New Zunes likely to cannibalize everything but iPod - analyst

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 65
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Eduardo View Post


    Please, Apple is also trying to do the same thing. Get people to buy iPods and iPhones in the hope they buy into the Mac-ecosystem.



    But you can use an ipod or iphone on a PC or a Mac...

    But when people get a taste of Mac's "taste"... they just might switch.

    Get a taste of Microsoft's "taste" and you'll need mouthwash. That's why they try to MAKE you stay.
  • Reply 22 of 65
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,660member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Eduardo View Post


    Please, Apple is also trying to do the same thing. Get people to buy iPods and iPhones in the hope they buy into the Mac-ecosystem.



    There's quite a bit of difference between offering explicit cross platform support while "hop(ing) they buy into the Mac ecosystem" and not offering any Mac support at all.
  • Reply 23 of 65
    Some people here are giving the Zune FAAAR to much credit. It fucking FLOPPED! 1 million in a year - that's including the Christmas season. Forget the hardware specs - the machines don't work, syncing problems, Support is virtually non-existant, and the name "Zune" has been dragged through the mud and is at the wrong end of more jokes than I can count. It's over, it's done. The only reason it gets all this attention is because people love watching Microsoft make asses of themselves.
  • Reply 24 of 65
    microsoft should throw in the towel their day has past..except the gaming platform...their products suck monkey balls..they can't even seem to copy good anymore...
  • Reply 25 of 65
    tbagginstbaggins Posts: 2,306member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post


    That is what SONY said with the XBOX. Last time I check the XBOX 360 crushed the PS3.



    Might wanna check again. The Wii is the one who's actually doing the crushing in sales, of both the PS3 AND the Xbox360. \



    Additionally, Sony basically shot themselves in the face with a lot of poor decisions. Apple is unlikely to do same.



    Finally, be aware of the fact that the Xbox franchise only sells decently in the US. In Europe, they don't do as well, and in Japan, you can't hardly even give the things away:



    http://www.joystiq.com/2006/12/12/ps...japan-already/



    .
  • Reply 26 of 65
    irelandireland Posts: 17,684member
    The Zune 2 is a competitor, the iPod is a trendsetter, and 'more importantly' it's part of modern culture. You can't simply take that away unless your product is leaps and bounds better than the iPod. Oh, and despite what's on the spec sheet, looks are important. iPods are simply better in almost every way.
  • Reply 27 of 65
    tbagginstbaggins Posts: 2,306member
    I guess the Zune fans are just gonna have to learn the same way they did last time... by seeing the sales figures. \



    Its not gonna be pretty when they realize sometime after the holidays that their vaunted offensive did little to anyone 'cept MS's former partners.



    Speaking of which, will companies be more wary of partnering with MS, after having seen them utterly backstab the likes of Creative, iRiver, SanDisk, etc.?



    .
  • Reply 28 of 65
    icfireballicfireball Posts: 2,594member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RidleyGriff View Post


    Precisely. Microsoft should be trying to beat Apple on the markets they have yet to overtake (i.e., the phone space -- may be too late here already -- and the living room with the 360 and Media Center).



    At best, these Zunes are "just as good" as iPods. However, if they continue to knock out such utterly baffling "features" as "wireless syncing -- if you are plugged into the wall or docked", they will continue to be looked upon as poor copies, with a distinct lack of iPod ease.



    Microsoft isn't interested in producing their own phone, IMO. They want to push Windows OS for mobile devices -- just like Microsoft doesn't sell their own PCs.
  • Reply 29 of 65
    icfireballicfireball Posts: 2,594member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by CosmoNut View Post


    I still maintain that if Microsoft was able to sell Zunes for $50 less than their Apple counterparts that this game would be much more interesting.



    I see Joe Shmoe Dad going out to Best Buy this holiday season and asking the sales person which is better, iPod or Zune. Upon hearing, "They're about the same, really," Dad would buy a Zune over an iPod if Zune was $50 less. Now, Dad will just pick up an iPod because that's what little Cindy asked for and they cost the same as a Zune.



    Point Apple.



    This could never happen. Apple's iPod volume is so much bigger than Microsoft's so the cost of parts and manufacturing per iPod is less, so at the same price point, Apple as a bigger profit margin. If Microsoft were to become truly aggressive with their pricing, Apple COULD easily cut their prices. That is not to say they WOULD, but the most certainly COULD in a heartbeat.



    The main problem with the Zune is marketing. The only people who want a Zune over an iPod are computer nerds who would actually spend the time to stack 'em up against each other. And even when you stack them up, they are pretty comparable in Hardware, pretty comparable in features (although Zune does have a few nice features iPod's don't), but the iPod is superior in third-party devices and integration, software/computer interface, user device interface, and design.
  • Reply 30 of 65
    mcdavemcdave Posts: 1,200member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    The Zune 2 is a competitor, the iPod is a trendsetter, and 'more importantly' it's part of modern culture. You can't simply take that away unless your product is leaps and bounds better than the iPod. Oh, and despite what's on the spec sheet, looks are important. iPods are simply better in almost every way.



    Zune 2 isn't the 'competitor' more the 'pretender'



    In fact most MS products are 'pretenders' (there must be one that isn't)



    They placate people who won't see past Microsoft and the only reason it will sell is because of AmazonMP3. Did anyone else notice that while we were looking at AmazonMP3 as an iTunes competitor it's also a real nail in the coffin for Plays4sure stores - good to get people off MS DRM lock-in not that the need much convincing.



    Didn't mean to go off topic but isn't forcing one retailer (iTunes) to package a product less-marketably while allowing another (Amazon) free reign illegal in the fair-trading-practice world we live in?



    McD
  • Reply 31 of 65
    mcdavemcdave Posts: 1,200member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by icfireball View Post


    Microsoft isn't interested in producing their own phone, IMO. They want to push Windows OS for mobile devices -- just like Microsoft doesn't sell their own PCs.



    But d'you think that people will get it?... Just as iPhone is to Windows-based smartphones and iPod is to Windows Media-based Players so Mac is to Windows-based computers?



    McD
  • Reply 32 of 65
    In the non-Japanese Asian market, Apple (and to a far lesser degree Microsoft) are trendy yet small niche players in the MP3 player market .... funny considering the devices themselves are assembled in Taiwan / Mainland China.



    Price point competitiveness here is just far lower here I guess ... odd though 'cus you see tons of fancy pricey phones here ... but far less pricey MP3 players. The contrast between a New York and Taipei subway ride is striking in the ratio of white iPod earbuds you see.
  • Reply 33 of 65
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TBaggins View Post


    Might wanna check again. The Wii is the one who's actually doing the crushing in sales, of both the PS3 AND the Xbox360. \



    Additionally, Sony basically shot themselves in the face with a lot of poor decisions. Apple is unlikely to do same.



    Finally, be aware of the fact that the Xbox franchise only sells decently in the US. In Europe, they don't do as well, and in Japan, you can't hardly even give the things away:



    http://www.joystiq.com/2006/12/12/ps...japan-already/



    .





    The Wii come in at a totally different price point for a different market compared to the PS3 and Xbox.



    The iPod will continue to dominate the mp3 market until MS comes up with an interface for windows that is easier to use than iTunes or form some reason their player has a feature that catches on.



    The simple fact is people don't put that much though into this whole mp3 player deal, iPods are out there so its easy to get one. Its not that fact that is so much better its just been around alot longer.



    I love how the faithful make such a big deal about iPod market shares but when you bring up the fact that Apple has failed to gain market share on any of their other products all of a sudden market share doesn't matter, people start to pull out the old bmw vs ford BS.



    You're talking about a 200.00 product these days that not something people put alot of though into.
  • Reply 34 of 65
    thebeatthebeat Posts: 113member
    wow, Zune to cannibalize everything but Ipods? Are you kidding me.. ZUNE can definitely eat iPod also. I don't see why you stick up for Apple so much. It will eat iPods, and you definitely have no proof that it can't. Learn to discriminate apple please
  • Reply 35 of 65
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,660member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post


    The Wii come in at a totally different price point for a different market compared to the PS3 and Xbox.



    The iPod will continue to dominate the mp3 market until MS comes up with an interface for windows that is easier to use than iTunes or form some reason their player has a feature that catches on.



    The simple fact is people don't put that much though into this whole mp3 player deal, iPods are out there so its easy to get one. Its not that fact that is so much better its just been around alot longer.



    I love how the faithful make such a big deal about iPod market shares but when you bring up the fact that Apple has failed to gain market share on any of their other products all of a sudden market share doesn't matter, people start to pull out the old bmw vs ford BS.



    You're talking about a 200.00 product these days that not something people put alot of though into.



    It's not that confusing: Apple can be and clearly is a profitable, thriving company, even when its total world market share is low (so in that sense "market share doesn't matter"), and having a dominate position in the MP3 player and music download business is great for the platform (in which case "market share matters").



    Selling 10 times as many computers would be great for the platform as well, but unlikely to happen, given the entrenched incumbancy of Windows. Selling lots and lots of iPhones and iPods is happening, and gives Apple a playing field without the historical baggage of Windows hegemony, which is great for mindshare and profits.



    See? Not mutually exclusive at all.
  • Reply 36 of 65
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,660member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thebeat View Post


    wow, Zune to cannibalize everything but Ipods? Are you kidding me.. ZUNE can definitely eat iPod also. I don't see why you stick up for Apple so much. It will eat iPods, and you definitely have no proof that it can't. Learn to discriminate apple please



    I'm assuming that just as you were bringing that post home, with a final few well chosen words, you were struck down by sudden illness-- which is why it makes no sense.
  • Reply 37 of 65
    tbagginstbaggins Posts: 2,306member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post


    The Wii come in at a totally different price point for a different market compared to the PS3 and Xbox.



    Not really. Wii is $249, Xbox Core is $279.



    Quote:

    The iPod will continue to dominate the mp3 market until MS comes up with an interface for windows that is easier to use than iTunes or form some reason their player has a feature that catches on.



    Good luck with that. MS's history is not one of being better than Apple at ease-of-use.



    Quote:

    The simple fact is people don't put that much though into this whole mp3 player deal, iPods are out there so its easy to get one. Its not that fact that is so much better its just been around alot longer.



    It's both, really. They've been out longer AND they're better. MS is playing catch-up here, but whose fault is that?



    Quote:

    I love how the faithful make such a big deal about iPod market shares but when you bring up the fact that Apple has failed to gain market share on any of their other products all of a sudden market share doesn't matter, people start to pull out the old bmw vs ford BS.



    Actually, Macs have been gaining in marketshare over the past several quarters. I think it'll be a very long time before it's a big deal, though.
  • Reply 38 of 65
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox View Post


    It's not that confusing: Apple can be and clearly is a profitable, thriving company, even when its total world market share is low (so in that sense "market share doesn't matter"), and having a dominate position in the MP3 player and music download business is great for the platform (in which case "market share matters").



    Selling 10 times as many computers would be great for the platform as well, but unlikely to happen, given the entrenched incumbancy of Windows. Selling lots and lots of iPhones and iPods is happening, and gives Apple a playing field without the historical baggage of Windows hegemony, which is great for mindshare and profits.



    See? Not mutually exclusive at all.





    No its a case where Apple fans discount market share when its in favor of another company but hold on to market share stats when it comes to the iPod because its the badge of honor for Apple. Lets call a spade a spade.
  • Reply 39 of 65
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TBaggins View Post


    Not really. Wii is $249, Xbox Core is $279.





    Good luck with that. MS's history is not one of being better than Apple at ease-of-use.





    It's both, really. They've been out longer AND they're better. MS is playing catch-up here, but whose fault is that?





    Actually, Macs have been gaining in marketshare over the past several quarters. I think it'll be a very long time before it's a big deal, though.





    Can you actually find a Xbox 360 core system? By the time you get done buying everything you need to actually use a core system its going to cost you 400.00 anyways.



    Easy of use? You know really I use both platforms and lets be honest there isn't any great easy of use with Os X compared to Windows. If you use the OS you get use to how it work its not rocket science.



    Apple has driver issues as does Windows, Apple has hardware issues with all their products to some degree, Safari crashes all the time, people talk about MS updates, Apple has a ton of bug fixes also.



    Security its simple its just not worth the effort to write viruses for 5% of the user population its not that Os X is that secure its a myth.



    I have never understood the its so easy and it just work because its total bullshit.



    What is so complicated about media player compared to itunes?



    For people that have never used one or the other you might be able to sell that easy of use but for someone that has used both platforms for 20+ years it just total bullshit. Both have advantages both have disadvantages.



    The difference with using Windows is at least you have options unlike using Apple or any of its products. Have a dirver issue your screwed unlike with Windows you can download different drivers if theres an issue one with one, with Apple you have to wait for them to fix the issue.



    Apple makes it sound like you don't need drivers for hardware that is total BS its just the drivers to some degree like windows are built into the OS. However its still best to go and grab the lastest drivers from the vendor. How is that easier?



    Talk about iPods my nano hangs all the time where it has to be reset.



    When tiger was first released it has so many issues it was insane.



    You guys either are trying to fool someone or you live in a dream world.



    We won't even get into options regarding 3rd party software. I like using apple products but lets stay in reality.
  • Reply 40 of 65
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post


    I like using apple products but lets stay in reality.



    Do you really? Go get one of those pea green Zunes. You'll be much happier since they won't have all those "dirver" issues that the iPods have.
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