Needham says Apple letting iPod touch cannibalize iPhone sales

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 52
    gqbgqb Posts: 1,934member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    While this is true, it's even truer* that he iPhone has cannibalized nearly 4M iPod sales. I now have one device where before I had two, and I don't know anyone who hasn't done this.





    * This isn't fact, but an opinion based on my observation.



    Given the BS kerfluffle that's been going on for the past week about iPod sales being down, and the resulting hit that's taken on stock, your point is worth noting. None of the figures I saw recognized that iPhone ARE also iPods, and should have been in some way added onto iPod sales numbers.
  • Reply 22 of 52
    gqbgqb Posts: 1,934member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Booga View Post


    I'm not sure about this. EDGE is much slower than wi-fi, and the Touch is not exactly a speed demon as it is.



    I believe he was proposing EDGE as the stop-gap for when you're out of wi-fi range, not as a replacement for wi-fi.
  • Reply 23 of 52
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jouster View Post


    When you had two devices, only one of them was sold to you by Apple. That's still the case. Where's the loss?



    There is no loss of sale to Apple, but they are no longer selling me an item that is classified as an iPod. Therefore, the iPhone is cannibalizing iPod sales. Where did I mention that Apple is losing money?
  • Reply 24 of 52
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by GQB View Post


    Given the BS kerfluffle that's been going on for the past week about iPod sales being down, and the resulting hit that's taken on stock, your point is worth noting. None of the figures I saw recognized that iPhone ARE also iPods, and should have been in some way added onto iPod sales numbers.



    For Apple's financial reports, it shouldn't be grouped together, but any analyst looking at unit sales should be grouping most of the iPhone sales in. I'm surprised that I haven't even read one analyst make mention of it.
  • Reply 25 of 52
    boogabooga Posts: 1,079member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by GQB View Post


    Given the BS kerfluffle that's been going on for the past week about iPod sales being down, and the resulting hit that's taken on stock, your point is worth noting. None of the figures I saw recognized that iPhone ARE also iPods, and should have been in some way added onto iPod sales numbers.



    That last point is an interesting one. I'd be more likely to add the iPhone and the Touch to the Mac's sales figures, myself. The OSes are closer, the utility is closer, and the use cases are closer to the Mac than the iPod.
  • Reply 26 of 52
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Booga View Post


    That last point is an interesting one. I'd be more likely to add the iPhone and the Touch to the Mac's sales figures, myself. The OSes are closer, the utility is closer, and the use cases are closer to the Mac than the iPod.



    Would you also add the AppleTV to Mac sales, too, since the AppleTV OS is much closer to a Mac than the iPhone. What is being considered is how the devices are being used. The AppleTV, iPhone nor iPod Touch are replacing the personal computer as primary devices, regardless of the underlying OS.
  • Reply 27 of 52
    Iphone is sure handy driving to florida from pennsylvania. Got out of 2 traffic jams that were totally stopped for 2 hours in the 2 days i was on the road. Showed me where i was in 2 seconds the traffic in one, and the connecting road faster than my wife could get out the map. The map showed none of the tiny roads we needed , but the iphone showed them all down to the dirt roads. Found my way around the stoppage in unbelievable time and updated the traffic perfectly. I found it worth the money just to get out of the irritation. And i don't even travel much. Never leave home without it . lol . It ain't cheap . But then it makes high end items. Get used to it . It just killed Motorola yesterday. Nokia will be hurtn next . Tough luck phone companies. Here comes Apple and u gonna die. Wait till SDK package comes out and all the beans will be spilled out . Then the future will be spelled out . Secrets will be comin out soon. But i think they want the new chip new phone new package at once. February will be starting in 3 days . But i predict it will be the time Steve says "ship it " and not on a calendar yet . Not more then 31 days . Hopefully they are shipping for friday release but i highly doubt it . But I'm droolin already . Love 1.1.3 upgrade. Can't wait for all the games comin . Got the champagne chillin now.
  • Reply 28 of 52
    gargar Posts: 1,201member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


    The increased support for the iPod touch may also be a calculated risk that future iPhone updates will negate any immediate hits to the current product's success. Needham predicts that Apple will release an upgraded, 3G-capable iPhone at the same price in the summer and will drop the price of the current model to $299 at the same time, also dumping current iPod touch prices to $199 and $299.



    What a nonsense.

    Apple is not a company which dumps prices to sell old inventory.



    If the 3G iPhone will be released the current iPhone will not drop in price, it simple will be discontinued.

    The new model might decrease in price, not the current model.
  • Reply 29 of 52
    This does NOT ring true for me. I own a Touch, but it has not cannibalized an iPhone sale. I don't want an iPhone, I wanted a Touch. Apple only gained a sale in my case. This is lame logic! Typical analyst BS.
  • Reply 30 of 52
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Banalltv View Post


    There's more to it than that, it also allows Apple to make money from the technology in countries where the iPhone isn't available and It allows them to be in less of a hurry to negotiate deals for selling the iPhone in these countries.



    Lots of people who want an iPhone will buy the Touch while they are waiting.



    I'm years away from an iPhone purchase, if ever. at&t never gets my business again. And if T-Mobile ever carries an iPhone, I would need it to be a much smaller future generation model. I carry my phone everywhere, so size matters. While I'm thrilled Apple has entered the mobile business and look forward to all the great things they'll do in years to come, I don't consider the current iPhone an option, regardless of carrier.



    So for me, the Touch is the only reasonable choice when next upgrade occurs. Bring on the price drop, increased capacity, plus hopefully a big surprise or 2 from Jobs that nobody is expecting it to have. Maybe stereo Bluetooth (not that there aren't people who expect that, but I haven't seen it rumored yet)?
  • Reply 31 of 52
    There are people who-

    1 detest the idea of an AT+T contract

    2 think the edge network makes dial up seem like light speed in comparison. These people would NEVER get a locked iphone BUT would be glad to plunk down the $$$ for an ipod touch.

    I don?t see how Apple is cannibalizing iphone sales because consumers like me would not have bought one anyway?.
  • Reply 32 of 52
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mr. H View Post


    Who cares if one Apple product cannibalises another?



    That seems to be their excuse for not releasing an xMac. The market may be "niche" but it's a hell of a lot less "niche" than the MacPro.



    Apple thinks they'll lose money if they don't pigeon-hole prosumers into the MacPro hole, but in reality, I think prosumers are buying new MacMinis every 3 years... which is still way cheaper than one MacPro every 9 years.



    Anyway, Apple should take a hint from their "new mobile platform market," and release a "MacPro without the phone," so to speak. It'll bring Apple switchers and it'll shut annoyances like me up.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tmedia1 View Post


    This does NOT ring true for me. I own a Touch, but it has not cannibalized an iPhone sale. I don't want an iPhone, I wanted a Touch. Apple only gained a sale in my case. This is lame logic! Typical analyst BS.



    Exactly. I wouldn't buy an iPhone, and I wouldn't buy a MacPro.



    I want an iPhone without the phone, and a MacPro without the Pro.



    If I was shopping for a iPod, I'd get the Touch - even though I'd "still have to carry around another device" (my RAZR) - or I wouldn't buy at all. If I was shopping for a Mac, I'd buy an xMac or I wouldn't buy at all... which is why I'm still using an 800MHz G4 iMac, and will probably be settling for a Mac Mini soon. It's been 6 years without a sale for Apple. Do you miss my money?



    Point is, there's a distinction to be made between canabalization and the lack of being pigeon-holed. This iPhone, iTouch business is about not being pigeon-holed.



    Unfortunately for my computer dilemma, it's not as easy as just "not buying a new iPod." My 4G iPod still works well enough. My iMac... practically has a beard.



    -Clive
  • Reply 33 of 52
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Joseph_xxl View Post


    There are people who-

    1 detest the idea of an AT+T contract

    2 think the edge network makes dial up seem like light speed in comparison. These people would NEVER get a locked iphone BUT would be glad to plunk down the $$$ for an ipod touch.

    I don?t see how Apple is cannibalizing iphone sales because consumers like me would not have bought one anyway?.



    FUD much?

    1) You don't need to have a contract to use an iPhone on AT&Ts network

    2) EDGE is up to 7x faster than dial-up
  • Reply 34 of 52
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    1) You don't need to have a contract to use an iPhone on AT&Ts network



    I think there are some people who don't like the idea of unlocking an iPhone because of the potential risks. Remember the 1.1.1 bricking scare? Sure it all got sorted out but some people don't want to deal with it. They want their phone to "just work."



    Luckily for my wife, her husband is enough of a nerd to help her troubleshoot anything, whether it be a mis-flashed iPhone, or her (yeuuk) Windows Vista PC. Don't worry guys, she wants to switch. She wanted a laptop, though, and a MacBook was a little out-of-budget for the time being.



    -Clive
  • Reply 35 of 52
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Clive At Five View Post


    I think there are some people who don't like the idea of unlocking an iPhone because of the potential risks.



    I am talking about unlocking the phone. I'm talking about AT&Ts Go Plan, or whatever their month to month, no contract plan is called.
  • Reply 36 of 52
    Apple only cannibalizes iPhone sales if the customers are willing to stick with AT&T for their cell phone service. Many, including myself and my wife, won't touch an iPhone until the AT&T exclusive agreement is done.



    That's why we went for the iPod Touch, didn't need a phone to go with the iPod.
  • Reply 37 of 52
    crebcreb Posts: 276member
    My son works for AT&T and tells me that it is the hoop-jumping and contractual obligations that stifle iPhone sales. Business customers (recently added iPhone category) are required to pay an additional $25/line for absolutely no additional service benefits; existing customers are obligated to append two-years to their current plan before being free from a plan; too much fine print between AT&T's contract and Apple's.
  • Reply 38 of 52
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by rifleman69 View Post


    Apple only cannibalizes iPhone sales if the customers are willing to stick with AT&T for their cell phone service. Many, including myself and my wife, won't touch an iPhone until the AT&T exclusive agreement is done.



    That's why we went for the iPod Touch, didn't need a phone to go with the iPod.



    I bought an iPod Touch and find that I am much more certain that I will purchase an iPhone when my contract runs out with Verizon. I would like all of my cool wi-fi apps to work even when there is no wi-fi. That of course means I need the iPhone.



    So I think there is a certain population who have bought the iPod touch and now want the iPhone.
  • Reply 39 of 52
    Originally Posted by zanshin

    Given that the Touch costs significantly less and now does just about everything I want from a mobile media device, I have no iPhone envy at all. Email is more useful to me than yakking away costly minutes on a cell phone that has far less connectivity than wireless internet access provides me.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jouster View Post


    Well, the iPhone also provides wireless internet access, so I don't really see your point.



    This should provide clarity about why the Touch costs less for me to use and therefore I like it better than an iPhone: The Touch does NOT require an expensive AT&T contract to activate and use with wireless internet. Without activation and an AT&T contract, the iPhone isn't even an MP3 player, let alone usable as a wireless internet connection device. Therefore, it has no value to ME because AT&T doesn't provide adequate coverage in my metro area -- I had to cancel Cingular and go to Verizon because others could use cell phones inside my house on Sprint, T-Mobile and Verizon, and I couldn't with AT&T.



    When I write about what "I want from a mobile media device," I'm speaking strictly about my personal user perspective, not trying to cover the entire market's experiences.



    I hope my point is sufficiently clear now.
  • Reply 40 of 52
    With Apple planning on starting their own music company I can see why Apple is pushing the iTouch hard.
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