Why arent people ranting about Panther?

in macOS edited January 2014
Months, even eons before 10.2 or 10.1 came out, people was talking high and low about when it would come, bitching about price, talking of new features, new insider info comming out almost every week..

But since we hear almost nothing about 10.3, should we then expect that people are really satisfied with 10.2, or what?

Speed is almost up to OS9, and I dont really need any big features...

Though what I would like to see is better sound-in support, a totally revamped (Spelled correctly?) 'connect to...' dialog and [apple]+[x] to work on files/folders like in Winblows!

For a timeline I'm hearing everything from march to august. Anybody care to comment on it?


  • Reply 1 of 59
    chuckerchucker Posts: 5,089member

    Seriously, March is a no-brainer, as there is not even evidence for any ADC member having received early builds, which are usually out over half a year before the golden master release.

    I'd expect late Summer for beta seeds and Fall for a final.

    Features? Metadata Just look at iTunes' Smart Playlists. Think of a Smart Query "today's pile of spam" <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
  • Reply 2 of 59
    kedakeda Posts: 722member
    Not enough bitching on AI?!

    Seriously, I think on e of the main reasons we aren't hearing as much hype this time is that Jag is kickin ass. When 10.0&1 were out, major holes existed, it was sloow, and only the most die-hard users had X on full time. Now, thing are much better. Jag is solid, fast and the main OS of most AI-ers.

    Now drop a few tastey gems about new features ,etc and watch the boards go nuts.
  • Reply 3 of 59
    stunnedstunned Posts: 1,096member
    Cos I am not to keen to pay US$129 for another OS when Jaguar is working perfectly fine for me.
  • Reply 4 of 59
    cubedudecubedude Posts: 1,556member
    I don't think they're going to charge $130 again. Something like $70 sounds about right.
  • Reply 5 of 59
    [quote]Originally posted by stunned:

    <strong>Cos I am not to keen to pay US$129 for another OS when Jaguar is working perfectly fine for me. </strong><hr></blockquote>What's funny is the number of people who said the same about 10.1 and upgrading to 10.2. I'd bet that as a major update, 10.3 will introduce more optimizations (I REALLY hope so in the Finder) and will most certainly introduce new technologies like 10.2 did. Of course the stragglers will say 10.2 is "good enough for me", but when they see 10.3 first hand, they will probably drop down the 130 clams like they did for 10.2.

    Such is the cycle these days...
  • Reply 6 of 59
    addisonaddison Posts: 1,185member
    10.2.3 is actually very good, so there are few complaints. Others are just waiting for the 970, so until we get the 970 I don't think we will here much about the OS.

    I agree the finder is still a pain and has got much better in 10.2.3 and I wouldn't be supprised to see further development but Jag does mopst thing well now. There are some outstanding issues which to me are far more important then new featurers.

    I won't buy the windtunnel machines and although I am in the market for 5 iMacs there is no way I am going to pay good money for the current 700mhz machines.

    Apple if you want my money for God say bump the CDRW iMac to 1.2 5 with a 133mhz bus speed and a 17" screen.

    Guess I'll ahev to wait another three weeks.

  • Reply 7 of 59
    I'd drop the cash in a heart beat. Apple OSes have me sold. (even if I have to pawn my car title)
  • Reply 8 of 59
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,227member

    Yes the Finder needs love. On Macintouch there's a thread responding to Rob Gailbraiths report on how Apple is getting it's BUTT kicked in RAW photo processing from Digicams.

    I was suprised to read that using CLI reduced one transfer from a minute and a half to just 12 seconds. That's huge! The finder must be updated!

    Audio will continue to improve. 10.3 will finally bring Native mLAN support. Namm this week is going to be a small coming out party for Yamaha and it's mLAN partners. I can't wait.

    Give me polished guts. OSX looks nice now lets make it fly!

    <a href="http://www.macintouch.com/g4performance02.html"; target="_blank">Rob Galbraith responses</a>

    [ 01-14-2003: Message edited by: hmurchison ]</p>
  • Reply 9 of 59
    Oh yes, the finder in its curent state is still quite pathetic. Ever open a directury with several hundred or few thousand files? Try selecting about half of them and drag them to another window. The Finder locks up HARD for several minutes, pegging one of the CPUs at 100%. Sometimes the Finder just outright dies and relaunches. What is disappointing is that, as hmurchison mentioned, moving or copying the same files in the terminal takes mere seconds.

    Additional threading in the Finder would help here, spreading the task over the two CPUs and allowing the user to do other tasks, but there HAS to be some other optimization that can clear up this stall. I suspect that part of the problem has to do with how the Finder draws its window contents. As I recall, the Finder now tries to draw *all* the content upon opening a window or refreshing it. This was done to improve scrolling and window resizing. However, when the Finder has to redraw the window content with many, many objects (as in my case), this redraw may be killing the performance.

    Then there is the Finder FTP access problems, the desktop icons shifting or jumping when Stuffit expands or you put an icon on the left or top of the desktop, the new folder naming bug in list view, the cramped Find dialog, the broken system sound events, the still-sorry state of the system-wide open/save dialogs, the problem of the system caches corrupting and causing random problems, the excruciatingly slow load time and overall bad performance of Help Viewer, the broken Dock keyboard controls....

    I could go on all day about the things that are still buggy about 10.2.3 and problems that affect me and people I know on a regular basis.

    Needless to say, Mac OS X could stand to have a LOT more fixes and updates. <img src="graemlins/hmmm.gif" border="0" alt="[Hmmm]" />

    [ 01-14-2003: Message edited by: Brad ]</p>
  • Reply 10 of 59
    I suppose that Panther will be optimzed for the 970´s or any other new mac chip.
  • Reply 11 of 59
    noseynosey Posts: 307member
    [quote] ...the new folder naming bug in list view... <hr></blockquote>

    New bug? If you mean that when you make a new folder with &gt;shift&lt;-ctrl-M and start typing it highlights different files/folders which start with the letters of whatever keys you are typing ((instead of typing in the name field of the new folder) I am afraid that has been around for quite a while.

    I even mentioned it on the board once, but I think there was a distracting flame war going on. I noticed the problem when I got 10.0, and it has been around ever since. Sometimes I remember before I type, but most of the time I have to go searching for 'untitled folder'.

    As much as it pains me to say it, since things like this should never be wished upon others, I am glad someone else has noticed this problem. I thought I was the only one.

    <img src="graemlins/hmmm.gif" border="0" alt="[Hmmm]" />

    I can't find the link, but I know I have seen this for over a year.

    [ 01-14-2003: Message edited by: nosey ]</p>
  • Reply 12 of 59
    I would buy 10.3 the optimizations in 10.2 was great and I wouldn't expect anything less in 10.3.
  • Reply 13 of 59
    [quote]Originally posted by nosey:

    <strong>New bug? If you mean that when you make a new folder with &gt;shift&lt;-ctrl-M and start typing it highlights different files/folders which start with the letters of whatever keys you are typing</strong><hr></blockquote>I didn't mean the bug was new; I meant to call it a "new folder" bug. I should have used quotes there to clarify. Anyhow, yes, that's the one. Bugs the crap outta me.

    [ 01-14-2003: Message edited by: Brad ]</p>
  • Reply 14 of 59
    evoevo Posts: 198member
    A subdued Aqua would be nice. Remove the pinstripes, and introduce more subtle greys to make window look less bright white. Just make the OS look more sleek and updated, in a minimalist way.

    The Dock needs to be completely reinvented as well. Better organization is much needed for stored folders and files documents. There needs to be some sort of indication of which App is the frontmost app. There also needs be be some sort of button to mimize all windows so you can get quick access to the desktop (Windows taskbar has had this for years..)

    Speed, speed, speed. Not only does under the hood stuff need to be faster (like App launching or file copying), but the GUI is still sluggish. Menus and windows don't popup instantly, like they do in 9. It always takes a slight pause after I click a button before the resulting action occurs. Call me nitpicky, but all these split seconds add up over time, and I end up getting frustrated with the sluggish GUI. Scrolling and window resizing could definitely use improvement.

    Needless to say, the Finder needs improvement too. The thing crashes whenever I'm doing moderately demanding work in it, like opening multple windows, moving files, etc. I think one way to improve the Finder would be to have a Preview drawer, much like the Preview you get in Column View. Only this drawer would come out on the side of the window, so that you can preview anything in any view, not just Column View. This would also allow you to preview Folders (which you can't do in column view), to see a larger version of its icon, its size, how many items, etc.

    Other minor Finder tweaks I'd like to see as well:

    - "Dock-awareness"

    - ablilty to have small icons in the toolbar

    - alternating background highlighting for List View, like in iTunes (makes lists easier to read)

    - hitting cmd-D on a file in should leave the next thing in the list selected (it currently deselects everything, forcing you to have to use the mouse to select the next item in the list... annoying if you want to delete a bunch of things in a directory one by on)

    - a drawer where you can temporarily plop files while you navigate to a different directory and drop them
  • Reply 15 of 59
    amorphamorph Posts: 7,112member
    I have to agree that the lack of clamoring over 10.3 is mostly due to the fact that Jaguar crossed over an important hump in terms of performance and sophistication. What remains is spit and polish, another round or so of performance tuning, peripherals support (which, to a certain degree, is out of Apple's hands), and a couple of Great Big Features like filesystem metadata.

    For me at least, 10.2.3 passed the Mom test. I finally upgraded my mom's grape iMac at work to OS X. She loves it. Her iBook is next.

    I don't think the interface needs any major overhaul. It does need a raftload of basic (but no less urgent) things like the sort of death-by-a-thousand-cuts bugs in Finder and the file dialogs, and ongoing permissions prickliness.

    [ 01-15-2003: Message edited by: Amorph ]</p>
  • Reply 16 of 59
    nevynnevyn Posts: 360member
    [quote]Originally posted by Amorph:

    <strong>I have to agree that the lack of clamoring over 10.3 is mostly due to the fact that Jaguar crossed over an important hump in terms of performance and sophistication. </strong><hr></blockquote>

    I think that's exactly it. There's a LOT of places that need polish - but all the crucial bits are in. Minimize in Place is one feature that we need RSN

    Speed is always good, Finder always needs help, More localizations (duh), Safari as default -&gt; "Help Viewer" either dies or uses Safari's library. More of the top help files are installed as a default (as profiling determines which are the most requested). More/Better man pages. Perhaps a 'bug' button in the Finder
  • Reply 17 of 59
    baumanbauman Posts: 1,248member
    One feature that was lost in 10.2.3 is an easy dock access keyboard control. It used to be that when I pressed "command-tab" it would switch to the app to the right in the dock. If I held down command, I could then just tap shift to go the opposite way.

    Now, Apple has tried to make it go to the previous app, which doesn't work too well for me (right now I have 13 apps open in my dock). Additionally, to go in the reverse order, I need to keep holding command and press shift-tab, a backwards step in ease of use.

    Really, it's just a little pet peeve of mine, and not very important, but I would like to see them return to that old, reliable app-switching.
  • Reply 18 of 59
    neutrino23neutrino23 Posts: 1,522member
    I second that. 10.2.3 is so good that I no longer worry about the next version. Certainly there are things that could make it better. But it now works so well that I am sometimes in awe just watching all my programs working together without problems. Compare that with last June when window resizing was slow on even the fastest G4s.

    At MWSF I heard from the Epson guys that 10.2.4 will include improvements allowing them to write better drivers. That will be appreciated. I would also like to see a way to drag a window from other places beside the top edge.

    [Edit: I too installed Jaguar on my mom's iMac. Runs great!]

    [ 01-15-2003: Message edited by: neutrino23 ]</p>
  • Reply 19 of 59
    mokimoki Posts: 551member
    [quote]Originally posted by Mac Man 020581:

    <strong>I would buy 10.3 the optimizations in 10.2 was great and I wouldn't expect anything less in 10.3.</strong><hr></blockquote>

    You might even want to expect something more.
  • Reply 20 of 59
    flounderflounder Posts: 2,674member
    [quote]Originally posted by eVo:

    <strong>There needs to be some sort of indication of which App is the frontmost app.</strong><hr></blockquote>

    Ummm, why don't you just look at the menu bar? <img src="graemlins/bugeye.gif" border="0" alt="[Skeptical]" />
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