit. I think my arguments stand on their own why we would be better suited with a two in one unit. Apple designers/engineers merely have to overcome the drawbacks instilled into the minds of all these PC weenies that think it's bad because their limited knowledge is based on the PC design. Apple/Mac engineering, and design is a whole new world to them which is why I forgive them for their cluelessness.
Tablets ... are more likely to break the screen when you drop them.
Do you have anything to back that up? The most fragile part is the LCD, which is probably the same unit as a non-tablet but with a thin sensor layer on top of it.
People complain about smudges, but I don't get that problem on my Palm.
I think a tablet would be great as a virtual audio control surface or video mixer control. For day-to-day GUI use, I think touching the buttons on the screen as if they were buttons would be a lot more efficient than adjusting the cursor with a mouse and clicking.
However, I don't think it makes sense to eliminate the keyboard. For a lot of text entry the keyboard is the best way to go.
1) when closed, crap on the ground on which I drop it cannot touch the screen of a laptop
2) Tablets are always 'open.'
∴ ...
Structurally, I have no idea which are more shock/dent resistant. I'd imagine throwing pebbles at the face of both screens would be a bad idea, but dropping it is like dropping a slice of bread with peanut butter on it: if you're not high enough, it's going to land face-side down.
I've seen combination laptops/tablets before and have yet to be impressed. They make good tablets but usually bulky laptops.
Again, however, I have no use for a tablet-only system. (and, as a disclaimer, I can't afford a laptop anyway right now).
If Apple made a tablet, I think we'd all need to examine what it's like before making judgements (as per onlooker's post). However, I, personally, need a keyboard, period.
1) when closed, crap on the ground on which I drop it cannot touch the screen of a laptop
2) Tablets are always 'open.'
...
I've seen combination laptops/tablets before and have yet to be impressed. They make good tablets but usually bulky laptops.
I hadn't considered tablet-only units. My sister has a "combination" unit, and its thickness is actually comparable to laptops, the touch sensor doesn't really add much thickness.
Frankly, dropping any type of portable computer larger than a Palm from waist height is almost certainly going to cause damage to the screen, open or closed, no matter the type of machine it is.
David Pogue of The New York Times today panned the Ultra Mobile PC running MS Windows Tablet OS. While he is very cranky about a lack of keyboard, these problems could perhaps be addressed by rethinking and retooling the operating software...hopefully by Apple. In any case, again as with the TabletPC, the OS seems to be the primary problem, making a keyboard desirable in the case of this machine. I don't want a machine like the one reviewed below, but if Apple can instead make a tablet on which I can get some real work done, I am all for it.
David Pogue of The New York Times today panned the Ultra Mobile PC running MS Windows Tablet OS. While he is very cranky about a lack of keyboard, these problems could perhaps be addressed by rethinking and retooling the operating software...hopefully by Apple. In any case, again as with the TabletPC, the OS seems to be the primary problem, making a keyboard desirable in the case of this machine. I don't want a machine like the one reviewed below, but if Apple can instead make a tablet on which I can get some real work done, I am all for it.
Well I think 57 to 38 isn't a bad meter, and I think 50% + of those 38 would probably reconsider once it was here. And it also seems that about 20% of those 38 just wanted a big PDA - so, you can count that, but wanting a big PDA is not of any real relevance being that this topic isn't about just a big screen with a pen input. We were trying to discuss a real tablet that would be usable by the most users possible. Obviously if used for school a student would probably want to do some gaming in their free time, and that isn't possible with a big PDA. Expanding the existing laptop design is obviously the most versatile decision because it can adapt itself to anything that is already being done, and expands it into new territories.
Sales would be the key factor, and chances of a large enough group buying a pen only input big PDA device would be less than enough to keep this thing a float. I just don't see it happening that way.
That's the problem. Too many of us don't need a toy. We need something that expands, or ad's on to the possibilities of what is already available to us.
That's why I wouldn't choose to buy just a Laptop, or, just a plain single input tablet. But if the two were combined the combination offers more than just one or the other. I have no use for either by itself, and I'm definitely not going to buy two products to lug around, but together as one I see a whole new level of possibilities. Other than that. I've had a PowerBook before. It was the one Mac that I have owned that I sold. When I used it It was like I felt I was half way there, but I needed for it to do more, and the things I needed it to do are easily achievable for Apple in 2006.
Acer & Toshiba do a combined Laptop/Tablet here in the uk.
David Pogue of The New York Times today panned the Ultra Mobile PC running MS Windows Tablet OS. While he is very cranky about a lack of keyboard, these problems could perhaps be addressed by rethinking and retooling the operating software...hopefully by Apple. In any case, again as with the TabletPC, the OS seems to be the primary problem, making a keyboard desirable in the case of this machine. I don't want a machine like the one reviewed below, but if Apple can instead make a tablet on which I can get some real work done, I am all for it.
Great article. I was starting to think he didn't 'get it' when he talked about the lack of a keyboard, but then David went on to talk about more likely uses--presentations, multimedia, etc.
The biggest complaints seem to be about input method (whether physical or OS-based) and small screen (number of pixels). Apple could fix the former with great engineering, and the latter with a screen with at least 800x600 resolution, if not more.
One thing David didn't emphasize (and why he still might not quite 'get it') is that, since a UMPC is not designed to be your primary PC, text input is not critically important.
I have a desktop. I don't need a desktop replacement. I want the equivalent of a computer iPod: an accessory that's small, light, and easy for web browsing and media playback.
Again, maybe I'm wanting something from the iPod division rather than the Mac division (but I do want it with OS X so I can use iPhoto, Mail, iCal, etc.).
For me, a laptop with a touchscreen and a bulky convertible keyboard (e.g., most Windows tablets) is useless and expensive.
I agree with you. I want a device that can do everything you said and be able to control my music from my Power Mac etc. In a way act as a remote control. I suppose my vision of a tablet is a mutimedia device rather than something I would being doing spreadsheets and word documents on.
Such is the vision of my 8" tablet; a small on-the-go computer for secondary tasks...
The 13.3" & 17" tablets would be for more 'traditional' usage, and better integrate with 'traditional' input devices...
;^p
I think the above would be a more plausable idea for a Tablet. In fact an 8" tablet would be ideal. With a cut down version of OSX and possibly with a feature like being able to control other devices such as TV's HI Fi. Idealy this would be flash based to make it as thin as possible and probably running a xscale processor from Intel?
I think the above would be a more plausable idea for a Tablet. In fact an 8" tablet would be ideal. With a cut down version of OSX and possibly with a feature like being able to control other devices such as TV's HI Fi. Idealy this would be flash based to make it as thin as possible and probably running a xscale processor from Intel?
That's it, guys! Perfect.
Hey, Apple, come talk to Jimbo, MacRonin and me. We have a business plan for ya.
I think the above would be a more plausable idea for a Tablet. In fact an 8" tablet would be ideal. With a cut down version of OSX and possibly with a feature like being able to control other devices such as TV's HI Fi. Idealy this would be flash based to make it as thin as possible and probably running a xscale processor from Intel?
So you want a big PDA. Start a new thread. Your mucking ours up.
About the size of a DVD case (which is really close to a 16:10 ratio) and half again as thick...
Looks like a large PDA phone with OSX to me.
I think it's usefulness is comparatively limited. Because all you really did is spec out a PDA phone, and added the OS, and a real processor. It looks more like a hardware hacked PDA really. \
Comments
Originally posted by slughead
As for "throwing the pen away".. how are you supposed to input data? a keyboard? Envision the a hard drive, battery, screen, mobo, processor, etc at an incline.. now, before it falls, connect a keyboard.. I donno what physics class you took, but that keyboard better weigh 8 pounds so the thing doesn't fall over!
I'll admit that there are some issues with attaching a keyboard to create a well balancing notebook, but I can imagine a tablet being around 3 lbs or less if flash is used. A keyboard base with most of the weight toward the front would maximize the lever action. Maybe even have it so you moved the battery from the tablet portion to the base.
Nothing the engineers couldn't figure out.
Originally posted by Nordstrodamus
Oh yeah, and I'm calling BS on those people who say they wouldn't buy a Macbook if it turned into a tablet.
Would these people seriously just throw away their existing Macs if they suddenly, magically acquired the ability to get input from the screen?
Just buy the Macbooks and throw the pens away if you feel that strongly about it. Geeesh...
That's where I have to agree to agree to agree....
Originally posted by slughead
Tablets ... are more likely to break the screen when you drop them.
Do you have anything to back that up? The most fragile part is the LCD, which is probably the same unit as a non-tablet but with a thin sensor layer on top of it.
People complain about smudges, but I don't get that problem on my Palm.
I think a tablet would be great as a virtual audio control surface or video mixer control. For day-to-day GUI use, I think touching the buttons on the screen as if they were buttons would be a lot more efficient than adjusting the cursor with a mouse and clicking.
However, I don't think it makes sense to eliminate the keyboard. For a lot of text entry the keyboard is the best way to go.
Originally posted by JeffDM
Do you have anything to back that up?
Absolutely:
1) when closed, crap on the ground on which I drop it cannot touch the screen of a laptop
2) Tablets are always 'open.'
∴ ...
Structurally, I have no idea which are more shock/dent resistant. I'd imagine throwing pebbles at the face of both screens would be a bad idea, but dropping it is like dropping a slice of bread with peanut butter on it: if you're not high enough, it's going to land face-side down.
I've seen combination laptops/tablets before and have yet to be impressed. They make good tablets but usually bulky laptops.
Again, however, I have no use for a tablet-only system. (and, as a disclaimer, I can't afford a laptop anyway right now).
If Apple made a tablet, I think we'd all need to examine what it's like before making judgements (as per onlooker's post). However, I, personally, need a keyboard, period.
Originally posted by slughead
Absolutely:
1) when closed, crap on the ground on which I drop it cannot touch the screen of a laptop
2) Tablets are always 'open.'
...
I've seen combination laptops/tablets before and have yet to be impressed. They make good tablets but usually bulky laptops.
I hadn't considered tablet-only units. My sister has a "combination" unit, and its thickness is actually comparable to laptops, the touch sensor doesn't really add much thickness.
Frankly, dropping any type of portable computer larger than a Palm from waist height is almost certainly going to cause damage to the screen, open or closed, no matter the type of machine it is.
Originally posted by slughead
?is like dropping a slice of bread with peanut butter on it: if you're not high enough, it's going to land face-side down?
So you are saying I gotta get REALLY baked before I make my PB&Js??!?
;^p
David Pogue's review of the UltraMobile PC
Originally posted by netdog
David Pogue of The New York Times today panned the Ultra Mobile PC running MS Windows Tablet OS. While he is very cranky about a lack of keyboard, these problems could perhaps be addressed by rethinking and retooling the operating software...hopefully by Apple. In any case, again as with the TabletPC, the OS seems to be the primary problem, making a keyboard desirable in the case of this machine. I don't want a machine like the one reviewed below, but if Apple can instead make a tablet on which I can get some real work done, I am all for it.
David Pogue's review of the UltraMobile PC
While I agree with Pogue on this one, he's usually a pro-Apple stooge. Every new OS Apple releases is practically without complaint from his column.
The guy's written several Mac OS help books, several of which I've owned. While he's a smart guy, it's hard to see him as objective
Sales would be the key factor, and chances of a large enough group buying a pen only input big PDA device would be less than enough to keep this thing a float. I just don't see it happening that way.
Originally posted by onlooker
That's the problem. Too many of us don't need a toy. We need something that expands, or ad's on to the possibilities of what is already available to us.
That's why I wouldn't choose to buy just a Laptop, or, just a plain single input tablet. But if the two were combined the combination offers more than just one or the other. I have no use for either by itself, and I'm definitely not going to buy two products to lug around, but together as one I see a whole new level of possibilities. Other than that. I've had a PowerBook before. It was the one Mac that I have owned that I sold. When I used it It was like I felt I was half way there, but I needed for it to do more, and the things I needed it to do are easily achievable for Apple in 2006.
Acer & Toshiba do a combined Laptop/Tablet here in the uk.
Originally posted by netdog
David Pogue of The New York Times today panned the Ultra Mobile PC running MS Windows Tablet OS. While he is very cranky about a lack of keyboard, these problems could perhaps be addressed by rethinking and retooling the operating software...hopefully by Apple. In any case, again as with the TabletPC, the OS seems to be the primary problem, making a keyboard desirable in the case of this machine. I don't want a machine like the one reviewed below, but if Apple can instead make a tablet on which I can get some real work done, I am all for it.
David Pogue's review of the UltraMobile PC
Great article. I was starting to think he didn't 'get it' when he talked about the lack of a keyboard, but then David went on to talk about more likely uses--presentations, multimedia, etc.
The biggest complaints seem to be about input method (whether physical or OS-based) and small screen (number of pixels). Apple could fix the former with great engineering, and the latter with a screen with at least 800x600 resolution, if not more.
One thing David didn't emphasize (and why he still might not quite 'get it') is that, since a UMPC is not designed to be your primary PC, text input is not critically important.
I have a desktop. I don't need a desktop replacement. I want the equivalent of a computer iPod: an accessory that's small, light, and easy for web browsing and media playback.
Again, maybe I'm wanting something from the iPod division rather than the Mac division (but I do want it with OS X so I can use iPhoto, Mail, iCal, etc.).
For me, a laptop with a touchscreen and a bulky convertible keyboard (e.g., most Windows tablets) is useless and expensive.
The 13.3" & 17" tablets would be for more 'traditional' usage, and better integrate with 'traditional' input devices...
;^p
Originally posted by MacRonin
Such is the vision of my 8" tablet; a small on-the-go computer for secondary tasks...
The 13.3" & 17" tablets would be for more 'traditional' usage, and better integrate with 'traditional' input devices...
;^p
I think the above would be a more plausable idea for a Tablet. In fact an 8" tablet would be ideal. With a cut down version of OSX and possibly with a feature like being able to control other devices such as TV's HI Fi. Idealy this would be flash based to make it as thin as possible and probably running a xscale processor from Intel?
Originally posted by jimbo123
I think the above would be a more plausable idea for a Tablet. In fact an 8" tablet would be ideal. With a cut down version of OSX and possibly with a feature like being able to control other devices such as TV's HI Fi. Idealy this would be flash based to make it as thin as possible and probably running a xscale processor from Intel?
That's it, guys! Perfect.
Hey, Apple, come talk to Jimbo, MacRonin and me. We have a business plan for ya.
Originally posted by jimbo123
I think the above would be a more plausable idea for a Tablet. In fact an 8" tablet would be ideal. With a cut down version of OSX and possibly with a feature like being able to control other devices such as TV's HI Fi. Idealy this would be flash based to make it as thin as possible and probably running a xscale processor from Intel?
So you want a big PDA. Start a new thread. Your mucking ours up.
60 to 39.
Originally posted by onlooker
So you want a big PDA. Start a new thread. Your mucking ours up.
60 to 39.
No, I want a small, highly portable Mac OS X tablet?
[deadhorse mode]
8" widescreen multi-touch LCD
1.06GHz ULV Core Duo CPU w/2MB shared cache
533MHz FSB
512MB NAND flash memory
2GB DDR2 SDRAM (two SO-DIMM slots)
32GB 1.8" FlashRAM HDD
Intel GMA950 integrated GPU
WUSB (wireless USB)
AirPort Extreme
BlueTooth
Quad band cell capabilities
Pivoting iSight camera
stereo BlueTooth headset w/microphone
Stylus
Mac OS X 10.5
About the size of a DVD case (which is really close to a 16:10 ratio) and half again as thick...
[/deadhorse mode]
Sorry about all the muck?
Smells like my horse mighta let loose with a few road apples?
(with an instant 'knock on wood', would't want to bring any bad mojo to the Apple tablet party?!)
;*p
Originally posted by MacRonin
8" widescreen multi-touch LCD
1.06GHz ULV Core Duo CPU w/2MB shared cache
533MHz FSB
512MB NAND flash memory
2GB DDR2 SDRAM (two SO-DIMM slots)
32GB 1.8" FlashRAM HDD
Intel GMA950 integrated GPU
WUSB (wireless USB)
AirPort Extreme
BlueTooth
Quad band cell capabilities
Pivoting iSight camera
stereo BlueTooth headset w/microphone
Stylus
Mac OS X 10.5
About the size of a DVD case (which is really close to a 16:10 ratio) and half again as thick...
Looks like a large PDA phone with OSX to me.
I think it's usefulness is comparatively limited. Because all you really did is spec out a PDA phone, and added the OS, and a real processor. It looks more like a hardware hacked PDA really.