There is your answer right there. 5.1 digital surround is a minority. You cannot make a healthy profit by targeting the minority.
All the DVDs are targetting the minority then, it's hard to find a DVD that doesn't have 5.1. They aren't that expensive, nor are 5.1 systems rare.
Quote:
I consider 'High def' anything that is above the norm really, 480 to me is high def, but to other only 1080 is high def. Anything above stereo is high def to me. Then again, I'm a college student and I still have an old Sanyo TV that doesn't even have AV ports in it. Hell I got a Powerbook G4 1.0 GHz...
For all of the people saying that they want their HD movies from iTunes now and to hurry up with the upgrades of mac and all that other impatient stuff need to just sit back and relax. I personally haven't been disappointed with Apple because they get the stuff out there and they get it done right. If we had our HD videos right now, we would have people on here saying that the video downloads take too long, instead of being able to buy a song, wait (for me not even 30 seconds) for the video to download, and enjoy a great movie. Apple will get it done and will get it done right, a la the Merom Macbooks and Pros, iTV (TelePort or whatever), "True Video ipod" and the next chapter of Intel chips.
We all just need to sit back. Relax. It will come, and it will be good.
Using the iPod as a transport medium is I think exactly what Apple is trying to get you to do. Rather than go over to a friend's place with a stack of cds and dvds, you can take one pocket-sized device. With the right dock, it would be easy to just put the iPod into place and with a good navigator (such as the updated front row on iTV), browse your media.
Great, once again us Apple users are the guinea pigs for Apple's guerrilla marketing ploys. "Lets violate people's digital rights and force them to use our product EVERYWHERE..."
I can see the new ad now... "This is how 2007 will be just like 1984".
I don't think people with 5.1 capable systems are the "extreme minority".
Well I did say HDTV and surround sound are the extreme minority.
Quote:
It seems crazy to me not to put 5.1 surround into these legal downloads when a decent bit-torrent file will have 5.1 surround.
So far the bit-torrent movies I've seen have not been that impressive. I would not use them as any measurement of consistent quality.
I think its pretty elitist to call 5.1 a make or break feature. It doesn't make the acting any better or make the content of the movie any better. Its just a nice addition.
If 5.1 could be added without significantly increasing the file size or adding significantly more compression to keep the same file size, then I can see your point.
I have never seen framerate used to make that distinction anywhere. 480i is standard definition.
That's true. I keep telling you guys video quality is not determined only by pixel size.
If 480i were recorded in HD color space with an HD sample rate that would make it HD.
I would not be surprised to see something like this come about. This would enable broadcast stations to use their available bandwidth to broadcast five stations at 480i in HD color space instead of one station at 1080i.
I have never seen framerate used to make that distinction anywhere. 480i is standard definition.
This arcticle seems to make that distinction. However, there are no external links or references, so it's difficult to verify.
It seems odd to denote 480/48i as "SDTV" and 480/24p as "EDTV". "EDTV" implies some sort of half-way-house between SD and HD, but the move from interlaced to progressive is nowhere near as big, quality-wise, as a move from 480 lines and 24 fps to 720 lines and 60 fps.
Someone earlier mentioned something about Apples hopes that people would abandon carrying around CDs and DVDs and just take their ipod to a friends house to watch their movies.
In the current situation this doesnt make all that much sense (unless your friend has an ipod dock all set up on his/her tv). The iPod dock limits you to composite (or S-Video) video and stereo sound.
Here's my though. What if, the iTV (or TelePort or whatever) not only acts as a content streaming device, but also an "upgraded" iPod dock. You stick your iPod in it and can then output its video through HDMI, or use the optical audio and component video? It could work with current iPods as well as the future "True" video iPods.
If the iTV device and iTunes movie store become ubiquitous enough, you could hypothetically carry your whole library around with you all the time. Instead of burning DVDs it would be much easier to pop your iPod right into your friends iTV. This would also diminish the complaints we hear about not being able to burn to a DVD. Through this, apple not only doesnt have to deal with the DRM mess of allowing people to burn to CD, but they can push more iTV and iPod sales as well.
All the DVDs are targetting the minority then, it's hard to find a DVD that doesn't have 5.1. They aren't that expensive, nor are 5.1 systems rare.
480p is enhanced definition, EDTV.
You missed the point. I'm trying to show that even though to people in the high def world already, anything below 720 is useless. But to me, with my 12 year old sanyo TV, 480 is high definition. Now I'm not saying that 480p IS high definition, I'm saying in my eyes, it looks high def.
Hell my iTunes Movie I bought looks great on my 17" powerbook G4. I have no complaints on the quality. I think it looks great, and any of the 1080 definition picture I missed, wasn't missed, because I didn't notice it.
Here's my though. What if, the iTV (or TelePort or whatever) not only acts as a content streaming device, but also an "upgraded" iPod dock. You stick your iPod in it and can then output its video through HDMI, or use the optical audio and component video? It could work with current iPods as well as the future "True" video iPods.
Thoughts?
Very good idea. Hopefully will happen given the presence of a USB port on the iTV.
In the current situation this doesnt make all that much sense (unless your friend has an ipod dock all set up on his/her tv). The iPod dock limits you to composite (or S-Video) video and stereo sound.
You don't need an iPod dock. You need a mini stereo to RCA wire. With that you plug the iPod into your TV AV ports.
You don't need an iPod dock. You need a mini stereo to RCA wire. With that you plug the iPod into your TV AV ports.
Right, but you cant output to component video (composite looks awful on anything bigger than 36") currently just using the video cables. Plus, how often do you carry a mini stereo to RCA cable around with you on the off chance youll watch a movie on your iPod at a friends?
I guess what I'm trying to say is that the current situation is far from what I would consider an elegant solution.
Someone earlier mentioned something about Apples hopes that people would abandon carrying around CDs and DVDs and just take their ipod to a friends house to watch their movies.
In the current situation this doesnt make all that much sense (unless your friend has an ipod dock all set up on his/her tv). The iPod dock limits you to composite (or S-Video) video and stereo sound.
Here's my though. What if, the iTV (or TelePort or whatever) not only acts as a content streaming device, but also an "upgraded" iPod dock. You stick your iPod in it and can then output its video through HDMI, or use the optical audio and component video? It could work with current iPods as well as the future "True" video iPods.
If the iTV device and iTunes movie store become ubiquitous enough, you could hypothetically carry your whole library around with you all the time. Instead of burning DVDs it would be much easier to pop your iPod right into your friends iTV. This would also diminish the complaints we hear about not being able to burn to a DVD. Through this, apple not only doesnt have to deal with the DRM mess of allowing people to burn to CD, but they can push more iTV and iPod sales as well.
Thoughts?
This possibility of hooking up an iPod to the iTV is completely possible. On the back of the system is a *gasp* USB port. It would be very easy to hook a dock up to the iTV, but to have iPods dock straight into the system would probably defeat the purpose. I think Apple is more concerned about getting your own media to the TV, through the wireless, then ipod connectivity, which is why there is a USB port but not a built in dock.
What I was thinking was that the iTV wasn't just a transmitter, but it actually enhances the video to true, by the definition, HD 1080 HDMI output.
Wait, would that be even possible? To take a non-HD video and stream it into HD?
What looks horrible on a large screen television depends on lot on the ability of that television to upgrade SD. The newest Sony televisions make SD look really good.
If your intent is to view videos from an iPod on a television you need some way to connect it. I don't see one wire as being overly inconvenient.
Wait, would that be even possible? To take a non-HD video and stream it into HD?
Yes, there are plenty of video-scaling integrated circuits on the market that do this. Some are much better than others. But (hopefully) obviously, none of them can magically "add" information which is absent from the original content. 1080p content delivered by the iTV (assuming it can do 1080p) would look better than 360p (what the iTunes downloads seem to be) upscaled to 1080p.
Yes, there are plenty of video scalers on the market that do this. Some are much better than others. But (hopefully) obviously, none of them can magically "add" information which is absent from the original content. 1080p content delivered by the iTV (assuming it can do 1080p) would look better than 360p (what the iTunes downloads seem to be) upscaled to 1080p.
Then I'd be willing to be thats what the iTV will do. It will be a scaler and wifi solution to getting the music and info from the computer.
Also, doesn't Apple's h.264 (don't quote me on the number) have the information there so that when you scale it it knows what to put into the empty information places?
Amazon.com's Unbox is a horror show. The Unbox service appears not so much to have been introduced as to have escaped from the laboratory.
Of all the smart and talented people at Amazon, did no one dare say, "Wait, our new service bites! It's slower than a trip to Blockbuster, more expensive than a DVD, absurdly restrictive on how the consumer uses the movie, delivers lower resolution than a DVD, and requires running a cable from the PC to the TV if you want to watch the movie on something larger than a PC monitor"?
Apple's iTunes media store, meanwhile, is the feel-good movie download service of the summer, and builds on the same style and ease of use that has made iTunes the world's leading legal download service for music and television shows. But my local cineplex or cable TV service offers more movie choices than iTunes (which I'll review in detail on Thursday) does at this point, and the missing link - getting the movie from the PC to the TV - is still missing. I think I'll wait for the sequel.
Although it's damning of Amazon's service, the article doesn't exactly sound like a ringing endorsement of either service, and in addition, the comments about "more expensive than a DVD, absurdly restrictive on how the consumer uses the movie, delivers lower resolution than a DVD, and requires running a cable from the PC to the TV if you want to watch the movie on something larger than a PC monitor" also applies to iTunes thanks to absurd restrictions mandated by the studios.
The weird thing is... since Jobs is a big boy at Disney now, couldn't Apple+Disney have at least agreed on less insane restrictions for their Disney/Touchstone/Pixar/Miramax product?
Also, doesn't Apple's h.264 (don't quote me on the number) have the information there so that when you scale it it knows what to put into the empty information places?
Comments
There is your answer right there. 5.1 digital surround is a minority. You cannot make a healthy profit by targeting the minority.
All the DVDs are targetting the minority then, it's hard to find a DVD that doesn't have 5.1. They aren't that expensive, nor are 5.1 systems rare.
I consider 'High def' anything that is above the norm really, 480 to me is high def, but to other only 1080 is high def. Anything above stereo is high def to me. Then again, I'm a college student and I still have an old Sanyo TV that doesn't even have AV ports in it. Hell I got a Powerbook G4 1.0 GHz...
480p is enhanced definition, EDTV.
For all of the people saying that they want their HD movies from iTunes now and to hurry up with the upgrades of mac and all that other impatient stuff need to just sit back and relax. I personally haven't been disappointed with Apple because they get the stuff out there and they get it done right. If we had our HD videos right now, we would have people on here saying that the video downloads take too long, instead of being able to buy a song, wait (for me not even 30 seconds) for the video to download, and enjoy a great movie. Apple will get it done and will get it done right, a la the Merom Macbooks and Pros, iTV (TelePort or whatever), "True Video ipod" and the next chapter of Intel chips.
We all just need to sit back. Relax. It will come, and it will be good.
..... and then there is iTunes 7 .......
480p is enhanced definition, EDTV.
That depends on the frame rate. 480/24p is Standard Definition, 480/50p or 480/60p is Enhanced Definition.
Anyway, describing 480-anything as High Definition is ludicrous. 480 lines has been the NTSC standard since 1941.
Using the iPod as a transport medium is I think exactly what Apple is trying to get you to do. Rather than go over to a friend's place with a stack of cds and dvds, you can take one pocket-sized device. With the right dock, it would be easy to just put the iPod into place and with a good navigator (such as the updated front row on iTV), browse your media.
Great, once again us Apple users are the guinea pigs for Apple's guerrilla marketing ploys. "Lets violate people's digital rights and force them to use our product EVERYWHERE..."
I can see the new ad now... "This is how 2007 will be just like 1984".
That depends on the frame rate. 480/24p is Standard Definition, 480/50p or 480/60p is Enhanced Definition.
I have never seen framerate used to make that distinction anywhere. 480i is standard definition.
I don't think people with 5.1 capable systems are the "extreme minority".
Well I did say HDTV and surround sound are the extreme minority.
It seems crazy to me not to put 5.1 surround into these legal downloads when a decent bit-torrent file will have 5.1 surround.
So far the bit-torrent movies I've seen have not been that impressive. I would not use them as any measurement of consistent quality.
I think its pretty elitist to call 5.1 a make or break feature. It doesn't make the acting any better or make the content of the movie any better. Its just a nice addition.
If 5.1 could be added without significantly increasing the file size or adding significantly more compression to keep the same file size, then I can see your point.
I have never seen framerate used to make that distinction anywhere. 480i is standard definition.
That's true. I keep telling you guys video quality is not determined only by pixel size.
If 480i were recorded in HD color space with an HD sample rate that would make it HD.
I would not be surprised to see something like this come about. This would enable broadcast stations to use their available bandwidth to broadcast five stations at 480i in HD color space instead of one station at 1080i.
I have never seen framerate used to make that distinction anywhere. 480i is standard definition.
This arcticle seems to make that distinction. However, there are no external links or references, so it's difficult to verify.
It seems odd to denote 480/48i as "SDTV" and 480/24p as "EDTV". "EDTV" implies some sort of half-way-house between SD and HD, but the move from interlaced to progressive is nowhere near as big, quality-wise, as a move from 480 lines and 24 fps to 720 lines and 60 fps.
In the current situation this doesnt make all that much sense (unless your friend has an ipod dock all set up on his/her tv). The iPod dock limits you to composite (or S-Video) video and stereo sound.
Here's my though. What if, the iTV (or TelePort or whatever) not only acts as a content streaming device, but also an "upgraded" iPod dock. You stick your iPod in it and can then output its video through HDMI, or use the optical audio and component video? It could work with current iPods as well as the future "True" video iPods.
If the iTV device and iTunes movie store become ubiquitous enough, you could hypothetically carry your whole library around with you all the time. Instead of burning DVDs it would be much easier to pop your iPod right into your friends iTV. This would also diminish the complaints we hear about not being able to burn to a DVD. Through this, apple not only doesnt have to deal with the DRM mess of allowing people to burn to CD, but they can push more iTV and iPod sales as well.
Thoughts?
All the DVDs are targetting the minority then, it's hard to find a DVD that doesn't have 5.1. They aren't that expensive, nor are 5.1 systems rare.
480p is enhanced definition, EDTV.
You missed the point. I'm trying to show that even though to people in the high def world already, anything below 720 is useless. But to me, with my 12 year old sanyo TV, 480 is high definition. Now I'm not saying that 480p IS high definition, I'm saying in my eyes, it looks high def.
Hell my iTunes Movie I bought looks great on my 17" powerbook G4. I have no complaints on the quality. I think it looks great, and any of the 1080 definition picture I missed, wasn't missed, because I didn't notice it.
Here's my though. What if, the iTV (or TelePort or whatever) not only acts as a content streaming device, but also an "upgraded" iPod dock. You stick your iPod in it and can then output its video through HDMI, or use the optical audio and component video? It could work with current iPods as well as the future "True" video iPods.
Thoughts?
Very good idea. Hopefully will happen given the presence of a USB port on the iTV.
In the current situation this doesnt make all that much sense (unless your friend has an ipod dock all set up on his/her tv). The iPod dock limits you to composite (or S-Video) video and stereo sound.
You don't need an iPod dock. You need a mini stereo to RCA wire. With that you plug the iPod into your TV AV ports.
You don't need an iPod dock. You need a mini stereo to RCA wire. With that you plug the iPod into your TV AV ports.
Right, but you cant output to component video (composite looks awful on anything bigger than 36") currently just using the video cables. Plus, how often do you carry a mini stereo to RCA cable around with you on the off chance youll watch a movie on your iPod at a friends?
I guess what I'm trying to say is that the current situation is far from what I would consider an elegant solution.
Someone earlier mentioned something about Apples hopes that people would abandon carrying around CDs and DVDs and just take their ipod to a friends house to watch their movies.
In the current situation this doesnt make all that much sense (unless your friend has an ipod dock all set up on his/her tv). The iPod dock limits you to composite (or S-Video) video and stereo sound.
Here's my though. What if, the iTV (or TelePort or whatever) not only acts as a content streaming device, but also an "upgraded" iPod dock. You stick your iPod in it and can then output its video through HDMI, or use the optical audio and component video? It could work with current iPods as well as the future "True" video iPods.
If the iTV device and iTunes movie store become ubiquitous enough, you could hypothetically carry your whole library around with you all the time. Instead of burning DVDs it would be much easier to pop your iPod right into your friends iTV. This would also diminish the complaints we hear about not being able to burn to a DVD. Through this, apple not only doesnt have to deal with the DRM mess of allowing people to burn to CD, but they can push more iTV and iPod sales as well.
Thoughts?
This possibility of hooking up an iPod to the iTV is completely possible. On the back of the system is a *gasp* USB port. It would be very easy to hook a dock up to the iTV, but to have iPods dock straight into the system would probably defeat the purpose. I think Apple is more concerned about getting your own media to the TV, through the wireless, then ipod connectivity, which is why there is a USB port but not a built in dock.
What I was thinking was that the iTV wasn't just a transmitter, but it actually enhances the video to true, by the definition, HD 1080 HDMI output.
Wait, would that be even possible? To take a non-HD video and stream it into HD?
If your intent is to view videos from an iPod on a television you need some way to connect it. I don't see one wire as being overly inconvenient.
Wait, would that be even possible? To take a non-HD video and stream it into HD?
Yes, there are plenty of video-scaling integrated circuits on the market that do this. Some are much better than others. But (hopefully) obviously, none of them can magically "add" information which is absent from the original content. 1080p content delivered by the iTV (assuming it can do 1080p) would look better than 360p (what the iTunes downloads seem to be) upscaled to 1080p.
Yes, there are plenty of video scalers on the market that do this. Some are much better than others. But (hopefully) obviously, none of them can magically "add" information which is absent from the original content. 1080p content delivered by the iTV (assuming it can do 1080p) would look better than 360p (what the iTunes downloads seem to be) upscaled to 1080p.
Then I'd be willing to be thats what the iTV will do. It will be a scaler and wifi solution to getting the music and info from the computer.
Also, doesn't Apple's h.264 (don't quote me on the number) have the information there so that when you scale it it knows what to put into the empty information places?
Great article!! I hope Apple does better.
From the article--- Although it's damning of Amazon's service, the article doesn't exactly sound like a ringing endorsement of either service, and in addition, the comments about "more expensive than a DVD, absurdly restrictive on how the consumer uses the movie, delivers lower resolution than a DVD, and requires running a cable from the PC to the TV if you want to watch the movie on something larger than a PC monitor" also applies to iTunes thanks to absurd restrictions mandated by the studios.
The weird thing is... since Jobs is a big boy at Disney now, couldn't Apple+Disney have at least agreed on less insane restrictions for their Disney/Touchstone/Pixar/Miramax product?
Also, doesn't Apple's h.264 (don't quote me on the number) have the information there so that when you scale it it knows what to put into the empty information places?
"more expensive than a DVD.
Not true of iTunes.
absurdly restrictive on how the consumer uses the movie
Also true of iTunes, but he may argue that the forthcoming iTV lessens this.
delivers lower resolution than a DVD
Also true of iTunes.
and requires running a cable from the PC to the TV if you want to watch the movie on something larger than a PC monitor"
Currently, this is also true of iTunes, but again he may argue that the iTV lessens this problem for iTunes.
It would seem there's plenty of room for him to quite like the iTunes Movies service.