Display upgrades

Posted:
in Future Apple Hardware edited January 2014
Wanted to get you folks' opinions on possible future updates to Apple's Cinema Display line. Some thoughts I had:



- 24" to replace the 23"? After hearing all the complaints about the "pink" 23" panel they use, and the recent introduction of the 24" iMac, this seems the logical next step, no?



- Built in iSight/IR receiver? I think the IR is a no-brainer -- how could they not include it? Are Mac Pro owners just not supposed to use Front Row ("standard" in Leopard, right)? iSight, tough to say, but if they can stick it in a consumer laptop, do we really *need* a separate camera for the pros? Or does the standalone iSight have other advantages that justify forcing headless desktop users to fork over extra for it?



- Alternate inputs (HDMI)? HDCP?



- When do we expect to see higher resolutions/pixel densities? Right now it'd be a tad absurd but if Leopard does turn out to feature resolution-independece, do you suppose we might see higher resolution in future iterations of the displays (and iMacs)? 3200x2000, anyone?
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 56
    mrtotesmrtotes Posts: 759member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by brianus


    Wanted to get you folks' opinions on possible future updates to Apple's Cinema Display line. Some thoughts I had:



    - 24" to replace the 23"? After hearing all the complaints about the "pink" 23" panel they use, and the recent introduction of the 24" iMac, this seems the logical next step, no?



    - Built in iSight/IR receiver? I think the IR is a no-brainer -- how could they not include it? Are Mac Pro owners just not supposed to use Front Row ("standard" in Leopard, right)? iSight, tough to say, but if they can stick it in a consumer laptop, do we really *need* a separate camera for the pros? Or does the standalone iSight have other advantages that justify forcing headless desktop users to fork over extra for it?



    - Alternate inputs (HDMI)? HDCP?



    - When do we expect to see higher resolutions/pixel densities? Right now it'd be a tad absurd but if Leopard does turn out to feature resolution-independece, do you suppose we might see higher resolution in future iterations of the displays (and iMacs)? 3200x2000, anyone?



    - Agree they'd be foolish not to use the 24" panel in the next range of displays - economies of scale and all that. The 20-23-30 range always seemed unbalanced to me anyway.



    - I think iSight and IR are probably given. Although I always through the Mac Pro would have WiFi as standard.



    - Can't see new inputs being used. Apple want's to sell these displays to MBP, Mini and Mac Pro users.



    - 3200x2000?? You'd need a serious serious graphics card for that!
  • Reply 2 of 56
    idaveidave Posts: 1,283member
    Aren't BlueRay (HDDVD) movies going to require HDCP (HDMI) compatible displays? I can't see Apple leaving it out of a newly revised lineup if that's the case.



    Front Row makes the most sense on big displays so IR sounds like a great idea.



    iSight built in is a given, IMO.



    I'm waiting to see what's going to happen, hopefully at MWSF. I'm kinda saving for a new 30 incher (or better). Might consider another brand too, depending on what happens in the next several months. The current ACD lineup is only just over two years old. It could be another year or more before Apple does a redesign.
  • Reply 3 of 56
    krispiekrispie Posts: 260member
    I don't see why a MacPro would have Wi-Fi as standard. A pro would be on a proper Gigabit wired network, and from there on a proper high-speed internet connection via fibre etc.



    Just like the sensible decision not to make Airport standard on a Mac Pro.
  • Reply 4 of 56
    messiahmessiah Posts: 1,689member
    I think we'll see the res. of the 24" iMac bumped up a bit, after all, there are 17" laptops out there that have the same resolution. If the 24" does get bumped, expect to see the same panel in the 24" Cinema HD Display.
  • Reply 5 of 56
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by iDave


    Aren't BlueRay (HDDVD) movies going to require HDCP (HDMI) compatible displays? I can't see Apple leaving it out of a newly revised lineup if that's the case.



    Front Row makes the most sense on big displays so IR sounds like a great idea.



    iSight built in is a given, IMO.



    I'm waiting to see what's going to happen, hopefully at MWSF. I'm kinda saving for a new 30 incher (or better). Might consider another brand too, depending on what happens in the next several months. The current ACD lineup is only just over two years old. It could be another year or more before Apple does a redesign.



    No they need HDCP and that works with DVI
  • Reply 6 of 56
    tenobelltenobell Posts: 7,014member
    Quote:

    If the 24" does get bumped, expect to see the same panel in the 24" Cinema HD Display.



    I don't think they will use the same LCD panel. When the Cinema Displays were first introduced they all cost more than the whole iMac computer.



    There are several new cutting edge LCD technologies available. My educated guess would be Apple will use one of these new and expensive LCD technologies in its next Cinema Displays.



    Which would mean the reason they are not lowering the prices is because they will introduce new expensive displays and they don't want customers to get used to less expensive prices.
  • Reply 7 of 56
    idaveidave Posts: 1,283member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TenoBell


    Which would mean the reason they are not lowering the prices is because they will introduce new expensive displays and they don't want customers to get used to less expensive prices.



    Um, but Apple just did reduce prices; $500 on the 30" model and I think $300 on the 23", about two months ago.
  • Reply 8 of 56
    tenobelltenobell Posts: 7,014member
    Still not as cheap as Dell.
  • Reply 9 of 56
    chuckerchucker Posts: 5,089member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TenoBell


    Still not as cheap as Dell.



    Apple is not interested in selling commodity hardware.
  • Reply 10 of 56
    idaveidave Posts: 1,283member
    I noticed Dell lowered the price on their 30" display almost immediately after Apple lowered theirs and not before. Funny how these things work. I think Dell makes fine displays, with more inputs and outputs than Apple's (although no Firewire). Am considering one myself. Hate the big fat logo on the front though.
  • Reply 11 of 56
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Chucker


    Apple is not interested in selling commodity hardware.



    You may be correct, but IMHO, there really isn't any difference between the apple displays and the dell displays in terms of quality at this juncture. Apple charges a premium for its hardware because it is like sculpture, but this won't be enough once obsolescence takes over.
  • Reply 12 of 56
    I'm pretty certain Apple's Cinema Displays and Dell's displays both use Samsung technology. If someone can prove me wrong on this, please do so.



    I've had my Dell 2405FPW for over a year now, thing is still flawless and it cost me $815.



    A minimalist appearance and matching theme for my PMG5 is not worth the cost difference of Apple's equivalent to the 2405FPW.



    There are many other Mac users out there who share my views on this. Apple needs to get more competitive in this market IMO.



    A nice touch Apple could do is offer a package or discount to Mac Pro/MBP buyers and include a Cinema Display at a certain percentage off, depending on the value of the computer they buy from them.

    Same could go for accessories IF purchased in the same order as the computer.
  • Reply 13 of 56
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SoopaDrive


    A nice touch Apple could do is offer a package or discount to Mac Pro/MBP buyers and include a Cinema Display at a certain percentage off, depending on the value of the computer they buy from them. Same could go for accessories IF purchased in the same order as the computer.



    I've always thought this, but pretty much figure Apple does what they does; I usually get things from them on order (even... gasp! Memory!) -- but monitors, I usually get somewhere else (unless a company is footing the bill). Don't know why monitors are such a big difference to me, but maybe it's because I usually hang onto them a long, long time. But, yeah, if I buy a Mac Pro and an MBP at the same time, it would be kinda cool to be rewarded with a little discount on a few monitors.
  • Reply 14 of 56
    chuckerchucker Posts: 5,089member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by flinch13


    You may be correct, but IMHO, there really isn't any difference between the apple displays and the dell displays in terms of quality at this juncture. Apple charges a premium for its hardware because it is like sculpture, but this won't be enough once obsolescence takes over.



    Which is why Apple will eventually drop the 20-incher, as it's become too much of a commodity item in the recent years.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SoopaDrive


    I'm pretty certain Apple's Cinema Displays and Dell's displays both use Samsung technology. If someone can prove me wrong on this, please do so.



    You are indeed wrong; they both use LG Philips technology.
  • Reply 15 of 56
    eckingecking Posts: 1,588member
    I'm pretty sure HDCP can be done through dvi so in that case you'd just need a dvi to hdmi converter. But what I believe they SHOULD do is at least offer all the conection options the dell monitor does.



    The 24 inch dell offers: DVI, VGA, Composite, S-Video, Component, USB Upstream, 4 USB downstream, card reader. And in my canada all for 799 (679.15USD)



    The 23 inch apple offers: DVI, 2 USB, 2 Firewire. And in canada for 1099 (999USD)



    The apple should at least offer: DVI(with HDCP), VGA, Composite, Component, 2 USB, 2 Firewire



    and preferably: DVI(with HDCP), HDMI, Composite, Component, 2 USB, 2 Firewire



    if they want to keep prices the same as they are now.



    In april or may I'll be looking for a new display and I'd love to have the apple one but even with my student discount the dell is 200 bucks cheaper, can be adjusted, and has almost all the ports I need.



    The apple, for anyone without an unlimited budget or crazy fanboyizm should be a hard sell(even if they do end up with it in the end)
  • Reply 16 of 56
    tenobelltenobell Posts: 7,014member
    Quote:

    Apple is not interested in selling commodity hardware.



    Yes I know, but as has been mentioned there isn't much difference between the quality and bigger difference between the price.



    My point was that people would complain if Apple did lower the prices to meet Dell. Then introduced new monitors that again were a big increase in price.



    Quote:

    The 24 inch dell offers: DVI, VGA, Composite, S-Video, Component, USB Upstream, 4 USB downstream, card reader.



    I don't think Apple needs to use all of those ports. Most of that stuff goes unused by most people. It just makes you feel like you are getting a lot for your money.
  • Reply 17 of 56
    chuckerchucker Posts: 5,089member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ecking


    The 24 inch dell offers: DVI, VGA, Composite, S-Video, Component, USB Upstream, 4 USB downstream, card reader. And in my canada all for 799 (679.15USD)



    "USB upstream" is just silly; of course Apple's USB hub in their displays has an upstream port, how else would it work?



    I've never understood people's fascination with card readers. How many different devices with different card types are you gonna have? And if you only have one type, or two or three, wouldn't it be redundant and, quite frankly, ugly, to have slots for all sorts of cards you're never going to own? That said, card readers are a useful accessory, but you can buy them for less than $10 so it's not like dell is giving you anything valuable by adding them. You'd be much more flexible by buying an external one, because you could take it with you, and because the main advantage of that very concept (having a huge array of different slots) would actually apply.



    4 USB ports is nice, but also something you could easily add for another ten bucks if you were so inclined. The Dell, on the other hand, has no FireWire whatsoever.



    So in terms of actual valuable features that have something to do with a monitor (gasp!), this leaves us with VGA, Composite, S-Video and Component. You will notice they all have two things in common: they're for video, and they're analog. But the screen is digital, and so is your computer's input data. So, the Dell screens (except for the 30-incher, which has none of these ports) use an analog-to-digital converter so they can do something with those analog signals. That kind of conversion, however, is bound to give you terrible quality, especially at the 1920x1200 resolution we're talking about!



    The only input that will actually give you proper quality is DVI, since that's the only digital one.



    Now, if you want the monitor to double as a TV so you can watch low-resolution, analog, pixelated and converted stuff, go ahead, but it's way too expensive for that purpose.
  • Reply 18 of 56
    drnatdrnat Posts: 142member
    I am borrowing a Dell 24" monitor & love the card reader - removes the necesity to plug in a card reader which is another wire to get tangled on the desk....
  • Reply 19 of 56
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by drnat


    I am borrowing a Dell 24" monitor & love the card reader - removes the necesity to plug in a card reader which is another wire to get tangled on the desk....



    Or another wire to put away and bring out the couple times a month that you unload your camera.



    I much prefer a USB cable directly into my camera, as that little card is annoying to take in and out of my Canon.



    Ick, card readers. Save em for overpriced printers with little LCDs.
  • Reply 20 of 56
    eckingecking Posts: 1,588member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Chucker


    "USB upstream" is just silly; of course Apple's USB hub in their displays has an upstream port, how else would it work?



    I've never understood people's fascination with card readers. How many different devices with different card types are you gonna have? And if you only have one type, or two or three, wouldn't it be redundant and, quite frankly, ugly, to have slots for all sorts of cards you're never going to own? That said, card readers are a useful accessory, but you can buy them for less than $10 so it's not like dell is giving you anything valuable by adding them. You'd be much more flexible by buying an external one, because you could take it with you, and because the main advantage of that very concept (having a huge array of different slots) would actually apply.



    4 USB ports is nice, but also something you could easily add for another ten bucks if you were so inclined. The Dell, on the other hand, has no FireWire whatsoever.



    So in terms of actual valuable features that have something to do with a monitor (gasp!), this leaves us with VGA, Composite, S-Video and Component. You will notice they all have two things in common: they're for video, and they're analog. But the screen is digital, and so is your computer's input data. So, the Dell screens (except for the 30-incher, which has none of these ports) use an analog-to-digital converter so they can do something with those analog signals. That kind of conversion, however, is bound to give you terrible quality, especially at the 1920x1200 resolution we're talking about!



    The only input that will actually give you proper quality is DVI, since that's the only digital one.



    Now, if you want the monitor to double as a TV so you can watch low-resolution, analog, pixelated and converted stuff, go ahead, but it's way too expensive for that purpose.



    That's why I wrote



    Quote:

    and preferably: DVI(with HDCP), HDMI, Composite, Component, 2 USB, 2 Firewire



    You can't say those are competely useless and no one would use them. That'd be invaluable to me as an independant editor.
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