"Wimax is coming"

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Posted:
in Future Apple Hardware edited January 2014
There is a lot of uproar over the Edge vs 3G option on the iPhone, but what is getting lost in this is the quote by the Eric Schmidt:



"Wimax is coming"



Compared to WiMax, Edge and 3G both suck. This is a phone that is meant for WiMax and WiFi. Given that quote, I'd say its a lot more plausible that the phone might be able to be activated for 802.16 standard via upgrade or that a WiMax enabled iPhone isn't far behind.



Also given the absurd data costs that you could rack up with this device, who would want to use it all that much outside of WiFi zones?
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  • Reply 1 of 26
    murkmurk Posts: 935member
    Apple probably has things timed out really well. The Cingular deal last until 2009. Wimax probably won't hit mainstream until then. As I said in another thread, WiMax and the descendants of the iPhone are the future of mobile computing.
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  • Reply 2 of 26
    slewisslewis Posts: 2,081member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by murk View Post


    Apple probably has things timed out really well. The Cingular deal last until 2009. Wimax probably won't hit mainstream until then. As I said in another thread, WiMax and the descendants of the iPhone are the future of mobile computing.



    I know I've said at least till 2009 myself, but Apple and Cingular only said multi year and that could be longer.



    Sebastian
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  • Reply 3 of 26
    I wonder if the agreement only pertains to other cellphone carriers. If the infrastructure appears, I wonder if Apple is free to release a WiMax only iPhone as long as the other cellphone carriers are not involved.



    Its not technically the same device then. VoIP over WiMax as the phone device maybe. I mean I can take my laptop to a WiFi zone and do that now. How would an iPhone doing it be any different? WiMax cant get here soon enough for me. I dont think we are going to see real convergence until the infrastructure converges first. Once we can get TV, Phone, and Internet all from one signal, then true convergence can occur.
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  • Reply 4 of 26
    slewisslewis Posts: 2,081member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by dancm2000 View Post


    I wonder if the agreement only pertains to other cellphone carriers. If the infrastructure appears, I wonder if Apple is free to release a WiMax only iPhone as long as the other cellphone carriers are not involved.



    Its not technically the same device then. VoIP over WiMax as the phone device maybe. I mean I can take my laptop to a WiFi zone and do that now. How would an iPhone doing it be any different? WiMax cant get here soon enough for me. I dont think we are going to see real convergence until the infrastructure converges first. Once we can get TV, Phone, and Internet all from one signal, then true convergence can occur.



    Why the hell would they do that? It would essentially be ripping Cingular off just because they have a backdoor and for no other reason other then they can.



    Sebastian
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  • Reply 5 of 26
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,954member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Slewis View Post


    Why the hell would they do that? It would essentially be ripping Cingular off just because they have a backdoor and for no other reason other then they can.



    It's not as if I have sympathy for Cingular.
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  • Reply 6 of 26
    slewisslewis Posts: 2,081member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    It's not as if I have sympathy for Cingular.



    You may not, but Apple partnered with Cingular, and Cingular is going to make sure that Apple respects that.



    Either way, Apple isn't going to use Loop Holes or go back on their deal.



    Sebastian
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  • Reply 7 of 26
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,954member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Slewis View Post


    You may not, but Apple partnered with Cingular, and Cingular is going to make sure that Apple respects that.



    Either way, Apple isn't going to use Loop Holes or go back on their deal.



    I wouldn't say that for certain, Apple made a deal not to go into the music business and they did violate that.
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  • Reply 8 of 26
    murkmurk Posts: 935member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Slewis View Post


    Why the hell would they do that? It would essentially be ripping Cingular off just because they have a backdoor and for no other reason other then they can.



    Sebastian



    Are you saying WiMax offers nothing over Cingular's current network? I think iPhone will really come into its own when fast, affordable and always available internet is pulsing through its (future) zirconia case. Of course, I can't say exactly when this will happen, but Sprint is apparently going to give it a big push. Google also seems to be planning for it. What are Cingular's, or should I say AT&T's, future plans?
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  • Reply 9 of 26
    gargar Posts: 1,201member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    I wouldn't say that for certain, Apple made a deal not to go into the music business and they did violate that.



    So everyone working in a (brick and mortar) CD store is in the music business nowadays

    It's called retail, not music business.
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  • Reply 10 of 26
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,954member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gar View Post


    So everyone working in a (brick and mortar) CD store is in the music business nowadays

    It's called retail, not music business.



    Enough such they got sued.



    Retail is just a different part of the business. Distribution is another part. The labels don't make music, but they are in the music business.
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  • Reply 11 of 26
    Didn't the court agree with Apple Computer (as it was, then), though?
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  • Reply 12 of 26
    slewisslewis Posts: 2,081member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    I wouldn't say that for certain, Apple made a deal not to go into the music business and they did violate that.



    True, but that deal was made when Steve Jobs was working on the NeXTstep of his career wasn't it? But Cingular said it was a Multi Year exclusive Partnership, Apple said it was a Multi Year exclusive Contract, that's 2+ years, so don't expect anything out of Verizon or T-Mobile or Sprint, or for Apple to work on a WiFi phone. WiFi phones are pointless, and it's just Wishful thinking. Apple would still have to create a Nationwide WiMax network in order to make it work.



    Sebastian
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  • Reply 13 of 26
    snoopysnoopy Posts: 1,901member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post




    Apple made a deal not to go into the music business and they did violate that.






    The court apparently didn't think so. The Beetles' lost that case in a UK court.





    Quote:



    Retail is just a different part of the business. Distribution is another part. The labels don't make music, but they are in the music business.






    Following this logic: A poet is in the music business if someone puts his words to music. DuPont is in the music business if someone makes CD blanks from their plastics. Comcast is in the music business if someone transmits music over their cable lines. Any company in the sound business is in the music business, since music is a form of sound. Since sound can be digitized, stored and reproduced by a computer, all computer companies are automatically in the music business.



    Apple and Apple simply disagreed about what constitutes the music business. The judge ruled in favor of Apple Computer, as it was called back then.



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  • Reply 14 of 26
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Slewis View Post


    Either way, Apple isn't going to use Loop Holes or go back on their deal.



    Perhaps they'll use Apple Loops!



    Kim Kap Sol
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  • Reply 15 of 26
    Where did Eric say Wimax is coming? I watched the keynote several times looking out for this coment but didn't catch it.
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  • Reply 16 of 26
    Ok, WiMax will offer everyone something. First, it will offer us "converged services" - media (newly purchased from ITs and "live" media - TV), true video chat, mobile computing, etc. blabalbal very very exciting.



    Now it will also offer Cingular a chance to shine if they can. They will be the ones providing the WiMax network along with the other carriers. So basically, this is the way I see it: the carriers provide the network - but with WiMax it's internet only they provide. So if we all had Skype-like clients on our phones, we would be able to call using IP - VOIP.



    And what's really cool about this (besides for paying a flat monthly fee to call anywhere in the world) is that there is no need to worry about contact synching. If I go and d/l Skype/AIM/Y!/MSN/Gtalk on any computer, all of my contacts are carried over! Now that's something I'm looking forward to.
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  • Reply 17 of 26
    I am surprised how few people know about WiMax. Or if they do, they aren't talking about it much. Currently WiFi is limited to 200 feet or less. WiMax will be like 20 miles. This is a huge difference and can't come fast enough. Also Intel is building it into all their future chips. MiMax should usher in a new era of always being able to be connected to the internet.



    What if Cingular is going to roll out WiMax so VoIP can work within 20 miles of every cell tower? Apple can add this capabilities to the iPhone. They work together so they each know they have a market and a solution that works. Cingular knows they will get all iPhone users and Apple knows they will get cell coverage everywhere. Cingular isn't worried about VOIP because it gets to charge for the WiMax data bandwidth. With WiMax, WiFi will eventually disappear.



    Apple probably doesn't care for 3G because it know something better is coming. Apple is not stupid enough to miss the 3G boat. They see something better coming down the road. I'm guessing that something is WiMax.



    Cingular can do a flat fee for now or they can just tolerate the WiFi drain because they know they have something way bigger coming. Remember what Jobs quoted about going to where the puck is going to be not to where it is now. Convergence is happening and phone, data, tv, etc can all come from these cell towers.



    I think this is what Apple sees about tv and movie distribution and their iTV is part of this equation. They see what is coming with networking and know a company like Cingular has the coverage to make it happen.



    Stop and think for a moment. Always being connected to the internet with a high bandwidth connection is the holy grail. Satellite is only good for downloads, has limited bandwidth, and is expensive (like having to put things in space). Land lines are fixed to one place so mobile connections are impossible. Cellular divides the two and has the best of both worlds. Cell towers are the best implementation for high speed two way communication.



    Apple is a solutions company, not just a hardware or software company. They are securing their future with hardware, software, and a cell distributor to be able to deliver a total solution. By the time other companies realize where Apple is heading, it will be too late and they will still have to hack together deals with other inferior companies.



    Imagine the iPhone with WiMax, then add GPS with Google Maps and Google Earth. Instant navigation system.



    Imagine Safari always connected and Yahoo Mail anywhere you go with the ability to read Office docs, pdfs, and other documents.



    Imagine iChat AV anywhere you go - yes, multi person mobile video conferencing on the iPhone. Talk about kill apps.



    Add the easy calendar, calculator,and other widgets that Apple and other vendors provide. Of course don't forget watching tv, movies, or listening to music. How about games too. Of course, let's not forget the ability to take photos and someday even video and immediately send them to your home computer for storage.



    It is important to realize how many apps do not have to have their data on the device if they have always connected high speed internet access. For example, a dictionary database does not have to reside on the device. You look up a word and it goes out to the internet for the result. Same with maps, email, even your photos and music.



    This would then open up possibilities like realtime speech to text and realtime language translation all on a device like the iPhone. It doesn't need the database or the CPU horsepower. It simply sends the voice over the net to your computer back home or some Google/Yahoo service and harnesses that power.



    Syncing the devices would happen in realtime in the background, kind of like Spotlight. Thus you send an email from the iPhone and your home computer automatically gets a copy right away. You take a picture and it gets sent home right away. Your iPhone only needs to buffer the recent or needed data.



    The iPhone and WiMax is a huge shift and I am still trying to understand all the ramifications of where this is going. Apple just introduced the first really portable computer. This is equivalent to going from desktops to laptops. Now we are going from laptops to handhelds.



    Apple was actually there first with the Newton but lost out. Other PDAs like Palm continued the evolution. Smart phones have been pushing this evolution lately but now Apple has grabbed the lead again. And it has a big lead.



    There will always be a market for standalone cell phones and standalone MP3 players. They will be dirt cheap too. What Apple is going after is not actually just a smart phone but the newly created handheld computer domain. The introduction of the iPhone truely is a special day. Like the iPod, it may take a year or two to really catch on but it changes everything.



    But what makes this revolution possible is something like WiMax. Intel is building it in every chip and I bet Cingular is building it in every tower. The future looks very interesting.
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  • Reply 18 of 26
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,954member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by visionary View Post


    I bet Cingular is building it in every tower.



    They haven't said anything. Sprint has said they are rolling out WiMax, starting with Chicago and DC.
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  • Reply 19 of 26
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by visionary View Post


    Cingular isn't worried about VOIP because it gets to charge for the WiMax data bandwidth.



    WiMax technology will, or should, be the end of per kilobyte charging. WiMax is poised to be the primary internet provider for both mobile and stationary devices. Cell phones and home PC's. The sort of speeds WiMax provides make limited data rates ridiculous.



    And WiMax is a standard, 802.16, so any device should be able to receive any WiMax signal. The WiMax developers are pushing for this to be like any 802.11 device. Not provider specific. And recent legislation points to this being required by law. Perhaps Cingular has tricked Apple into an agreement that its iPhones will come locked from accessing WiMax networks that are not from Cingular. I just cant believe that can be the case. If it is then Cingular really did win the war. Because what that means is that every iPhone user will be forced to use Cingular (or AT&T) broadband services for everything inculding home internet access. Because when you purchase access to a WiMax network it wont be just for your mobile device, it will be for every internet using piece of hardware you own. Unless people just are aching to pay twice to get through the same door once. So if you want an iPhone, you'll have to use Cingular for internet access at home as well. I love Apple, but I dont love Apple that much. I really expect some long drawn out legal battles in the US over WiMax access. I hope the net neutrality boys win. so I dont have to worry about it. I tend to lean conservative, but it sounds like having the Dems in power right now is a good thing for net neutrality.



    Btw,



    Sprint recently announced that it plans to charge users $55/month to connect multiple devices to their WiMax network which will provide speed at 2-4Mbps. Think about how much cheaper that is than what you currently pay for cellphone + internet.



    Other news like the bit above, plus tons of great resourves on WiMax and what it mean can be found at The Wimax Forum.
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  • Reply 20 of 26
    murkmurk Posts: 935member
    I think Cingular is actually working on 3G, not WiMax. I wish it was otherwise.
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