On the Saxon review, that is the polar opposite from what I've experienced. (weak on application, etc.)
They got started in the homeschool market --- the curriculum was created by a guy who was once told "he could never learn math". It's a hit in charter schools and I think some public schools are looking at it as well (Harcourt bought Saxon a year or two ago).
****Breaking news
...my wife just leaned over and read that review and quipped, and I quote: "that's such bullshit it's not even funny".
That dude is fascinating. Swedish. Four languages. Captain of the Swedish Olympic Karate team. MA in Chemistry and won a Fulbright to go to MIT but turned it down.
That dude is fascinating. Swedish. Four languages. Captain of the Swedish Olympic Karate team. MA in Chemistry and won a Fulbright to go to MIT but turned it down.
I think math past high school sophomore year should be taught as a two-week crash course at the start of college. So much of the material is such that it will never be applied outside of a math/science career.
I think math past high school sophomore year should be taught as a two-week crash course at the start of college. So much of the material is such that it will never be applied outside of a math/science career.
Unfortunately, that is how it seems to go in many cases: People going to college are tested and often found to be so poor at basic math that they are required to take remedial math (that usually doesn't count toward college graduation).
But I have to ask about "never being applied outside of a math/science career." Is college supposed to be job training? How much of what people take in college is career-related? English? History? Geography? And is this a good or bad thing?
Unfortunately, that is how it seems to go in many cases: People going to college are tested and often found to be so poor at basic math that they are required to take remedial math (that usually doesn't count toward college graduation).
I hear that -- if I set one "pre" Algebra text a year, I set a dozen; it's a total disgrace. In some cases, my 11 year-old could get a C.
I find it difficult to believe that the most effective way to teach math is to have someone at the front of the room writing things on the blackboard.
Sometime things that are difficult to believe actually work pretty well.
Classroom instruction is only one part of the puzzle... alone it's not the most effective, but when combined with after class activities and seminars it works well.
You should do that AND send them to socialize/learn with other children; but seeing as you live in a town of ~3500, I can see where you can rationally argue that your family constitutes the only source of children for the school system.
Did you go to public school? If so your behavior doesn't support your arguement of public education 'improving' one's social skills. You do realize that in this post alone you've gone out of your way to insult two posters?
Sometime things that are difficult to believe actually work pretty well.
Classroom instruction is only one part of the puzzle... alone it's not the most effective, but when combined with after class activities and seminars it works well.
Sometimes things that are difficult to believe suggest a discipline throughly untouched by developments in pedagogy since the 1970s. Or since the 18th century.
I started this thread because it stuck me as mighty odd that classroom activities that are common in many other disciplines (something as simple as group work) are foreign to so much of math instruction, and I wanted to know whether my experiences were an anomaly. It would seem they are not.
Now I'm curious to hear how other countries do it. How is math taught in Japan? In India?
Yes. Like a few other people around here, I'm a university professor.
/me frantically tries to finish prepping for class this evening....
Midwinter,
Does it have to be an either or proposition? Couldn't you use several methods of teaching in your class? For example, couldn't you do traditional blackboard instruction and then also have groups that solved complicated problems?
Did you go to public school? If so your behavior doesn't support your arguement of public education 'improving' one's social skills. You do realize that in this post alone you've gone out of your way to insult two posters?
Most definitely, I did attend public schools.
And no, I don't care that you think I 'went out of my way to insult' anyone.
Does it have to be an either or proposition? Couldn't you use several methods of teaching in your class? For example, couldn't you do traditional blackboard instruction and then also have groups that solved complicated problems?
I would argue that not only can you mix methods, but that you SHOULD do it. Were I a math instructor (and if you knew me, you'd know what a laugh that idea is) I would push your example even further: have the groups then teach the class, then position weaker students together and stronger students together, then mix weak and strong students, then have groups come up with lists of things they don't understand and have other groups figure them out, and on and on.
Comments
Czech girls can be gorgeous.
From http://www.sonlight.com/saxon.html
Really, really really doesn't seem appropriate for my 8 year-old...
DMZ, please let us know, were you home schooled? This gives me an idea for a new thread...
Yes, from about the 6th grade on -- I essentially taught myself (with curriculum) from there, and started college early.
I hear a lot of stories from people who talk about the less savory aspects of high school, politics, etc. -- I feel like I escaped a prison sentence.
They got started in the homeschool market --- the curriculum was created by a guy who was once told "he could never learn math". It's a hit in charter schools and I think some public schools are looking at it as well (Harcourt bought Saxon a year or two ago).
****Breaking news
...my wife just leaned over and read that review and quipped, and I quote: "that's such bullshit it's not even funny".
Come on...
The Russian from Rocky IV?
That dude is fascinating. Swedish. Four languages. Captain of the Swedish Olympic Karate team. MA in Chemistry and won a Fulbright to go to MIT but turned it down.
That dude is fascinating. Swedish. Four languages. Captain of the Swedish Olympic Karate team. MA in Chemistry and won a Fulbright to go to MIT but turned it down.
And looks like Groverat!
Yes, from about the 6th grade on -- I essentially taught myself (with curriculum) from there, and started college early.
I hear a lot of stories from people who talk about the less savory aspects of high school, politics, etc. -- I feel like I escaped a prison sentence.
Saxton math is great, I did their "pre algebra" book cover to cover, every exercise in my 8th grade year, and slept through high school algebra.
I think math past high school sophomore year should be taught as a two-week crash course at the start of college. So much of the material is such that it will never be applied outside of a math/science career.
Unfortunately, that is how it seems to go in many cases: People going to college are tested and often found to be so poor at basic math that they are required to take remedial math (that usually doesn't count toward college graduation).
But I have to ask about "never being applied outside of a math/science career." Is college supposed to be job training? How much of what people take in college is career-related? English? History? Geography? And is this a good or bad thing?
Unfortunately, that is how it seems to go in many cases: People going to college are tested and often found to be so poor at basic math that they are required to take remedial math (that usually doesn't count toward college graduation).
I hear that -- if I set one "pre" Algebra text a year, I set a dozen; it's a total disgrace. In some cases, my 11 year-old could get a C.
Crazy.
Russian accents?
Russian accents are the sexiest.
Well, they were probably looking at you confused cause that's 6 dollars change
Ouch!
Ouch!
But if TWO are drunk, it's totally OK.
I find it difficult to believe that the most effective way to teach math is to have someone at the front of the room writing things on the blackboard.
Sometime things that are difficult to believe actually work pretty well.
Classroom instruction is only one part of the puzzle... alone it's not the most effective, but when combined with after class activities and seminars it works well.
You should do that AND send them to socialize/learn with other children; but seeing as you live in a town of ~3500, I can see where you can rationally argue that your family constitutes the only source of children for the school system.
Did you go to public school? If so your behavior doesn't support your arguement of public education 'improving' one's social skills. You do realize that in this post alone you've gone out of your way to insult two posters?
Sometime things that are difficult to believe actually work pretty well.
Classroom instruction is only one part of the puzzle... alone it's not the most effective, but when combined with after class activities and seminars it works well.
Sometimes things that are difficult to believe suggest a discipline throughly untouched by developments in pedagogy since the 1970s. Or since the 18th century.
I started this thread because it stuck me as mighty odd that classroom activities that are common in many other disciplines (something as simple as group work) are foreign to so much of math instruction, and I wanted to know whether my experiences were an anomaly. It would seem they are not.
Now I'm curious to hear how other countries do it. How is math taught in Japan? In India?
Do you teach at the college level or high school? Just curious to know, I'm not a teacher but find the discussion interesting.
PS I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express a few weeks ago.
Midwinter,
Do you teach at the college level or high school? Just curious to know, I'm not a teacher but find the discussion interesting.
PS I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express a few weeks ago.
Yes. Like a few other people around here, I'm a university professor.
/me frantically tries to finish prepping for class this evening....
Yes. Like a few other people around here, I'm a university professor.
/me frantically tries to finish prepping for class this evening....
Midwinter,
Does it have to be an either or proposition? Couldn't you use several methods of teaching in your class? For example, couldn't you do traditional blackboard instruction and then also have groups that solved complicated problems?
Did you go to public school? If so your behavior doesn't support your arguement of public education 'improving' one's social skills. You do realize that in this post alone you've gone out of your way to insult two posters?
Most definitely, I did attend public schools.
And no, I don't care that you think I 'went out of my way to insult' anyone.
Midwinter,
Does it have to be an either or proposition? Couldn't you use several methods of teaching in your class? For example, couldn't you do traditional blackboard instruction and then also have groups that solved complicated problems?
I would argue that not only can you mix methods, but that you SHOULD do it. Were I a math instructor (and if you knew me, you'd know what a laugh that idea is) I would push your example even further: have the groups then teach the class, then position weaker students together and stronger students together, then mix weak and strong students, then have groups come up with lists of things they don't understand and have other groups figure them out, and on and on.