Totally agree. I can't stand the iTunes/Finder theme anymore - a step back IMO. iTunes just looks like they originally started in one theme, and then as the store and it's features expanded, they needed to quickly throw up some more colors and sections to add distinction. It just doesn't look natural and cutting edge. Very flat and blah colors. Folders in the Finder now with Leopard? C'mon.. B.O.R.I.N.G. Say what you want about Vista/Windows 7, the OS sucks functionally in comparison to OS X, but the UI theme looks more appealing.
What makes NeXTStep still the hallmark of OS Design is how the UI was consistent and easy on the eyes with a clean, minimalistic approach to form and function.
This software snapshot is 15 years old. OS X shouldn't be NeXTSTEP 6 but it should recall how to deliver more of a consistent look n' feel while getting out of your face or in your face, per app, depending on your needs.
I actually like Vista's min/max/close controls: adjoining rectangles (instead of small, separated circles), colored glow (visual feedback) when being used and visually inert when not, and a larger (easier to click) close button (since it is the most commonly used).
The rest of Aero, however, (transparent title bars).......... yikes. I've slowly gotten used to it, but not because I like it.
-Clive
I second this. I like Vista's min/max/close controls as well. Certainly an improvement over the 9x and XP styles. If I could put them on my Mac (on the left side, naturally I would
Also, I reallllly think Apple should move away from Lucida Grande as the default system font, or at least provide more flexibility to globally change it. Some apps like Mail do (which I view in Helvetica - much much nicer), but many don't. It too had grown tiresome.
.
The best is Apple Myriad (the font they use in their ad and product copy)..if you can get your hands on it
Brushed Aluminum was okay for a while, but I'm over it.
So far I like Leopard's grayness for things.
"Marble" as based on iTunes, would be an interesting UI choice. Personally, though, I think they should just modify the Appearances system pane to let you choose between all the different themes we've seen in OSX releases, complete with the appropriate Aqua Blue or Graphite wallpapers for the chosen release.
personally i love the blue bubbly buttons and scrollbars, though i would not fret if they were superseded by the powder look of the itunes scroll bar.
brushed metal used to look like the coolest thing ever but it looks a little out of place now.
I'm not a fan of the greyification process that OS X has been going through because it's a little Windows 98 although i understand it is hard to settle on a neutral colour and something like beige would look even worse.
What makes NeXTStep still the hallmark of OS Design is how the UI was consistent and easy on the eyes with a clean, minimalistic approach to form and function.
This software snapshot is 15 years old. OS X shouldn't be NeXTSTEP 6 but it should recall how to deliver more of a consistent look n' feel while getting out of your face or in your face, per app, depending on your needs.
So true. This is a legendary OS and that's why it found a place in the X11 windows manager I am using as Window Maker. And now that fullcreen mode is back again in Leopard, life is nice again.
By the way, do you still have around a NeXT computer alive?
So true. This is a legendary OS and that's why it found a place in the X11 windows manager I am using as Window Maker. And now that fullcreen mode is back again in Leopard, life is nice again.
By the way, do you still have around a NeXT computer alive?
Are we looking at the same thing? Because all I see is sharply defined rectangles interrupted by many more sharply defined rectangles. The content is caught up in the net.
This OS thing, is it like music?
You know, where whatever style of music they were playing when you first got laid is imprinted on you for the rest of your life?
I personally would like to see them get rid of the Klingon short-cut key symbols in the drop-down menuse.
Inituitive and ease of use my butt. Geekiest stuff still around in any modern UI. I still can't figure them out, can't memorize 'em, can't find a way to type them.
The cloverleaf is at least on my CMD key.
Anyway why not just ctrl- and opt- ? Even great aunt Sadie and the temp in the typing pool can get those.
There are lots of other inconsistencies in the interface as well. Sometimes typing the first key in the name of an option box works, sometimes it does nothing.
I feel like there are other things that should have been taken care of a long time ago. I still haven't used my "Chinese Text Converter" on every one of my Services menus and don't want to spend up to an hour researching how to make it disappear.
Not that I've ever used the Services menu anyway since first trying to figure out whatever tonsil-like function it has for the average modern user, and which wasn't ueful enough to me to even remember it. Redesign it, make its use clear in context of using it, or de-emphasize or replace it with a useful "service."
And maybe there's a way to keep iPhoto from booting into the middle of everything whenever I insert a drive or thumb drive with even a single image on it - especially since it's a program I have no use for whatsoever, being a Photoshop user and capable of organizing my own folders in a more understandable way than iP does. But if we're into auto-everything, why not a box that asks me the first time I attach such a drive if I want to open up iPhoto a) whenever I insert a device, b) not this time but always ask or c) don't open it and quit asking, instead of having to muck around in the preferences of a program I don't use to see if the option's even there?
This behavior reminds me more of "Clippy" in older versions of MS Office than Macness.
I personally would like to see them get rid of the Klingon short-cut key symbols in the drop-down menuse.
Inituitive and ease of use my butt. Geekiest stuff still around in any modern UI. I still can't figure them out, can't memorize 'em, can't find a way to type them.
amen to that. very cryptic and especially annoying when you want to be serious about keyboard shortcuts in logic pro
So true. This is a legendary OS and that's why it found a place in the X11 windows manager I am using as Window Maker. And now that fullcreen mode is back again in Leopard, life is nice again.
By the way, do you still have around a NeXT computer alive?
I don't have my NeXTCube anymore. I regret it, but I've always got VirtualBox. Of course, I'm still looking for the occasional NeXTStation Turbo color.
Apple still needs to impress people. Making OS X grey, simplistic, like a GUI from 15 years ago is insane. It may be your personal preference, but I think far more people would choose the current OS X/Aqua look, or Vista/7 over grey NEXTSTEP or Windows 95. I'd rather have a fun, attractive GUI. I really hope to god they aren't heading in a flat/grey direction, and if they are, at least offer options for something more interesting. I like OS X's more fun-looking GUI and is one of the main reasons I've always wanted to switch. I'm on the verge of buying a MB now, and will hate Apple if they make OS X look more plain and boring than Windows and consumer-oriented Linux distros (Ubuntu/Kubuntu).
Apple still needs to impress people. Making OS X grey, simplistic, like a GUI from 15 years ago is insane. It may be your personal preference, but I think far more people would choose the current OS X/Aqua look, or Vista/7 over grey NEXTSTEP or Windows 95. I'd rather have a fun, attractive GUI. I really hope to god they aren't heading in a flat/grey direction, and if they are, at least offer options for something more interesting. I like OS X's more fun-looking GUI and is one of the main reasons I've always wanted to switch. I'm on the verge of buying a MB now, and will hate Apple if they make OS X look more plain and boring than Windows and consumer-oriented Linux distros (Ubuntu/Kubuntu).
Apple simply needs to take Core UI, make it a decent system-wide API that makes themes a piece of cake. I've love to see people go wild with themes without resorting to destabilzing hacks.
Apple simply needs to take Core UI, make it a decent system-wide API that makes themes a piece of cake. I've love to see people go wild with themes without resorting to destabilzing hacks.
This is one of the reasons it will never be themeable as you want. The abortions of old in Mac OS were immediately axed during the early days of Rhapsody.
Why do Apple fans care so much about having a unified UI? It just reeks of monotony. And I hate the fact that I confuse iTunes with the Finder ALL THE FREAKING TIME.
I like my apps different. I appreciate the fact that Winamp still looks like Winamp in Windows, and not like iTunes or Windows Explorer.
Sure, it might take a few minutes to figure out where things are and how the app behaves, but then you get used to it and eventually you come to appreciate how each app's UI is optimized for itself (for instance, Notepad versus Word 2007).
I second this. I like Vista's min/max/close controls as well. Certainly an improvement over the 9x and XP styles. If I could put them on my Mac (on the left side, naturally I would
I was always wondering why the three buttons are on the left hand side while the scroll bars are at the right? On NextStep it was the the other way around. But why aren't they on the same side?
The other way you have the possibility of accidently closing or minimizing your window. However, having the Close/Minimize/Expand on the left makes sure that the user doesn't accidently do that.
Just thought i'd chime in with an anti-consistency-mini-rant...
Consistency is good... except for when it isn't. Imagine trying to find your car in a parking lot if all of the cars looked the same.
The same is true for window dressing. As long as behavior is predictable and consistent, it is actually advantageous for applications to be visually distinct.
Consitency = non-distinct = harder to identify on-screen objects
Consitency is a good thing to beat into the head of a novice GUI designer. But this is only because the tendancy is to error on the side of inconsistent behavior with no added advantage from distinctness.
What makes NeXTStep still the hallmark of OS Design is how the UI was consistent and easy on the eyes with a clean, minimalistic approach to form and function.
This software snapshot is 15 years old. OS X shouldn't be NeXTSTEP 6 but it should recall how to deliver more of a consistent look n' feel while getting out of your face or in your face, per app, depending on your needs.
Ugh.... The minute there's a discussion about interface design, someone is bound to slap a NextStep screenshot in our face.
I think Nextstep certainly hasn't the best UI. Check the bevels, the icons inside an application that catch your eye (in your face!)... The amount of colors, the lack of anti-aliasing....
BeOS is much better with interface design (consistency, colors, minimalism, speed)
ps; check the "winamp" application... funny thing; as long as other developers refuse the UI rules of the OS, these rules mean nothing
The same is true for window dressing. As long as behavior is predictable and consistent, it is actually advantageous for applications to be visually distinct.
Good point. In the end that is exactly what consistency is about (being consistent with different window dressings when it helps).
Comments
Totally agree. I can't stand the iTunes/Finder theme anymore - a step back IMO. iTunes just looks like they originally started in one theme, and then as the store and it's features expanded, they needed to quickly throw up some more colors and sections to add distinction. It just doesn't look natural and cutting edge. Very flat and blah colors. Folders in the Finder now with Leopard? C'mon.. B.O.R.I.N.G. Say what you want about Vista/Windows 7, the OS sucks functionally in comparison to OS X, but the UI theme looks more appealing.
What makes NeXTStep still the hallmark of OS Design is how the UI was consistent and easy on the eyes with a clean, minimalistic approach to form and function.
This software snapshot is 15 years old. OS X shouldn't be NeXTSTEP 6 but it should recall how to deliver more of a consistent look n' feel while getting out of your face or in your face, per app, depending on your needs.
I actually like Vista's min/max/close controls: adjoining rectangles (instead of small, separated circles), colored glow (visual feedback) when being used and visually inert when not, and a larger (easier to click) close button (since it is the most commonly used).
The rest of Aero, however, (transparent title bars).......... yikes. I've slowly gotten used to it, but not because I like it.
-Clive
I second this. I like Vista's min/max/close controls as well. Certainly an improvement over the 9x and XP styles. If I could put them on my Mac (on the left side, naturally
Also, I reallllly think Apple should move away from Lucida Grande as the default system font, or at least provide more flexibility to globally change it. Some apps like Mail do (which I view in Helvetica - much much nicer), but many don't. It too had grown tiresome.
.
The best is Apple Myriad (the font they use in their ad and product copy)..if you can get your hands on it
Pinstripes were a little tacky.
Brushed Aluminum was okay for a while, but I'm over it.
So far I like Leopard's grayness for things.
"Marble" as based on iTunes, would be an interesting UI choice. Personally, though, I think they should just modify the Appearances system pane to let you choose between all the different themes we've seen in OSX releases, complete with the appropriate Aqua Blue or Graphite wallpapers for the chosen release.
personally i love the blue bubbly buttons and scrollbars, though i would not fret if they were superseded by the powder look of the itunes scroll bar.
brushed metal used to look like the coolest thing ever but it looks a little out of place now.
I'm not a fan of the greyification process that OS X has been going through because it's a little Windows 98 although i understand it is hard to settle on a neutral colour and something like beige would look even worse.
What makes NeXTStep still the hallmark of OS Design is how the UI was consistent and easy on the eyes with a clean, minimalistic approach to form and function.
This software snapshot is 15 years old. OS X shouldn't be NeXTSTEP 6 but it should recall how to deliver more of a consistent look n' feel while getting out of your face or in your face, per app, depending on your needs.
So true. This is a legendary OS and that's why it found a place in the X11 windows manager I am using as Window Maker. And now that fullcreen mode is back again in Leopard, life is nice again.
By the way, do you still have around a NeXT computer alive?
So true. This is a legendary OS and that's why it found a place in the X11 windows manager I am using as Window Maker. And now that fullcreen mode is back again in Leopard, life is nice again.
By the way, do you still have around a NeXT computer alive?
Are we looking at the same thing? Because all I see is sharply defined rectangles interrupted by many more sharply defined rectangles. The content is caught up in the net.
This OS thing, is it like music?
You know, where whatever style of music they were playing when you first got laid is imprinted on you for the rest of your life?
Inituitive and ease of use my butt. Geekiest stuff still around in any modern UI. I still can't figure them out, can't memorize 'em, can't find a way to type them.
The cloverleaf is at least on my CMD key.
Anyway why not just ctrl- and opt- ? Even great aunt Sadie and the temp in the typing pool can get those.
There are lots of other inconsistencies in the interface as well. Sometimes typing the first key in the name of an option box works, sometimes it does nothing.
I feel like there are other things that should have been taken care of a long time ago. I still haven't used my "Chinese Text Converter" on every one of my Services menus and don't want to spend up to an hour researching how to make it disappear.
Not that I've ever used the Services menu anyway since first trying to figure out whatever tonsil-like function it has for the average modern user, and which wasn't ueful enough to me to even remember it. Redesign it, make its use clear in context of using it, or de-emphasize or replace it with a useful "service."
And maybe there's a way to keep iPhoto from booting into the middle of everything whenever I insert a drive or thumb drive with even a single image on it - especially since it's a program I have no use for whatsoever, being a Photoshop user and capable of organizing my own folders in a more understandable way than iP does. But if we're into auto-everything, why not a box that asks me the first time I attach such a drive if I want to open up iPhoto a) whenever I insert a device, b) not this time but always ask or c) don't open it and quit asking, instead of having to muck around in the preferences of a program I don't use to see if the option's even there?
This behavior reminds me more of "Clippy" in older versions of MS Office than Macness.
I personally would like to see them get rid of the Klingon short-cut key symbols in the drop-down menuse.
Inituitive and ease of use my butt. Geekiest stuff still around in any modern UI. I still can't figure them out, can't memorize 'em, can't find a way to type them.
amen to that. very cryptic and especially annoying when you want to be serious about keyboard shortcuts in logic pro
So true. This is a legendary OS and that's why it found a place in the X11 windows manager I am using as Window Maker. And now that fullcreen mode is back again in Leopard, life is nice again.
By the way, do you still have around a NeXT computer alive?
I don't have my NeXTCube anymore. I regret it, but I've always got VirtualBox. Of course, I'm still looking for the occasional NeXTStation Turbo color.
I don't have my NeXTCube anymore. I regret it, but I've always got VirtualBox.
And how does this works? You mean that you can run NeXT on a Mac today?
Apple still needs to impress people. Making OS X grey, simplistic, like a GUI from 15 years ago is insane. It may be your personal preference, but I think far more people would choose the current OS X/Aqua look, or Vista/7 over grey NEXTSTEP or Windows 95. I'd rather have a fun, attractive GUI. I really hope to god they aren't heading in a flat/grey direction, and if they are, at least offer options for something more interesting. I like OS X's more fun-looking GUI and is one of the main reasons I've always wanted to switch. I'm on the verge of buying a MB now, and will hate Apple if they make OS X look more plain and boring than Windows and consumer-oriented Linux distros (Ubuntu/Kubuntu).
Apple simply needs to take Core UI, make it a decent system-wide API that makes themes a piece of cake. I've love to see people go wild with themes without resorting to destabilzing hacks.
Apple simply needs to take Core UI, make it a decent system-wide API that makes themes a piece of cake. I've love to see people go wild with themes without resorting to destabilzing hacks.
This is one of the reasons it will never be themeable as you want. The abortions of old in Mac OS were immediately axed during the early days of Rhapsody.
And how does this works? You mean that you can run NeXT on a Mac today?
Yes.
http://www.virtualbox.org/
http://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Downloads
Setting it up inside of Debian Linux which can be done on Mac OS X. The steps should help clarify stuff up.
http://www.nextcomputers.org/forums/...pic.php?t=1663
OPENSTEP Patch List:
http://support.apple.com/kb/TA45377
Patch 4 Overview: http://support.apple.com/kb/TA45410?viewlocale=en_US
This Patch 4 gives you the update SVGA driver to get the VirtualBox environment for Openstep Mach in color.
I like my apps different. I appreciate the fact that Winamp still looks like Winamp in Windows, and not like iTunes or Windows Explorer.
Sure, it might take a few minutes to figure out where things are and how the app behaves, but then you get used to it and eventually you come to appreciate how each app's UI is optimized for itself (for instance, Notepad versus Word 2007).
I second this. I like Vista's min/max/close controls as well. Certainly an improvement over the 9x and XP styles. If I could put them on my Mac (on the left side, naturally
I was always wondering why the three buttons are on the left hand side while the scroll bars are at the right? On NextStep it was the the other way around. But why aren't they on the same side?
Consistency is good... except for when it isn't. Imagine trying to find your car in a parking lot if all of the cars looked the same.
The same is true for window dressing. As long as behavior is predictable and consistent, it is actually advantageous for applications to be visually distinct.
Consitency = non-distinct = harder to identify on-screen objects
Consitency is a good thing to beat into the head of a novice GUI designer. But this is only because the tendancy is to error on the side of inconsistent behavior with no added advantage from distinctness.
What makes NeXTStep still the hallmark of OS Design is how the UI was consistent and easy on the eyes with a clean, minimalistic approach to form and function.
This software snapshot is 15 years old. OS X shouldn't be NeXTSTEP 6 but it should recall how to deliver more of a consistent look n' feel while getting out of your face or in your face, per app, depending on your needs.
Ugh.... The minute there's a discussion about interface design, someone is bound to slap a NextStep screenshot in our face.
I think Nextstep certainly hasn't the best UI. Check the bevels, the icons inside an application that catch your eye (in your face!)... The amount of colors, the lack of anti-aliasing....
BeOS is much better with interface design (consistency, colors, minimalism, speed)
ps; check the "winamp" application... funny thing; as long as other developers refuse the UI rules of the OS, these rules mean nothing
The same is true for window dressing. As long as behavior is predictable and consistent, it is actually advantageous for applications to be visually distinct.
Good point. In the end that is exactly what consistency is about (being consistent with different window dressings when it helps).