NeXTAnswers was always a superior solution to answering the most commonly fielded support questions in which the general masses benefited for free. It also taught everyone working inside the castle how to form better relationships with clients and consumers.
Also, most--if not all--of the solutions simply involved reinstalling the entire OS, even if that problem happened to be, oh, the wrong font was showing up or some other trivial matter.
Sorry macinthe408, I disagree completely!!
I have been a participant in Apple Discussions for quite a while and would challenge anyone that suggests what you have stated.
1. RARELY (<1%) are solutions given to ANY problem that involve reinstalling the OS.
2. Many of the participants in the different forums (myself excluded) are of "experts" in that topic, and spend hours selflessly trying to help the newbies and the old timers alike.
3. Apple Discussions was created to allow Mac users an all inclusive place to post questions, find answers, and get solutions to mundane and technical problems, not only from (on occasion) moderators, but primarily, other more experienced users who are "in the trenches"
4. If you want to see threads that VERY OFTEN serve no purpose except to flame and vent, look no further than HERE!! I can hardly think of a circumstance when a thread at Apple Discussions has been shut down prior to it becoming a bitch session.
5. It will truly be a shame if Apple allows its' Discussion Forum to disintegrate into an uncontrolled free-for-all as many help sites/blogs have become. Then, possibly tossing the idea altogether.
I have frequented the boards a bit myself while having problems. Most notable was when my dual 2.0 g5 rev b was kernel panicing like mad. People would dump their log files, users would parse them and let others know what exactly was the problem. It was rare even in that discussion saying to reinstall the OS. It's rare you have to re-install the whole OS. If there are people saying to reinstall the OS as their first statement, then they are noob.
I have always found those boards to be full of wonderful information on OS X and hardware problems. I will be sad to see it go.
In regards to apple shutting down the boards along with dismembering the team...
I believe there are many frequenters of those boards that would LOVE to volunteer to moderate / monitor those boards. Just like most other forums. It's free, and people are helping to support apple.
Personally I think the management is nuts for thinking it doesn't help... but what do I know... I'm just a dumb dev.
I hate to disagree, but perhaps Apple would think that self-policing would be better for the community. I would agree to that.
Self policing doesn't work. It doesn't always here, why should it work there? Without the threat that they will be removed, some people feel they must vent with insults, which brings down the quality for everyone.
In regards to apple shutting down the boards along with dismembering the team...
I believe there are many frequenters of those boards that would LOVE to volunteer to moderate / monitor those boards. Just like most other forums. It's free, and people are helping to support apple.
Personally I think the management is nuts for thinking it doesn't help... but what do I know... I'm just a dumb dev.
That would be Apple taking over the mods again. Even if it was done by non Apple employees, with Apple giving them the ability to moderate them, it would still be Apple in charge.
I'm not sure if Apple would like those who are not under their employee contracts to do official moderating, for official is what it would be.
Self policing doesn't work. It doesn't always here, why should it work there? Without the threat that they will be removed, some people feel they must vent with insults, which brings down the quality for everyone.
The way I see it, digg works. Maybe they need to adapt to that model.
Why would Apple do such a thing as dismantle the forum staff? What did they have in mind?
I think Apple's discussions are a great place to go to get your technical questions answered. I myself have helped answer many people's questions over there and ask some questions of my own.
If anyone can answer my question that would be great.
so, if i am reading this correctly, apple was removing moderators from the forums when they started going off the tracks? did they think this would help matters? i dunno. i'd rather there be a moderated discussion (with proper disavowments if necessary whenever anyone suggested "recalll" or "faulty") from apple than the tower of babel you find anywhere else. plus, we the experienced users know where else to look for help, but does the new apple computer owner know? seems like this is going to jettison more people at the call centers than anything else. hmmm... maybe this is a wacko attempt at getting more people to signup for applecare to get the full two years of phone assistance? yeah, i know. crazy talk, but don't think there isn't at least one exec who think that's a brilliant idea, dilbert pointy-haired-boss style.
so, if i am reading this correctly, apple was removing moderators from the forums when they started going off the tracks? did they think this would help matters? i dunno. i'd rather there be a moderated discussion (with proper disavowments if necessary whenever anyone suggested "recalll" or "faulty") from apple than the tower of babel you find anywhere else. plus, we the experienced users know where else to look for help, but does the new apple computer owner know? seems like this is going to jettison more people at the call centers than anything else. hmmm... maybe this is a wacko attempt at getting more people to signup for applecare to get the full two years of phone assistance? yeah, i know. crazy talk, but don't think there isn't at least one exec who think that's a brilliant idea, dilbert pointy-haired-boss style.
The question is why, and how far up the chain has this pointy-haired decision gone?
Because, if it was Jobs, I can believe it. He is prickly, to be sure.
Because if he heard, in a meeting, of something happening in the forums he didn't like, he might pull the whole thing down. Don't forget when the bio of him came out, a bio that was pretty much positive, he found something he didn't like in it, and pulled the entire catalog of books from the company off the shelves.
When someone wrote a chapter about Job's father, and Jobs earlier relationships, and sent it to him for comments, he called the writer " a nutcase", and used pressure to have the magazine recind its contract to publish the piece. I read it, and it wasn't bad, just straightfoward. Too bad it wasn't published.
The Apple forums are for the most part, duplications of what any of us can get here, at MacNN or Ars. Even MacRumors is good at posting big issues that are getting the most attention. I ask questions all of the time that are answered sometimes within minutes in any of these places. (And there are countless more. Daring Fireball, etc.) I also enjoy answering things when I can or adding my 2 cents.
Mac users are so much more open to helping others that Apple really doesn't need to do it for us. We do it for each other.
As long as they keep the bulletins around everything will be just fine.
Because if he heard, in a meeting, of something happening in the forums he didn't like, he might pull the whole thing down. Don't forget when the bio of him came out, a bio that was pretty much positive, he found something he didn't like in it, and pulled the entire catalog of books from the company off the shelves.
When someone wrote a chapter about Job's father, and Jobs earlier relationships, and sent it to him for comments, he called the writer " a nutcase", and used pressure to have the magazine recind its contract to publish the piece. I read it, and it wasn't bad, just straightfoward. Too bad it wasn't published.
So, sure, I could see him doing that.
Thanks for the explanation. I heard about this.
Why would Steve not like something going on in the forums?
The forums were created for the purpose of discussing Apple products and helping other Mac users out.
Comments
This address is monitored and forwarded to the appropriate people at apple.
Keep it brief and on target.
Originally posted by macinthe408
Also, most--if not all--of the solutions simply involved reinstalling the entire OS, even if that problem happened to be, oh, the wrong font was showing up or some other trivial matter.
Sorry macinthe408, I disagree completely!!
I have been a participant in Apple Discussions for quite a while and would challenge anyone that suggests what you have stated.
1. RARELY (<1%) are solutions given to ANY problem that involve reinstalling the OS.
2. Many of the participants in the different forums (myself excluded) are of "experts" in that topic, and spend hours selflessly trying to help the newbies and the old timers alike.
3. Apple Discussions was created to allow Mac users an all inclusive place to post questions, find answers, and get solutions to mundane and technical problems, not only from (on occasion) moderators, but primarily, other more experienced users who are "in the trenches"
4. If you want to see threads that VERY OFTEN serve no purpose except to flame and vent, look no further than HERE!! I can hardly think of a circumstance when a thread at Apple Discussions has been shut down prior to it becoming a bitch session.
5. It will truly be a shame if Apple allows its' Discussion Forum to disintegrate into an uncontrolled free-for-all as many help sites/blogs have become. Then, possibly tossing the idea altogether.
Regards,
BuzDots
Originally posted by macFanDave
They are not ditching the discussions only the moderation of them.
If that were to be true, it would not be a good idea at all. It would also serve no purpose anymore. It would be best to shut them down.
Originally posted by melgross
If that were to be true, it would not be a good idea at all. It would also serve no purpose anymore. It would be best to shut them down.
I hate to disagree, but perhaps Apple would think that self-policing would be better for the community. I would agree to that.
Originally posted by BuzDots
Sorry macinthe408, I disagree completely!!
I second that...
I have frequented the boards a bit myself while having problems. Most notable was when my dual 2.0 g5 rev b was kernel panicing like mad. People would dump their log files, users would parse them and let others know what exactly was the problem. It was rare even in that discussion saying to reinstall the OS. It's rare you have to re-install the whole OS. If there are people saying to reinstall the OS as their first statement, then they are noob.
I have always found those boards to be full of wonderful information on OS X and hardware problems. I will be sad to see it go.
I believe there are many frequenters of those boards that would LOVE to volunteer to moderate / monitor those boards. Just like most other forums. It's free, and people are helping to support apple.
Personally I think the management is nuts for thinking it doesn't help... but what do I know... I'm just a dumb dev.
Originally posted by SpamSandwich
I hate to disagree, but perhaps Apple would think that self-policing would be better for the community. I would agree to that.
Self policing doesn't work. It doesn't always here, why should it work there? Without the threat that they will be removed, some people feel they must vent with insults, which brings down the quality for everyone.
Originally posted by emig647
In regards to apple shutting down the boards along with dismembering the team...
I believe there are many frequenters of those boards that would LOVE to volunteer to moderate / monitor those boards. Just like most other forums. It's free, and people are helping to support apple.
Personally I think the management is nuts for thinking it doesn't help... but what do I know... I'm just a dumb dev.
That would be Apple taking over the mods again. Even if it was done by non Apple employees, with Apple giving them the ability to moderate them, it would still be Apple in charge.
I'm not sure if Apple would like those who are not under their employee contracts to do official moderating, for official is what it would be.
its too bad.
Originally posted by melgross
Self policing doesn't work. It doesn't always here, why should it work there? Without the threat that they will be removed, some people feel they must vent with insults, which brings down the quality for everyone.
The way I see it, digg works. Maybe they need to adapt to that model.
Oh, and I just found this... hmmm...
http://news.com.com/.Mac+users+mock+...l?tag=nefd.top
Why would Apple do such a thing as dismantle the forum staff? What did they have in mind?
I think Apple's discussions are a great place to go to get your technical questions answered. I myself have helped answer many people's questions over there and ask some questions of my own.
If anyone can answer my question that would be great.
Thanks.
Originally posted by rok
so, if i am reading this correctly, apple was removing moderators from the forums when they started going off the tracks? did they think this would help matters? i dunno. i'd rather there be a moderated discussion (with proper disavowments if necessary whenever anyone suggested "recalll" or "faulty") from apple than the tower of babel you find anywhere else. plus, we the experienced users know where else to look for help, but does the new apple computer owner know? seems like this is going to jettison more people at the call centers than anything else. hmmm... maybe this is a wacko attempt at getting more people to signup for applecare to get the full two years of phone assistance? yeah, i know. crazy talk, but don't think there isn't at least one exec who think that's a brilliant idea, dilbert pointy-haired-boss style.
The question is why, and how far up the chain has this pointy-haired decision gone?
Because, if it was Jobs, I can believe it. He is prickly, to be sure.
Originally posted by melgross
The question is why, and how far up the chain has this pointy-haired decision gone?
Because, if it was Jobs, I can believe it. He is prickly, to be sure.
Why would Steve Jobs do such a thing?
Originally posted by Dr. X
Why would Steve Jobs do such a thing?
Because if he heard, in a meeting, of something happening in the forums he didn't like, he might pull the whole thing down. Don't forget when the bio of him came out, a bio that was pretty much positive, he found something he didn't like in it, and pulled the entire catalog of books from the company off the shelves.
When someone wrote a chapter about Job's father, and Jobs earlier relationships, and sent it to him for comments, he called the writer " a nutcase", and used pressure to have the magazine recind its contract to publish the piece. I read it, and it wasn't bad, just straightfoward. Too bad it wasn't published.
So, sure, I could see him doing that.
Originally posted by meelash
Definitely will. Anyone got a good email address...?
http://www.apple.com/contact/feedback.html
Mac users are so much more open to helping others that Apple really doesn't need to do it for us. We do it for each other.
As long as they keep the bulletins around everything will be just fine.
Originally posted by melgross
Because if he heard, in a meeting, of something happening in the forums he didn't like, he might pull the whole thing down. Don't forget when the bio of him came out, a bio that was pretty much positive, he found something he didn't like in it, and pulled the entire catalog of books from the company off the shelves.
When someone wrote a chapter about Job's father, and Jobs earlier relationships, and sent it to him for comments, he called the writer " a nutcase", and used pressure to have the magazine recind its contract to publish the piece. I read it, and it wasn't bad, just straightfoward. Too bad it wasn't published.
So, sure, I could see him doing that.
Thanks for the explanation. I heard about this.
Why would Steve not like something going on in the forums?
The forums were created for the purpose of discussing Apple products and helping other Mac users out.