German publisher drops 12,000 PCs for Mac; more

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Comments

  • Reply 61 of 75
    zinfellazinfella Posts: 875member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Walter Slocombe View Post


    Knife/screwdriver = tool ???



    too bad you need a tool to fix a computer with WHEN IT BREAKS DOWN.





    Ask me how many how many phillips screwdriver tips I went through in order to find one that fit well enough to let me upgrade the ram in my new iMac?



    If ya don't have any tools, they you're just a "girly man" anyway!
  • Reply 62 of 75
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,946member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Walter Slocombe View Post


    Knife/screwdriver = tool ???



    too bad you need a tool to fix a computer with WHEN IT BREAKS DOWN.





    But that computer is the only only one I've heard of that requires a knife to open, and the only one I've known that has to be pried open. A flat head screwdriver is too thick to do the job. It feels pretty silly have to use a spackle blade to open up a computer.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by zinfella View Post


    Ask me how many how many phillips screwdriver tips I went through in order to find one that fit well enough to let me upgrade the ram in my new iMac?



    If ya don't have any tools, they you're just a "girly man" anyway!



    You're not the first to complain about the dubious quality of those two screws. They are supposed to be the common #2 Philips drive but it doesn't work that way. It's as if the machine or the dies used to make the screw's drive socket is faulty.
  • Reply 63 of 75
    futurepastnowfuturepastnow Posts: 1,772member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Walter Slocombe View Post


    Knife/screwdriver = tool ???



    too bad you need a tool to fix a computer with WHEN IT BREAKS DOWN.





    Actually, the typical computer that a business would use has a case held on with thumbscrews and tool-less hard drive caddys. For that matter, the Mac Pro doesn't even have the thumbscrews, just a latch.



    The easier something is, the better.
  • Reply 64 of 75
    abster2coreabster2core Posts: 2,501member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lundy View Post


    As usual, the same members want to turn every thread into an xMac thread.



    I'm thinking something needs to be done about this. I doubt the majority of posters find it useful.



    I would agree.
  • Reply 65 of 75
    abster2coreabster2core Posts: 2,501member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post


    Actually, the typical computer that a business would use has a case held on with thumbscrews and tool-less hard drive caddys. For that matter, the Mac Pro doesn't even have the thumbscrews, just a latch.



    The easier something is, the better.



    The IT department would have authorized, certified service people and the right tools.



    Most of my clients lock/seal all their computers. In light of the current economic concerns and with all the down sizing going on, nobody is walking out the door with a laptop full of company info that is not backed up and/or restricted to certain files.
  • Reply 66 of 75
    zinfellazinfella Posts: 875member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    But that computer is the only only one I've heard of that requires a knife to open, and the only one I've known that has to be pried open. A flat head screwdriver is too thick to do the job. It feels pretty silly have to use a spackle blade to open up a computer.







    You're not the first to complain about the dubious quality of those two screws. They are supposed to be the common #2 Philips drive but it doesn't work that way. It's as if the machine or the dies used to make the screw's drive socket is faulty.



    I don't think it a screw quality issue, as much as mis-identifying the head. Obviously, we should ignore our #2 Phillips head screwdrivers, and search out Phirrips #2 instead.
  • Reply 67 of 75
    gongon Posts: 2,437member
    I think it'd be great if iMac and Mac mini had easy access to internals, like any quality PC case does. Its omission is especially stupid considering both home users, and small businesses, who do not have their own "internal service department" and are realistically not going to be able to remove the HD before sending the machine to be fixed.



    That said, there is an easy fix that at least ensures your data cannot be read directly: enable Filevault. To be diligent, you still can't use the disk when it comes back, as the full disk is not encrypted and the OS could be infected. But, do a full erase, restore data from backup and all's well.
  • Reply 68 of 75
    cavallocavallo Posts: 57member
    But the real question is, what will Springer use as a layout engine - Quark or InDesign?
  • Reply 69 of 75
    haggarhaggar Posts: 1,568member
    Subtract the number of Macs that are not being used for Mac OS, and that will give you a more accurate number of "switchers".
  • Reply 70 of 75
    haggarhaggar Posts: 1,568member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post


    Once those people get switched over to Mac they'll wonder how they ever did without it.



    Not if they are using Macs to run Windows.
  • Reply 71 of 75
    haggarhaggar Posts: 1,568member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Unless the system failed to power up at all, there are many ways retrieve data and then secure erase a HDD prior to sending out for repair without removing the HDD, but even taking the back off an iMac isn't that hard.



    That may apply to the original iMac G5, which was easy to service. But all later iMacs are a complete nightmare to take apart, even for professional technicians.
  • Reply 72 of 75
    haggarhaggar Posts: 1,568member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lundy View Post


    As usual, the same members want to turn every thread into an xMac thread.



    I'm thinking something needs to be done about this. I doubt the majority of posters find it useful.



    Apple will never make video iPods. Nobody wants to watch video on an iPod.



    Apple will never enter the cell phone market.



    Apple will not release an iPhone SDK. Nobody needs third party iPhone applications.



    Apple will never switch to Intel processors.
  • Reply 73 of 75
    frank777frank777 Posts: 5,773member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Unless the system failed to power up at all, there are many ways retrieve data and then secure erase a HDD prior to sending out for repair without removing the HDD, but even taking the back off an iMac isn't that hard. Sure, it's more involved than a PC tower, but not to the point of nixing AIOs int eh workplace; especially if the need to do so is rare.



    You can't take "the back" off a current iMac. You get at the internals by removing the front, including the LCD.



    Aside from the outward good looks, it's one of the dumbest designs Apple's ever used.
  • Reply 74 of 75
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,946member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Haggar View Post


    Apple will never make video iPods. Nobody wants to watch video on an iPod.



    Apple will never enter the cell phone market.



    Apple will not release an iPhone SDK. Nobody needs third party iPhone applications.



    Apple will never switch to Intel processors.



    Lundy didn't say anything in that post for that to be an appropriate response. Lundy's point in that post is that someone bringing up xMac in every other Mac thread is getting very old.
  • Reply 75 of 75
    aluopaluop Posts: 57member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Some of the main issues are having multiple server and workstation technologies and platforms—as not every machine can be Sun Ray—adds overhead to the IT department. It also requires you to have a staff that is versed in multiple platforms. Thin-clients will reduce the number of tier 1 IT support but may increase the need for more experienced, thus higher paid, tier 3 staff as the server and network requirements become considerably greater. The cost of these additional servers can be excessive.



    First of all, sorry for the late reply.

    The IT staff saving from using thin clients is 100 to 1, if not more.

    After things are set up, a 3-person IT department can maintain and support thousands of users.

    How many IT staff do you need to support thousands of individual boxes?

    Can their salary pay for 3 persons?

    This is proven and applies to any industries, including this German publisher.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    It also means your network has to be faster and more redundant as lag and downtime will prevent people any computer work, not just intra-/internet work, to be completed. Beefing up a network can come at considerable expense.



    Network bandwidth is not really an issue.

    Unless everybody tries to watch YouTube at the same time, the bandwidth usage for normal office use is very minimal because the screen data is compressed and only the difference is sent.

    In my previous company, everybody used a Sun Ray with Solaris (even the receptionists), and the Sun Ray only supported 100Mbp Ethernet. Nobody felt any slowness or lagging.

    Other companies that I have been at mostly used VNC to connect to the server. Same thing. No network issue. Only plain 100Mbps Ethernet and switches. Using VNC is like using a Sun Ray; the only difference is people are used to the desktop so they don't care if their desktops are just acting as dummy terminal clients.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    There is also the cost of a thin-client. While they are cheaper than the average PC, you can get a Dell or HP desktop that will perform faster and be around the same price. The thin-clients themselves have the possibility to be considerably cheaper but they are still a niche market and so the price is still high.



    Man, you definitely can't argue about the cost.

    I agree, some cheap PCs may be cheaper than thin clients. But you need to factor in the power usage of a PC vs a thin client.

    How much power does one typical PC under normal load consume? 100W? 150W?

    A Sun Ray only consumes 4W.

    That's at least 25 times saving in power bills.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Also, the beefing up of the network and the additional servers to support thin-clients require a large up front cost that companies may not want to deal with. Many rather spread their fees out over multiple quarters even if the end cost is somewhat higher.



    Like I said, there are pros and cons here, but I don't think a blanket statement of 'should have' is a valid assessment.



    That's why I said their CTO do not do their homework.

    We should convince themselves that thin clients are the correct way to go.

    Especially this German publishers. When they have the budget to replace all PC with Mac at once, they don't have that rather-spread-cost-over-quarters excuse you mentioned.

    Buying 12,000 Sun Ray + some nice PC servers could not be more expensive than buying 12,000 Macs + new Mac servers.



    Besides the above benefits, there are plenty of other benefits from using a Sun Ray. Portability is one key benefit. Once I worked for the company that used Sun Ray, I really think there is no better technology that is as cool. I can go to any conference room or other people's office, plug in my badge, type my password, and I can see the exact same desktop session. It works even across multiple campuses and even countries.



    My school has a PC labs, and every time I switch to any PC, they have a stupid script that takes a few minutes to copy files over so that I can see the same "My Documents" and other personal stuff. This only makes personal files portable; not the desktop session, i.e. I can't leave my Word open and switch desktop. Session portability is one thing a PC can't have (of course, using VNC on a PC doesn't count).



    Another thing is security. There is just nothing to steal and nothing to break. Nobody can steal any data from the thin client, and there is no hard drive, RAM, motherboard, fans, etc so you rarely need IT staff to come over to fix things when they break.



    The Sun Ray software supports all major OSes including Windows and OS X, so if that German publisher really wants Mac, they can still choose Sun Ray over 12,000 Macs. Again, unless they need to do video stuff, I really don't see any reasons why they should choose Mac over thin client.



    I may seem like a Sun advertiser but honestly I am very impressed by their Sun Ray thin client. I still miss the days when I can just run into my co-worker's office, plug in my card, show my screen and prove that he has made some mistakes. It's a really good technology. Every time I go to a library and see those Dell PCs sitting there for people to search catalog, I always think of Sun Ray. Why do we need a power-hungry Pentium 4 with HT, a CDRW drive, and the bulk chassis for a catalog search / Internet access machine? There is no better places to spend our tax dollars? These are also the examples that the IT staff do not do their homework. Too bad, either Sun's marketing is not doing a good job or people just don't want to change their habits. Just like here we all know Macs are better, but when we need computers, the IT guys will just automatically log on to Dell web site and order PCs.
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