Woah, when was 3G coming soon was absolutely confirmed? It all looks like rumor and speculation so far, but with more circumstantial evidence, that's all. Don't get me wrong, that would make me happy, but I don't want to be counting the chickens before they hatch, or so the expression goes.
It'll be here for either the Euro iPhone launch or the Asian one.
I'm not sure how many 3G cards are available right now, though I know there are a few. It's the phone companies that limit this with the high monthly charges. Until they go down, the interest will be low for anyone except professionals, or business people, who really need it. Just "wanting it isn't often an excuse for paying for it.
Meh, it really depends on your carrier. Sprint, for instance, has some pretty reasonable data plans, as I'm sure you're aware.
Mobile broadband in the US is still an immature market, because good 3G coverage in the US is a relatively new development (only a year or two on the EVDO side, and we're still waiting on the HSDPA/UMTS side). But new markets are the ones that grow the fastest, and more and more ppl will be wanting mobile broadband on their laptops.
At some point Apple will include 3G card slots on their entire mobile lineup (nice for MBPs too, as the regular card slot doesn't get used up), and then prolly announce that they have some sort of special data deal with ATT to provide mobile broadband to Mac users for 'cheap'.
Of course, you'll be able to put any supported card in there and go with any 3G provider you want, but I'm sure Stevie will be pushing ATT, even though their 3G coverage is the worst of the 'Big Three' US carriers.
What are the chances that 3G will also be embedded technology in a future Apple notebook?
Imtel has been working to get HSPDA and WiMAX chipsets into notebooks (like the Centrino WiFi) for some time now. They seem to be behind schedule but who knows, maybe built HSPDA will be in theit next chipset release/
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBaggins
Yep, Apple's moving quickly towards getting 3G into the iPhone, depsite what the "We don't really need 3G" crowd was originally saying. RDF, and all that.
That isn't true. The argument was that AT&T didn't have the infrasturcture to support wide-area 3G, the way the CMDA carriers do, so why bother adding a costly component that drains battery life, takes up space and benefits very few customers? AT&T seems to be adding 3G coverage at break-neck speeds... at least here in Florida.
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross
Probably very little.
Refer to first post. Depends on how strong Intel's Kung Fu really is. You are the one who got me onto that. PS: I missed out this week on a huge profit from CLWR. The Apple keynote trend clearly seems to be if 'alien technology"y is not presented then the stock will plummet that day/week.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBaggins
Well, its all water under the bridge. Judging from the reviews and reaction, Apple did wake up to the fact 3G was a higher priority for potential iPhone customers than they thought. And they appear to be taking steps to deliver it sooner, rather than later. 'tis good.
Now, if they also eliminate most of the other weaknesses, such as no voice calling, no GPS, no Flash support, no MMS, etc., I think we have a home run here.
Flash looks like a no go. What is the point of running Flash-Lite so you can drain you battery faster. Adobe needs to get Flash 9 (or 10) and create a hardware accelerator chip if the really want to keep with this new trend created by iPhone/iPod Touch.
I really hope Apple doesn't give in to MMS, but I'm an Yank and don't have the same desire to send crappy low-res images to other phones like the right-pondians do. I'd much rather see more phones with REAL mail clients that will send snapshots with one click. After all, the EU does have the 3G bandwidth to support full size images being sent quickly.
Voice calling would be nice and Notes syncing too. I expect severe feature update when Leopard in release. Both being OS X.5 there are many frameworks that need to work in conjunction here.
I think Apple planned the 3G as a later development all along, after all, they were with AT&T's poor 3G coverage. Plus, this allows for even more people to buy new iPhones. Not a bad marketing plan. New features in October; 3G in November. But will the phone be heavier and thicker to account for the larger chips and much needed battery size improvement?
I rally hope the don't add traditional GPS services. If I need to know my exact location in the jungles of the Congo I'll be using a standalone GPS system and a sat phone, not my iPhone. I just want an iPhone that uses cell tower long/lat/degrees/minutes via Google Maps to direct me to where I need to be in a settled area. Again, there is affitional cost, size of chip, radio, and battery usage.
I do see Apple as having one huge failure--at least for Apple--when tey introduced the 4GB model. If they started with a 8.16GB mode perhaps things would have been different, but thr 4GB model was certainly a poor judgment on Apple's part.
Quote:
Originally Posted by purpleshorts
I am outraged. As if dropping the price of the iPhone were not enough, now they are adding features! What next? A new model? How can Apple treat us this way? We buy products and then they build better ones! Outrageous.
: If any other tech company ever dis this *cough*all of them*cough* I'd understand the outrage, but this is unprecedented (sarcasm)
That isn't true. The argument was that AT&T didn't have the infrasturcture to support wide-area 3G, the way the CMDA carriers do, so why bother adding a costly component that drains battery life, takes up space and benefits very few customers? AT&T seems to be adding 3G coverage at break-neck speeds... at least here in Florida.
Yeah, I know... in fact, I was making that particular argument before almost anybody here. The argument was to take EDGE over 3G because EDGE, while damn slow, was nearly everywhere. ATT's 3G coverage was poor. So let's benefit the majority.
However, shortly after making that argument, I realized that 3G and EDGE was not an 'either/or' situation. Phones like the Samsung Blackjack had chipsets in them that could support both HSDPA(3G) and EDGE. So, it was possible to benefit both the majority AND the minority.
And as you yourself note, ATT is building out its 3G network quite rapidly. It's still nowhere near EVDO's 3G coverage, but it's getting almost respectable now. So it's worth supporting.
Far as 'costly' goes, 3G radio chips aren't expensive, really. Even some entry-level cell phones have 'em now.
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Flash looks like a no go. What is the point of running Flash-Lite so you can drain you battery faster. Adobe needs to get Flash 9 (or 10) and create a hardware accelerator chip if the really want to keep with this new trend created by iPhone/iPod Touch.
I have a feeling we'll be seeing Flash support sooner rather than later. For good or ill, the user's web experience is just too dependent on Flash these days to ignore it.
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I think Apple planned the 3G as a later development all along, after all, they were with AT&T's poor 3G coverage.
Yes, and I was one of the ones who had to run around reminding all the ' who needs 3G' RDFers that Jobs had indeed promised 3G on the iPhone at some date. \
The problem was that while simultaneously promising 3G, Jobs also had to downplay 3G, since he could not offer it in iPhone 1.0. Many folks here swallowed the PR kool-aid a bit too hard and mistakenly thought that no 3G was no big deal, and that it could be back-burnered for a couple of years. Obviously, no way.
Quote:
Plus, this allows for even more people to buy new iPhones. Not a bad marketing plan. New features in October; 3G in November.
LOL. Given recent events (i.e. the Great iPhone Rebellion of '07), one has to question that, and wonder just how warmly an iPhone 2.0 showing up just 4-5 months after launch will be received by some.
Don't get me wrong, I'd like to see it, and I think Apple being aggressive here is necessary to ensure their success in what is likely going to be a tough market, most especially in Europe and Asia. But it'll be interesting to see how many people cry that their 2.5G iPhones are now 'bricks' just a few months after launch.
Quote:
But will the phone be heavier and thicker to account for the larger chips and much needed battery size improvement?
We'll see. Back then, Electric Monk had the 411 on some new chips that should minimize those problems.
Quote:
I rally hope the don't add traditional GPS services. If I need to know my exact location in the jungles of the Congo I'll be using a standalone GPS system and a sat phone, not my iPhone.
Many users don't agree with you on that. On high-end phones, they expect GPS, and real-time location-based services.
Quote:
I do see Apple as having one huge failure--at least for Apple--when tey introduced the 4GB model. If they started with a 8.16GB mode perhaps things would have been different, but thr 4GB model was certainly a poor judgment on Apple's part.
It doesn't seem to have been terribly damaging for them. In fact, it's kinda nice that you can pick one up for $299 now, since it's being EOL'd (assuming that you're ok with having an iPhone 1.0).
I really hope Apple doesn't give in to MMS, but I'm an Yank and don't have the same desire to send crappy low-res images to other phones like the right-pondians do. I'd much rather see more phones with REAL mail clients that will send snapshots with one click. After all, the EU does have the 3G bandwidth to support full size images being sent quickly.
We have had this argument before and you just dont get the point!!
1 - There is no point emailing a full size photo to a phone, the small screen size makes it a waste of bandwidth, small res is perfect for a small screen display.
2 - Also the people you are sending photographs to are paying for each MB they have to download, if you keep sending them full size picture you will find they soon get pissed off with you.
3 - MMS is instant, push technology, you send a pic and it appears instantly on someone elses phone, email goes via 3rd party servers (gmail, yahoo etc..) not once but twice, emails can sometimes gets delayed and most people have to remember to check their email every 30 seconds all night in order to get pics within a reasonable time of being sent.
You are dismissing technology that was implemented precisely to overcome the limitations of email as a method of phone to phone photographs, a technology that is far more widely used on phones than email despite the fact that many many phones have supported "real email" for many years. Email and MMS have lived side by side on the same handsets for years and yet people have always used MMS to send photos and not email, does that not tell you something?
Yep, Apple's moving quickly towards getting 3G into the iPhone, depsite what the "We don't really need 3G" crowd was originally saying. RDF, and all that.
I thought the first rule of RDF was to watch carefully what Jobs was saying they weren't going to do. Like completely dissing flash based music players, then releasing flash based players like the Shuffle, or computers behind an LCD panel and then doing the iMac G5.
But, wasn't it announced somewhere that Apple planned to incorporate slots for 3G cards into their entire notebook lineup at some point? Pretty sure I remember that.
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Do we know if it's possible to connect an iPhone to a laptop?
Clearly if out of range of a WiFi area, it could be useful to connect to the internet and use a larger display with more functionality (e.g. Flash etc.)
As an owner of the iPhone I would say 3G isn't absolutely necessary for satisfactory use of the phone. But this isn't new information, Jobs said the iPhone would eventually get 3G from the beginning. 3G will be a nice addition once it does not make the phone larger or draw too much battery power.
This was misinformation from Apple and you believed it. The SE W880i proves otherwise. In fact most European and Asian 3G phones today prove it.
Do we know if it's possible to connect an iPhone to a laptop?
Clearly if out of range of a WiFi area, it could be useful to connect to the internet and use a larger display with more functionality (e.g. Flash etc.)
IIRC not via USB and there's no Bluetooth profile for using it as a modem.
LOL. Given recent events (i.e. the Great iPhone Rebellion of '07), one has to question that, and wonder just how warmly an iPhone 2.0 showing up just 4-5 months after launch will be received by some.
Don't get me wrong, I'd like to see it, and I think Apple being aggressive here is necessary to ensure their success in what is likely going to be a tough market, most especially in Europe and Asia. But it'll be interesting to see how many people cry that their 2.5G iPhones are now 'bricks' just a few months after launch.
They'll *have* to do that to keep up in Europe.
Sony Ericsson's P990i was released to the public last October. The P1i that replaces it is out now.
Nokia's N95 was released earlier this year and it's now being replaced by an upgraded 16GB model 6? months later.
You can bet the iPhone has stuck a fire under SE and Nokia's belly.
That is exactly how I too recall the general conversation. And I agree totally with TenoBell, the issue of 3G is one of functionality (+) traded off against size (-), battery usage (-), price (-), and in the US, availability of 3G outside of major metro areas (-).
All the negatives though are fairy tales.
Size - There are phones much smaller eg. SE W880i than the iPhone with 3G already. The very bad comparison used as a negative was the comparison between a Qualcomm chipset CDMA phone and the iPhone.
Battery - It's only a significant negative if the 3G aspect is being used. If it drops back the 2G then it powers down. If you've switched 3G off, as you can in many other phones, the battery lasts as long as 2G.
Price - the iPhone was already hugely expensive as it turned out.
Availability of 3G - temporary. It would be a negative that gets less and less over time to the point that not having 3G would become a bigger negative.
I think that for Apple's best long-term prospects announcing a 3G iPhone in October for a European (where Europe = France/Germany/UK) launch in October/November is the best move.
What they'd do is also talk about the other improved aspects (better camera, 16GB of storage I imagine) and then say oh and it's also coming to the States say December (with the different UMTS bands, of course). I don't know how long the FCC takes, though it's not 6 months, so I don't know when Apple has to submit it to the FCC to get it back for an early December launch.
Both are pretty viable alternatives. The main questions is whether the EDGE iPhone would piss off the Europeans enough to hurt future European iPhones.
[1] As I'm explained elsewhere a Japanese (or South Korean) iPhone would require a lot of extra software, plus at least an e-cash chip (Apple could include that as deadweight on the European iPhone, as it's small and cheap, so they could sell only two models: Europe/Japan/world, North America). As Japan uses the same UMTS band as Europe the main difference could be in the software.
Ideally a Japanese/SK iPhone would also include GPS, a really good camera, and digital TV. I don't see any of those until Revision C of the iPhone, though. The added benefit being that by Revision C of the iPhone the European digital TV market should be much better, and so those features would be used over there as well.[/QUOTE]
i agree with the above-- i think the whole reason for the price drop at this time was to prepare for the euopean rollout. europe i think will be presented with two models at different price points, edge AND 3 g that will keep the european makers off balance, since they didn't see the price cut coming. the handset makers were preparing their assult on the iphone primarily price/ 3g focus. no more especially if SJ sends them two phones, but this allows SJ to start earlier. the 3g model was always a given it was when. what's wrong with the US getting a 3g along side edge this christmas?? a new high end model, a lower price model, no need for a nanophone yet, this is all do-able from apple especially since this price cut gives new room for high end growth.... when SJ said he would be agressive it wasn't just price he was referring to IMO
[1] As I'm explained elsewhere a Japanese (or South Korean) iPhone would require a lot of extra software, plus at least an e-cash chip (
That's right about the E-cash chip and software. The Japanese use their phones to pay for almost everything, esp. those small items, from vending machines.
Meh, it really depends on your carrier. Sprint, for instance, has some pretty reasonable data plans, as I'm sure you're aware.
Yes. If I had a laptop, Sprint would let me use my Treo 700p as a modem.
Quote:
Mobile broadband in the US is still an immature market, because good 3G coverage in the US is a relatively new development (only a year or two on the EVDO side, and we're still waiting on the HSDPA/UMTS side). But new markets are the ones that grow the fastest, and more and more ppl will be wanting mobile broadband on their laptops.
We don't have the highest speeds yet, that would be true, but, otherwise, it's not bad. I've never been out of Sprints 3G network, other than in some of the more obscure areas. The US is such a large country, with so many sparsely populated areas, that it's tough to supply even cell service, in some spots, unlike in heavily populated Europe, where there are very few areas like that.
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At some point Apple will include 3G card slots on their entire mobile lineup (nice for MBPs too, as the regular card slot doesn't get used up), and then prolly announce that they have some sort of special data deal with ATT to provide mobile broadband to Mac users for 'cheap'.
I never like to predict what Apple will do, though I will give my idea of what I think they will do. I agree that it would be a good idea to do what you say.
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Of course, you'll be able to put any supported card in there and go with any 3G provider you want, but I'm sure Stevie will be pushing ATT, even though their 3G coverage is the worst of the 'Big Three' US carriers.
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Yeah, well, business is business. It will all get better with time.
Imtel has been working to get HSPDA and WiMAX chipsets into notebooks (like the Centrino WiFi) for some time now. They seem to be behind schedule but who knows, maybe built HSPDA will be in theit next chipset release/
Intel's original attempts along this line, several years ago, with the original Centrino, was a flop, because the computer manufacturers around the world didn't want it. Therefore, Intel dropped it from the chipset, and we haven't seen another initiative from them until now.
I thought the first rule of RDF was to watch carefully what Jobs was saying they weren't going to do. Like completely dissing flash based music players, then releasing flash based players like the Shuffle, or computers behind an LCD panel and then doing the iMac G5.
I for one, would like to see Flash supported. As long as you have the option to turn it off as in our computers, it wouldn't hurt.
I'd rather have more options than fewer.
The cpu's will be gaining power as the iPhones are upgraded, over time, so Flash wouldn't always hog the device.
Comments
Woah, when was 3G coming soon was absolutely confirmed? It all looks like rumor and speculation so far, but with more circumstantial evidence, that's all. Don't get me wrong, that would make me happy, but I don't want to be counting the chickens before they hatch, or so the expression goes.
It'll be here for either the Euro iPhone launch or the Asian one.
Only real question is... which one?
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I'm not sure how many 3G cards are available right now, though I know there are a few. It's the phone companies that limit this with the high monthly charges. Until they go down, the interest will be low for anyone except professionals, or business people, who really need it. Just "wanting it isn't often an excuse for paying for it.
Meh, it really depends on your carrier. Sprint, for instance, has some pretty reasonable data plans, as I'm sure you're aware.
Mobile broadband in the US is still an immature market, because good 3G coverage in the US is a relatively new development (only a year or two on the EVDO side, and we're still waiting on the HSDPA/UMTS side). But new markets are the ones that grow the fastest, and more and more ppl will be wanting mobile broadband on their laptops.
At some point Apple will include 3G card slots on their entire mobile lineup (nice for MBPs too, as the regular card slot doesn't get used up), and then prolly announce that they have some sort of special data deal with ATT to provide mobile broadband to Mac users for 'cheap'.
Of course, you'll be able to put any supported card in there and go with any 3G provider you want, but I'm sure Stevie will be pushing ATT, even though their 3G coverage is the worst of the 'Big Three' US carriers.
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What are the chances that 3G will also be embedded technology in a future Apple notebook?
Imtel has been working to get HSPDA and WiMAX chipsets into notebooks (like the Centrino WiFi) for some time now. They seem to be behind schedule but who knows, maybe built HSPDA will be in theit next chipset release/
Yep, Apple's moving quickly towards getting 3G into the iPhone, depsite what the "We don't really need 3G" crowd was originally saying. RDF, and all that.
That isn't true. The argument was that AT&T didn't have the infrasturcture to support wide-area 3G, the way the CMDA carriers do, so why bother adding a costly component that drains battery life, takes up space and benefits very few customers? AT&T seems to be adding 3G coverage at break-neck speeds... at least here in Florida.
Probably very little.
Refer to first post. Depends on how strong Intel's Kung Fu really is. You are the one who got me onto that. PS: I missed out this week on a huge profit from CLWR. The Apple keynote trend clearly seems to be if 'alien technology"y is not presented then the stock will plummet that day/week.
Well, its all water under the bridge. Judging from the reviews and reaction, Apple did wake up to the fact 3G was a higher priority for potential iPhone customers than they thought. And they appear to be taking steps to deliver it sooner, rather than later. 'tis good.
Now, if they also eliminate most of the other weaknesses, such as no voice calling, no GPS, no Flash support, no MMS, etc., I think we have a home run here.
Flash looks like a no go. What is the point of running Flash-Lite so you can drain you battery faster. Adobe needs to get Flash 9 (or 10) and create a hardware accelerator chip if the really want to keep with this new trend created by iPhone/iPod Touch.
I really hope Apple doesn't give in to MMS, but I'm an Yank and don't have the same desire to send crappy low-res images to other phones like the right-pondians do. I'd much rather see more phones with REAL mail clients that will send snapshots with one click. After all, the EU does have the 3G bandwidth to support full size images being sent quickly.
Voice calling would be nice and Notes syncing too. I expect severe feature update when Leopard in release. Both being OS X.5 there are many frameworks that need to work in conjunction here.
I think Apple planned the 3G as a later development all along, after all, they were with AT&T's poor 3G coverage. Plus, this allows for even more people to buy new iPhones. Not a bad marketing plan. New features in October; 3G in November. But will the phone be heavier and thicker to account for the larger chips and much needed battery size improvement?
I rally hope the don't add traditional GPS services. If I need to know my exact location in the jungles of the Congo I'll be using a standalone GPS system and a sat phone, not my iPhone. I just want an iPhone that uses cell tower long/lat/degrees/minutes via Google Maps to direct me to where I need to be in a settled area. Again, there is affitional cost, size of chip, radio, and battery usage.
I do see Apple as having one huge failure--at least for Apple--when tey introduced the 4GB model. If they started with a 8.16GB mode perhaps things would have been different, but thr 4GB model was certainly a poor judgment on Apple's part.
I am outraged. As if dropping the price of the iPhone were not enough, now they are adding features! What next? A new model? How can Apple treat us this way? We buy products and then they build better ones! Outrageous.
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That isn't true. The argument was that AT&T didn't have the infrasturcture to support wide-area 3G, the way the CMDA carriers do, so why bother adding a costly component that drains battery life, takes up space and benefits very few customers? AT&T seems to be adding 3G coverage at break-neck speeds... at least here in Florida.
Yeah, I know... in fact, I was making that particular argument before almost anybody here. The argument was to take EDGE over 3G because EDGE, while damn slow, was nearly everywhere. ATT's 3G coverage was poor. So let's benefit the majority.
However, shortly after making that argument, I realized that 3G and EDGE was not an 'either/or' situation. Phones like the Samsung Blackjack had chipsets in them that could support both HSDPA(3G) and EDGE. So, it was possible to benefit both the majority AND the minority.
And as you yourself note, ATT is building out its 3G network quite rapidly. It's still nowhere near EVDO's 3G coverage, but it's getting almost respectable now. So it's worth supporting.
Far as 'costly' goes, 3G radio chips aren't expensive, really. Even some entry-level cell phones have 'em now.
Flash looks like a no go. What is the point of running Flash-Lite so you can drain you battery faster. Adobe needs to get Flash 9 (or 10) and create a hardware accelerator chip if the really want to keep with this new trend created by iPhone/iPod Touch.
I have a feeling we'll be seeing Flash support sooner rather than later. For good or ill, the user's web experience is just too dependent on Flash these days to ignore it.
I think Apple planned the 3G as a later development all along, after all, they were with AT&T's poor 3G coverage.
Yes, and I was one of the ones who had to run around reminding all the ' who needs 3G' RDFers that Jobs had indeed promised 3G on the iPhone at some date.
The problem was that while simultaneously promising 3G, Jobs also had to downplay 3G, since he could not offer it in iPhone 1.0. Many folks here swallowed the PR kool-aid a bit too hard and mistakenly thought that no 3G was no big deal, and that it could be back-burnered for a couple of years. Obviously, no way.
Plus, this allows for even more people to buy new iPhones. Not a bad marketing plan. New features in October; 3G in November.
LOL. Given recent events (i.e. the Great iPhone Rebellion of '07), one has to question that, and wonder just how warmly an iPhone 2.0 showing up just 4-5 months after launch will be received by some.
Don't get me wrong, I'd like to see it, and I think Apple being aggressive here is necessary to ensure their success in what is likely going to be a tough market, most especially in Europe and Asia. But it'll be interesting to see how many people cry that their 2.5G iPhones are now 'bricks' just a few months after launch.
But will the phone be heavier and thicker to account for the larger chips and much needed battery size improvement?
We'll see. Back then, Electric Monk had the 411 on some new chips that should minimize those problems.
I rally hope the don't add traditional GPS services. If I need to know my exact location in the jungles of the Congo I'll be using a standalone GPS system and a sat phone, not my iPhone.
Many users don't agree with you on that. On high-end phones, they expect GPS, and real-time location-based services.
I do see Apple as having one huge failure--at least for Apple--when tey introduced the 4GB model. If they started with a 8.16GB mode perhaps things would have been different, but thr 4GB model was certainly a poor judgment on Apple's part.
It doesn't seem to have been terribly damaging for them. In fact, it's kinda nice that you can pick one up for $299 now, since it's being EOL'd (assuming that you're ok with having an iPhone 1.0).
.
Honestly I could live with an iPhone that's twice as thick if that is what you need to have a battery that can handle 3G.
So I don't understand how AT&T's system works. If you are in an area that does not have 3G what happens? Does the phone then "bump" down to 2.5 or 2G?
Honestly I could live with an iPhone that's twice as thick if that is what you need to have a battery that can handle 3G.
Don't know about AT&T but yes on UK networks if you are out of 3G coverage yes the same radio will use GPRS instead.
I really hope Apple doesn't give in to MMS, but I'm an Yank and don't have the same desire to send crappy low-res images to other phones like the right-pondians do. I'd much rather see more phones with REAL mail clients that will send snapshots with one click. After all, the EU does have the 3G bandwidth to support full size images being sent quickly.
We have had this argument before and you just dont get the point!!
1 - There is no point emailing a full size photo to a phone, the small screen size makes it a waste of bandwidth, small res is perfect for a small screen display.
2 - Also the people you are sending photographs to are paying for each MB they have to download, if you keep sending them full size picture you will find they soon get pissed off with you.
3 - MMS is instant, push technology, you send a pic and it appears instantly on someone elses phone, email goes via 3rd party servers (gmail, yahoo etc..) not once but twice, emails can sometimes gets delayed and most people have to remember to check their email every 30 seconds all night in order to get pics within a reasonable time of being sent.
You are dismissing technology that was implemented precisely to overcome the limitations of email as a method of phone to phone photographs, a technology that is far more widely used on phones than email despite the fact that many many phones have supported "real email" for many years. Email and MMS have lived side by side on the same handsets for years and yet people have always used MMS to send photos and not email, does that not tell you something?
Yep, Apple's moving quickly towards getting 3G into the iPhone, depsite what the "We don't really need 3G" crowd was originally saying. RDF, and all that.
I thought the first rule of RDF was to watch carefully what Jobs was saying they weren't going to do. Like completely dissing flash based music players, then releasing flash based players like the Shuffle, or computers behind an LCD panel and then doing the iMac G5.
Embedded (as in included)? You're right, no.
But, wasn't it announced somewhere that Apple planned to incorporate slots for 3G cards into their entire notebook lineup at some point? Pretty sure I remember that.
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Do we know if it's possible to connect an iPhone to a laptop?
Clearly if out of range of a WiFi area, it could be useful to connect to the internet and use a larger display with more functionality (e.g. Flash etc.)
As an owner of the iPhone I would say 3G isn't absolutely necessary for satisfactory use of the phone. But this isn't new information, Jobs said the iPhone would eventually get 3G from the beginning. 3G will be a nice addition once it does not make the phone larger or draw too much battery power.
This was misinformation from Apple and you believed it. The SE W880i proves otherwise. In fact most European and Asian 3G phones today prove it.
Do we know if it's possible to connect an iPhone to a laptop?
Clearly if out of range of a WiFi area, it could be useful to connect to the internet and use a larger display with more functionality (e.g. Flash etc.)
IIRC not via USB and there's no Bluetooth profile for using it as a modem.
LOL. Given recent events (i.e. the Great iPhone Rebellion of '07), one has to question that, and wonder just how warmly an iPhone 2.0 showing up just 4-5 months after launch will be received by some.
Don't get me wrong, I'd like to see it, and I think Apple being aggressive here is necessary to ensure their success in what is likely going to be a tough market, most especially in Europe and Asia. But it'll be interesting to see how many people cry that their 2.5G iPhones are now 'bricks' just a few months after launch.
They'll *have* to do that to keep up in Europe.
Sony Ericsson's P990i was released to the public last October. The P1i that replaces it is out now.
Nokia's N95 was released earlier this year and it's now being replaced by an upgraded 16GB model 6? months later.
You can bet the iPhone has stuck a fire under SE and Nokia's belly.
IIRC not via USB and there's no Bluetooth profile for using it as a modem.
Fixing this could be somewhat attractive then!
That is exactly how I too recall the general conversation. And I agree totally with TenoBell, the issue of 3G is one of functionality (+) traded off against size (-), battery usage (-), price (-), and in the US, availability of 3G outside of major metro areas (-).
All the negatives though are fairy tales.
Size - There are phones much smaller eg. SE W880i than the iPhone with 3G already. The very bad comparison used as a negative was the comparison between a Qualcomm chipset CDMA phone and the iPhone.
Battery - It's only a significant negative if the 3G aspect is being used. If it drops back the 2G then it powers down. If you've switched 3G off, as you can in many other phones, the battery lasts as long as 2G.
Price - the iPhone was already hugely expensive as it turned out.
Availability of 3G - temporary. It would be a negative that gets less and less over time to the point that not having 3G would become a bigger negative.
What they'd do is also talk about the other improved aspects (better camera, 16GB of storage I imagine) and then say oh and it's also coming to the States say December (with the different UMTS bands, of course). I don't know how long the FCC takes, though it's not 6 months, so I don't know when Apple has to submit it to the FCC to get it back for an early December launch.
Both are pretty viable alternatives. The main questions is whether the EDGE iPhone would piss off the Europeans enough to hurt future European iPhones.
[1] As I'm explained elsewhere a Japanese (or South Korean) iPhone would require a lot of extra software, plus at least an e-cash chip (Apple could include that as deadweight on the European iPhone, as it's small and cheap, so they could sell only two models: Europe/Japan/world, North America). As Japan uses the same UMTS band as Europe the main difference could be in the software.
Ideally a Japanese/SK iPhone would also include GPS, a really good camera, and digital TV. I don't see any of those until Revision C of the iPhone, though. The added benefit being that by Revision C of the iPhone the European digital TV market should be much better, and so those features would be used over there as well.[/QUOTE]
i agree with the above-- i think the whole reason for the price drop at this time was to prepare for the euopean rollout. europe i think will be presented with two models at different price points, edge AND 3 g that will keep the european makers off balance, since they didn't see the price cut coming. the handset makers were preparing their assult on the iphone primarily price/ 3g focus. no more especially if SJ sends them two phones, but this allows SJ to start earlier. the 3g model was always a given it was when. what's wrong with the US getting a 3g along side edge this christmas?? a new high end model, a lower price model, no need for a nanophone yet, this is all do-able from apple especially since this price cut gives new room for high end growth.... when SJ said he would be agressive it wasn't just price he was referring to IMO
[1] As I'm explained elsewhere a Japanese (or South Korean) iPhone would require a lot of extra software, plus at least an e-cash chip (
That's right about the E-cash chip and software. The Japanese use their phones to pay for almost everything, esp. those small items, from vending machines.
Meh, it really depends on your carrier. Sprint, for instance, has some pretty reasonable data plans, as I'm sure you're aware.
Yes. If I had a laptop, Sprint would let me use my Treo 700p as a modem.
Mobile broadband in the US is still an immature market, because good 3G coverage in the US is a relatively new development (only a year or two on the EVDO side, and we're still waiting on the HSDPA/UMTS side). But new markets are the ones that grow the fastest, and more and more ppl will be wanting mobile broadband on their laptops.
We don't have the highest speeds yet, that would be true, but, otherwise, it's not bad. I've never been out of Sprints 3G network, other than in some of the more obscure areas. The US is such a large country, with so many sparsely populated areas, that it's tough to supply even cell service, in some spots, unlike in heavily populated Europe, where there are very few areas like that.
At some point Apple will include 3G card slots on their entire mobile lineup (nice for MBPs too, as the regular card slot doesn't get used up), and then prolly announce that they have some sort of special data deal with ATT to provide mobile broadband to Mac users for 'cheap'.
I never like to predict what Apple will do, though I will give my idea of what I think they will do. I agree that it would be a good idea to do what you say.
Of course, you'll be able to put any supported card in there and go with any 3G provider you want, but I'm sure Stevie will be pushing ATT, even though their 3G coverage is the worst of the 'Big Three' US carriers.
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Yeah, well, business is business. It will all get better with time.
Imtel has been working to get HSPDA and WiMAX chipsets into notebooks (like the Centrino WiFi) for some time now. They seem to be behind schedule but who knows, maybe built HSPDA will be in theit next chipset release/
Intel's original attempts along this line, several years ago, with the original Centrino, was a flop, because the computer manufacturers around the world didn't want it. Therefore, Intel dropped it from the chipset, and we haven't seen another initiative from them until now.
Don't know about AT&T but yes on UK networks if you are out of 3G coverage yes the same radio will use GPRS instead.
It works that way with Sprint as well.
I thought the first rule of RDF was to watch carefully what Jobs was saying they weren't going to do. Like completely dissing flash based music players, then releasing flash based players like the Shuffle, or computers behind an LCD panel and then doing the iMac G5.
I for one, would like to see Flash supported. As long as you have the option to turn it off as in our computers, it wouldn't hurt.
I'd rather have more options than fewer.
The cpu's will be gaining power as the iPhones are upgraded, over time, so Flash wouldn't always hog the device.