Well, 10.4.6 introduced more bugs, such as the cusor disappearing and apps losing focus along with other strange behaviors (Mail is still jacked up, and I often can't send mail at all due to some Mail SMTP issue)
More importantly, since they came out, the intel iMacs airport fails when resuming from full sleep, forcing a restart. I reported the bug through the developer connection and it is a known issue, but still not fixed. You would think having networking not function would be a sev 1 issue wouldn't you?
I have some ongoing bug issues with Mail and I hope they get resolved.
1) Certain e-mails get sent to Junk and there is nothing I can do about it. The addresses are in my Address Book and there is no 'junk icon' on the the e-mails that lets me tell the program that it is 'not junk.'
2) Preferences for when to delete e-mail from the server never stick. IF I quit the program then it reverts to never delete.
Anybody else have these issues or am I 'special' ?
I can confirm both.. I have that issue too. My own mail gets deleted when I try to send mail to my wife on the same box, and I'm the owner of the box.
here's more:
Junk filters won't block Apple mail - at least not for me. I pick junk for every apple mail that comes in, and its never junked.
Trying to set up two mail accounts within the same user ends up breaking outbound mail somehow where both accounts fail with SMTP errors.
I bought this machine in large part due to its app integration, but am finding mail pretty useless, and safari unable to play most media I run across on the internet (I'm on intel imac). iPhoto crashed fatally several times and has a number of annoying bugs.
Hmmm I guess I should have waited a while for a stable OS.. Looks to me like Apple is falling for the "features" over function problem..
I can confirm both.. I have that issue too. My own mail gets deleted when I try to send mail to my wife on the same box, and I'm the owner of the box.
Not had that one. Maybe you've not set the accounts up correctly.
Quote:
Originally posted by Spinnetti
Junk filters won't block Apple mail - at least not for me. I pick junk for every apple mail that comes in, and its never junked.
That's because most mail from apple is just one big image or set of images. The junk mail filter won't work on that. Also, you've probably got Apple in your address book so the mail will be coming from someone you know. And as a previous reply said, Apple only sends mail if you subscribe to their mailouts. There's an 'unsubscribe' link in the bottom of every mail from them.
Quote:
Originally posted by Spinnetti
Trying to set up two mail accounts within the same user ends up breaking outbound mail somehow where both accounts fail with SMTP errors.
I've 11 mail accounts in mail. 4 different mail servers. 2 IMAP and the rest POP/SMTP. I never have errors other than those when the network is down. I get a couple of hundred emails a day.
Quote:
Originally posted by Spinnetti
I bought this machine in large part due to its app integration, but am finding mail pretty useless, and safari unable to play most media I run across on the internet (I'm on intel imac). iPhoto crashed fatally several times and has a number of annoying bugs.
Make sure you have the latest Quicktime 7 and that you've installed the WMV Plugin from http://www.flip4mac.com/
I don't know why you're finding Mail useless. IMHO it's one of the better pieces in OSX although I prefered OSX 10.3's Mail. iPhoto06 has never crashed for me either and I love it, but then my opinion is tainted by having to suffer iPhoto 05 - which was unusable. If they fixed the redeye tool (ie. put it back to iPhoto 2's method) I'd be happy.
Quote:
Originally posted by Spinnetti
Hmmm I guess I should have waited a while for a stable OS.. Looks to me like Apple is falling for the "features" over function problem..
I wouldn't have said so but it always amazes me that I can never have problems but then some other user who does something differently (wrongly or rightly) can get into quite a mess.
Most of this stuff worked fine on my G5 - and started up when I got my MacIntel.
The mail stuff was fine a couple point releases ago, and worked great on my G5. I never had any problems with iPhoto5 either, but on intel, iPhoto and mail are truly jacked up. I've done all sorts of stuff and if you look on the apple support site, you will find dozens of others with the same problems.
Flipformac doesn't work on intel either.
I got the dissapearing cursor in Safari again last night (triggered while in safari, but cursor was gone for all apps)
its all fixable - eventually. You would probably feel different if your finder crashed and took out your whole machine too (copy too many files to the desktop, and computer goes bye-bye), or iPhoto dumped and you lost all your albums and meta data and had to redo thousands of pictures (Twice)... I've had Apples since before the Mac, and things are less stable than I've ever experienced. It sucks that I'm half afraid of tripping over another fatal bug and have to backup constantly to not lose data. I've got 6 pages of bugs documented, and have been slowly feeding them to Apples internal reporter - most are already known...
I'd say, if you are on a G5, wait another generation before going intel!
The first G5 towers shipped with 10.2 but started to shine when 10.3 was released. I would expect that the intel Macs fare better with the latest OS updates and I'd wager a good deal of 10.5 will be making intel scream that much more.
I don't see staying away from the intel machines though. But I do have a dual G5 tower so my machine's power will last me another 6-12 months.
One thing I like about Thunderbird, and the reason I won't use Mail until it has it, is one button per mail that allows me to mark any given mail as junk and it automatically moves it to the junk folder. A single click vs. two clicks or a click and key combination. IIRC, the default Mail "mark junk" key combination was something like three keys simultaneously. It's so for Thunderbird, marking junk is quick and I don't have to think about it. Mail's method seemed pretty backward and inefficient to me.
One thing I like about Thunderbird, and the reason I won't use Mail until it has it, is one button per mail that allows me to mark any given mail as junk and it automatically moves it to the junk folder. A single click vs. two clicks or a click and key combination. IIRC, the default Mail "mark junk" key combination was something like three keys simultaneously. It's so for Thunderbird, marking junk is quick and I don't have to think about it. Mail's method seemed pretty backward and inefficient to me.
Another thing that seems odd; if you go the the junk folder and mark something as not junk, it doesn't move it out; it leaves it in junk. I understand the logic, but don't like that either.
I'm an 'early adopter', so I jumped on the latest hardware, but this is the first time I've thought that wasn't the smartest thing to do (I've had two generations of the G5 imac too oh, and have a G3 also)
Another thing that seems odd; if you go the the junk folder and mark something as not junk, it doesn't move it out; it leaves it in junk. I understand the logic, but don't like that either.
Unfortunately, Thunderbird behaves the same in this regard, unless there is a setting I haven't seen.
One thing I like about Thunderbird, and the reason I won't use Mail until it has it, is one button per mail that allows me to mark any given mail as junk and it automatically moves it to the junk folder.
Add the "Mark as Junk" button to the toolbar. Works on one or many messages, whatever you have selected. You can do the same in the individual message window. When you're in the Junk folder, or looking at a Junked message, it becomes "Mark as Not Junk", so it just toggles.
One thing I like about Thunderbird, and the reason I won't use Mail until it has it, is one button per mail that allows me to mark any given mail as junk and it automatically moves it to the junk folder. A single click vs. two clicks or a click and key combination. IIRC, the default Mail "mark junk" key combination was something like three keys simultaneously. It's so for Thunderbird, marking junk is quick and I don't have to think about it. Mail's method seemed pretty backward and inefficient to me.
The Junk Mail icon in the toolbar does this already when you're not running in training mode atleast - I can't remember what it does in non-training mode. Always has done. You click it, the mail disappears to the junk mail folder.
Shift-Command-J is the keyboard equivalent. You can of course change that to anything you fancy.
Add the "Mark as Junk" button to the toolbar. Works on one or many messages, whatever you have selected. You can do the same in the individual message window. When you're in the Junk folder, or looking at a Junked message, it becomes "Mark as Not Junk", so it just toggles.
I've done that, but it's not in-line with with the individual mail, the in-line button is more efficient. At any given time, but many times a day, I usually only get one or two junks that don't automatically get junked and I've found that Thunderbird's method to be far better and a lot more efficient for me.
Quote:
Originally posted by aegisdesign
Shift-Command-J is the keyboard equivalent. You can of course change that to anything you fancy.
That was the brain damaged three key combination that I was complaining about. The default combination shouldn't be more than two keys. I know it can be changed, but that process is somewhat tedious as well.
Another thing that seems odd; if you go the the junk folder and mark something as not junk, it doesn't move it out; it leaves it in junk. I understand the logic, but don't like that either.
Where would it put it?
If it put it in your inbox it would be ignoring your rules.
If it didn't ignore the rules, then it'd end back in Junk!
Quote:
Originally posted by Spinnetti
I'm an 'early adopter', so I jumped on the latest hardware, but this is the first time I've thought that wasn't the smartest thing to do (I've had two generations of the G5 imac too oh, and have a G3 also)
Someone has to be my test patsy.
Seriously though. The writing was on the wall. It's a stop gap CPU for Intel. It's Apple's first foray into Intel tech and it's midstream in the OS.
I'm waiting for the Core architecure, the second set of intel Macs and OSX 10.5.
If it put it in your inbox it would be ignoring your rules.
If it didn't ignore the rules, then it'd end back in Junk!
Someone has to be my test patsy.
Seriously though. The writing was on the wall. It's a stop gap CPU for Intel. It's Apple's first foray into Intel tech and it's midstream in the OS.
I'm waiting for the Core architecure, the second set of intel Macs and OSX 10.5.
Well, it goes like this:
> "It puts the message in the junk folder"
> "It puts the lotion on... " no, wait.. I mean I look at the mail, mark it as not-junk, then it should put it BACK in the inbox. Think it over again.. its how it should work, since it put it in the wrong folder to start with - it SHOULD be in the inbox where it was supposed to go.
On the hardware front, I'm waiting too - then I'll upgrade again, making it my 5th iMac
Mail.app is one of the applications carried over from NeXT almost unchanged until they destroyed it in 10.4. In NeXTStep applications showed the extension.
What I can't get with the updates is that Calculator seems to change with every update. Do they break it each time and let some intern cut their teeth on software releases as an exercise? Or is teh Steve still fiddling with the calculator construction set ?
Dont forget that 10.4 also shows app extensions now too.
Microsoft had an app called "Mail" too (Microsoft Mail).
Since the word "mail" is used a lot, its smart to refer to Apple's Mail.app so that once can discern the application Mail from the topic of mail.
"I launched mail to get my mail, and then I read a new mail that said I can get a 50% discount on Viagra by mail".
Microsoft had Windows 3.11 and it was no big deal so I see no reason for Apple not to have Mac OS X 4.10, 4.11, etc., which is really how it should be written.
Sadly, it's Mac OS X 10.4.11 not Mac OS X 4.11 ... And to bring up Windows in such an argument is just bad taste. :P ... I guess Apple will simply freak us all out and go with 10.4.9.1 instead.
regarding the not junk thing, here's the solution (i think): basically, apple has relegated most fo the junk/not junk training to its toolbar buttons. so you HAVE to have the junk button as part of your message reading window. then, when you open a message in its own window, the button will VERY subtly change between being labeled "junk" or "not junk" and you HAVE to have text AND icons showing int he toolbar, or else you'd never know, because the button icon itself doesn't change.
it's actually a pretty friggin' bizarre human-interface thing, with the downside that you can very-likely LOSE e-mail if your filter's not behaving properly.
i seem to be having the same problem. you advised to look for the button to change subtly to "not junk." i guess that works for you, but it doesn't for me. good mail goes right into my junk mailbox, and the button stays junk, so i have no way of training the program to accept this sender as non-junk. the button stays junk even when i open the mail in a separate window. i have repaired permissions.
i used to see the not junk button in 10.3 and in earlier versions of 10.4, i just don't see it in 10.4.10. is there any way to get it back?
Comments
More importantly, since they came out, the intel iMacs airport fails when resuming from full sleep, forcing a restart. I reported the bug through the developer connection and it is a known issue, but still not fixed. You would think having networking not function would be a sev 1 issue wouldn't you?
Originally posted by amac4me
Apple is ahead despite the Intel transition. "Redmond, your copy machines are slow"
Imagine the Buzz
Its off topic, but Ooo... I like it... they should use that!
Originally posted by Carson O'Genic
I have some ongoing bug issues with Mail and I hope they get resolved.
1) Certain e-mails get sent to Junk and there is nothing I can do about it. The addresses are in my Address Book and there is no 'junk icon' on the the e-mails that lets me tell the program that it is 'not junk.'
2) Preferences for when to delete e-mail from the server never stick. IF I quit the program then it reverts to never delete.
Anybody else have these issues or am I 'special'
I can confirm both.. I have that issue too. My own mail gets deleted when I try to send mail to my wife on the same box, and I'm the owner of the box.
here's more:
Junk filters won't block Apple mail - at least not for me. I pick junk for every apple mail that comes in, and its never junked.
Trying to set up two mail accounts within the same user ends up breaking outbound mail somehow where both accounts fail with SMTP errors.
I bought this machine in large part due to its app integration, but am finding mail pretty useless, and safari unable to play most media I run across on the internet (I'm on intel imac). iPhoto crashed fatally several times and has a number of annoying bugs.
Hmmm I guess I should have waited a while for a stable OS.. Looks to me like Apple is falling for the "features" over function problem..
As soon as Vista is released Apple will be on to 10.6!
Long before longhorn indeed!
Originally posted by Spinnetti
I can confirm both.. I have that issue too. My own mail gets deleted when I try to send mail to my wife on the same box, and I'm the owner of the box.
Not had that one. Maybe you've not set the accounts up correctly.
Originally posted by Spinnetti
Junk filters won't block Apple mail - at least not for me. I pick junk for every apple mail that comes in, and its never junked.
That's because most mail from apple is just one big image or set of images. The junk mail filter won't work on that. Also, you've probably got Apple in your address book so the mail will be coming from someone you know. And as a previous reply said, Apple only sends mail if you subscribe to their mailouts. There's an 'unsubscribe' link in the bottom of every mail from them.
Originally posted by Spinnetti
Trying to set up two mail accounts within the same user ends up breaking outbound mail somehow where both accounts fail with SMTP errors.
I've 11 mail accounts in mail. 4 different mail servers. 2 IMAP and the rest POP/SMTP. I never have errors other than those when the network is down. I get a couple of hundred emails a day.
Originally posted by Spinnetti
I bought this machine in large part due to its app integration, but am finding mail pretty useless, and safari unable to play most media I run across on the internet (I'm on intel imac). iPhoto crashed fatally several times and has a number of annoying bugs.
Make sure you have the latest Quicktime 7 and that you've installed the WMV Plugin from http://www.flip4mac.com/
I don't know why you're finding Mail useless. IMHO it's one of the better pieces in OSX although I prefered OSX 10.3's Mail. iPhoto06 has never crashed for me either and I love it, but then my opinion is tainted by having to suffer iPhoto 05 - which was unusable. If they fixed the redeye tool (ie. put it back to iPhoto 2's method) I'd be happy.
Originally posted by Spinnetti
Hmmm I guess I should have waited a while for a stable OS.. Looks to me like Apple is falling for the "features" over function problem..
I wouldn't have said so but it always amazes me that I can never have problems but then some other user who does something differently (wrongly or rightly) can get into quite a mess.
Most of this stuff worked fine on my G5 - and started up when I got my MacIntel.
The mail stuff was fine a couple point releases ago, and worked great on my G5. I never had any problems with iPhoto5 either, but on intel, iPhoto and mail are truly jacked up. I've done all sorts of stuff and if you look on the apple support site, you will find dozens of others with the same problems.
Flipformac doesn't work on intel either.
I got the dissapearing cursor in Safari again last night (triggered while in safari, but cursor was gone for all apps)
its all fixable - eventually. You would probably feel different if your finder crashed and took out your whole machine too (copy too many files to the desktop, and computer goes bye-bye), or iPhoto dumped and you lost all your albums and meta data and had to redo thousands of pictures (Twice)... I've had Apples since before the Mac, and things are less stable than I've ever experienced. It sucks that I'm half afraid of tripping over another fatal bug and have to backup constantly to not lose data. I've got 6 pages of bugs documented, and have been slowly feeding them to Apples internal reporter - most are already known...
I'd say, if you are on a G5, wait another generation before going intel!
I don't see staying away from the intel machines though. But I do have a dual G5 tower so my machine's power will last me another 6-12 months.
Originally posted by JeffDM
One thing I like about Thunderbird, and the reason I won't use Mail until it has it, is one button per mail that allows me to mark any given mail as junk and it automatically moves it to the junk folder. A single click vs. two clicks or a click and key combination. IIRC, the default Mail "mark junk" key combination was something like three keys simultaneously. It's so for Thunderbird, marking junk is quick and I don't have to think about it. Mail's method seemed pretty backward and inefficient to me.
Another thing that seems odd; if you go the the junk folder and mark something as not junk, it doesn't move it out; it leaves it in junk. I understand the logic, but don't like that either.
I'm an 'early adopter', so I jumped on the latest hardware, but this is the first time I've thought that wasn't the smartest thing to do (I've had two generations of the G5 imac too oh, and have a G3 also)
Originally posted by Spinnetti
Another thing that seems odd; if you go the the junk folder and mark something as not junk, it doesn't move it out; it leaves it in junk. I understand the logic, but don't like that either.
Unfortunately, Thunderbird behaves the same in this regard, unless there is a setting I haven't seen.
Originally posted by JeffDM
One thing I like about Thunderbird, and the reason I won't use Mail until it has it, is one button per mail that allows me to mark any given mail as junk and it automatically moves it to the junk folder.
Add the "Mark as Junk" button to the toolbar. Works on one or many messages, whatever you have selected. You can do the same in the individual message window. When you're in the Junk folder, or looking at a Junked message, it becomes "Mark as Not Junk", so it just toggles.
Originally posted by JeffDM
One thing I like about Thunderbird, and the reason I won't use Mail until it has it, is one button per mail that allows me to mark any given mail as junk and it automatically moves it to the junk folder. A single click vs. two clicks or a click and key combination. IIRC, the default Mail "mark junk" key combination was something like three keys simultaneously. It's so for Thunderbird, marking junk is quick and I don't have to think about it. Mail's method seemed pretty backward and inefficient to me.
The Junk Mail icon in the toolbar does this already when you're not running in training mode atleast - I can't remember what it does in non-training mode. Always has done. You click it, the mail disappears to the junk mail folder.
Shift-Command-J is the keyboard equivalent. You can of course change that to anything you fancy.
Originally posted by Kickaha
Add the "Mark as Junk" button to the toolbar. Works on one or many messages, whatever you have selected. You can do the same in the individual message window. When you're in the Junk folder, or looking at a Junked message, it becomes "Mark as Not Junk", so it just toggles.
I've done that, but it's not in-line with with the individual mail, the in-line button is more efficient. At any given time, but many times a day, I usually only get one or two junks that don't automatically get junked and I've found that Thunderbird's method to be far better and a lot more efficient for me.
Originally posted by aegisdesign
Shift-Command-J is the keyboard equivalent. You can of course change that to anything you fancy.
That was the brain damaged three key combination that I was complaining about. The default combination shouldn't be more than two keys. I know it can be changed, but that process is somewhat tedious as well.
Originally posted by Spinnetti
Another thing that seems odd; if you go the the junk folder and mark something as not junk, it doesn't move it out; it leaves it in junk. I understand the logic, but don't like that either.
Where would it put it?
If it put it in your inbox it would be ignoring your rules.
If it didn't ignore the rules, then it'd end back in Junk!
Originally posted by Spinnetti
I'm an 'early adopter', so I jumped on the latest hardware, but this is the first time I've thought that wasn't the smartest thing to do (I've had two generations of the G5 imac too oh, and have a G3 also)
Someone has to be my test patsy.
Seriously though. The writing was on the wall. It's a stop gap CPU for Intel. It's Apple's first foray into Intel tech and it's midstream in the OS.
I'm waiting for the Core architecure, the second set of intel Macs and OSX 10.5.
Originally posted by aegisdesign
Where would it put it?
If it put it in your inbox it would be ignoring your rules.
If it didn't ignore the rules, then it'd end back in Junk!
Someone has to be my test patsy.
Seriously though. The writing was on the wall. It's a stop gap CPU for Intel. It's Apple's first foray into Intel tech and it's midstream in the OS.
I'm waiting for the Core architecure, the second set of intel Macs and OSX 10.5.
Well, it goes like this:
> "It puts the message in the junk folder"
> "It puts the lotion on... " no, wait.. I mean I look at the mail, mark it as not-junk, then it should put it BACK in the inbox. Think it over again.. its how it should work, since it put it in the wrong folder to start with - it SHOULD be in the inbox where it was supposed to go.
On the hardware front, I'm waiting too - then I'll upgrade again, making it my 5th iMac
Originally posted by aegisdesign
It's historical.
Mail.app is one of the applications carried over from NeXT almost unchanged until they destroyed it in 10.4. In NeXTStep applications showed the extension.
What I can't get with the updates is that Calculator seems to change with every update. Do they break it each time and let some intern cut their teeth on software releases as an exercise? Or is teh Steve still fiddling with the calculator construction set ?
Dont forget that 10.4 also shows app extensions now too.
Microsoft had an app called "Mail" too (Microsoft Mail).
Since the word "mail" is used a lot, its smart to refer to Apple's Mail.app so that once can discern the application Mail from the topic of mail.
"I launched mail to get my mail, and then I read a new mail that said I can get a 50% discount on Viagra by mail".
Originally posted by Gene Clean
What's wrong with 10.4.10? 10.4.11? 10.4.12?
Microsoft had Windows 3.11 and it was no big deal so I see no reason for Apple not to have Mac OS X 4.10, 4.11, etc., which is really how it should be written.
Mac OS X 10.4.9½
regarding the not junk thing, here's the solution (i think): basically, apple has relegated most fo the junk/not junk training to its toolbar buttons. so you HAVE to have the junk button as part of your message reading window. then, when you open a message in its own window, the button will VERY subtly change between being labeled "junk" or "not junk" and you HAVE to have text AND icons showing int he toolbar, or else you'd never know, because the button icon itself doesn't change.
it's actually a pretty friggin' bizarre human-interface thing, with the downside that you can very-likely LOSE e-mail if your filter's not behaving properly.
i seem to be having the same problem. you advised to look for the button to change subtly to "not junk." i guess that works for you, but it doesn't for me. good mail goes right into my junk mailbox, and the button stays junk, so i have no way of training the program to accept this sender as non-junk. the button stays junk even when i open the mail in a separate window. i have repaired permissions.
i used to see the not junk button in 10.3 and in earlier versions of 10.4, i just don't see it in 10.4.10. is there any way to get it back?