Well, Mac OS X has had X11 apps for a while, the new thing is that Apple is providing its own X Server which bodes well for better integration and general support from Apple.
Many assumed that Apple would distance itself from X11 in order to force ports. I think Apple has been pleasantly surprised by the uptake by, and commitment from, the unix community and want's to give them the ability to run remote apps even if it makes 'native' ports slightly less likely.
So to answer your question, the difference is the same as it has always been: Mac OS X is a slightly odd unix that makes up for its slight idiosyncracies by being an absolute corker of a desktop/office/multimedia machine.
Linux's key feature has always been, and always will be, its licence. The many benefits are too numerous to list so I'll stick to three key effects (which are also causes): it is cheap, it is a commodity, and it is ubiquitous.
It is important to note that these OS's are helping each other much more than they are competing, and future success depends on co-operating more with those that you compete with in order to leave behind those that don't co-operate. It's all about what people are calling co-opetition.
So to answer your question, the difference is the same as it has always been: Mac OS X is a slightly odd unix that makes up for its slight idiosyncracies by being an absolute corker of a desktop/office/multimedia machine.
I feel compelled to point out that Linux is also a "slightly odd" UNIX with its own set of idiosyncracies. That's why IBM expects to spend several years getting a common interface for their administration tools to bridge the differences between AIX (a far more standard UNIX distro) and Linux.
I'm sure someone will pop in and point out that all UNIXen are slightly odd, but that's another kettle of fish.
I use Gimp, Gaim, sodipodi, and once I get it to work right, 3Dpong. I don't use them very often since I have OS X equivalents of all... well, not 3D Pong, but I have http://www.a-stupid.co.uk/cgi-bin/curveball.php
Dude, 3d Pong's the bomb. I love 80's style wireframe 3d, in that hideous, yet 80's hi-tek, green.
Actually, after playing both extensively, I've decided Armagetron is the radder Tron lightcycle game (mostly for gameplay reasons). I think it is being ported to OSX
If you're a newbie and you don't bother it then it won't bother you.
Someone installing other X servers or doing whatever unix stuff may notice it but it generally doesn't make a difference to have it there and not use it.
This is good as there is no uninstaller that I am aware of and the installer puts some files into the unix underbelly of Mac OS X.
I just use Xmaple and occasionally Xemacs (what a POS text editor...). Wish I could get pro/engineer working through one of the school's solaris servers but that's not supported.
Installing x11 is as easy as double clicking on an installer and accepting a few default answers.
I wish! Twice I've attempted to install x11 gave up on both occasions.
No, its not impossible, but I'd bet that less than 5% of users are capable of installing X11 and then running an app. There is so much conflicting and incomplete information on these windowing systems that users must be damn near *nix experts in order to run apps on X11. The installation steps aren't hard, but figuring out what the steps are, without making a single mistake the first time, is quite difficult. An unsuccessful installation is likely to make further installation effort fruitless without first knowing how to 'uninstall'.
Don't get me wrong; X11 is a great addition to OS X. It opens up a whole new library of free (and commercial) software for Mac users.
I just hope that apple is still streamlining the installation process. If X11 installation was actually simple, users wouldn't know (or even need to know) that an app was X11 dependent. Currently, the installation process is complicated enough that it would be a disservice to list the apps on verstiontracker and MacUpdate. However, java apps don't need to be distinguished from 'native' apps because the installation process is exactly the same. This is what we should be shooting for with regard to X window apps.
Hmmm. I was trying to write this such to not piss off all the X11 users but may have failed. Sorry! I really do like the idea of Mac OS X being able to seamlessly run X11 software. This post is just an attempt to raise awareness that their is much room for improvement in the installation process. Without improvement, only forum mongers and us geeks will be able to successfully run X11 apps.
In conclusion: I'm running no X11 apps.
It just isn't worth my time to do the google research on how to un-bork my installation. It would be more economical for me to work at my regular job and then buy a 'commercial' version of openoffice. shhhh
The installation steps aren't hard, but figuring out what the steps are, without making a single mistake the first time, is quite difficult. An unsuccessful installation is likely to make further installation effort fruitless without first knowing how to 'uninstall'.
Installing and running X11 apps isn't the most obvious thing (though it is getting better and will continue to do so) but installing Apple's X Server *is* simple and borking your system while doing so would take a near superhuman effort.
If you had tried installing other X Servers then I could understand but Apple's really is a double-click affair and if it doesn't work then another double-click should sort it.
Comments
Many assumed that Apple would distance itself from X11 in order to force ports. I think Apple has been pleasantly surprised by the uptake by, and commitment from, the unix community and want's to give them the ability to run remote apps even if it makes 'native' ports slightly less likely.
So to answer your question, the difference is the same as it has always been: Mac OS X is a slightly odd unix that makes up for its slight idiosyncracies by being an absolute corker of a desktop/office/multimedia machine.
Linux's key feature has always been, and always will be, its licence. The many benefits are too numerous to list so I'll stick to three key effects (which are also causes): it is cheap, it is a commodity, and it is ubiquitous.
It is important to note that these OS's are helping each other much more than they are competing, and future success depends on co-operating more with those that you compete with in order to leave behind those that don't co-operate. It's all about what people are calling co-opetition.
Originally posted by stupider...likeafox
So to answer your question, the difference is the same as it has always been: Mac OS X is a slightly odd unix that makes up for its slight idiosyncracies by being an absolute corker of a desktop/office/multimedia machine.
I feel compelled to point out that Linux is also a "slightly odd" UNIX with its own set of idiosyncracies. That's why IBM expects to spend several years getting a common interface for their administration tools to bridge the differences between AIX (a far more standard UNIX distro) and Linux.
I'm sure someone will pop in and point out that all UNIXen are slightly odd, but that's another kettle of fish.
Actually, after playing both extensively, I've decided Armagetron is the radder Tron lightcycle game (mostly for gameplay reasons). I think it is being ported to OSX
After installing X11 is it ok to just have it sitting around, or can you delete all remnants of it if you wish and banish it to the bin.
Someone installing other X servers or doing whatever unix stuff may notice it but it generally doesn't make a difference to have it there and not use it.
This is good as there is no uninstaller that I am aware of and the installer puts some files into the unix underbelly of Mac OS X.
http://primates.ximian.com/~aaron/doing/evo-osx.html
Originally posted by stupider...likeafox
Installing x11 is as easy as double clicking on an installer and accepting a few default answers.
I wish! Twice I've attempted to install x11 gave up on both occasions.
No, its not impossible, but I'd bet that less than 5% of users are capable of installing X11 and then running an app. There is so much conflicting and incomplete information on these windowing systems that users must be damn near *nix experts in order to run apps on X11. The installation steps aren't hard, but figuring out what the steps are, without making a single mistake the first time, is quite difficult. An unsuccessful installation is likely to make further installation effort fruitless without first knowing how to 'uninstall'.
Don't get me wrong; X11 is a great addition to OS X. It opens up a whole new library of free (and commercial) software for Mac users.
I just hope that apple is still streamlining the installation process. If X11 installation was actually simple, users wouldn't know (or even need to know) that an app was X11 dependent. Currently, the installation process is complicated enough that it would be a disservice to list the apps on verstiontracker and MacUpdate. However, java apps don't need to be distinguished from 'native' apps because the installation process is exactly the same. This is what we should be shooting for with regard to X window apps.
Hmmm. I was trying to write this such to not piss off all the X11 users but may have failed. Sorry! I really do like the idea of Mac OS X being able to seamlessly run X11 software. This post is just an attempt to raise awareness that their is much room for improvement in the installation process. Without improvement, only forum mongers and us geeks will be able to successfully run X11 apps.
In conclusion: I'm running no X11 apps.
It just isn't worth my time to do the google research on how to un-bork my installation. It would be more economical for me to work at my regular job and then buy a 'commercial' version of openoffice. shhhh
Originally posted by jxfreak
Will someone please post pictures of X11 apps running in OS X? I would like to see Gnome and KDE apps please. Would Evolution ever be ported by Fink?
Two Gnome apps
Gnometris
xBill
Gimp Screen Shot
Originally posted by dfiler
The installation steps aren't hard, but figuring out what the steps are, without making a single mistake the first time, is quite difficult. An unsuccessful installation is likely to make further installation effort fruitless without first knowing how to 'uninstall'.
Installing and running X11 apps isn't the most obvious thing (though it is getting better and will continue to do so) but installing Apple's X Server *is* simple and borking your system while doing so would take a near superhuman effort.
If you had tried installing other X Servers then I could understand but Apple's really is a double-click affair and if it doesn't work then another double-click should sort it.
Where exactly do you think you've went wrong?