It should be noted, your starting/ early-years salary isn't the only thing. I knew a guy from San Diego that went to the expensive University of San Fran (not UCSF)... Once he graduated he was working in the SF Financial District. He didn't seem tremendously satisfied though, even though his pay was quite decent. He perhaps yearned for the more laid-back San Diego atmosphere, or maybe the burden of his student loans was such that the higher-than-average starting salary didn't feel that great.
...One of the college grads they talked to, her major was something like folklore or something like that and she couldn't get a job in her field for 3 years. They made her out to be the victim of the "college scam" but she looked to me to be in idiot for not changing her plan on what she was going to do to be successful...
The US college system is still highly regarded globally because of the broad range of subjects you do in your undergraduate years. In my working experience, US graduates have one of the best general-knowledge and speaking ability. But I think O-Mac you have a point... A broad foundation is always good, but its the last few years of college that you need to have some real-life employment plans or your in some trouble.
But like I said, is earning potential or current earnings a measure of satisfaction and fulfilment? It may be, it may not be. I'm back in South East Asia now and my annual salary is about the equivalent of USD $5,500 a year. That's five thousand not fifty thousand.
Apologies if I am rambling on...
It's just that I am such a different person compared to before college and after college, due to so many factors, not necessarily that college was so important and fantastic... Anyway that's why this topic is quite interesting to me.
College isn't a scam if you do it right. (Of course colleges are in it for money, but a student can get something out of it too) It's that perfect balance of class/learning, socially maturing, meeting the right people (who will get you jobs), enjoying your youth, etc. Studying long hours every night for four years is just about as useless as going out drinking every night for 4 years. The point of college isn't grades, its to mature from a stupid kid into a (hopefully) intelligent, productive member of society not just by going to class and getting a degree but by learning about the world as a whole, not just your own.
ABC had a show on the other night called 'What are you worth?"
One of the topics they covered was the value of a 4yr college degree these days.
One guy interviewed talks about how he got his 4yr degree and the best job he could find was doing IT Support for $10/hr. He basically calls college a scam.
Supposedly there's a saying out there that says college graduates make on ave $1,000,000 more than someone who didn't go to college. WTH? Where did that come from?
Opinions?
Well if he makes $10/year I am sure he went to DeVry, FSU or some other shiity college like that. In that case yes, college is a scam.
If you go to a good college then it is not a scam.
If you go to a good college then it is not a scam.
I agree with this in general, but I still find much to lament in the costs of college. Several top universities have endowment funds that are so large and make so much interest that they could seriously re-think their tuition model. They don't. The best they've done is to punish kids from the middle class (of any ethnicity) with huge loans while throwing free money at often unqualified affirmative-action applicants.
Sad but true. The way society conditions its youth is a whole other topic. As a member of Gen X I think we've done it a lot harder than the baby boomers because, right through their lives the boomers have been the dominant social group. In their old age they will still control the political and social agenda by weight of their sheer numbers. My experience has been (and this is a gross generalisation) that they have become somewhat selfish because of their dominance in Western societies. Unfortunately too, it's the baby boomers that are responsible for a lot of the economic problems that we now find ourselves in...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phong
Of course it's a scam. Are people finally waking up to this?
The real crime is compulsory schooling, which is slavery. The only reason we don't call it slavery is because it doesn't directly benefit any particular master or group of masters, except those who want youth to be secluded from the rest of society until they are properly broken.
I agree with this in general, but I still find much to lament in the costs of college. Several top universities have endowment funds that are so large and make so much interest that they could seriously re-think their tuition model. They don't. The best they've done is to punish kids from the middle class (of any ethnicity) with huge loans while throwing free money at often unqualified affirmative-action applicants.
Not these days. The endowments lost huge amounts of value over the last year.
Learn to write Apps for the App Store or start your own business with the money you would spend on college instead. Become a "well-rounded" individual on your own time, and keep the money in your own pocket.
Facebook basically replaces the inner-circle networking you'd develop in college also.
I took a few semesters worth of classes at a community college and it got me nowhere except loans. I might have been able to get more out of it had more of my professors taught me things related to the task at hand as opposed to their own opinions to fill up time.
Business school education is important if you want to be hired from a company. Companies don't overlook at your resume. They look at what degree you have earned and which REPUTABLE university you have went to. They don't obvs higher DeVry grads or bums on the street to do their work.
You took "highly flawed US education system" from my post and inserted "higher education." Tell me these things aren't the case:
- US Public schools students test worse than those in other developed and developing nations despite the larger amount of funding.
The US education system can be improved and needs improvement. But given our high drop out rates (25%), our scoring is reasonable. Couple that with the statistic that 24% go on to higher education and you have an indicator that a good part of the US system is working.
Science and math are not high on our list of importance in this country. It is reflected in our test scores.
Quote:
- Public and private US colleges show tuition costs rising far faster than inflation.
Because it is highly valued.
Quote:
Combine these two and you have a system where unqualified kids enter college, pay too much, and likely leave the system unqualified.
Unsubstantiated assertion. It doesn't even logically follow even if we accept your premise.
Quote:
If your kids can score a top school, then good for them, they have the option of being way ahead if they choose the right major OR pay more in various grad schooling. But if not, either you or they will pay a lot of money for an education that would have been better delivered by a trade-school.
Like I said, please keep your kids out of college. It is a complete waste of money.
But like I said, is earning potential or current earnings a measure of satisfaction and fulfilment? It may be, it may not be. I'm back in South East Asia now and my annual salary is about the equivalent of USD $5,500 a year. That's five thousand not fifty thousand.
$5,500 can be decent given the cost of living over there. Of course $50K would be much better.
I have a cousin working in China for a not so great sum but she can afford stuff that we cannot. Like a driver and housekeeping.
Quote:
It's just that I am such a different person compared to before college and after college, due to so many factors, not necessarily that college was so important and fantastic... Anyway that's why this topic is quite interesting to me.
Well, lets face it, college isn't very hard in comparison to "real life". There's a lot of opportunity to meet folks and do things that you don't have time for once you hit the daily grind. And you get to do so at a nearly optimum age.
- US Public schools students test worse than those in other developed and developing nations despite the larger amount of funding.
In the US we educate every kid k-12. In many of the countries that are spanking us competitively only the elite are given the opportunity of education.
$5,500 can be decent given the cost of living over there. Of course $50K would be much better.
I have a cousin working in China for a not so great sum but she can afford stuff that we cannot. Like a driver and housekeeping.
Where in China... Hong Kong?... and doing what? Finance? Direct-import? AND does she speak Chinese? I've given serious thought to packing it up and moving to Shanghai or Hong Kong for a few years.
Comments
...One of the college grads they talked to, her major was something like folklore or something like that and she couldn't get a job in her field for 3 years. They made her out to be the victim of the "college scam" but she looked to me to be in idiot for not changing her plan on what she was going to do to be successful...
The US college system is still highly regarded globally because of the broad range of subjects you do in your undergraduate years. In my working experience, US graduates have one of the best general-knowledge and speaking ability. But I think O-Mac you have a point... A broad foundation is always good, but its the last few years of college that you need to have some real-life employment plans or your in some trouble.
But like I said, is earning potential or current earnings a measure of satisfaction and fulfilment? It may be, it may not be. I'm back in South East Asia now and my annual salary is about the equivalent of USD $5,500 a year. That's five thousand not fifty thousand.
Apologies if I am rambling on...
It's just that I am such a different person compared to before college and after college, due to so many factors, not necessarily that college was so important and fantastic... Anyway that's why this topic is quite interesting to me.
"Trump went to college." And Trump also had a million dollars handed to him by Papa Trump when he started his rise to fame and fortune.
Ten million dollars.
And when he lost it he got another ten.
ABC had a show on the other night called 'What are you worth?"
One of the topics they covered was the value of a 4yr college degree these days.
One guy interviewed talks about how he got his 4yr degree and the best job he could find was doing IT Support for $10/hr. He basically calls college a scam.
Supposedly there's a saying out there that says college graduates make on ave $1,000,000 more than someone who didn't go to college. WTH? Where did that come from?
Opinions?
Well if he makes $10/year I am sure he went to DeVry, FSU or some other shiity college like that. In that case yes, college is a scam.
If you go to a good college then it is not a scam.
If you go to a good college then it is not a scam.
I agree with this in general, but I still find much to lament in the costs of college. Several top universities have endowment funds that are so large and make so much interest that they could seriously re-think their tuition model. They don't. The best they've done is to punish kids from the middle class (of any ethnicity) with huge loans while throwing free money at often unqualified affirmative-action applicants.
Of course it's a scam. Are people finally waking up to this?
The real crime is compulsory schooling, which is slavery. The only reason we don't call it slavery is because it doesn't directly benefit any particular master or group of masters, except those who want youth to be secluded from the rest of society until they are properly broken.
I am not joking.
I agree with this in general, but I still find much to lament in the costs of college. Several top universities have endowment funds that are so large and make so much interest that they could seriously re-think their tuition model. They don't. The best they've done is to punish kids from the middle class (of any ethnicity) with huge loans while throwing free money at often unqualified affirmative-action applicants.
Not these days. The endowments lost huge amounts of value over the last year.
Facebook basically replaces the inner-circle networking you'd develop in college also.
Business school education is important if you want to be hired from a company. Companies don't overlook at your resume. They look at what degree you have earned and which REPUTABLE university you have went to. They don't obvs higher DeVry grads or bums on the street to do their work.
You took "highly flawed US education system" from my post and inserted "higher education." Tell me these things aren't the case:
- US Public schools students test worse than those in other developed and developing nations despite the larger amount of funding.
The US education system can be improved and needs improvement. But given our high drop out rates (25%), our scoring is reasonable. Couple that with the statistic that 24% go on to higher education and you have an indicator that a good part of the US system is working.
Science and math are not high on our list of importance in this country. It is reflected in our test scores.
- Public and private US colleges show tuition costs rising far faster than inflation.
Because it is highly valued.
Combine these two and you have a system where unqualified kids enter college, pay too much, and likely leave the system unqualified.
Unsubstantiated assertion. It doesn't even logically follow even if we accept your premise.
If your kids can score a top school, then good for them, they have the option of being way ahead if they choose the right major OR pay more in various grad schooling. But if not, either you or they will pay a lot of money for an education that would have been better delivered by a trade-school.
Like I said, please keep your kids out of college. It is a complete waste of money.
But like I said, is earning potential or current earnings a measure of satisfaction and fulfilment? It may be, it may not be. I'm back in South East Asia now and my annual salary is about the equivalent of USD $5,500 a year. That's five thousand not fifty thousand.
$5,500 can be decent given the cost of living over there. Of course $50K would be much better.
I have a cousin working in China for a not so great sum but she can afford stuff that we cannot. Like a driver and housekeeping.
It's just that I am such a different person compared to before college and after college, due to so many factors, not necessarily that college was so important and fantastic... Anyway that's why this topic is quite interesting to me.
Well, lets face it, college isn't very hard in comparison to "real life". There's a lot of opportunity to meet folks and do things that you don't have time for once you hit the daily grind. And you get to do so at a nearly optimum age.
- US Public schools students test worse than those in other developed and developing nations despite the larger amount of funding.
In the US we educate every kid k-12. In many of the countries that are spanking us competitively only the elite are given the opportunity of education.
$5,500 can be decent given the cost of living over there. Of course $50K would be much better.
I have a cousin working in China for a not so great sum but she can afford stuff that we cannot. Like a driver and housekeeping.
Where in China... Hong Kong?... and doing what? Finance? Direct-import? AND does she speak Chinese? I've given serious thought to packing it up and moving to Shanghai or Hong Kong for a few years.