Does Leopard Finally Fix the Finder?

Posted:
in macOS edited January 2014
I've been a long time very satisfied user of PathFinder as a Finder replacement. I think it's a magnificent Mac program. The new version 4.7 has Subversion, a competitor to Time Machine. I'm now testing that out.



After watching the WWDC Keynote and reading some (not all) of the comments on AI, I'd be interested in what folks think (particularly the developers) of the new Leopard Finder. IYO, Has Apple finally fixed the FF?



Thanks.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 32
    lets hope so.. hard to say without actually using it
  • Reply 2 of 32
    backtomacbacktomac Posts: 4,579member
    It would be nice if the developers with the beta would chime in. I guess they're covered by NDA but would general statements like 'I think finder is much better(or worse)' violate the NDA? I don't expect them to reveal details but aren't they allowed to express an opinion without violating the NDA?
  • Reply 3 of 32
    lfe2211lfe2211 Posts: 507member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by backtomac View Post


    It would be nice if the developers with the beta would chime in. I guess they're covered by NDA but would general statements like 'I think finder is much better(or worse)' violate the NDA? I don't expect them to reveal details but aren't they allowed to express an opinion without violating the NDA?



    Thanks for the bump up Backtomac. You may be right about the NDA issue. I sure would like to hear from the devs though, if they can say anything at all. If any developer with a beta reads this, could you please say whether you are prohibited by an NDA at this time from making comments? Thanks.
  • Reply 4 of 32
    backtomacbacktomac Posts: 4,579member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lfe2211 View Post


    Thanks for the bump up Backtomac. You may be right about the NDA issue. I sure would like to hear from the devs though, if they can say anything at all. If any developer with a beta reads this, could you please say whether you are prohibited by an NDA at this time from making comments? Thanks.



    You're welcome. I guess we'll know in October, but like you I want to know now.
  • Reply 5 of 32
    javacowboyjavacowboy Posts: 816member
    I'm not sure whether this falls under the NDA of the latest build of Leopard, but I'll ask anyway:



    Is the new Finder written in Cocoa, or is it still a Carbon app?
  • Reply 6 of 32
    m01etym01ety Posts: 278member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JavaCowboy View Post


    I'm not sure whether this falls under the NDA of the latest build of Leopard, but I'll ask anyway:



    Is the new Finder written in Cocoa, or is it still a Carbon app?



    It's still Carbon. Then again, so is iTunes. Just being Cocoa wouldn't make the Finder "better". However, it is far more multi-threaded and aware of extra cores, and it puts them to very good use. (So, at least, go reports from WWDC session attendees posted around the Intarwebs.)



    Now, not like I have Leopard or anything -- and if I had, I couldn't tell anyone, could I? -- but allegedly the Finder is dramatically better. Allegedly, thumbnail generation is actually fast, at last. (Really fast.) Allegedly, networking with Windows shares no longer seems to lead to hangups, and Windows machines on a local network actually show up, the first time around. I also hear (allegedly) that the new folder icons that ship with the system are gorgeous, and very reminiscent of the System 7 days. Allegedly icons can now be scaled *way* beyond 128x128, although the only slider for that is in the Spotlight results window, and the View Options for the Finder in general is still limited to 128x128. Allegedly, some apps (like Font Book) ship with 512x512 icons, although most apps still have 128x128. Allegedly Spotlight is fixed now, and it is possible to type-and-search without delay. Allegedly the whole Finder in general is much much more responsive and a pleasure to use in ways it really never has been.





    Of course, I wouldn't know. Though I wonder what specific questions people might have about the Finder.
  • Reply 7 of 32
    akacakac Posts: 511member
    I'm curious about a few things. Like how about the "Show Item Info" option, does it truncate info like 10.4 does? For example under "Macintosh HD" it says "148.73 GB, .....95 GB free" which is pretty useless.
  • Reply 8 of 32
    pbpb Posts: 4,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by m01ety View Post


    It's still Carbon. Then again, so is iTunes. Just being Cocoa wouldn't make the Finder "better".

    .

    .

    .

    Now, not like I have Leopard or anything -- and if I had, I couldn't tell anyone, could I? -- but allegedly the Finder is dramatically better.



    I am afraid you contradict yourself a little here. How can you be so affirmative that the new Finder is still written in Carbon, and yet say that you have no involvement in development for Leopard? Or... ? OK, OK.



    Not that I really care which framework the Finder is written in. Let it be Carbon, Diamond, Cocoa or Cocoanut, all I (and many others) care about is a Finder Fixed at last.



    Anyway, thanks for sheding some... alleged ... light on critical Finder issues.
  • Reply 9 of 32
    m01etym01ety Posts: 278member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Akac View Post


    I'm curious about a few things. Like how about the "Show Item Info" option, does it truncate info like 10.4 does? For example under "Macintosh HD" it says "148.73 GB, .....95 GB free" which is pretty useless.



    Allegedly, after trying three different drives with every single icon size and text orientation (right/bottom), neither on the desktop or in the Finder was anything ever truncated. So I think your answer is, allegedly, a cautious "yes, looks fixed".



    Anything else?
  • Reply 10 of 32
    giantgiant Posts: 6,041member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by PB View Post


    I am afraid you contradict yourself a little here. How can you be so affirmative that the new Finder is still written in Carbon, and yet say that you have no involvement in development for Leopard? Or... ? OK, OK.



    http://lists.apple.com/archives/carb.../msg00476.html
  • Reply 11 of 32
    krispiekrispie Posts: 260member
    "Is the new Finder written in Cocoa, or is it still a Carbon app?"



    It doesn't matter.
  • Reply 12 of 32
    pbpb Posts: 4,233member


    Ah, thanks, now it makes sense.
  • Reply 13 of 32
    daffy_duckdaffy_duck Posts: 248member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by m01ety View Post


    Anything else?



    I have questions!



    Is there, allegedly, more information in copy/move dialogs when there is a conflict? Can you rename a folder and only change the case of a letter or letters (upper to lower case)? Does a finder window update when it is not active? Can Windows shared drives or folders be indexed and searched with Spotlight? Are Spotlight comments the only way to add metadata?
  • Reply 14 of 32
    m01etym01ety Posts: 278member
    Is there, allegedly, more information in copy/move dialogs when there is a conflict?

    I hear there is not. (And I agree that such conflict management, especially like Vista's copy/move dialogs feature, would be lovely and necessary. It's especially stupid because Apple *has* proven that they can handle conflict management quite well, as seen, for example, in Address Book's vcard merge feature.)



    Can you rename a folder and only change the case of a letter or letters (upper to lower case)?

    I'm not sure I understand what you mean. I hear that renaming a folder from "TEST" to "test" works as one might expect. Why, was this not possible in Tiger?



    Does a finder window update when it is not active?

    Again, what do you mean? I hear that saving a new document from TextEdit to a folder that is open in the background as an inactive Finder window will make it refresh with the changes instantly -- is that what you meant?



    Can Windows shared drives or folders be indexed and searched with Spotlight?

    Can't check now; will see what is alleged later today.



    Are Spotlight comments the only way to add metadata?

    I hear that if there *is* any additional way, it's kept well hidden. (Cautious "no".)
  • Reply 15 of 32
    irelandireland Posts: 17,616member
    Quote:

    Does Leopard Finally Fix the Finder?



    I'll tell you tomorrow
  • Reply 16 of 32
    daffy_duckdaffy_duck Posts: 248member
    I'm not sure I understand what you mean. I hear that renaming a folder from "TEST" to "test" works as one might expect. Why, was this not possible in Tiger?



    Apparently, the problem is on Windows SMB shares. Now that I am home I tried changing the case of a folder name in OS X and it wasn't a problem.



    Again, what do you mean? I hear that saving a new document from TextEdit to a folder that is open in the background as an inactive Finder window will make it refresh with the changes instantly -- is that what you meant?



    Yes. It may be another Windows share thing. If I move some files into a folder and then start using Safari, the files don't show up in the Finder window until it's selected.



    Can't check now; will see what is alleged later today.



    Thanks. In Tiger, you can force Spotlight to index a shared drive (http://tinyurl.com/2l6ztu) but it doesn't automatically update to changes.



    I hear that if there *is* any additional way, it's kept well hidden. (Cautious "no".)



    I guess I am hoping for a lot of Windows sharing improvements. It's already pretty good though. I was really hoping that they would embrace the IPTC standard for embedding metadata in photo files. Maybe iPhoto '07...
  • Reply 17 of 32
    lfe2211lfe2211 Posts: 507member
    m01ety,



    Just got in from a business trip. Thanks for the remarks on the alleged Finder changes and the link. Except for the prettier interface and fast cover flow view (as seen at the WWDC Keynote ), it still doesn't look to be better than Cocoatech's magnificent Pathfinder. Hope I'm wrong.
  • Reply 18 of 32
    dacloodacloo Posts: 890member
    Does the new Finder allegedly support "cut / paste" or similair behaviour?
  • Reply 19 of 32
    akacakac Posts: 511member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lfe2211 View Post


    m01ety,



    Just got in from a business trip. Thanks for the remarks on the alleged Finder changes and the link. Except for the prettier interface and fast cover flow view (as seen at the WWDC Keynote ), it still doesn't look to be better than Cocoatech's magnificent Pathfinder. Hope I'm wrong.



    How about the fact that it no longer beachballs on network shares among *many* changes. The truth is that the Finder has been radically updated on its internals.
  • Reply 20 of 32
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,271member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Akac View Post


    How about the fact that it no longer beachballs on network shares among *many* changes. The truth is that the Finder has been radically updated on its internals.



    Yes..that's the most imporant part to me is how it handles network shares, the performance of moving large file copy and the UI. I believe it should be simple yet powerful and configurable enough for most users.
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