i'm surprised that to put more distance between the other products that it didn't have a 15" screen.
Probably cheaper to stick with a 17" for manufacturing purposes. This is one of those machines that's not supposed to fit into their tidy consumer lineup. It's entirely for education purposes alone.
Just looking at the simple specs under the pricing at the store...
17" 1.83 GHz Duo and 17" 1.83 GHz Duo (same)
$899 edu vs. $1199 edu/$1299 standard
80 GB HDD vs. 160 GB HDD
Combo Drive vs. Dual-Layer Super Drive
Intel GMA Graphics (64 MB shared) vs. ATI x1600 (128 MB dedicated)
No Bluetooth vs. Bluetooth
No Remote vs. Apple Remote
Does that account for $300?
No, it accounts for $400 to most people and then $300 educationally.
I think many of you are missing the point here. Apple is really cutting their margin out on THIS MACHINE alone to provide the education market a very inexpensive alternative. They may reduce the price of the Mac Minis, who knows, but I highly doubt this will be available to the public like the eMac was. We'll all just have to suck it up and move on with our lives.
So what's the big difference from a normal iMac here..?
Is it the Intel GMA 950 graphics that makes it cheap and somewhat dull?
I guess it's good enough for schools, and that's great.
It's not just good for schools. It's great for Mac based small businesses with a few low level admins whose work is primarily email, Word, and the web. I've got three eMacs that are perfectly fine for light duty work. These will make a nice replacement, taking up much less desk real estate, getting current with hardware and preparing for the more distant future's inevitable Intel only OS features.
I think that unless a school was doing a lot of video editing this would be an excellent machine.
There's nothing wrong with these machines for video-editing. You don't need a dedicated graphics chip for video editing.
Whilst this machine is a great deal, I hope that it isn't "it" for Apple's educational offerings. I hope they are working on an education-specific design and that this is a stop-gap. Where's the protective glass to prevent poking fingers from damaging the LCD? Where is the option for no camera (which is an issue for many schools, apparently)?
There's nothing wrong with these machines for video-editing. You don't need a dedicated graphics chip for video editing.
There's nothing wrong with these machines for most things. I think people forget on here that many Pros have absolutely no need for 3D graphics or even a fast CPU.
I spend most of my time editing PHP/XHTML, ObjC code and 2D work in Photoshop/Illustrator or my personal stuff in iLife. To be frank, even the educational iMac is overkill.
Do you all think this release precludes the possibility of a new eMac? [/B]
At the very least, it makes it unlikely. Notice also that apple.com/emac used to redirect to apple.com/education/emac (once they had removed general-public eMac sales), which now redirects, in turn, to apple.com/education. So for now, eMac is no more. I see no reason for Apple to reintroduce it; they have the mini at the lower end and the non-education-specific iMacs at the higher end. Seems to me this segment is quite saturated now. Don't forget the MacBook, too.
I too agree that this machine will be fine for most classrooms. The computers in the classrooms wher I work are mainly for Word Processing, PowerPoint presentaions, Indesign and I do my work in Finale. I think these machines are adequate for the uses stated above. I don't know what the per unit cost of the Dells we purchased were last year, but I don't think it was much less and they came with smaller HD's (everything saved on central server), no CDR, and NO STYLE!!
I wonder why there's not even an option to add Bluetooth via BTO. Yeah, I know you can do it with a USB dongle, but why isn't it an option? The old first-generation G5 iMacs that didn't have Bluetooth standard at least let you add it as an option...
Probably cheaper to stick with a 17" for manufacturing purposes. This is one of those machines that's not supposed to fit into their tidy consumer lineup. It's entirely for education purposes alone.
And they said that about the eMac until they learned there was a market. It still exists.
There's nothing wrong with these machines for most things. I think people forget on here that many Pros have absolutely no need for 3D graphics or even a fast CPU.
I've heard of a test that showed that the "unsupported" configurations for Final Cut Studio still work fine, at a negligible speed difference, the MB did about as well as a MBP. Any operation that uses the GPU will work fine because the Intel video chip is programmable, and as such, supports Core Image / Core Video.
So what's the big difference from a normal iMac here..?
Is it the Intel GMA 950 graphics that makes it cheap and somewhat dull?
I guess it's good enough for schools, and that's great.
The 950 is fine for video editing. The only area it falls down on is 3D games and CAD. Not likely a major user base for this machine.
We have been doing video editing over the years with video cards far less powerful than the 950 IG. All we need is a 24 bit output with high enough video rez for the monitor. The 17" monitor built-in here will be well served by the 950.
It's not just good for schools. It's great for Mac based small businesses with a few low level admins whose work is primarily email, Word, and the web. I've got three eMacs that are perfectly fine for light duty work. These will make a nice replacement, taking up much less desk real estate, getting current with hardware and preparing for the more distant future's inevitable Intel only OS features.
I like it.
gc
That's right!
A machine that sits on the desk of most secretary's doesn't need fancy graphics, a huge HD, Blutooth, WiFi, or major RAM installs. As most business machines go on desks like that, it could be of interest to companies, as Apple will likely sell this machine to the general public as well, if the outcry is loud enough (if they aren't already!).
Do you all think this release precludes the possibility of a new eMac?
Once Apple started selling it to the general public it became a misnomer anyway. This might just be an acknowledgment of that. Why call something the "Educational" machine if anyone can buy it?
"The eMac will no longer be in production and is available for purchase while supplies last through the Apple Store for Education or by calling an Apple education sales representative at 800-800-APPL."
FYI
There are NO supplies of eMacs available anywhere. When I called Apple Education, they only had refurbs, and those were only available to educational buyers (not individual education sales).
I was hoping to nab one of the last eMacs with a Superdrive, but there are NONE to be found. Every website I visit (even those that say they have stock) have no stock. Talk about scarce. I know I shouldn't have waited, but I was still hoping. Anyone know where I can find a new one?
BTW: I don't like LCD. I'm old school...prefer CRTs.
I wonder why there's not even an option to add Bluetooth via BTO. Yeah, I know you can do it with a USB dongle, but why isn't it an option? The old first-generation G5 iMacs that didn't have Bluetooth standard at least let you add it as an option...
Schools don't want the capability for wireless Bluetooth on many machines. The idea is to lock the machines down, operationally. Bluetooth would be a nucience. By Apple removing the upgradability, they lose nothing, and save some in component, assembly, and testing costs.
No, it accounts for $400 to most people and then $300 educationally.
I think many of you are missing the point here. Apple is really cutting their margin out on THIS MACHINE alone to provide the education market a very inexpensive alternative. They may reduce the price of the Mac Minis, who knows, but I highly doubt this will be available to the public like the eMac was. We'll all just have to suck it up and move on with our lives.
The educational price of one product shouldn't be compared to the retail price of a different model. The price difference would still be $300 if it had a retail presence. The educational price of the next model up is $1199.
There are NO supplies of eMacs available anywhere. When I called Apple Education, they only had refurbs, and those were only available to educational buyers (not individual education sales).
I was hoping to nab one of the last eMacs with a Superdrive, but there are NONE to be found. Every website I visit (even those that say they have stock) have no stock. Talk about scarce. I know I shouldn't have waited, but I was still hoping. Anyone know where I can find a new one?
They are probably holding onto their refurbished units to make sure schools can get replacements of the same machine for the service life of the computers, especially for labs where they might want to keep all the computers identical.
Quote:
Originally posted by melgross
Oh, by the way, we might take notice of the fact that it's WEDNESDAY!!!
So much for Tuesday only intro's, that some keep insisting upon. Remember this for future arguments.
For the record, it doesn't matter to me what day it's announced. I would call it an exception because of the holiday. It doesn't make sense to announce on a holiday.
Comments
Originally posted by NOFEER
i'm surprised that to put more distance between the other products that it didn't have a 15" screen.
Probably cheaper to stick with a 17" for manufacturing purposes. This is one of those machines that's not supposed to fit into their tidy consumer lineup. It's entirely for education purposes alone.
Originally posted by macbear01
Just looking at the simple specs under the pricing at the store...
17" 1.83 GHz Duo and 17" 1.83 GHz Duo (same)
$899 edu vs. $1199 edu/$1299 standard
80 GB HDD vs. 160 GB HDD
Combo Drive vs. Dual-Layer Super Drive
Intel GMA Graphics (64 MB shared) vs. ATI x1600 (128 MB dedicated)
No Bluetooth vs. Bluetooth
No Remote vs. Apple Remote
Does that account for $300?
No, it accounts for $400 to most people and then $300 educationally.
I think many of you are missing the point here. Apple is really cutting their margin out on THIS MACHINE alone to provide the education market a very inexpensive alternative. They may reduce the price of the Mac Minis, who knows, but I highly doubt this will be available to the public like the eMac was. We'll all just have to suck it up and move on with our lives.
Originally posted by palegolas
So what's the big difference from a normal iMac here..?
Is it the Intel GMA 950 graphics that makes it cheap and somewhat dull?
I guess it's good enough for schools, and that's great.
It's not just good for schools. It's great for Mac based small businesses with a few low level admins whose work is primarily email, Word, and the web. I've got three eMacs that are perfectly fine for light duty work. These will make a nice replacement, taking up much less desk real estate, getting current with hardware and preparing for the more distant future's inevitable Intel only OS features.
I like it.
gc
Originally posted by backtomac
I think that unless a school was doing a lot of video editing this would be an excellent machine.
There's nothing wrong with these machines for video-editing. You don't need a dedicated graphics chip for video editing.
Whilst this machine is a great deal, I hope that it isn't "it" for Apple's educational offerings. I hope they are working on an education-specific design and that this is a stop-gap. Where's the protective glass to prevent poking fingers from damaging the LCD? Where is the option for no camera (which is an issue for many schools, apparently)?
Originally posted by Mr. H
There's nothing wrong with these machines for video-editing. You don't need a dedicated graphics chip for video editing.
There's nothing wrong with these machines for most things. I think people forget on here that many Pros have absolutely no need for 3D graphics or even a fast CPU.
I spend most of my time editing PHP/XHTML, ObjC code and 2D work in Photoshop/Illustrator or my personal stuff in iLife. To be frank, even the educational iMac is overkill.
Originally posted by Placebo
Do you all think this release precludes the possibility of a new eMac? [/B]
At the very least, it makes it unlikely. Notice also that apple.com/emac used to redirect to apple.com/education/emac (once they had removed general-public eMac sales), which now redirects, in turn, to apple.com/education. So for now, eMac is no more. I see no reason for Apple to reintroduce it; they have the mini at the lower end and the non-education-specific iMacs at the higher end. Seems to me this segment is quite saturated now. Don't forget the MacBook, too.
I too agree that this machine will be fine for most classrooms. The computers in the classrooms wher I work are mainly for Word Processing, PowerPoint presentaions, Indesign and I do my work in Finale. I think these machines are adequate for the uses stated above. I don't know what the per unit cost of the Dells we purchased were last year, but I don't think it was much less and they came with smaller HD's (everything saved on central server), no CDR, and NO STYLE!!
Originally posted by ApplePi
Probably cheaper to stick with a 17" for manufacturing purposes. This is one of those machines that's not supposed to fit into their tidy consumer lineup. It's entirely for education purposes alone.
And they said that about the eMac until they learned there was a market. It still exists.
Originally posted by aegisdesign
There's nothing wrong with these machines for most things. I think people forget on here that many Pros have absolutely no need for 3D graphics or even a fast CPU.
I've heard of a test that showed that the "unsupported" configurations for Final Cut Studio still work fine, at a negligible speed difference, the MB did about as well as a MBP. Any operation that uses the GPU will work fine because the Intel video chip is programmable, and as such, supports Core Image / Core Video.
I have not sought out this test though.
Originally posted by palegolas
So what's the big difference from a normal iMac here..?
Is it the Intel GMA 950 graphics that makes it cheap and somewhat dull?
I guess it's good enough for schools, and that's great.
The 950 is fine for video editing. The only area it falls down on is 3D games and CAD. Not likely a major user base for this machine.
We have been doing video editing over the years with video cards far less powerful than the 950 IG. All we need is a 24 bit output with high enough video rez for the monitor. The 17" monitor built-in here will be well served by the 950.
Originally posted by GordonComstock
It's not just good for schools. It's great for Mac based small businesses with a few low level admins whose work is primarily email, Word, and the web. I've got three eMacs that are perfectly fine for light duty work. These will make a nice replacement, taking up much less desk real estate, getting current with hardware and preparing for the more distant future's inevitable Intel only OS features.
I like it.
gc
That's right!
A machine that sits on the desk of most secretary's doesn't need fancy graphics, a huge HD, Blutooth, WiFi, or major RAM installs. As most business machines go on desks like that, it could be of interest to companies, as Apple will likely sell this machine to the general public as well, if the outcry is loud enough (if they aren't already!).
Originally posted by Placebo
Do you all think this release precludes the possibility of a new eMac?
Once Apple started selling it to the general public it became a misnomer anyway. This might just be an acknowledgment of that. Why call something the "Educational" machine if anyone can buy it?
FYI
There are NO supplies of eMacs available anywhere. When I called Apple Education, they only had refurbs, and those were only available to educational buyers (not individual education sales).
I was hoping to nab one of the last eMacs with a Superdrive, but there are NONE to be found. Every website I visit (even those that say they have stock) have no stock. Talk about scarce. I know I shouldn't have waited, but I was still hoping. Anyone know where I can find a new one?
BTW: I don't like LCD. I'm old school...prefer CRTs.
Originally posted by CharlesS
I wonder why there's not even an option to add Bluetooth via BTO. Yeah, I know you can do it with a USB dongle, but why isn't it an option? The old first-generation G5 iMacs that didn't have Bluetooth standard at least let you add it as an option...
Schools don't want the capability for wireless Bluetooth on many machines. The idea is to lock the machines down, operationally. Bluetooth would be a nucience. By Apple removing the upgradability, they lose nothing, and save some in component, assembly, and testing costs.
Originally posted by xebeche
No, it accounts for $400 to most people and then $300 educationally.
I think many of you are missing the point here. Apple is really cutting their margin out on THIS MACHINE alone to provide the education market a very inexpensive alternative. They may reduce the price of the Mac Minis, who knows, but I highly doubt this will be available to the public like the eMac was. We'll all just have to suck it up and move on with our lives.
The educational price of one product shouldn't be compared to the retail price of a different model. The price difference would still be $300 if it had a retail presence. The educational price of the next model up is $1199.
So much for Tuesday only intro's, that some keep insisting upon. Remember this for future arguments.
Originally posted by initiator
There are NO supplies of eMacs available anywhere. When I called Apple Education, they only had refurbs, and those were only available to educational buyers (not individual education sales).
I was hoping to nab one of the last eMacs with a Superdrive, but there are NONE to be found. Every website I visit (even those that say they have stock) have no stock. Talk about scarce. I know I shouldn't have waited, but I was still hoping. Anyone know where I can find a new one?
They are probably holding onto their refurbished units to make sure schools can get replacements of the same machine for the service life of the computers, especially for labs where they might want to keep all the computers identical.
Originally posted by melgross
Oh, by the way, we might take notice of the fact that it's WEDNESDAY!!!
So much for Tuesday only intro's, that some keep insisting upon. Remember this for future arguments.
For the record, it doesn't matter to me what day it's announced. I would call it an exception because of the holiday. It doesn't make sense to announce on a holiday.