Yep, nowhere to go but up and still just "pretty good." Offers more features in an attempt to compensate for their lower quality. Far cheaper but not as far as it used to be.
Like the reviews posted by Macworld and CNN, same manufacturer, but Apple as it has done with Intel, they just ends up with a simpler and simply better looking, better quality and better functional product. Like a Movado vs Timex, Volvo vs Hyunda or Mont Blanc vs Waterman.
It is like everything that Apple produces. Just better quality all around. Walk into a top NY ad agency with a bunch of different monitors, and it is amazing how everbody gravitates towards the Apple displays.
Read one reviewer after another, and it basically the same, "the Apple just looks so much better."
Interesting that if the price were the same, like everybody else, I would be that you would undoubtedly take the Apple over the Dell.
You're not on the mark here. Apple's monitors are also "pretty good". But the Dells have been getting better scores on image quality.
I'm more interested in the image looking good than the case.
I wonder just how many "top" ad agencies you have been to. While I've seen plenty of Apple displays on Macs, I see plenty of Dell displays on PC's AND Macs.
Sadly, Apple refuses to put controls on the monitors as other monitor makers do. This makes them very hard to use on the over 90% of computers on the market, severely limiting their appeal. Even in "top" ad agencies, half of the computers are NOT Macs.
Odd, Ive put many side by side... Ive even opened some up and they have the exact same manufactured screens inside the housing... and they cost almost double the price. I love the enclosures on Apple monitors, but id rather pay less for the same quality, a better warranty, and nice little things like telescoping stands and such to make the height i want.
Despite the panels being the same, often the backlight or the power supply are also different. The Apple monitors are very consistent whereas others will fade at the edges or have weird banding particularly in shadows or be over contrasty to make text stand out on Windows. Apple will also set the gamma differently so it matches a Mac better than a PC. One of my bugbears with PC/Mac retail stores in the UK is they often put PC monitors on Macs and then don't change the settings to match it up with the Mac resulting in overly blue displays.
The differences aren't necessarily a few hundred dollars difference but you do know what you're getting with an Apple monitor linked to an Apple computer.
Personally I could care less about the extra inputs and features you get on a Dell. Never going to use them.
You're not on the mark here. Apple's monitors are also "pretty good". But the Dells have been getting better scores on image quality.
I'm more interested in the image looking good than the case.
I wonder just how many "top" ad agencies you have been to. While I've seen plenty of Apple displays on Macs, I see plenty of Dell displays on PC's AND Macs.
Sadly, Apple refuses to put controls on the monitors as other monitor makers do. This makes them very hard to use on the over 90% of computers on the market, severely limiting their appeal. Even in "top" ad agencies, half of the computers are NOT Macs.
DIdn't suggest that Dell's weren't getting better. They just haven't caught up yet. Check the tests.
My word against yours. But for every one you may have been in (if any), count me for 4. That was one of my most recent business ventures. More important, you are going against the stream on this one. Recall some of so-called pundants who claimed that without the creative directors, the Mac would be history.
As the adage states, "the more choices you have, the longer it takes to make a decision."
As you also may notice, there is hardly an innovation that Apple introduces that immediately copies abound declaring superiority because it allows one to make more adjustments. Some good, some great, like MacWrite vs Word. But for many over functioned like Entourage vs Mail.
Hook a Dell monitor to a Dell PC and it looks good. Make many adjustments and 10 others will want to adjust it.
Hook a Dell monitor to a Mac and it looks better. Make many adjustments and 10 others will still try to adjust it.
Hook a Mac monitor to a Dell and it looks even better. Make a few adjustments and 10 others would still want to adjust it.
Hook a Mac monitor to a Mac and it looks fantastic. Try to make an adjustment and 10 others will want to kill you. Now that is functionality.
Despite the panels being the same, often the backlight or the power supply are also different. The Apple monitors are very consistent whereas others will fade at the edges or have weird banding particularly in shadows or be over contrasty to make text stand out on Windows. Apple will also set the gamma differently so it matches a Mac better than a PC. One of my bugbears with PC/Mac retail stores in the UK is they often put PC monitors on Macs and then don't change the settings to match it up with the Mac resulting in overly blue displays.
The differences aren't necessarily a few hundred dollars difference but you do know what you're getting with an Apple monitor linked to an Apple computer.
Personally I could care less about the extra inputs and features you get on a Dell. Never going to use them.
I seem to remember some well publicized problems with Apple's monitors, that we discussed here.
Pink screens, Yellow screens. Uneven brightness, etc.
DIdn't suggest that Dell's weren't getting better. They just haven't caught up yet. Check the tests.
My word against yours. But for every one you may have been in (if any), count me for 4. That was one of my most recent business ventures. More important, you are going against the stream on this one. Recall some of so-called pundants who claimed that without the creative directors, the Mac would be history.
As the adage states, "the more choices you have, the longer it takes to make a decision."
As you also may notice, there is hardly an innovation that Apple introduces that immediately copies abound declaring superiority because it allows one to make more adjustments. Some good, some great, like MacWrite vs Word. But for many over functioned like Entourage vs Mail.
Hook a Dell monitor to a Dell PC and it looks good. Make many adjustments and 10 others will want to adjust it.
Hook a Dell monitor to a Mac and it looks better. Make many adjustments and 10 others will still try to adjust it.
Hook a Mac monitor to a Dell and it looks even better. Make a few adjustments and 10 others would still want to adjust it.
Hook a Mac monitor to a Mac and it looks fantastic. Try to make an adjustment and 10 others will want to kill you. Now that is functionality.
I suppose we can go for one-upmanship, but that was my business for 30 years. Quite a few major ad agebcies were clients of mine.
Perhaps the recently discovered patents having to do with outer edge screen control have more to do with the large screens than small ones. It might be cool to just glide your hand along the edges of your display to increase brightness, decrease volume, etc...
Apple needs the 17 at $249, or even less, and the 20 at $399.
I agree. Costco sells a 20 inch ViewSonic, 5ms Display for $349, and had it on special one week for $299. That's when I bought it. Couldn't resist, but $399 would be a good price for Apple.
I believe the metallic case looks good with the Mac Pro, but Apple could use a 17 and 20 inch in white plastic for the Mac Mini, and lower budgets in general.
I was making the point that Apple start with higher quality components with higher specifications usually but that doesn't mean they are immune to problems. Dell starts with lower quality components which may be equally prone to problems, or more, or less.
In the bicycle world we have the phrase "Cheap, Light, Reliable - Pick two" cf Keith Bontrager and it holds true for computers too mostly.
Often the most reliable products are also dirt cheap, but rarely are they high specification. In the same vein, buying on high specification doesn't guarantee reliability if it's also cheap.
I agree. Costco sells a 20 inch ViewSonic, 5ms Display for $349, and had it on special one week for $299. That's when I bought it. Couldn't resist, but $399 would be a good price for Apple.
Which uses a 6bit display capable of only showing 262144 colours hence the high speed since it's got less to shove about. Great if you're a gamer, not so great if you're using Photoshop.
It depends of course what you want in a monitor so I'm not knocking it but I can't imagine Apple releasing a monitor that isn't up to use with Photoshop, even a 17".
It depends of course what you want in a monitor so I'm not knocking it but I can't imagine Apple releasing a monitor that isn't up to use with Photoshop, even a 17".
I really don't understand that because it looks like they sell a lot more units to consumers than to pros. I don't see a pro buying a new 17" display, but it might be fine for consumers.
It may very well be that Apple doesn't think they can get into the consumer monitor market, if that's their deal, then I can accept that. Monitors are close to being a commodity, it often doesn't matter what model, size or brand, it generally will work with any computer output.
Comments
Yep, nowhere to go but up and still just "pretty good." Offers more features in an attempt to compensate for their lower quality. Far cheaper but not as far as it used to be.
Like the reviews posted by Macworld and CNN, same manufacturer, but Apple as it has done with Intel, they just ends up with a simpler and simply better looking, better quality and better functional product. Like a Movado vs Timex, Volvo vs Hyunda or Mont Blanc vs Waterman.
It is like everything that Apple produces. Just better quality all around. Walk into a top NY ad agency with a bunch of different monitors, and it is amazing how everbody gravitates towards the Apple displays.
Read one reviewer after another, and it basically the same, "the Apple just looks so much better."
Interesting that if the price were the same, like everybody else, I would be that you would undoubtedly take the Apple over the Dell.
You're not on the mark here. Apple's monitors are also "pretty good". But the Dells have been getting better scores on image quality.
I'm more interested in the image looking good than the case.
I wonder just how many "top" ad agencies you have been to. While I've seen plenty of Apple displays on Macs, I see plenty of Dell displays on PC's AND Macs.
Sadly, Apple refuses to put controls on the monitors as other monitor makers do. This makes them very hard to use on the over 90% of computers on the market, severely limiting their appeal. Even in "top" ad agencies, half of the computers are NOT Macs.
17" display, moving on.
What do you have against tiny?
What do you have against tiny?
I live big me
Odd, Ive put many side by side... Ive even opened some up and they have the exact same manufactured screens inside the housing... and they cost almost double the price. I love the enclosures on Apple monitors, but id rather pay less for the same quality, a better warranty, and nice little things like telescoping stands and such to make the height i want.
Despite the panels being the same, often the backlight or the power supply are also different. The Apple monitors are very consistent whereas others will fade at the edges or have weird banding particularly in shadows or be over contrasty to make text stand out on Windows. Apple will also set the gamma differently so it matches a Mac better than a PC. One of my bugbears with PC/Mac retail stores in the UK is they often put PC monitors on Macs and then don't change the settings to match it up with the Mac resulting in overly blue displays.
The differences aren't necessarily a few hundred dollars difference but you do know what you're getting with an Apple monitor linked to an Apple computer.
Personally I could care less about the extra inputs and features you get on a Dell. Never going to use them.
You're not on the mark here. Apple's monitors are also "pretty good". But the Dells have been getting better scores on image quality.
I'm more interested in the image looking good than the case.
I wonder just how many "top" ad agencies you have been to. While I've seen plenty of Apple displays on Macs, I see plenty of Dell displays on PC's AND Macs.
Sadly, Apple refuses to put controls on the monitors as other monitor makers do. This makes them very hard to use on the over 90% of computers on the market, severely limiting their appeal. Even in "top" ad agencies, half of the computers are NOT Macs.
DIdn't suggest that Dell's weren't getting better. They just haven't caught up yet. Check the tests.
My word against yours. But for every one you may have been in (if any), count me for 4. That was one of my most recent business ventures. More important, you are going against the stream on this one. Recall some of so-called pundants who claimed that without the creative directors, the Mac would be history.
As the adage states, "the more choices you have, the longer it takes to make a decision."
As you also may notice, there is hardly an innovation that Apple introduces that immediately copies abound declaring superiority because it allows one to make more adjustments. Some good, some great, like MacWrite vs Word. But for many over functioned like Entourage vs Mail.
Hook a Dell monitor to a Dell PC and it looks good. Make many adjustments and 10 others will want to adjust it.
Hook a Dell monitor to a Mac and it looks better. Make many adjustments and 10 others will still try to adjust it.
Hook a Mac monitor to a Dell and it looks even better. Make a few adjustments and 10 others would still want to adjust it.
Hook a Mac monitor to a Mac and it looks fantastic. Try to make an adjustment and 10 others will want to kill you. Now that is functionality.
Unless it's for a new MacBook Pro I don't see Apple doing this. You just can't have a good Mac experience on a monitor that small.
You can with a res independent OS, which is coming...
Despite the panels being the same, often the backlight or the power supply are also different. The Apple monitors are very consistent whereas others will fade at the edges or have weird banding particularly in shadows or be over contrasty to make text stand out on Windows. Apple will also set the gamma differently so it matches a Mac better than a PC. One of my bugbears with PC/Mac retail stores in the UK is they often put PC monitors on Macs and then don't change the settings to match it up with the Mac resulting in overly blue displays.
The differences aren't necessarily a few hundred dollars difference but you do know what you're getting with an Apple monitor linked to an Apple computer.
Personally I could care less about the extra inputs and features you get on a Dell. Never going to use them.
I seem to remember some well publicized problems with Apple's monitors, that we discussed here.
Pink screens, Yellow screens. Uneven brightness, etc.
I seem to remember some well publicized problems with Apple's monitors, that we discussed here.
Pink screens, Yellow screens. Uneven brightness, etc.
And so have Dell, Samsung and any number of manufacturers. Apple is no more immune from problems than others.
DIdn't suggest that Dell's weren't getting better. They just haven't caught up yet. Check the tests.
My word against yours. But for every one you may have been in (if any), count me for 4. That was one of my most recent business ventures. More important, you are going against the stream on this one. Recall some of so-called pundants who claimed that without the creative directors, the Mac would be history.
As the adage states, "the more choices you have, the longer it takes to make a decision."
As you also may notice, there is hardly an innovation that Apple introduces that immediately copies abound declaring superiority because it allows one to make more adjustments. Some good, some great, like MacWrite vs Word. But for many over functioned like Entourage vs Mail.
Hook a Dell monitor to a Dell PC and it looks good. Make many adjustments and 10 others will want to adjust it.
Hook a Dell monitor to a Mac and it looks better. Make many adjustments and 10 others will still try to adjust it.
Hook a Mac monitor to a Dell and it looks even better. Make a few adjustments and 10 others would still want to adjust it.
Hook a Mac monitor to a Mac and it looks fantastic. Try to make an adjustment and 10 others will want to kill you. Now that is functionality.
I suppose we can go for one-upmanship, but that was my business for 30 years. Quite a few major ad agebcies were clients of mine.
But, you're wrong on the quality issue.
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/...1991548,00.asp
http://www.macworld.com/2005/12/revi...0fpw/index.php
There were more, but I don't have time now to look.
And so have Dell, Samsung and any number of manufacturers. Apple is no more immune from problems than others.
That was the point I was making.
Their prices on the 17 and 20 are still too high.
Apple needs the 17 at $249, or even less, and the 20 at $399.
I agree. Costco sells a 20 inch ViewSonic, 5ms Display for $349, and had it on special one week for $299. That's when I bought it. Couldn't resist, but $399 would be a good price for Apple.
I believe the metallic case looks good with the Mac Pro, but Apple could use a 17 and 20 inch in white plastic for the Mac Mini, and lower budgets in general.
I seem to remember some well publicized problems with Apple's monitors, that we discussed here.
Pink screens, Yellow screens. Uneven brightness, etc.
The dreaded white spots for which I just sent my laptop in and received a shiney new LCD screen.
That was the point I was making.
Was it?
I was making the point that Apple start with higher quality components with higher specifications usually but that doesn't mean they are immune to problems. Dell starts with lower quality components which may be equally prone to problems, or more, or less.
In the bicycle world we have the phrase "Cheap, Light, Reliable - Pick two" cf Keith Bontrager and it holds true for computers too mostly.
Often the most reliable products are also dirt cheap, but rarely are they high specification. In the same vein, buying on high specification doesn't guarantee reliability if it's also cheap.
I agree. Costco sells a 20 inch ViewSonic, 5ms Display for $349, and had it on special one week for $299. That's when I bought it. Couldn't resist, but $399 would be a good price for Apple.
This one... ?
http://www.buy.com/prod/Viewsonic_20...203403537.html
Which uses a 6bit display capable of only showing 262144 colours hence the high speed since it's got less to shove about. Great if you're a gamer, not so great if you're using Photoshop.
It depends of course what you want in a monitor so I'm not knocking it but I can't imagine Apple releasing a monitor that isn't up to use with Photoshop, even a 17".
It depends of course what you want in a monitor so I'm not knocking it but I can't imagine Apple releasing a monitor that isn't up to use with Photoshop, even a 17".
I really don't understand that because it looks like they sell a lot more units to consumers than to pros. I don't see a pro buying a new 17" display, but it might be fine for consumers.
It may very well be that Apple doesn't think they can get into the consumer monitor market, if that's their deal, then I can accept that. Monitors are close to being a commodity, it often doesn't matter what model, size or brand, it generally will work with any computer output.
Cinema Display
Metallic Look
17/19", 20"
Standard Resolution
Usual DVI
and
Cinema Display Pro
Alu Look
20", 23", 30", ???
Bigger and more resoultion
HDMI and other stuff
Photoshop Enalbled
This one... ?
http://www.buy.com/prod/Viewsonic_20...203403537.html
No, this one. I forgot already, it's a 22 inch, model VX2235WM. Costco normal price is $349.99.
http://www.circuitcity.com/ccd/productDetail.do?oid=162158&WT.mc_n=4&WT.mc_t=U&cm _ven=COMPARISON%20SHOPPING&cm_cat=GOOGLE&cm_pla=DA TAFEED->PRODUCTS&cm_ite=1%20PRODUCT&cm_keycode=4
No, this one. I forgot already, it's a 22 inch, model VX2235WM. Costco normal price is $349.99.
http://www.circuitcity.com/ccd/productDetail.do?oid=162158&WT.mc_n=4&WT.mc_t=U&cm _ven=COMPARISON%20SHOPPING&cm_cat=GOOGLE&cm_pla=DA TAFEED->PRODUCTS&cm_ite=1%20PRODUCT&cm_keycode=4
It uses the same 6bit panel. Lots of monitors use that panel...
http://forums.anandtech.com/messagev...readid=1958386
Cheap, Light, Reliable
Quality, Speed, Price: pick any two but you cannot have all three.
That's what we say in filmmaking.