But thanks for playing. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
I'm glad Apple backed out. I never use Apple support but still people expect more from Apple.
Personally I am slightly hard of hearing from a cave diving accident. It isn't the training or English that usualy does me in, it's the accent. Call centers should be "local." The only time you should end up in a foreign call center is for overflow reasons and that needs to be the exception rather than the rule.
Personally, I find the offshore call centers insulting. I don't blame the workers there. They're doing their job exactly as their trained to do. What I don't like is the attempt to fool customers into believing that the call is being handled in someones native country. When you know how the off shore call center training is done and you get someone that follows that training step by step... it just ticks me off. Someone answers the phone... you pick up on the accent and the delay... "Hi, my name is Bob, how can I help you?". And then if a country specific holiday is coming soon, they will say something like "Enjoy your Thanksgiving". Again, I don't blame the people in the call centers for this... I blame the companies who are using them and clearly know the feeling that people have about outsourcing work so they try to cover it up.
Unfortunately, my computer skills are strong enough that by the time I get to the point where I call for help... I need more help than a simple script is going to be able to provide. That applies regardless of where the call center is located. I was setting up a Dell for my parents a few years ago... and it would hang for nearly a minute everytime I turned it on. I couldn't for the life of me figure out what was wrong... I went so far as to do a re-install of Windows. The good old "When all else fails... re-install" and it still didn't fix the problem. Finally, I called Dell support. They asked if I had installed any new programs and apart from that, the only thing they could offer is restoring the system using the restore disks. My problem was that it had the problem out of the box... what would restoring it do? But I gave it a shot... and of course, nada. Turns out the BIOS was set to boot from the Zip drive first. Since there wasn't anything in there, it would just hang until it timed out. But, that was something I had to figure out on my own.
Here's a question... exactly how many Indians actually own a Mac? Anyone got current consumer sales figures for Apple India?
Bear in mind that wages in India are pretty low, therefore the average call center worker is not going to be in a position to purchase one. Anyone in India who owns a Mac will probably not be looking for work in a call center anyway.
I only ask because (correct me if I'm wrong) if Mac ownership is low in proportion to population then how exactly would 3000 Indian call center drones be able to offer support as regards a computer they have had little experience of?
I only ask because (correct me if I'm wrong) if Mac ownership is low in proportion to population then how exactly would 3000 Indian call center drones be able to offer support as regards a computer they have had little experience of?
They can't. But the same can be said of many people who work at your local Apple store. Last time I went there, the only differences that was mentioned to me (after talking to some reps and staffers at the "Genius" bar) between the MBs and the 15" MBP was screen size, color, and better graphics on the MBP. How can they work there if they don't know their own products? What helpful tech support can they provide even in person, let alone on the phone?
err shouldn't the debate in this thread be more about how Apple got this so wrong? why they changed their minds so fast after making a big deal out of it? seems like some poor business decisions going down at the top at Apple. I know every company makes poor choices sometimes but this seems remarkably poorly thought out if they pull the plug after only couple of months?
Will this have a bearing outside of the US though? Australia and NZ get diverted to India for all tech support calls. I think Apple Australia - which IS rather separate from 'Apple' US - will still use this feature Unfortunately Apple Australia is responsible for how everything runs business wise here, and I don't think America has much of a say with administration issues (but does have a say with products, advertising, etc).
In the 80s if we had a tech support question, we got diverted to the US. Then Apple Australia set up local support staff in the mid 1990s. Then in 2003-2004 they slowly started to cut back the staff, until they eventually got rid of all of the support staff Would be great if people here could get their jobs back!
They can't. But the same can be said of many people who work at your local Apple store. Last time I went there, the only differences that was mentioned to me (after talking to some reps and staffers at the "Genius" bar) between the MBs and the 15" MBP was screen size, color, and better graphics on the MBP. How can they work there if they don't know their own products? What helpful tech support can they provide even in person, let alone on the phone?
I am from India and I guess I speak from experience, the wage disparites between an american worker and indian worker are huge. The person employed at the Apple store would get more than 1500 dollars per month I am just guessing, I am an engineer and my monthly check is worth 330 dollars. MiMac is right how can people who have never worked on a mac be counted on giving customer support for Apple customers. I have a mac myself but I would not work for Apple customer support, and Apple would not hire me for that too.
yes - A LOT of money is saved by outsourcing. They also do not have to worry so much about all the work-place laws and penalty rates because they do not apply in India under their workplace laws.
Techies would most definitely get more than 1500 per month. This could be considered proportionate due to the higher costs of living in the US, and Australia, etc, could it not? Having said that though, workers should be paid what they deserve for the tasks they are expected to fulfill - regardless of where you live.
I hope you are not offended by the apparent aversion to Indian call centres! I don't think it matters where the centre is located, if the staff know what they are talking about, then it is a plus. Unfortunately in this case, the staff do not seem to be overly experienced with Macs - or at least to the degree the customer base expects them to be. Also it is hard for many to understand accents that they are not accustomed to hearing, which can be quite frustrating at times.
Comments
Originally posted by BWhaler
Oh spare me. This is so idiotic it hurts.
...
But thanks for playing. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
I'm glad Apple backed out. I never use Apple support but still people expect more from Apple.
Personally I am slightly hard of hearing from a cave diving accident. It isn't the training or English that usualy does me in, it's the accent. Call centers should be "local." The only time you should end up in a foreign call center is for overflow reasons and that needs to be the exception rather than the rule.
Unfortunately, my computer skills are strong enough that by the time I get to the point where I call for help... I need more help than a simple script is going to be able to provide. That applies regardless of where the call center is located. I was setting up a Dell for my parents a few years ago... and it would hang for nearly a minute everytime I turned it on. I couldn't for the life of me figure out what was wrong... I went so far as to do a re-install of Windows. The good old "When all else fails... re-install" and it still didn't fix the problem. Finally, I called Dell support. They asked if I had installed any new programs and apart from that, the only thing they could offer is restoring the system using the restore disks. My problem was that it had the problem out of the box... what would restoring it do? But I gave it a shot... and of course, nada. Turns out the BIOS was set to boot from the Zip drive first. Since there wasn't anything in there, it would just hang until it timed out. But, that was something I had to figure out on my own.
Bear in mind that wages in India are pretty low, therefore the average call center worker is not going to be in a position to purchase one. Anyone in India who owns a Mac will probably not be looking for work in a call center anyway.
I only ask because (correct me if I'm wrong) if Mac ownership is low in proportion to population then how exactly would 3000 Indian call center drones be able to offer support as regards a computer they have had little experience of?
Originally posted by MiMac
I only ask because (correct me if I'm wrong) if Mac ownership is low in proportion to population then how exactly would 3000 Indian call center drones be able to offer support as regards a computer they have had little experience of?
They can't. But the same can be said of many people who work at your local Apple store. Last time I went there, the only differences that was mentioned to me (after talking to some reps and staffers at the "Genius" bar) between the MBs and the 15" MBP was screen size, color, and better graphics on the MBP. How can they work there if they don't know their own products? What helpful tech support can they provide even in person, let alone on the phone?
In the 80s if we had a tech support question, we got diverted to the US. Then Apple Australia set up local support staff in the mid 1990s. Then in 2003-2004 they slowly started to cut back the staff, until they eventually got rid of all of the support staff
Originally posted by Placebo
Thank god. English speakers rock.
Amen to that!!!
Originally posted by axc51
They can't. But the same can be said of many people who work at your local Apple store. Last time I went there, the only differences that was mentioned to me (after talking to some reps and staffers at the "Genius" bar) between the MBs and the 15" MBP was screen size, color, and better graphics on the MBP. How can they work there if they don't know their own products? What helpful tech support can they provide even in person, let alone on the phone?
I am from India and I guess I speak from experience, the wage disparites between an american worker and indian worker are huge. The person employed at the Apple store would get more than 1500 dollars per month I am just guessing, I am an engineer and my monthly check is worth 330 dollars. MiMac is right how can people who have never worked on a mac be counted on giving customer support for Apple customers. I have a mac myself but I would not work for Apple customer support, and Apple would not hire me for that too.
Techies would most definitely get more than 1500 per month. This could be considered proportionate due to the higher costs of living in the US, and Australia, etc, could it not? Having said that though, workers should be paid what they deserve for the tasks they are expected to fulfill - regardless of where you live.
I hope you are not offended by the apparent aversion to Indian call centres! I don't think it matters where the centre is located, if the staff know what they are talking about, then it is a plus. Unfortunately in this case, the staff do not seem to be overly experienced with Macs - or at least to the degree the customer base expects them to be. Also it is hard for many to understand accents that they are not accustomed to hearing, which can be quite frustrating at times.