Apple's Mac Pro to sport twin engines

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Comments

  • Reply 121 of 215
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 32,977member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Placebo

    Sadly, the use of a product typically dictates what the product is designed to be used for.



    Funny, that.




    That's quite true. But, don't forget that most graphics are designed specifically to play games. They don't do as well as the professional cards at CAD, or other 3D work.
  • Reply 122 of 215
    onlookeronlooker Posts: 5,252member
    I think Apple is intent on impressing everybody. Especially windows users in 3D, and insane high performance gamers. I think RAID options will be limited, but If I were designing for Apple, windows and Mac users needs and views of the high performance machine would by a priority for us.

    I would definitely have a Quad (2 socket) 3GHz Woodcrests, Two 16x full-speed PCI-E slots available, and a hot swappable hard drive chassis.

    The drive chassis would serve more purposes than one could imagine. For Mac, or windows users having a copy of windows available for gaming if they chose to. You could easily just add/remove your windows drive, and slap in your music, or storage drive, or whatever it's designated as, when you weren't using it. On the other hand they are quite handy in a workstation weather your a musician, into Video editing, 3D, Cad, whatever you do that takes up lots of space, it's really handy to be able to swap them out, and have a designated drive(s) for different things, or even for different projects depending on how much you do. I think the big model will be historic in the eyes of users.

    The leopard demo should be very wicked also.
  • Reply 123 of 215
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 32,977member
    Well, it won't be long before we find out. No more than 7 weeks. It will be here before we know it.



    Sunil! Start the countdown!
  • Reply 124 of 215
    sunilramansunilraman Posts: 8,133member
    Originally posted by emig647

    While I feel SLI / Crossfire isn't all it's cracked up to be... it sure is easier to add another card than upgrade to the top line card.




    Yeah... I just wanted to have the option of SLI hence I got a nice Asus SLI board with 1 6600GT sitting in 1 of the PCIExpress slots Also a bit of a enviro-thing, I didn't want to throw away my old card, if I needed, just pop another 6600GT (which has come down in price and will go down even further... yeah) and it will be sweet.



    The SLI for games that would help me would be it helps in heavy scenes to keep the minimum frame rates up, plus it helps 4x antialiasing. Overall, if I add another card in my case, it would be a smoother gaming experience, even if I could only play games as what would, by the end of this year, be considered "Medium" settings. (The "High" settings would need single 7800/7900s or dual 6800s etc. etc.)
  • Reply 125 of 215
    sunilramansunilraman Posts: 8,133member
    Originally posted by melgross

    Sunil! Start the countdown!






    Heh. AFTER the World Cup football/soccer

    & AFTER Wimbledon.



    Then I'll get crazy with WWDC mania.



    Blatant repost if you haven't seen it: [credit to another forum member that did the BlingMac GoldPlated - sorry forgot your username]

  • Reply 126 of 215
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 32,977member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by sunilraman

    Originally posted by emig647

    While I feel SLI / Crossfire isn't all it's cracked up to be... it sure is easier to add another card than upgrade to the top line card.




    Yeah... I just wanted to have the option of SLI hence I got a nice Asus SLI board with 1 6600GT sitting in 1 of the PCIExpress slots Also a bit of a enviro-thing, I didn't want to throw away my old card, if I needed, just pop another 6600GT (which has come down in price and will go down even further... yeah) and it will be sweet.



    The SLI for games that would help me would be it helps in heavy scenes to keep the minimum frame rates up, plus it helps 4x antialiasing. Overall, if I add another card in my case, it would be a smoother gaming experience, even if I could only play games as what would, by the end of this year, be considered "Medium" settings. (The "High" settings would need single 7800/7900s or dual 6800s etc. etc.)




    The main problem I have with Crossfire/SLI is that the top cards already mostly obscure the slot next to them. with this, you lose two additional slots, rather than just one. For dual cards, the mobo really needs to have the slots placed with an empty space between themselves, and any other slots. But, then there is the question of room on the mobo.
  • Reply 127 of 215
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,426member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by melgross

    The main problem I have with Crossfire/SLI is that the top cards already mostly obscure the slot next to them. with this, you lose two additional slots, rather than just one. For dual cards, the mobo really needs to have the slots placed with an empty space between themselves, and any other slots. But, then there is the question of room on the mobo.



    That is true. But if someone is a modeler, than usually that's all they need.
  • Reply 128 of 215
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 32,977member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by emig647

    That is true. But if someone is a modeler, than usually that's all they need.



    Sure. But then we're back to the problem of how many models will Apple release? That's been an issue in the PC world as well. Gamers don't need much else either. But, some of us do. The question here, if Apple won't release varying models, is just what percentages of people need what, and therefore, who does Apple respond to?
  • Reply 129 of 215
    Quote:

    Originally posted by moloko

    IF the $2000 machine has the potential to be upgraded to the level of a $3000 machine in time...



    Sorry dude, Apple is not going to sell you a $2000 machine where you can wait 6 months, buy a $300 CPU from PriceWatch and then get a machine that they're selling for $3000. Just never going to happen -- get a different vendor if that's what you want.



    And also, I think you vastly over-estimate the popularity of dual-socket PCs. They're primarily sold into the professional workstation market and not to bargin-seeking techie population. Apple sells a much higher % of 2S systems than any other vendor.



    There's just not many systems being sold with an empty socket -- the cost of a dual-capable motherboard and a pricy Xeon CPU is not economic compared to a single-socket system, if you aren't using both sockets. Who would pay $500+ extra for "dual-capable" system? You can get a whole PC for $500 and buy the dual system when you need it.
  • Reply 130 of 215
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,426member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by IntlHarvester

    Sorry dude, Apple is not going to sell you a $2000 machine where you can wait 6 months, buy a $300 CPU from PriceWatch and then get a machine that they're selling for $3000. Just never going to happen -- get a different vendor if that's what you want.



    What makes you say that? You can do it with the iMac and Mac Mini.
  • Reply 131 of 215
    Quote:

    Originally posted by emig647

    What makes you say that? You can do it with the iMac and Mac Mini.



    While you can upgrade these systems, you can't undercut Apple by doing so. (At least I doubt it.)



    The original poster was talking about adding a second CPU to a 2-socket system at a price below what Apple is selling 2S boxes.
  • Reply 132 of 215
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,426member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by IntlHarvester

    While you can upgrade these systems, you can't undercut Apple by doing so. (At least I doubt it.)



    The original poster was talking about adding a second CPU to a 2-socket system at a price below what Apple is selling 2S boxes.




    Well I doubt you'd ever be able to undercut Apple's pricing in the first place, unless the user waited xx months.
  • Reply 133 of 215
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 32,977member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by IntlHarvester

    Sorry dude, Apple is not going to sell you a $2000 machine where you can wait 6 months, buy a $300 CPU from PriceWatch and then get a machine that they're selling for $3000. Just never going to happen -- get a different vendor if that's what you want.



    And also, I think you vastly over-estimate the popularity of dual-socket PCs. They're primarily sold into the professional workstation market and not to bargin-seeking techie population. Apple sells a much higher % of 2S systems than any other vendor.



    There's just not many systems being sold with an empty socket -- the cost of a dual-capable motherboard and a pricy Xeon CPU is not economic compared to a single-socket system, if you aren't using both sockets. Who would pay $500+ extra for "dual-capable" system? You can get a whole PC for $500 and buy the dual system when you need it.




    Entire populated (except for the cpu's) mobo's for PC's go for much less than $500. They start at well under $100. even the most expensive boards are normally shy of $300. It's the chips that have added to the cost. A top cpu from either AMD or Intel has cost north of $1,000. so, it sure is possible to offer a machine with just one socket occupied, as long as you are talking about top-of-the-line chips.



    But, no, I very much doubt that Apple would ever offer one.
  • Reply 134 of 215
    Quote:

    Originally posted by melgross

    Entire populated (except for the cpu's) mobo's for PC's go for much less than $500. They start at well under $100. even the most expensive boards are normally shy of $300.



    Since we're talking about dual-socket boards, $300 is a reasonable starting point. You won't find anything near $100 retail. Plus, of course, the dual-capable Xeon processors will be more expensive than the regular Conroes at a given speed. A half-full dual-capable system just doesn't make much financial sense.
  • Reply 135 of 215
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,949member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by IntlHarvester

    A half-full dual-capable system just doesn't make much financial sense.



    Unless one plans to upgrade later, or some other feature of the system was needed that wasn't available on the typical single socket board or system. Over the past several years, I've bought six to eight off-lease Xeon systems plus a couple PII dual-capable server and only one had both sockets populated. Many of the systems apparently had some use of the PCI-X slots, something not found on many single CPU systems.
  • Reply 136 of 215
    onlookeronlooker Posts: 5,252member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by JeffDM

    Unless one plans to upgrade later, or some other feature of the system was needed that wasn't available on the typical single socket board or system. Over the past several years, I've bought six to eight off-lease Xeon systems plus a couple PII dual-capable server and only one had both sockets populated. Many of the systems apparently had some use of the PCI-X slots, something not found on many single CPU systems.



    OK, but we all now Apple is not going to sell a computer with a missing processor. . so lets move on.
  • Reply 137 of 215
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,949member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by onlooker

    OK, but we all now Apple is not going to sell a computer with a missing processor. . so lets move on.



    If that's the way you want to put it, then why does Apple sell those same computers with missing memory?
  • Reply 138 of 215
    onlookeronlooker Posts: 5,252member
    For crying out loud man let it go.
  • Reply 139 of 215
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,949member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by onlooker

    For crying out loud man let it go.



    No. If you want to derisively call a processor-upgradeable computer as having a "missing chip", that's fine, though it's probably something only an Apple fan would say. I don't see the point in giving up when every other workstation producer sells such a computer. It used to be that iMacs couldn't screen span and we were told by Mac fans that it would never happen, but it does now. There was never supposed to be a video capable iPod, but we have it. There are probably several other examples of things that would "never happen" but it did.
  • Reply 140 of 215
    onlookeronlooker Posts: 5,252member
    Where is the crying face..'



    Ok , YES THERE IS GOING A MISSING PROCESSOR OPTION ON THE NEXT APPLE PRO MACHINE.



    So Apple will be cutting costs also and only be using the one motherboard. If you want single processor machine it will also be with woodcrest. Because now they can put all the conroes in the iMac alone to further separate the lines of consumer and pro as well. Thus there will be no need to use a conroe, or have a single processor motherboard for the Pro machine specifically designed for the conroe. Furthering their ability to reduce product inventory, and that is what the shareholders like to hear most. I like it. I should have thought of it myself.
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