Until my purchase of an iPhone, I purchased unlocked Nokia's and could go any where the hell I wanted based upon the cost and quality of service. The deal Apple has struck eliminated that option.
I have always had a Blackberry. This is my bag and my bag entirely. I purchased the iPhone knowing that I was locked in for 2 yrs to AT&T and their lousy service. I paid full retail. I had the option of not buying the iPhone.
Please, I'm not buying any crap about how Apple is now soley concerns about the stability and Job's absurd concerns about network security where 3rd party apps and hackers are concerned. My BBerry and Nokia never ever crashed from the time of purchase, And the iPhone crashes frequently so efforts to make the iPhone more stable are required and appropriate. Can't knock it even though I sit here steaming at the lack of certain SMS/IM functionality available on every phone I have ever had and need.
Like any good firm, Apple is motivated by profit, but they will deliver functionality that they determine is appropriate for the market consistent with balancing their profit motive and, most importnatly control over revenue streams with their partner. But they struck a deal that lines their pockets further, and saddled me with a poor data service and carrier for 2 years. Again, mea culpa. Caveat Emptor.
The question is only what did that freedom cost? The one time I purchased an unlocked phone in the US I got no discount and I paid as much as I did for the iPhone I now have. The service plan I got was the same cost as if I had gone for a discounted phone. So again, what was the cost?
You saying you could buy a phone and take it to Verizon, Sprint, Cingular, or T-Mobile?
I had options.. Buying an unlocked GSM phone, I could go to the GSM provider who offers me the best deal at that time. Particlurly useful when travelling abroad as I do quite frequently but where I am now screwed with outrageous AT&T charges
This isn't a totally fair comparision. The only app I see crash frequently on the iPhone is Safari. Web broswers on the BB or Nokia are not displaying the full page with text, graphics, and pictures. So they are not even making the same effort that Safari is. If one of those phones had a browser that rendered the entire web page and never crashed then you would be saying something.
I've had problems with many applications including Safari. It's fair to have a stable, bug free, crash free solution and I can't fault Apple for seeking to improve matters. They need to.
The question is only what did that freedom cost? The one time I purchased an unlocked phone in the US I got no discount and I paid as much as I did for the iPhone I now have. The service plan I got was the same cost as if I had gone for a discounted phone. So again, what was the cost?
I have been able to purchase unlocked Nokia phones at a discount to the "no plan" rate offered by carriers and, at the rate I lost them, I needed it.
I am locked into a service that at times is inadequate in Manhattan, and absurdly expensive when travelling abroad. I've received an AT&T bill and the toll charges are disgraceful. There is a real cost to me to be locked into AT&T.
Again, I have nobody to truly blame but myself (except who would anticipated that Apple would not deliver a fully featured SMS, MMS and IM app, when every other decent phone on the market supports them?), but Apple will not be receiving any thanks or expressions of gratitude from me either.
I've had problems with many applications including Safari.
There are no wide reports of crashing problems. Safari is the only one I've experienced frequent crashes so it sounds as if you are having more problems that the average user.
Quote:
I am locked into a service that at times is inadequate in Manhattan
I'm not sure what you mean by inadequate but I've had no problems in NYC. I infact find open WiFi signals all over Manhattan.
There are no wide reports of crashing problems. Safari is the only one I've experienced frequent crashes so it sounds as if you are having more problems that the average user.
I'm not sure what you mean by inadequate but I've had no problems in NYC. I infact find open WiFi signals all over Manhattan.
No offense, but you're just one anecdotal data point -- mine rarely "crashes," even on Safari, after Bug Fix 1.01. The phone has so far "crashed" twice when adding a picture taken on the iPhone camera to my contacts list.
Btw, I say "crash" in quotes because it is a bit of a misnomer, and an overstatement. All it means in the iPhone context is that it takes me back to the main menu, and I go right back to the application I was on in a second or two -- i.e., I've never had to restart, not once.
No offense, but you're just one anecdotal data point -- mine rarely "crashes," even on Safari, after Bug Fix 1.01. The phone has so far "crashed" twice when adding a picture taken on the iPhone camera to my contacts list.
Btw, I say "crash" in quotes because it is a bit of a misnomer, and an overstatement. All it means in the iPhone context is that it takes me back to the main menu, and I go right back to the application I was on in a second or two -- i.e., I've never had to restart, not once.
I was referring to widespread WiFi in Manhattan. Safari has issues but it's manageable.
A search on jwire.com finds 133 free WiFi hotspots in Manhattan.
Just to give examples. Most all major city parks have free WiFi: Central Park, Union Square, Madison Square Park, Byrant Park. As well as all NY City libraries, Penn Station, and Grand Central Terminal.
A search on jwire.com finds 133 free WiFi hotspots in Manhattan.
Just to give examples. Most all major city parks have free WiFi: Central Park, Union Square, Madison Square Park, Byrant Park. As well as all NY City libraries, Penn Station, and Grand Central Terminal.
I walk to work every day a 40 minute jaunt from the UWS to Midtown east. I encounter not a single free hi-Fi spot on the way until I reach the coffee shop in my building.
I have been able to purchase unlocked Nokia phones at a discount to the "no plan" rate offered by carriers and, at the rate I lost them, I needed it.
I am locked into a service that at times is inadequate in Manhattan, and absurdly expensive when travelling abroad. I've received an AT&T bill and the toll charges are disgraceful. There is a real cost to me to be locked into AT&T.
Again, I have nobody to truly blame but myself (except who would anticipated that Apple would not deliver a fully featured SMS, MMS and IM app, when every other decent phone on the market supports them?), but Apple will not be receiving any thanks or expressions of gratitude from me either.
But again, what did it cost you? I have no idea what discount you have gotten, nor the unlocked phone cost, nor what you paid for the plans you found? It would be nice to know.
Regarding the overseas plans, I'm not aware of any better plans that allow you to use your number? They are ALL bad as far as I've found so this is not an unlocking issue as far as I can tell. I had T-mobile before and had the same issues/costs (within 5%). In fact, I still have that phone, which was unlocked, and so for local phone access I could just get a local SIM for that.
But back to the main point, what are the other, lower costs?
If anyone had done their research you would have know how apple will go to any ends to protect their intellectual rights. ATT has great service in most area and will work hard to keep you happy, while not always meeting that goal. Anyone purchasing the phone could have taken it back, but chose not to stop bugging ....use your phone you ipod and your organizer or use the frigging IPHONE... More stuff will come be patient.......Call Bill and tell him you want a windows phone as great and wait till the 3rd revision to have it be half the phone. I use Windows and Macs....Like using both ...stop Buggin!!!!! Oh yeah for all you unlockers crying about not being able to ...you were stupid if you thought apple was not going to protect their intrest .....they dont make any money from TMOBILE
I have been thinking about getting the iPhone ever since it came out and I guess I was wondering if anyone could answer whether or not it can connect to secure wireless connections that require a password. I am a college student and we have wireless throughout campus but it requires my student id and password to be typed in if it were used on a computer. Thanks for any information.
The question is only what did that freedom cost? The one time I purchased an unlocked phone in the US I got no discount and I paid as much as I did for the iPhone I now have. The service plan I got was the same cost as if I had gone for a discounted phone. So again, what was the cost?
It's just a different business model, but still basically the same money. You still got a discount on the cost of the iPhone (despite what some here want to claim). AT&T just pays Apple part of your monthly service charges rather than a one time rebate on the phone.
The service plans cost the same if you buy an unlocked phone or take the rebate from the carrier. The difference is that if you provide your own phone, there is no 2 year service plan, so you can change carriers at any time ... with a service plan, there is usually upwards of a $200 early termination fee.
So, in the end, "freedom" usually costs around the price of the rebate. But signing up for a plan and doing an early terminate with the fee easily cancels that out.
I have been thinking about getting the iPhone ever since it came out and I guess I was wondering if anyone could answer whether or not it can connect to secure wireless connections that require a password. I am a college student and we have wireless throughout campus but it requires my student id and password to be typed in if it were used on a computer. Thanks for any information.
It would really depend on what kind of authentication/security they use. If you just go through a web page to log in, then probably yes, but other networks require 3rd party tools that would not (currently) work on the iPhone.
...you were stupid if you thought apple was not going to protect their intrest .....they dont make any money from TMOBILE
They aren't supposed to, thats what it means when the phone is sold unsubsidised. It's funny to watch Yankees quibble about unlocking, because you don't really have alternatives, even if you managed to unlock. Here in the old continent, we have many operators, and we also have steep competition. In this area regulating has actually spawn more market freedom, than your model that has only inflicted monopoly.
They aren't supposed to, thats what it means when the phone is sold unsubsidised. It's funny to watch Yankees quibble about unlocking, because you don't really have alternatives, even if you managed to unlock. Here in the old continent, we have many operators, and we also have steep competition. In this area regulating has actually spawn more market freedom, than your model that has only inflicted monopoly.
Yeah, but I guess your going to have to get used to a new business model as well, since Apple is busy working only on LOCKED contracts so far in the EU.
Wow -- this thread is completely not what the OP started..."Apple releases iPhone software update version 1.0.2"
Comments
Until my purchase of an iPhone, I purchased unlocked Nokia's and could go any where the hell I wanted based upon the cost and quality of service. The deal Apple has struck eliminated that option.
I have always had a Blackberry. This is my bag and my bag entirely. I purchased the iPhone knowing that I was locked in for 2 yrs to AT&T and their lousy service. I paid full retail. I had the option of not buying the iPhone.
Please, I'm not buying any crap about how Apple is now soley concerns about the stability and Job's absurd concerns about network security where 3rd party apps and hackers are concerned. My BBerry and Nokia never ever crashed from the time of purchase, And the iPhone crashes frequently so efforts to make the iPhone more stable are required and appropriate. Can't knock it even though I sit here steaming at the lack of certain SMS/IM functionality available on every phone I have ever had and need.
Like any good firm, Apple is motivated by profit, but they will deliver functionality that they determine is appropriate for the market consistent with balancing their profit motive and, most importnatly control over revenue streams with their partner. But they struck a deal that lines their pockets further, and saddled me with a poor data service and carrier for 2 years. Again, mea culpa. Caveat Emptor.
The question is only what did that freedom cost? The one time I purchased an unlocked phone in the US I got no discount and I paid as much as I did for the iPhone I now have. The service plan I got was the same cost as if I had gone for a discounted phone. So again, what was the cost?
You saying you could buy a phone and take it to Verizon, Sprint, Cingular, or T-Mobile?
I had options.. Buying an unlocked GSM phone, I could go to the GSM provider who offers me the best deal at that time. Particlurly useful when travelling abroad as I do quite frequently but where I am now screwed with outrageous AT&T charges
This isn't a totally fair comparision. The only app I see crash frequently on the iPhone is Safari. Web broswers on the BB or Nokia are not displaying the full page with text, graphics, and pictures. So they are not even making the same effort that Safari is. If one of those phones had a browser that rendered the entire web page and never crashed then you would be saying something.
I've had problems with many applications including Safari. It's fair to have a stable, bug free, crash free solution and I can't fault Apple for seeking to improve matters. They need to.
The question is only what did that freedom cost? The one time I purchased an unlocked phone in the US I got no discount and I paid as much as I did for the iPhone I now have. The service plan I got was the same cost as if I had gone for a discounted phone. So again, what was the cost?
I have been able to purchase unlocked Nokia phones at a discount to the "no plan" rate offered by carriers and, at the rate I lost them, I needed it.
I am locked into a service that at times is inadequate in Manhattan, and absurdly expensive when travelling abroad. I've received an AT&T bill and the toll charges are disgraceful. There is a real cost to me to be locked into AT&T.
Again, I have nobody to truly blame but myself (except who would anticipated that Apple would not deliver a fully featured SMS, MMS and IM app, when every other decent phone on the market supports them?), but Apple will not be receiving any thanks or expressions of gratitude from me either.
I've had problems with many applications including Safari.
There are no wide reports of crashing problems. Safari is the only one I've experienced frequent crashes so it sounds as if you are having more problems that the average user.
I am locked into a service that at times is inadequate in Manhattan
I'm not sure what you mean by inadequate but I've had no problems in NYC. I infact find open WiFi signals all over Manhattan.
There are no wide reports of crashing problems. Safari is the only one I've experienced frequent crashes so it sounds as if you are having more problems that the average user.
I'm not sure what you mean by inadequate but I've had no problems in NYC. I infact find open WiFi signals all over Manhattan.
NOT my experience at all.
NOT my experience at all.
No offense, but you're just one anecdotal data point -- mine rarely "crashes," even on Safari, after Bug Fix 1.01. The phone has so far "crashed" twice when adding a picture taken on the iPhone camera to my contacts list.
Btw, I say "crash" in quotes because it is a bit of a misnomer, and an overstatement. All it means in the iPhone context is that it takes me back to the main menu, and I go right back to the application I was on in a second or two -- i.e., I've never had to restart, not once.
No offense, but you're just one anecdotal data point -- mine rarely "crashes," even on Safari, after Bug Fix 1.01. The phone has so far "crashed" twice when adding a picture taken on the iPhone camera to my contacts list.
Btw, I say "crash" in quotes because it is a bit of a misnomer, and an overstatement. All it means in the iPhone context is that it takes me back to the main menu, and I go right back to the application I was on in a second or two -- i.e., I've never had to restart, not once.
I was referring to widespread WiFi in Manhattan. Safari has issues but it's manageable.
I infact find open WiFi signals all over Manhattan.
NOT my experience at all.
Nor mine, and not for lack of tryin'
Nor mine, and not for lack of tryin'
A search on jwire.com finds 133 free WiFi hotspots in Manhattan.
Just to give examples. Most all major city parks have free WiFi: Central Park, Union Square, Madison Square Park, Byrant Park. As well as all NY City libraries, Penn Station, and Grand Central Terminal.
A search on jwire.com finds 133 free WiFi hotspots in Manhattan.
Just to give examples. Most all major city parks have free WiFi: Central Park, Union Square, Madison Square Park, Byrant Park. As well as all NY City libraries, Penn Station, and Grand Central Terminal.
I walk to work every day a 40 minute jaunt from the UWS to Midtown east. I encounter not a single free hi-Fi spot on the way until I reach the coffee shop in my building.
So, consider yourself quite fortunate.
I have been able to purchase unlocked Nokia phones at a discount to the "no plan" rate offered by carriers and, at the rate I lost them, I needed it.
I am locked into a service that at times is inadequate in Manhattan, and absurdly expensive when travelling abroad. I've received an AT&T bill and the toll charges are disgraceful. There is a real cost to me to be locked into AT&T.
Again, I have nobody to truly blame but myself (except who would anticipated that Apple would not deliver a fully featured SMS, MMS and IM app, when every other decent phone on the market supports them?), but Apple will not be receiving any thanks or expressions of gratitude from me either.
But again, what did it cost you? I have no idea what discount you have gotten, nor the unlocked phone cost, nor what you paid for the plans you found? It would be nice to know.
Regarding the overseas plans, I'm not aware of any better plans that allow you to use your number? They are ALL bad as far as I've found so this is not an unlocking issue as far as I can tell. I had T-mobile before and had the same issues/costs (within 5%). In fact, I still have that phone, which was unlocked, and so for local phone access I could just get a local SIM for that.
But back to the main point, what are the other, lower costs?
The question is only what did that freedom cost? The one time I purchased an unlocked phone in the US I got no discount and I paid as much as I did for the iPhone I now have. The service plan I got was the same cost as if I had gone for a discounted phone. So again, what was the cost?
It's just a different business model, but still basically the same money. You still got a discount on the cost of the iPhone (despite what some here want to claim). AT&T just pays Apple part of your monthly service charges rather than a one time rebate on the phone.
The service plans cost the same if you buy an unlocked phone or take the rebate from the carrier. The difference is that if you provide your own phone, there is no 2 year service plan, so you can change carriers at any time ... with a service plan, there is usually upwards of a $200 early termination fee.
So, in the end, "freedom" usually costs around the price of the rebate. But signing up for a plan and doing an early terminate with the fee easily cancels that out.
I have been thinking about getting the iPhone ever since it came out and I guess I was wondering if anyone could answer whether or not it can connect to secure wireless connections that require a password. I am a college student and we have wireless throughout campus but it requires my student id and password to be typed in if it were used on a computer. Thanks for any information.
It would really depend on what kind of authentication/security they use. If you just go through a web page to log in, then probably yes, but other networks require 3rd party tools that would not (currently) work on the iPhone.
...you were stupid if you thought apple was not going to protect their intrest .....they dont make any money from TMOBILE
They aren't supposed to, thats what it means when the phone is sold unsubsidised. It's funny to watch Yankees quibble about unlocking, because you don't really have alternatives, even if you managed to unlock. Here in the old continent, we have many operators, and we also have steep competition. In this area regulating has actually spawn more market freedom, than your model that has only inflicted monopoly.
They aren't supposed to, thats what it means when the phone is sold unsubsidised. It's funny to watch Yankees quibble about unlocking, because you don't really have alternatives, even if you managed to unlock. Here in the old continent, we have many operators, and we also have steep competition. In this area regulating has actually spawn more market freedom, than your model that has only inflicted monopoly.
Yeah, but I guess your going to have to get used to a new business model as well, since Apple is busy working only on LOCKED contracts so far in the EU.
Wow -- this thread is completely not what the OP started..."Apple releases iPhone software update version 1.0.2"