But above you said it did. Sorry, could you explain this SATA issue to me? What does SATA stand for, and what is the problem with it?
Serial ATA (or SATA) is the type of hard drive / HD interface that the Mac Pros use with their internal hard drives. In Mac OS X, they run just fine. In Windows, the run slower than a tenth of what they should, meaning that XP takes incredibly long to boot up, minutes to launch programs, and overall terrible hard drive performance despite everything else running every quickly when access to the hard drive isn't required.
For example, Everquest runs at a great framerate, but whenever you enter a new area, it takes an extraordinary amount of time to load.
Actually this Boot Camp thing alone might have MS agreeing to port some of their apps.
The rest I get. but not this part.
How would having the Mac run windows as well as any other PC cause MS to want to port the programs that will run perfectly fine under Windows through Boot Camp, to the Mac OS?
If anything, it would be the other way around. Unless you have some arcane concept that I'm not getting.
If Apple sells more machines because of Boot Camp (and Parallels, etc.), MS will be selling more copies of XP and Vista. More copies of other Windows programs from them and others as well.
Only if, at some time in the future, the Mac's sales move up significently WITHOUT accompanying Windows sales might MS and others want to port, rather than to have Mac users buy their Windows versions. Perhaps that would happen after a time when Apple's sales are boosted somewhat because of windows.
Serial ATA (or SATA) is the type of hard drive / HD interface that the Mac Pros use with their internal hard drives. In Mac OS X, they run just fine. In Windows, the run slower than a tenth of what they should, meaning that XP takes incredibly long to boot up, minutes to launch programs, and overall terrible hard drive performance despite everything else running every quickly when access to the hard drive isn't required.
For example, Everquest runs at a great framerate, but whenever you enter a new area, it takes an extraordinary amount of time to load.
I don't remembder this being stated for every machine model. Are you saying it is?
I think if MS is going to get the revenue either way (Visio Win vs Visio Mac), and Steve tells Monkey-Boy that he'll continue to improve and promote Boot Camp (perhaps in ads) if they port them, then MS really has no dis-incentive to do it. Sometimes little agreements like that can happen.
Serial ATA (or SATA) is the type of hard drive / HD interface that the Mac Pros use with their internal hard drives. In Mac OS X, they run just fine. In Windows, the run slower than a tenth of what they should, meaning that XP takes incredibly long to boot up, minutes to launch programs, and overall terrible hard drive performance despite everything else running every quickly when access to the hard drive isn't required.
For example, Everquest runs at a great framerate, but whenever you enter a new area, it takes an extraordinary amount of time to load.
Well, since Mac Pros are the only Macs currently using SATA II drives then it's safe to assume that this 'problem' is limited to the Workstations.
Also, since Boot Camp 1.1 adds support for the Mac Pros where there once was not, it's also safe to say that it's better than nothing. (I mean, c'mon, give them a break it's still called BETA!)
I was able to use the mute and volume keys without installing any Apple driver. It appears that Windows has built-in support for these keys on USB keyboards.
Well, since Mac Pros are the only Macs currently using SATA II drives then it's safe to assume that this 'problem' is limited to the Workstations.
I don't understand what you mean by this. In the twio reviews I've read where they used Bootcamp on the Mac Pro's, this problem didn't occur. The same has been true for reviews of other Mac's and Boot Camp. It doesn't seem to be a universal problen (no pun intended!).
They have done what I once thought unthinkable... switch to Intel. You could argue that it wasn't the first time they changed processor architectures but still... they keep making moves that, when you line them up, it makes it if not believable, at least possible, that in the future, a long way down the line, they could sell macs with windows.
This is what is known strategically as "taking the fight to the enemy". You contain him by making him part of your offering (Windows on OSX), then you cut his legs off by offering a superior experience.
If Jobs wasn't in computers, he'd make a brilliant military strategist.
I don't understand what you mean by this. In the twio reviews I've read where they used Bootcamp on the Mac Pro's, this problem didn't occur. The same has been true for reviews of other Mac's and Boot Camp. It doesn't seem to be a universal problen (no pun intended!).
I don't have an Intel Mac, much less a Mac Pro. So I cannot confirm or deny if there is a problem at all. I was just saying that since it's a complaint about the speed of the SATA II drives then it would only be a problem on the new Mac Pros (And that compared to the previous version of Boot Camp which does not even support the Mac Pro at all it's nothing to sneeze at). He just made it sound like it was a platform wide issue, if it's an issue at all.
I don't have an Intel Mac, much less a Mac Pro. So I cannot confirm or deny if there is a problem at all. I was just saying that since it's a complaint about the speed of the SATA II drives then it would only be a problem on the new Mac Pros (And that compared to the previous version of Boot Camp which does not even support the Mac Pro at all it's nothing to sneeze at). He just made it sound like it was a platform wide issue, if it's an issue at all.
As far as I know, the ONLY Mac's at this time, to have SATA II drives ARE the Mac Pro's. The rest use SATA I.
I haven't seen a SATA speed problem mentioned for the Pro's.
First of all I want to say that I'm a really big MacOS fan. I love the OS to bits (no pun intended) but... ,and sorry to sound so JohnDvorak-like, Apple just keeps making things that make me wonder if they ever would sell computers with Microsoft Windows, either as their primary or secondary OS pre-loaded right out of the box.
They have done what I once thought unthinkable... switch to Intel. You could argue that it wasn't the first time they changed processor architectures but still... they keep making moves that, when you line them up, it makes it if not believable, at least possible, that in the future, a long way down the line, they could sell macs with windows.
Still, I'm not saying I think this will happen or that it should happen. I'm just saying that it wouldn't surprise me that badly if one sad day in the history of computing, it ended up happening. They have all the pieces in place, and their machines are perfectly capable of doing it and boot camp just keeps getting better.
Could we see the day when Apple, in order to broaden their competitive advantage with other PC makers, brokered some deal with Microsoft to include Windows Whatever licenses along with every macintosh? Co-exist with OS X right out of the box? They are, after all, a so-called hardware company.
They switched to Intel because Intel made better procs. They run windows because they only need a handful of developers to make an intel machine with EFI do such a thing, and it adds amazing value to the machine.
Apple makes their money off hardware. If they thought they could make more money by getting rid of OS X and just selling windows-only boxes, THEY WOULD.
However, this is not the case, and therefore our precious Mac OS X is safe.
They switched to Intel because Intel made better procs. They run windows because they only need a handful of developers to make an intel machine with EFI do such a thing, and it adds amazing value to the machine.
Apple makes their money off hardware. If they thought they could make more money by getting rid of OS X and just selling windows-only boxes, THEY WOULD.
However, this is not the case, and therefore our precious Mac OS X is safe.
As much as I'm not thrilled about the thought, there's this in support:
This is what is known strategically as "taking the fight to the enemy". You contain him by making him part of your offering (Windows on OSX), then you cut his legs off by offering a superior experience.
If Jobs wasn't in computers, he'd make a brilliant military strategist.
Right now the experience on Mac Pros is pretty mediocre.
Thank you. It helps to know the details of the issue. The fourth comment on the story you linked has a possible solution that sounds reasonable to me. Has anyone tried this on a MacPro? Alternatively, has anyone installed the new version of Boot Camp on a MacPro that's never had it before? Presumably this would preempt XP's setting the mode of the drive to PIO permanently.
Argh when when i install the Mac Drivers do my keyboard and trackpad stop working, i have tried plugging in a USB Mouse but the ports have no power to them. This is anoying as i need windows for chemistry apps as i am a Chem student.
Comments
But above you said it did. Sorry, could you explain this SATA issue to me? What does SATA stand for, and what is the problem with it?
Serial ATA (or SATA) is the type of hard drive / HD interface that the Mac Pros use with their internal hard drives. In Mac OS X, they run just fine. In Windows, the run slower than a tenth of what they should, meaning that XP takes incredibly long to boot up, minutes to launch programs, and overall terrible hard drive performance despite everything else running every quickly when access to the hard drive isn't required.
For example, Everquest runs at a great framerate, but whenever you enter a new area, it takes an extraordinary amount of time to load.
Actually this Boot Camp thing alone might have MS agreeing to port some of their apps.
The rest I get. but not this part.
How would having the Mac run windows as well as any other PC cause MS to want to port the programs that will run perfectly fine under Windows through Boot Camp, to the Mac OS?
If anything, it would be the other way around. Unless you have some arcane concept that I'm not getting.
If Apple sells more machines because of Boot Camp (and Parallels, etc.), MS will be selling more copies of XP and Vista. More copies of other Windows programs from them and others as well.
Only if, at some time in the future, the Mac's sales move up significently WITHOUT accompanying Windows sales might MS and others want to port, rather than to have Mac users buy their Windows versions. Perhaps that would happen after a time when Apple's sales are boosted somewhat because of windows.
If that happens, it could take years.
But, is that what you mean?
Serial ATA (or SATA) is the type of hard drive / HD interface that the Mac Pros use with their internal hard drives. In Mac OS X, they run just fine. In Windows, the run slower than a tenth of what they should, meaning that XP takes incredibly long to boot up, minutes to launch programs, and overall terrible hard drive performance despite everything else running every quickly when access to the hard drive isn't required.
For example, Everquest runs at a great framerate, but whenever you enter a new area, it takes an extraordinary amount of time to load.
I don't remembder this being stated for every machine model. Are you saying it is?
Serial ATA (or SATA) is the type of hard drive / HD interface that the Mac Pros use with their internal hard drives. In Mac OS X, they run just fine. In Windows, the run slower than a tenth of what they should, meaning that XP takes incredibly long to boot up, minutes to launch programs, and overall terrible hard drive performance despite everything else running every quickly when access to the hard drive isn't required.
For example, Everquest runs at a great framerate, but whenever you enter a new area, it takes an extraordinary amount of time to load.
Well, since Mac Pros are the only Macs currently using SATA II drives then it's safe to assume that this 'problem' is limited to the Workstations.
Also, since Boot Camp 1.1 adds support for the Mac Pros where there once was not, it's also safe to say that it's better than nothing.
the mute works from the keyboard
the volume controls work from the keyboard
the eject key still doesn't work
the cinema on/off and brightness controls work.
INteresting...
I was able to use the mute and volume keys without installing any Apple driver. It appears that Windows has built-in support for these keys on USB keyboards.
Well, since Mac Pros are the only Macs currently using SATA II drives then it's safe to assume that this 'problem' is limited to the Workstations.
I don't understand what you mean by this. In the twio reviews I've read where they used Bootcamp on the Mac Pro's, this problem didn't occur. The same has been true for reviews of other Mac's and Boot Camp. It doesn't seem to be a universal problen (no pun intended!).
[/QUOTE]
They have done what I once thought unthinkable... switch to Intel. You could argue that it wasn't the first time they changed processor architectures but still... they keep making moves that, when you line them up, it makes it if not believable, at least possible, that in the future, a long way down the line, they could sell macs with windows.
This is what is known strategically as "taking the fight to the enemy". You contain him by making him part of your offering (Windows on OSX), then you cut his legs off by offering a superior experience.
If Jobs wasn't in computers, he'd make a brilliant military strategist.
I don't understand what you mean by this. In the twio reviews I've read where they used Bootcamp on the Mac Pro's, this problem didn't occur. The same has been true for reviews of other Mac's and Boot Camp. It doesn't seem to be a universal problen (no pun intended!).
I don't have an Intel Mac, much less a Mac Pro. So I cannot confirm or deny if there is a problem at all. I was just saying that since it's a complaint about the speed of the SATA II drives then it would only be a problem on the new Mac Pros (And that compared to the previous version of Boot Camp which does not even support the Mac Pro at all it's nothing to sneeze at). He just made it sound like it was a platform wide issue, if it's an issue at all.
I don't have an Intel Mac, much less a Mac Pro. So I cannot confirm or deny if there is a problem at all. I was just saying that since it's a complaint about the speed of the SATA II drives then it would only be a problem on the new Mac Pros (And that compared to the previous version of Boot Camp which does not even support the Mac Pro at all it's nothing to sneeze at). He just made it sound like it was a platform wide issue, if it's an issue at all.
As far as I know, the ONLY Mac's at this time, to have SATA II drives ARE the Mac Pro's. The rest use SATA I.
I haven't seen a SATA speed problem mentioned for the Pro's.
First of all I want to say that I'm a really big MacOS fan. I love the OS to bits (no pun intended) but... ,and sorry to sound so JohnDvorak-like, Apple just keeps making things that make me wonder if they ever would sell computers with Microsoft Windows, either as their primary or secondary OS pre-loaded right out of the box.
They have done what I once thought unthinkable... switch to Intel. You could argue that it wasn't the first time they changed processor architectures but still... they keep making moves that, when you line them up, it makes it if not believable, at least possible, that in the future, a long way down the line, they could sell macs with windows.
Still, I'm not saying I think this will happen or that it should happen. I'm just saying that it wouldn't surprise me that badly if one sad day in the history of computing, it ended up happening. They have all the pieces in place, and their machines are perfectly capable of doing it and boot camp just keeps getting better.
Could we see the day when Apple, in order to broaden their competitive advantage with other PC makers, brokered some deal with Microsoft to include Windows Whatever licenses along with every macintosh? Co-exist with OS X right out of the box? They are, after all, a so-called hardware company.
They switched to Intel because Intel made better procs. They run windows because they only need a handful of developers to make an intel machine with EFI do such a thing, and it adds amazing value to the machine.
Apple makes their money off hardware. If they thought they could make more money by getting rid of OS X and just selling windows-only boxes, THEY WOULD.
However, this is not the case, and therefore our precious Mac OS X is safe.
They switched to Intel because Intel made better procs. They run windows because they only need a handful of developers to make an intel machine with EFI do such a thing, and it adds amazing value to the machine.
Apple makes their money off hardware. If they thought they could make more money by getting rid of OS X and just selling windows-only boxes, THEY WOULD.
However, this is not the case, and therefore our precious Mac OS X is safe.
As much as I'm not thrilled about the thought, there's this in support:
http://news.com.com/2300-1010_3-6106530-1.html
This is what is known strategically as "taking the fight to the enemy". You contain him by making him part of your offering (Windows on OSX), then you cut his legs off by offering a superior experience.
If Jobs wasn't in computers, he'd make a brilliant military strategist.
Right now the experience on Mac Pros is pretty mediocre.
Right now the experience on Mac Pros is pretty mediocre.
You keep making these type of comments and not backing them up with anything- not even personal experience. What are you trying to say?
He's Placebo. He makes you think there's substance when there really isn't.
In defense of accuracy;
http://www.anandtech.com/weblog/default.aspx#287
He's Placebo. He makes you think there's substance when there really isn't.
In defense of accuracy;
http://www.anandtech.com/weblog/default.aspx#287
Oh. The Irony.
In defense of accuracy;
http://www.anandtech.com/weblog/default.aspx#287
Thank you. It helps to know the details of the issue. The fourth comment on the story you linked has a possible solution that sounds reasonable to me. Has anyone tried this on a MacPro? Alternatively, has anyone installed the new version of Boot Camp on a MacPro that's never had it before? Presumably this would preempt XP's setting the mode of the drive to PIO permanently.
You keep making these type of comments and not backing them up with anything- not even personal experience. What are you trying to say?
I mean that when you use Windows XP on a Mac Pro, you might as well be accessing your hard drive by dialup the SATA drivers are so bad.
ANybody got any ideas on how to fix this?