An obvious alternative to a TiVo btw is a PC-based solution. I've heard good things about Eye-TV. I briefly played around with MythTV but couldn't get the scheduler to populate the MySQL database properly in order to use the program guide, so I switched from booting Linux back to XP and am using BeyondTV (which is my one-and-only reason for still running Windows at home). BeyondTV is an incredible piece of software that has features like remote scheduling via WAP/WEB, automatic transcoding to various formats (WMV/DivX/iPod/AppleTV) which can be done at a global or per-show basis, show-based retention policies, automatic chapter creation at commercial breaks, powerful program guide searches (with no monthly subscription free), and media server functionality. It also can turn recordings into podcast feeds (again, globally or by show) which iTunes can subscribe to. This allows my AppleTV to automatically grab certain shows.
An obvious alternative to a TiVo btw is a PC-based solution. I've heard good things about Eye-TV. I briefly played around with MythTV but couldn't get the scheduler to populate the MySQL database properly in order to use the program guide, so I switched from booting Linux back to XP and am using BeyondTV (which is my one-and-only reason for still running Windows at home).
IMHO EyeTV's interface doesn't begin to compare to even TiVo series 1 (which came out over 8 years ago.)
All I want is something that can be controlled by a basic remote control (EyeTV's or Apple's), without ever having to resort to keyboard or mouse. No alert boxes or text entry from keyboard, ever, thanks!
(I've not seen BeyondTV, but I don't have any Windows systems at home.)
An obvious alternative to a TiVo btw is a PC-based solution. I've heard good things about Eye-TV. I briefly played around with MythTV but couldn't get the scheduler to populate the MySQL database properly in order to use the program guide, so I switched from booting Linux back to XP and am using BeyondTV (which is my one-and-only reason for still running Windows at home). BeyondTV is an incredible piece of software that has features like remote scheduling via WAP/WEB, automatic transcoding to various formats (WMV/DivX/iPod/AppleTV) which can be done at a global or per-show basis, show-based retention policies, automatic chapter creation at commercial breaks, powerful program guide searches (with no monthly subscription free), and media server functionality. It also can turn recordings into podcast feeds (again, globally or by show) which iTunes can subscribe to. This allows my AppleTV to automatically grab certain shows.
An obvious alternative to TiVo? I don't think so. I don't need a noisy PC running in my living room trying to control my TV. If it is not connected to the TV, it is pointless. I have no interest in watching TV on a computer, or transferring shows to an AppleTV box. Do you reboot Windows XP everyday to make sure it is still stable? That sounds to be more of a pain in the ass maintaining that setup. Checked their website. You need a fast PC, a compatible TV Tuner card, and keep your existing cable box in order to record digital cable. You also need to buy a remote. You also have to make sure your cable box is compatible to receive signals from their IR blaster device in order to change channels. After buying the PC, if you didn't have one already, then you have to spend another $209 for their product. TiVo HD is $250 and it just works without all that mess in your living room.
An obvious alternative to TiVo? I don't think so. I don't need a noisy PC running in my living room trying to control my TV. If it is not connected to the TV, it is pointless. I have no interest in watching TV on a computer, or transferring shows to an AppleTV box. Do you reboot Windows XP everyday to make sure it is still stable? That sounds to be more of a pain in the ass maintaining that setup. Checked their website. You need a fast PC, a compatible TV Tuner card, and keep your existing cable box in order to record digital cable. You also need to buy a remote. You also have to make sure your cable box is compatible to receive signals from their IR blaster device in order to change channels. After buying the PC, if you didn't have one already, then you have to spend another $209 for their product. TiVo HD is $250 and it just works without all that mess in your living room.
I was offering this as an alternative to those who were complaining about paying a monthly service charge to TiVo or complaining about the meager boxes offered by their providers.
FWIW, my PC is ancient (well, at least two years old anyway, a 1.83ghz C2D) with a very inexpensive tuner card (a PVR-150 that runs about $50), and my coax is plugged straight in to it. Yes, I only receive analog service. If I decide to upgrade (which is unlikely, since I opted for an AppleTV as an alternative to paying $1200/yr to Comcast for a bunch of crappy TV I won't watch and instead pay a tenth that to Apple to subscribe to the handful of shows I find to be worth watching), then I could fork over a whopping $100 for a HD card that would receive digital signal. I believe there are a few cards out there that support cablecard as well.
My PC is also tucked away upstairs in the office, where it serves up content to my AppleTV, either by way of the 'podcast' XML feed I mentioned before, or for non-mp4 content, as a network drive that Boxee can see. Hardly pointless. The AppleTV is a single access point to its own content, and that of my Mac Mini and PC both on the other side of the house. I don't want another media device...
I'm not sure where you saw $209 for the product. I paid about $70 (if that) for the software. Unless you're referring to a bundle. More expensive than a TiVo? Yeah, for the basic TiVo. For HD, I see TiVo wants you to fork over a ridiculous $800 for the box in addition to yearly service charges. I could build a media center (Windows or Linux) for less than that. It would have more storage than the TiVo and would be more flexible. For roughly the same price, I could do it with a Mac Mini.
I agree that it's not a user-friendly as simply unpacking a device and plugging it in, but it's not that hard either. As for transferring shows to an AppleTV? It's as hard as selecting the show in the interface, enabling the XML feed and copying the provided link into the podcast subscription dialog in iTunes. Done.
When this takes off for real, im getting myself a 'rent movies over the internet' thingy for my TV.
It's pretty good right now; no 'rain fade', no late fee, no scratches, can pause for interruptions (we get 48 hours to watch in NZ), same price as SkyBoxOffice (for us), can buy the good stuff & rent the rest.
It doesn't have every movie and it's not as quick off the mark with rentals as BB but all in all it's a viable alternative right now.
An obvious alternative to a TiVo btw is a PC-based solution. I've heard good things about Eye-TV. I briefly played around with MythTV but couldn't get the scheduler to populate the MySQL database properly in order to use the program guide, so I switched from booting Linux back to XP and am using BeyondTV (which is my one-and-only reason for still running Windows at home). BeyondTV is an incredible piece of software that has features like remote scheduling via WAP/WEB, automatic transcoding to various formats (WMV/DivX/iPod/AppleTV) which can be done at a global or per-show basis, show-based retention policies, automatic chapter creation at commercial breaks, powerful program guide searches (with no monthly subscription free), and media server functionality. It also can turn recordings into podcast feeds (again, globally or by show) which iTunes can subscribe to. This allows my AppleTV to automatically grab certain shows.
Err, OK mate. I'll just stick to a couple of clicks!
10,000? Apple only has about 2,500 doesn't it? That's huge.
I hope they do get access to AppleTV. I'd much rather have AppleTV giving me access to a variety of sources (but I'm happy to be forced to use iTunes if any movie is available on both Apple & Blockbuster).
ps.
Blockbuster is about to start movie rentals direct to TiVo in Australia, it was supposed to start in March but now April.
Me too but Apple need to sort the ATV movie interface out first. Upgrade from 'hobby' & get a real designer on it then push the content through.
Who do companies like BB hire to set all this up? There must be only a couple players in the game who can manage to set up an online system like this yea? Is BB actually doing the contracting or do the movie companies take care of this? How does BB get the permission to convert the movie to online formats and how many systems exist that can deliver online movies?
I thought the content was encoded by the studios but DRM was added by the distribution service. That's why iTunes video used to be crap (even after upgrade from 320 to 640)
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman
The whole online video rental 'thing' is obviously in its infancy and at the moment it is completely fragmented and to be honest, stupid. The fact that not all video content is rentable and viewable by anybody, no matter what hardware they have is not only lame but old fashioned, counter productive and consumer un-friendly. For any company - Apple included - to impose artificial hardware barriers is wrong wrong wrong. I should be able to rent a movie from any source and view it through my Apple TV, Tivo box, or whatever hardware I have. I used to go to BB and get a DVD and pop it into any player, PC or dedicated, and watch the content I had rented. I REALLY resent being tied to a specific hardware solution.
Valid complaint but the tech standards have been around for a while so the whole play is political to prevent one service becoming too powerful (as with non-DRM music). Doesn't take too much to work out who that service is.
I was offering this as an alternative to those who were complaining about paying a monthly service charge to TiVo or complaining about the meager boxes offered by their providers.
FWIW, my PC is ancient (well, at least two years old anyway, a 1.83ghz C2D) with a very inexpensive tuner card (a PVR-150 that runs about $50), and my coax is plugged straight in to it. Yes, I only receive analog service. If I decide to upgrade (which is unlikely, since I opted for an AppleTV as an alternative to paying $1200/yr to Comcast for a bunch of crappy TV I won't watch and instead pay a tenth that to Apple to subscribe to the handful of shows I find to be worth watching), then I could fork over a whopping $100 for a HD card that would receive digital signal. I believe there are a few cards out there that support cablecard as well.
My PC is also tucked away upstairs in the office, where it serves up content to my AppleTV, either by way of the 'podcast' XML feed I mentioned before, or for non-mp4 content, as a network drive that Boxee can see. Hardly pointless. The AppleTV is a single access point to its own content, and that of my Mac Mini and PC both on the other side of the house. I don't want another media device...
I'm not sure where you saw $209 for the product. I paid about $70 (if that) for the software. Unless you're referring to a bundle. More expensive than a TiVo? Yeah, for the basic TiVo. For HD, I see TiVo wants you to fork over a ridiculous $800 for the box in addition to yearly service charges. I could build a media center (Windows or Linux) for less than that. It would have more storage than the TiVo and would be more flexible. For roughly the same price, I could do it with a Mac Mini.
I agree that it's not a user-friendly as simply unpacking a device and plugging it in, but it's not that hard either. As for transferring shows to an AppleTV? It's as hard as selecting the show in the interface, enabling the XML feed and copying the provided link into the podcast subscription dialog in iTunes. Done.
I don't pay a monthly fee for TiVo. I paid for three years up front, at a reduced cost. The $209 for BeyondTV is directly from their website when you choose the option for digital cable. It includes the software and a compatible TV Tuner card. I don't know what you are looking at on the TiVo products. You can get the TIVo HD for $249 at Amazon and a three year pre-paid plan is $299 ($8/month) or $399 for product lifetime. The TiVo HD XL is $489. TiVo no longer sells a DVR for $800.
Don't blame Blockbuster. Their movies are almost certainly delivered with Windows Media DRM, something Microsoft hasn't made available for non-Windows platforms. Apple has refused to license their Fairplay DRM (which would allow competing services, like BB, to provide streaming content to non-Apple devices). Netflix has made content available to Mac users, but only by using Silverlight as a delivery system. I hear it works well, but I've not tried it. I can't imagine that it provides the same experience as the downloadable HD content I can rent on my Apple TV.
If we're to see platform-independent content, then Apple would need to license Fairplay (and release QuickTime for other Unix platforms). Then Netflix, Amazon, Blockbuster and everyone else in the business could convert their content to h.264 (like YouTube did). That way everyone could view content via iTunes on their computers, or by way of QuickTime on a dedicated box (like a TiVo). I don't see the incentive for Apple to do so, although I think Apple really should license the technology to Blockbuster. I think the BB/TiVo partnership is mainstream enough that it could really take what little steam there is in the Apple TV platform.
However, the fact that BB is looking to partner with Apple gives me hope -- hope that there is a new Apple TV on the horizon! The current unit is nearly perfect, it just needs more storage and a faster processor (as it currently will only play 720p content if its in h.264, there's no support for 1080, and can only playback non-h.264 content at 480p - and then only after a hack).
It's a nice idea but I think your cross-licensing suggestions are too messy & fragmented to be useful. The benefit of DVD wasn't the codec, it was simply the fact the DVD-Video profile was standardised - that lack of flexibility allows any DVD to be played in any player and gives the interoperability you crave. Legit Apple content is QA'd to play on the device, other content isn't & non-H.264 content has gone the way of the dinosaur, only pirates advocate it. I'm also not convinced 1080 content is downloadable within an acceptable time (an hour before playback?).
Both Apple & Microsofts systems should accommodate a third party DRM standard (HDCP-based?). Until standard profiles for AV data & DRM can be agreed and adopted this market area will always be a bun-fight and unlikely to gain any traction. Of course, only the studios would benefit from that to maintain incumbent practice.
Not available to consumers, only sold to OEMs that sell Media PC's with Vista Media Center software. Also, it is only supports one CableCARD, so no dual tuner support. Doesn't seem like a worthwhile option. Since you don't subscribe to digital service or HD, sounds like your option works well for you.
I said a while back that blockbuster in order to survive should start teaming up with apple. The two if the done right, have the power to stomp netflix and get blockbuster back in the game. Even the name works, "Blockbuster" sounds like the name of an apple App. Apple could even help BB redesign their stores, look more apple like and sell the apple products that would make sense, instead of the incredibly shitty cheap consumer electronics they've got in the ones up here.
When are we going to get a DVR that doesn't require a monthly subscription? TiVo is dying because for the same subscription price you can get DVR from your cable company and you don't have to hook up another box and keep track of another remote.
Actually, your cable company charges you more for your DVR service than TiVo charges for their subscription. And if you do that math and are willing to take the small risk that the TV box might die after it's warranty period is over (whereas the cable company will replace your box for free if it dies), TiVo is about the same total cost even including the purchase price of the TiVo unit.
In my area, Comcast charges $16/month to rent their HD DVR. A 3-year TiVo service contract is $299, or about $8.30/month. Add in $1.50/month to rent the cable card from Comcast, and you have under $10/month for your TiVo service. So TiVo costs $6/month less than Comcast's DVR box. Over 3 years, that saves you $216. Right now on Amazon you can get an HD TiVo for $231.
As soon as the new Tru2Way cable card standard is available in a TiVo, I'll be switching back. I'm tired of Comcast's DVR constantly missing my recordings, locking up, saying the disk is full when it's not even close, inaccurate program guide, and needing to be rebooted at least monthly to get it working again (and then waiting nearly 24 hours before it's repopulated the guide).
Think "App Store" for Apple TV. Plug-in's like Boxee make sense. Extensible. Pandora and AIM are on the iPhone (2 apps/services I figured Apple would want more control over)
I don't pay a monthly fee for TiVo. I paid for three years up front, at a reduced cost. The $209 for BeyondTV is directly from their website when you choose the option for digital cable. It includes the software and a compatible TV Tuner card. I don't know what you are looking at on the TiVo products. You can get the TIVo HD for $249 at Amazon and a three year pre-paid plan is $299 ($8/month) or $399 for product lifetime. The TiVo HD XL is $489. TiVo no longer sells a DVR for $800.
I admit I didn't do much research -- okay, I googled "TiVo series 3 HD" and came up with this item on TiVo's site which says "DVR price: $799.99". I didn't look for alternative devices, nor did I check Amazon. Had I been looking to purchase one, I certainly would've looked around.
The $209 quote from Snapstream no doubt includes a Happauge HD tuner card, which probably runs about $150 normally.
Anyway, I don't mean to argue or put down your points. I don't know anyone who owns a TiVo who isn't in love with it, and I've definitely considered one (primarily as a way to decommission my old Windows box, since its only function at this point is in running BeyondTV), I was just offering up a suggestion to those who were complaining about paying a service fee, and who might enjoy building their own alternative.
Not available to consumers, only sold to OEMs that sell Media PC's with Vista Media Center software. Also, it is only supports one CableCARD, so no dual tuner support. Doesn't seem like a worthwhile option. Since you don't subscribe to digital service or HD, sounds like your option works well for you.
Bummer. Comcast is reportedly in the process of encrypting most channels from 30 up, for no reason whatsoever. They claim it's part of transitioning all content to digital in order to enhance customer service by enabling more channels. Whatever. Then digitise the signal and allow me to continue using the QAM tuner in my TV, don't encrypt them -- unless of course, you want to control which devices I can put at the end of your pipe (i.e. disable my ability to use my computer to record television). I'm sure that, every time someone calls in to complain about how their TiVo, Windows Media Center PC, EyeTV or other DVR solution doesn't work, Comcast is happy to sell them on their crappy solution to put more money in their pocket, whether it be renting their DVR, or paying a monthly fee for a Cablecard (for those who have a compatible TiVo).
My solution? Cancel my service altogether and continue purchasing my programming through iTunes. It's cheaper, I don't have to watch commercials, and I can rewatch shows whenever I want.
Anyone know if BB has talked about what codec they'll use?
I dig being able to watch random movies on my laptop from Netflix without any additional fee, but I have to say that Silverlight doesn't look that great, even on a 15" screen. I find Hulu's flash stuff to be better looking.
For all the jostling competition among providers, set-top box makers, software suppliers, et al, I can't see where any streaming solution is going to take off until they can get it looking better, especially if the expectation is that such services will replace or augment cable and optical discs for viewing content on large flat screens. Going from cable HD to Netflix streaming is like going from DVD to VHS, which isn't exactly an audience builder.
Me too but Apple need to sort the ATV movie interface out first. Upgrade from 'hobby' & get a real designer on it then push the content through.
Yes the interface was very simple originally and worked with MINIMAL content. Then ATV2.0 changed the menus, offered a list of options slightly too long for a screen, and didn't group options that could have been grouped together.
It needs a good, simple redesign... for example you shouldn't choose Mac Gallery or Flickr before seeing your subscriptions to either - both sets of subscriptions should be under "photos", and when you subscribe to a feed you specify which of the 2 (or more) it is connecting to. Another eg, a single search could search both podcasts and youtube simultaneously. But it's nothing so simple of course - the handling of media is complex.
Opening up the AppleTV to applications solves the copyright problem in that a 3rd party could use their own DRM on AppleTV - but multiple apps could make navigating the ATV very difficult unless it is well controlled and given a good menu framework on which to build.
Comments
An obvious alternative to a TiVo btw is a PC-based solution. I've heard good things about Eye-TV. I briefly played around with MythTV but couldn't get the scheduler to populate the MySQL database properly in order to use the program guide, so I switched from booting Linux back to XP and am using BeyondTV (which is my one-and-only reason for still running Windows at home).
IMHO EyeTV's interface doesn't begin to compare to even TiVo series 1 (which came out over 8 years ago.)
All I want is something that can be controlled by a basic remote control (EyeTV's or Apple's), without ever having to resort to keyboard or mouse. No alert boxes or text entry from keyboard, ever, thanks!
(I've not seen BeyondTV, but I don't have any Windows systems at home.)
An obvious alternative to a TiVo btw is a PC-based solution. I've heard good things about Eye-TV. I briefly played around with MythTV but couldn't get the scheduler to populate the MySQL database properly in order to use the program guide, so I switched from booting Linux back to XP and am using BeyondTV (which is my one-and-only reason for still running Windows at home). BeyondTV is an incredible piece of software that has features like remote scheduling via WAP/WEB, automatic transcoding to various formats (WMV/DivX/iPod/AppleTV) which can be done at a global or per-show basis, show-based retention policies, automatic chapter creation at commercial breaks, powerful program guide searches (with no monthly subscription free), and media server functionality. It also can turn recordings into podcast feeds (again, globally or by show) which iTunes can subscribe to. This allows my AppleTV to automatically grab certain shows.
An obvious alternative to TiVo? I don't think so. I don't need a noisy PC running in my living room trying to control my TV. If it is not connected to the TV, it is pointless. I have no interest in watching TV on a computer, or transferring shows to an AppleTV box. Do you reboot Windows XP everyday to make sure it is still stable? That sounds to be more of a pain in the ass maintaining that setup. Checked their website. You need a fast PC, a compatible TV Tuner card, and keep your existing cable box in order to record digital cable. You also need to buy a remote. You also have to make sure your cable box is compatible to receive signals from their IR blaster device in order to change channels. After buying the PC, if you didn't have one already, then you have to spend another $209 for their product. TiVo HD is $250 and it just works without all that mess in your living room.
An obvious alternative to TiVo? I don't think so. I don't need a noisy PC running in my living room trying to control my TV. If it is not connected to the TV, it is pointless. I have no interest in watching TV on a computer, or transferring shows to an AppleTV box. Do you reboot Windows XP everyday to make sure it is still stable? That sounds to be more of a pain in the ass maintaining that setup. Checked their website. You need a fast PC, a compatible TV Tuner card, and keep your existing cable box in order to record digital cable. You also need to buy a remote. You also have to make sure your cable box is compatible to receive signals from their IR blaster device in order to change channels. After buying the PC, if you didn't have one already, then you have to spend another $209 for their product. TiVo HD is $250 and it just works without all that mess in your living room.
I was offering this as an alternative to those who were complaining about paying a monthly service charge to TiVo or complaining about the meager boxes offered by their providers.
FWIW, my PC is ancient (well, at least two years old anyway, a 1.83ghz C2D) with a very inexpensive tuner card (a PVR-150 that runs about $50), and my coax is plugged straight in to it. Yes, I only receive analog service. If I decide to upgrade (which is unlikely, since I opted for an AppleTV as an alternative to paying $1200/yr to Comcast for a bunch of crappy TV I won't watch and instead pay a tenth that to Apple to subscribe to the handful of shows I find to be worth watching), then I could fork over a whopping $100 for a HD card that would receive digital signal. I believe there are a few cards out there that support cablecard as well.
My PC is also tucked away upstairs in the office, where it serves up content to my AppleTV, either by way of the 'podcast' XML feed I mentioned before, or for non-mp4 content, as a network drive that Boxee can see. Hardly pointless. The AppleTV is a single access point to its own content, and that of my Mac Mini and PC both on the other side of the house. I don't want another media device...
I'm not sure where you saw $209 for the product. I paid about $70 (if that) for the software. Unless you're referring to a bundle. More expensive than a TiVo? Yeah, for the basic TiVo. For HD, I see TiVo wants you to fork over a ridiculous $800 for the box in addition to yearly service charges. I could build a media center (Windows or Linux) for less than that. It would have more storage than the TiVo and would be more flexible. For roughly the same price, I could do it with a Mac Mini.
I agree that it's not a user-friendly as simply unpacking a device and plugging it in, but it's not that hard either. As for transferring shows to an AppleTV? It's as hard as selecting the show in the interface, enabling the XML feed and copying the provided link into the podcast subscription dialog in iTunes. Done.
When this takes off for real, im getting myself a 'rent movies over the internet' thingy for my TV.
It's pretty good right now; no 'rain fade', no late fee, no scratches, can pause for interruptions (we get 48 hours to watch in NZ), same price as SkyBoxOffice (for us), can buy the good stuff & rent the rest.
It doesn't have every movie and it's not as quick off the mark with rentals as BB but all in all it's a viable alternative right now.
McD
An obvious alternative to a TiVo btw is a PC-based solution. I've heard good things about Eye-TV. I briefly played around with MythTV but couldn't get the scheduler to populate the MySQL database properly in order to use the program guide, so I switched from booting Linux back to XP and am using BeyondTV (which is my one-and-only reason for still running Windows at home). BeyondTV is an incredible piece of software that has features like remote scheduling via WAP/WEB, automatic transcoding to various formats (WMV/DivX/iPod/AppleTV) which can be done at a global or per-show basis, show-based retention policies, automatic chapter creation at commercial breaks, powerful program guide searches (with no monthly subscription free), and media server functionality. It also can turn recordings into podcast feeds (again, globally or by show) which iTunes can subscribe to. This allows my AppleTV to automatically grab certain shows.
Err, OK mate. I'll just stick to a couple of clicks!
McD
10,000? Apple only has about 2,500 doesn't it? That's huge.
I hope they do get access to AppleTV. I'd much rather have AppleTV giving me access to a variety of sources (but I'm happy to be forced to use iTunes if any movie is available on both Apple & Blockbuster).
ps.
Blockbuster is about to start movie rentals direct to TiVo in Australia, it was supposed to start in March but now April.
Me too but Apple need to sort the ATV movie interface out first. Upgrade from 'hobby' & get a real designer on it then push the content through.
McD
Who do companies like BB hire to set all this up? There must be only a couple players in the game who can manage to set up an online system like this yea? Is BB actually doing the contracting or do the movie companies take care of this? How does BB get the permission to convert the movie to online formats and how many systems exist that can deliver online movies?
I thought the content was encoded by the studios but DRM was added by the distribution service. That's why iTunes video used to be crap (even after upgrade from 320 to 640)
The whole online video rental 'thing' is obviously in its infancy and at the moment it is completely fragmented and to be honest, stupid. The fact that not all video content is rentable and viewable by anybody, no matter what hardware they have is not only lame but old fashioned, counter productive and consumer un-friendly. For any company - Apple included - to impose artificial hardware barriers is wrong wrong wrong. I should be able to rent a movie from any source and view it through my Apple TV, Tivo box, or whatever hardware I have. I used to go to BB and get a DVD and pop it into any player, PC or dedicated, and watch the content I had rented. I REALLY resent being tied to a specific hardware solution.
Valid complaint but the tech standards have been around for a while so the whole play is political to prevent one service becoming too powerful (as with non-DRM music). Doesn't take too much to work out who that service is.
McD
I was offering this as an alternative to those who were complaining about paying a monthly service charge to TiVo or complaining about the meager boxes offered by their providers.
FWIW, my PC is ancient (well, at least two years old anyway, a 1.83ghz C2D) with a very inexpensive tuner card (a PVR-150 that runs about $50), and my coax is plugged straight in to it. Yes, I only receive analog service. If I decide to upgrade (which is unlikely, since I opted for an AppleTV as an alternative to paying $1200/yr to Comcast for a bunch of crappy TV I won't watch and instead pay a tenth that to Apple to subscribe to the handful of shows I find to be worth watching), then I could fork over a whopping $100 for a HD card that would receive digital signal. I believe there are a few cards out there that support cablecard as well.
My PC is also tucked away upstairs in the office, where it serves up content to my AppleTV, either by way of the 'podcast' XML feed I mentioned before, or for non-mp4 content, as a network drive that Boxee can see. Hardly pointless. The AppleTV is a single access point to its own content, and that of my Mac Mini and PC both on the other side of the house. I don't want another media device...
I'm not sure where you saw $209 for the product. I paid about $70 (if that) for the software. Unless you're referring to a bundle. More expensive than a TiVo? Yeah, for the basic TiVo. For HD, I see TiVo wants you to fork over a ridiculous $800 for the box in addition to yearly service charges. I could build a media center (Windows or Linux) for less than that. It would have more storage than the TiVo and would be more flexible. For roughly the same price, I could do it with a Mac Mini.
I agree that it's not a user-friendly as simply unpacking a device and plugging it in, but it's not that hard either. As for transferring shows to an AppleTV? It's as hard as selecting the show in the interface, enabling the XML feed and copying the provided link into the podcast subscription dialog in iTunes. Done.
I don't pay a monthly fee for TiVo. I paid for three years up front, at a reduced cost. The $209 for BeyondTV is directly from their website when you choose the option for digital cable. It includes the software and a compatible TV Tuner card. I don't know what you are looking at on the TiVo products. You can get the TIVo HD for $249 at Amazon and a three year pre-paid plan is $299 ($8/month) or $399 for product lifetime. The TiVo HD XL is $489. TiVo no longer sells a DVR for $800.
Don't blame Blockbuster. Their movies are almost certainly delivered with Windows Media DRM, something Microsoft hasn't made available for non-Windows platforms. Apple has refused to license their Fairplay DRM (which would allow competing services, like BB, to provide streaming content to non-Apple devices). Netflix has made content available to Mac users, but only by using Silverlight as a delivery system. I hear it works well, but I've not tried it. I can't imagine that it provides the same experience as the downloadable HD content I can rent on my Apple TV.
If we're to see platform-independent content, then Apple would need to license Fairplay (and release QuickTime for other Unix platforms). Then Netflix, Amazon, Blockbuster and everyone else in the business could convert their content to h.264 (like YouTube did). That way everyone could view content via iTunes on their computers, or by way of QuickTime on a dedicated box (like a TiVo). I don't see the incentive for Apple to do so, although I think Apple really should license the technology to Blockbuster. I think the BB/TiVo partnership is mainstream enough that it could really take what little steam there is in the Apple TV platform.
However, the fact that BB is looking to partner with Apple gives me hope -- hope that there is a new Apple TV on the horizon! The current unit is nearly perfect, it just needs more storage and a faster processor (as it currently will only play 720p content if its in h.264, there's no support for 1080, and can only playback non-h.264 content at 480p - and then only after a hack).
It's a nice idea but I think your cross-licensing suggestions are too messy & fragmented to be useful. The benefit of DVD wasn't the codec, it was simply the fact the DVD-Video profile was standardised - that lack of flexibility allows any DVD to be played in any player and gives the interoperability you crave. Legit Apple content is QA'd to play on the device, other content isn't & non-H.264 content has gone the way of the dinosaur, only pirates advocate it. I'm also not convinced 1080 content is downloadable within an acceptable time (an hour before playback?).
Both Apple & Microsofts systems should accommodate a third party DRM standard (HDCP-based?). Until standard profiles for AV data & DRM can be agreed and adopted this market area will always be a bun-fight and unlikely to gain any traction. Of course, only the studios would benefit from that to maintain incumbent practice.
McD
I believe there are a few cards out there that support cablecard as well.
http://ati.amd.com/products/tvwonderdigital/index.html
Not available to consumers, only sold to OEMs that sell Media PC's with Vista Media Center software. Also, it is only supports one CableCARD, so no dual tuner support. Doesn't seem like a worthwhile option. Since you don't subscribe to digital service or HD, sounds like your option works well for you.
When are we going to get a DVR that doesn't require a monthly subscription? TiVo is dying because for the same subscription price you can get DVR from your cable company and you don't have to hook up another box and keep track of another remote.
Actually, your cable company charges you more for your DVR service than TiVo charges for their subscription. And if you do that math and are willing to take the small risk that the TV box might die after it's warranty period is over (whereas the cable company will replace your box for free if it dies), TiVo is about the same total cost even including the purchase price of the TiVo unit.
In my area, Comcast charges $16/month to rent their HD DVR. A 3-year TiVo service contract is $299, or about $8.30/month. Add in $1.50/month to rent the cable card from Comcast, and you have under $10/month for your TiVo service. So TiVo costs $6/month less than Comcast's DVR box. Over 3 years, that saves you $216. Right now on Amazon you can get an HD TiVo for $231.
As soon as the new Tru2Way cable card standard is available in a TiVo, I'll be switching back. I'm tired of Comcast's DVR constantly missing my recordings, locking up, saying the disk is full when it's not even close, inaccurate program guide, and needing to be rebooted at least monthly to get it working again (and then waiting nearly 24 hours before it's repopulated the guide).
Some of the players:
TiVO
Hulu
Roku
NetFlix
BlockBuster
Amazon
Apple: iPhone, AppleTV, FrontRow, QuickTime, etc
Wal-Mart?
Cable providers
Satellite providers
Microsoft: XBOX, Silverlight etc
Adobe: Flash etc
Boxee
I don't pay a monthly fee for TiVo. I paid for three years up front, at a reduced cost. The $209 for BeyondTV is directly from their website when you choose the option for digital cable. It includes the software and a compatible TV Tuner card. I don't know what you are looking at on the TiVo products. You can get the TIVo HD for $249 at Amazon and a three year pre-paid plan is $299 ($8/month) or $399 for product lifetime. The TiVo HD XL is $489. TiVo no longer sells a DVR for $800.
I admit I didn't do much research -- okay, I googled "TiVo series 3 HD" and came up with this item on TiVo's site which says "DVR price: $799.99". I didn't look for alternative devices, nor did I check Amazon. Had I been looking to purchase one, I certainly would've looked around.
The $209 quote from Snapstream no doubt includes a Happauge HD tuner card, which probably runs about $150 normally.
Anyway, I don't mean to argue or put down your points. I don't know anyone who owns a TiVo who isn't in love with it, and I've definitely considered one (primarily as a way to decommission my old Windows box, since its only function at this point is in running BeyondTV), I was just offering up a suggestion to those who were complaining about paying a service fee, and who might enjoy building their own alternative.
http://ati.amd.com/products/tvwonderdigital/index.html
Not available to consumers, only sold to OEMs that sell Media PC's with Vista Media Center software. Also, it is only supports one CableCARD, so no dual tuner support. Doesn't seem like a worthwhile option. Since you don't subscribe to digital service or HD, sounds like your option works well for you.
Bummer. Comcast is reportedly in the process of encrypting most channels from 30 up, for no reason whatsoever. They claim it's part of transitioning all content to digital in order to enhance customer service by enabling more channels. Whatever. Then digitise the signal and allow me to continue using the QAM tuner in my TV, don't encrypt them -- unless of course, you want to control which devices I can put at the end of your pipe (i.e. disable my ability to use my computer to record television). I'm sure that, every time someone calls in to complain about how their TiVo, Windows Media Center PC, EyeTV or other DVR solution doesn't work, Comcast is happy to sell them on their crappy solution to put more money in their pocket, whether it be renting their DVR, or paying a monthly fee for a Cablecard (for those who have a compatible TiVo).
My solution? Cancel my service altogether and continue purchasing my programming through iTunes. It's cheaper, I don't have to watch commercials, and I can rewatch shows whenever I want.
I dig being able to watch random movies on my laptop from Netflix without any additional fee, but I have to say that Silverlight doesn't look that great, even on a 15" screen. I find Hulu's flash stuff to be better looking.
For all the jostling competition among providers, set-top box makers, software suppliers, et al, I can't see where any streaming solution is going to take off until they can get it looking better, especially if the expectation is that such services will replace or augment cable and optical discs for viewing content on large flat screens. Going from cable HD to Netflix streaming is like going from DVD to VHS, which isn't exactly an audience builder.
Me too but Apple need to sort the ATV movie interface out first. Upgrade from 'hobby' & get a real designer on it then push the content through.
Yes the interface was very simple originally and worked with MINIMAL content. Then ATV2.0 changed the menus, offered a list of options slightly too long for a screen, and didn't group options that could have been grouped together.
It needs a good, simple redesign... for example you shouldn't choose Mac Gallery or Flickr before seeing your subscriptions to either - both sets of subscriptions should be under "photos", and when you subscribe to a feed you specify which of the 2 (or more) it is connecting to. Another eg, a single search could search both podcasts and youtube simultaneously. But it's nothing so simple of course - the handling of media is complex.
Opening up the AppleTV to applications solves the copyright problem in that a 3rd party could use their own DRM on AppleTV - but multiple apps could make navigating the ATV very difficult unless it is well controlled and given a good menu framework on which to build.