Apple's next-gen Macs to have something special under the hood

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  • Reply 181 of 203
    aplnubaplnub Posts: 2,605member
    since we are all guessing, all iPods will have touch screen and the click wheel is gone.
  • Reply 182 of 203
    One of the main reasons of this could be this whole pystar nonsense etc... using something else makes it harder for a mac cloner to make mac clones
  • Reply 183 of 203
    programmerprogrammer Posts: 3,458member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mac-sochist View Post


    But...this general-purpose vector processor we've been talking about could revolutionize the situation in graphics. Of course, that's about all they've been used for in the past, but there's at least the possibility that it could help out in a lot of areas of computing.



    I don't think it'll revolutionize graphics -- as you observe that's where this stuff is already being used. It is elsewhere in the system that the interesting potential lies.
  • Reply 184 of 203
    ...then, along with the comments made by Oppenheimer and Jobs, I predict that the next Apple MacBooks will be using Rambus XDR(2?) memory.
    • It's game changing.

    • It will hurt Apple's margins while providing performance that competitors cannot match.

    • It will give the MacBook (Pro) line the HW differentiation they badly need to make them something other than 'pretty, overpriced, generic, laptops with OS X'.

    • It will give Apple control over the MacBook memory market.

    • XDR achieves higher bandwith and lower latencies than DDR3, all while using less power.

    • Rambus has a cross license agreement with Intel that I still believe is in effect.

    • Working with Rambus will not alienate Apple's existing relationship with Intel.

    • Supporting new memory technology is about the only thing Montevina has going for it compared to Santa Rosa.

    • Apple has access to all the talent needed to pull this off.

    • It's the only valid reason I can think of to go to the trouble of designing your own chipset.

    • I hope it's true .

    It's just a shame Rambus' technology always seems to be overshadowed by their propensity for litigation.
  • Reply 185 of 203
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by chaosvoyager View Post


    ...then, along with the comments made by Oppenheimer and Jobs, I predict that the next Apple MacBooks will be using Rambus XDR(2?) memory.

    <list>

    It's just a shame Rambus' technology always seems to be overshadowed by their propensity for litigation.



    You seem to be knowledgeable of this tech. Could you explain it in more detail. Would this mean that typical RAM isn't going to work in the Mac and that even 3rd parties will be forced to sell RAM upgrades at high prices for Mac users?
  • Reply 186 of 203
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,951member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by chaosvoyager View Post


    It's just a shame Rambus' technology always seems to be overshadowed by their propensity for litigation.



    That's an understatement, they were pretty sleezy, at least in the past, I don't know anything about XDR. From what I understand, in the early years of the RIMM memory standard, they filed a patent using information from a JEDEC conference, basically taking IP that wasn't theirs to take and it took a long time to beat it out of them, I think they basically sued every memory manufacturer that existed, at least one time each.
  • Reply 187 of 203
    ameristamerist Posts: 77member
    Am I the only one who is thinking about what other technologies Apple already uses in other devices and hasn't put into its notebook line?



    1. Touch-sensitivity

    2. Location awareness

    3. attitude-awareness (multiple accelerometers)





    Just a thought.
  • Reply 188 of 203
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by amerist View Post


    Am I the only one who is thinking about what other technologies Apple already uses in other devices and hasn't put into its notebook line?



    1. Touch-sensitivity

    2. Location awareness

    3. attitude-awareness (multiple accelerometers)



    Just a thought.



    I'm not sure I'm following your "Does it have to be hardware?" title. The things you mention require HW.



    1. I don't think we'll see a touch-sensitive main display. For many reason, hat just doesn't make sense. What would make sense is what Apple has been pioneering for years: intelligent-touch pads. It first started with a touchpad that could read double inputs and then more than two and with the rumour of a glass covered trackpad I wonder if Apple will put a simple, iPhone-like touch-display in the trackpad. I think this is possible as the corners and sides or a typical trackpad tend not to get used much.



    2. Have 3G and A-GPS would be nice. The 3G was rumoured for the MBA, but to my surprise did not pan out. Perhaps because it would be sold mostly in the US where CDMA2000 is more popular than UMTS. Either way, this does seem to be the future of computing and I'm sure Apple has data (perhaps even directly from AT&T and other carriers as part of their dealings) as to how many users buy cellular data cards.
  • Reply 189 of 203
    ameristamerist Posts: 77member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    I'm not sure I'm following your "Does it have to be hardware?" title. The things you mention require HW.



    1. I don't think we'll see a touch-sensitive main display. For many reason, hat just doesn't make sense. What would make sense is what Apple has been pioneering for years: intelligent-touch pads. It first started with a touchpad that could read double inputs and then more than two and with the rumour of a glass covered trackpad I wonder if Apple will put a simple, iPhone-like touch-display in the trackpad. I think this is possible as the corners and sides or a typical trackpad tend not to get used much.



    2. Have 3G and A-GPS would be nice. The 3G was rumoured for the MBA, but to my surprise did not pan out. Perhaps because it would be sold mostly in the US where CDMA2000 is more popular than UMTS. Either way, this does seem to be the future of computing and I'm sure Apple has data (perhaps even directly from AT&T and other carriers as part of their dealings) as to how many users buy cellular data cards.



    I guess you're right. These ideas all would require more hardware than what's already in the current line of laptops.



    What you said about 3G is interesting. If Apple built-in a 3G data access card, GSM companies would *heart* apple for sure. Plus, this would fit in with the mobile me concept of keeping things in sync up in the cloud. If there was a way to tether the iPhone to the computer with the USB cable so that data transmission could be done over USB that could be just as effective as having a dedicated card. I'm aware that there's a proxy/subscription solution for doing this now but that doesn't count.



    I do like the idea of a touchpad that doubles as a display. This is totally doable. They could write programs for it in Cocoa Touch. They could take this a step further and embed a lower voltage processor to be used when the computer is on standby that essentially makes your notebook like a giant iPod Touch, using the trackpad as the sole interface. Imagine the battery life you could get from your macbook if you could access all your files and even do basic things with them from the touchpad display instead of having the screen and CPU running. If Apple made a notebook like this it would be ground-breaking, although the similar concept of a smaller, external display is not new.
  • Reply 190 of 203
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by amerist View Post


    I do like the idea of a touchpad that doubles as a display. This is totally doable. They could write programs for it in Cocoa Touch. They could take this a step further and embed a lower voltage processor to be used when the computer is on standby that essentially makes your notebook like a giant iPod Touch, using the trackpad as the sole interface. Imagine the battery life you could get from your macbook if you could access all your files and even do basic things with them from the touchpad display instead of having the screen and CPU running. If Apple made a notebook like this it would be ground-breaking, although the similar concept of a smaller, external display is not new.



    Now we're talking! I hadn't conceived any specific uses, but this would be an excellent start. A notebook that could be really long lasting iPod for flights and such. Or just having my iTunes controller be in the touchpad instead of that mini-controller you can make as always-on-top from iTunes on OS X.



    I don't' think they would yet, but their is plenty of space to the left and right of the touchpad that goes unused. We use it to rest our wrists when typing and in the past this would have been an issue but with capacitance multi-touch software they could make it usable for multiple things that goes dormant if it senses your wrist. A nice equalizer for a DJ comes to mind but there are plenty of other uses that Inspector type-windows would be handy down there.



    This has been done with a simple monochrome screen but that isn't really Apple's way. This could be one of the many things that Apple didn't invent but made everything they did by using the idea in a way that is actually useful.
  • Reply 191 of 203
    aapleaaple Posts: 78member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Now we're talking! I hadn't conceived any specific uses, but this would be an excellent start. A notebook that could be really long lasting iPod for flights and such. Or just having my iTunes controller be in the touchpad instead of that mini-controller you can make as always-on-top from iTunes on OS X.



    I don't' think they would yet, but their is plenty of space to the left and right of the touchpad that goes unused. We use it to rest our wrists when typing and in the past this would have been an issue but with capacitance multi-touch software they could make it usable for multiple things that goes dormant if it senses your wrist. A nice equalizer for a DJ comes to mind but there are plenty of other uses that Inspector type-windows would be handy down there.



    This has been done with a simple monochrome screen but that isn't really Apple's way. This could be one of the many things that Apple didn't invent but made everything they did by using the idea in a way that is actually useful.



    You are correct sir. This is in fact the direction Apple is headed. I have a "friend" in Cupertino who tipped me off to this.



    Not really...but seriously, I think this is a natural progression of Apple touch technology. However, if the touchpad is still used as a mouse, how would it do both well and/or at the same time?
  • Reply 192 of 203
    +mimic+mimic Posts: 37member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Programmer View Post


    Flash memory and SSD drives (or better priced HDD) don't explain most of the CFO quote... it doesn't shut anybody out, and it doesn't provide key technological advances. The use of the term "transition" tends to imply that some existing component is being replaced with something else, and in doing so it is worth far more to Apple than a couple percent of their gross margin. I have yet to see another idea that carries as much merit as the new chip idea. When Apple switched to Intel and used the Intel chipsets it was said that this was a temporary measure to expedite the transition. Now its time to transition back to an ecosystem where Apple controls more of its own destiny. The great thing is that the CFO gave us a timeframe in which to look for this change.



    Programmer, very good point in your first post!!



    Transition could also imply product shift and not just a component shift. I can't believe it is the iPod like many are speculating, as Apple has this market already to themselves. Smart phone is being carved up nicely between Apple and RIM. Notebooks are doing extremely well, although something is this product line could be used to capture even greater share.



    I am very much liking the vector chip idea, as this would fit into all new computers, and possibly all new devices, while allowing scaling. iMac only has 1 or 2 of these chips while the Power Mac has 4-8. This would also fit with Snow Leopard. This would be something competition could not match, and would put Apple years ahead of everyone, in every market. Apple seems to do things in broad stokes, even if it only offers technology, such as touch, on limited devices at first.



    Thanks for the read Programmer
  • Reply 193 of 203
    I like the idea of a multi-touch display acting as a trackpad, and working kind of like the little door some refrigerators have, with a few frequently-needed items in it so you don't have to open the big door all the time. What if, though...this trackpad just plugged into a recess on your computer, functioned like we've been talking about, but then if you snapped it out and took it with you, it's an iPod Touch? I'm not saying that's going to happen this soon, but that's a hardware transition that nobody could match.
  • Reply 194 of 203
    aplnubaplnub Posts: 2,605member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mac-sochist View Post


    I like the idea of a multi-touch display acting as a trackpad, and working kind of like the little door some refrigerators have, with a few frequently-needed items in it so you don't have to open the big door all the time. What if, though...this trackpad just plugged into a recess on your computer, functioned like we've been talking about, but then if you snapped it out and took it with you, it's an iPod Touch? I'm not saying that's going to happen this soon, but that's a hardware transition that nobody could match.



    How about an iPhone display as the new the trackpad. That would make for an interesting trackpad.
  • Reply 195 of 203
    ameristamerist Posts: 77member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aplnub View Post


    How about an iPhone display as the new the trackpad. That would make for an interesting trackpad.



    That's exactly what we have been talking about.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mac-sochist View Post


    I like the idea of a multi-touch display acting as a trackpad, and working kind of like the little door some refrigerators have, with a few frequently-needed items in it so you don't have to open the big door all the time. What if, though...this trackpad just plugged into a recess on your computer, functioned like we've been talking about, but then if you snapped it out and took it with you, it's an iPod Touch? I'm not saying that's going to happen this soon, but that's a hardware transition that nobody could match.



    I like this idea too... if future macbooks INCLUDED an iPod touch that just snaps into the bottom of the laptop where the touchpad normally sits and becomes the trackpad when the laptop is turned on, and can be charged along with the laptop battery when the computer is plugged in. I like where this idea is headed...



    Apple, are you listening?



    OR included in the macbook was an iphone 3G that does all the above, plus uses the data and GPS capabilities of the iphone 3G from any program running on the mac! Holy crap that would be awesome!
  • Reply 196 of 203
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by amerist View Post


    OR included in the macbook was an iphone 3G that does all the above, plus uses the data and GPS capabilities of the iphone 3G from any program running on the mac! Holy crap that would be awesome!



    Yeah, that could definitely be an extra-cost option, if you wanted an iPhone service account. It could then serve as a 3G and Wi-Fi modem. Plus, I just thought about this: it could have a little firmware authentification chip built in (maybe including the key to decrypt your hard drive) so that if you found a laptop sitting around without it, it wouldn't even be worth stealing?
  • Reply 197 of 203
    brendonbrendon Posts: 642member
    So what happens when people lose their phones? Is the laptop useless? Maybe a new phone could be married to the laptop in an Apple store, but what if I live in Colombia, or some other exotic place? I too like the idea but I don't know about the computer being worthless without the phone where the phone is some kind of key for the laptop. But I really like the marriage of an iPhone and a laptop, I would buy one just so I could have internet everywhere.



    Why not use the built in bluetooth to make the internet connection? Wireless is better such as WiFi and I could use the phone for wireless and still not be tethered. Wonderful, I wonder what AT&T would think about that?



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mac-sochist View Post


    Yeah, that could definitely be an extra-cost option, if you wanted an iPhone service account. It could then serve as a 3G and Wi-Fi modem. Plus, I just thought about this: it could have a little firmware authentification chip built in (maybe including the key to decrypt your hard drive) so that if you found a laptop sitting around without it, it wouldn't even be worth stealing?



  • Reply 198 of 203
    I agree this process would take some thinking about. Like you say, it would be relatively easy in an Apple Store, but everybody else might have to wait for the end of AT&T's exclusive, so a new phone could be activated online. You'd have to prove you are who you say you are, but I think that's doable. The beauty is, your phone could be returned to the exact state of your old phone when you lost it, from the computer's HD. Maybe not everybody would use these security features, but corporations should love it: not only could they kill an employee's phone remotely, but his computer, too!
  • Reply 199 of 203
    +mimic+mimic Posts: 37member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mac-sochist View Post


    I agree this process would take some thinking about. Like you say, it would be relatively easy in an Apple Store, but everybody else might have to wait for the end of AT&T's exclusive, so a new phone could be activated online. You'd have to prove you are who you say you are, but I think that's doable. The beauty is, your phone could be returned to the exact state of your old phone when you lost it, from the computer's HD. Maybe not everybody would use these security features, but corporations should love it: not only could they kill an employee's phone remotely, but his computer, too!



    I for one love the idea, and would use it. Play those iPhone games on the big screen!!!



    Talking on the phone can be as simple as jacking a headset in. For those wanting both, the Macbook can come standard with a drop in touchpad. I really like the 3G option if your phone is plugged in.



    Nice idea!
  • Reply 200 of 203
    mcdavemcdave Posts: 1,927member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ?MiMiC View Post


    Programmer, very good point in your first post!!



    Transition could also imply product shift and not just a component shift. I can't believe it is the iPod like many are speculating, as Apple has this market already to themselves. Smart phone is being carved up nicely between Apple and RIM. Notebooks are doing extremely well, although something is this product line could be used to capture even greater share.



    I am very much liking the vector chip idea, as this would fit into all new computers, and possibly all new devices, while allowing scaling. iMac only has 1 or 2 of these chips while the Power Mac has 4-8. This would also fit with Snow Leopard. This would be something competition could not match, and would put Apple years ahead of everyone, in every market. Apple seems to do things in broad stokes, even if it only offers technology, such as touch, on limited devices at first.



    Thanks for the read Programmer



    Makes a lot of sense given the current thrashing Apple are getting about price, that hardware differentiation is going to be critical. For me some additional cell-like vector units would make sense in the pro space but consumers didn't get anything more complex than GHz the first time around. I think iPod or iPhone hardware would amount to more than a few %.



    I like the touch/trackpad idea - reinvent the mouse but it's not really a transition although HP have rushed out the SmartTouch which smacks of "we got there first"



    Baited breath, McD
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