<strong>Hopefully the 970 will be hitting the towers this summer/fall and at that point you KNOW the iMac will be getting a whole lot better.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I hadn't thought of that, lets hope you are right, but do you think the iMacs will get a low end 970 or will they just end up with the 1.42 ghz g4? I mean it seems like they would have to go 970 in the iMac sooner or later but I think Apple will prolly milk it and put 1.42 ghz g4s in the imacs and then later put the 970 so like 6-12 months after the 970 hits power macs the iMac will get the trickle down effect.
That screen is so gorgeous, I could never be mad at you. It's okay baby, I think you have a wonderful price/performance ratio. And more importantly a price/value ratio.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
The 17 inch is definitively a good buy with a decent prize. He is cheaper than the old 17 inch i mac and more powerfull.
And hey, didn't the old iMacs have only 2 USB ports on the back, plus the 2 on the keyboard, for a total of 4? Or am I still drunk?
Here's a shot of the 17" rear:
</strong><hr></blockquote>
The old 17" iMac has 3 usb ports on the back but that audio in jack is new. <img src="graemlins/cancer.gif" border="0" alt="[cancer]" />
They also rearranged the ports, on the old one its power button, mini vga, usb, modem, power cord, ethernet, firewire, speakers, headphones, cable lock
<strong>nosey, and if you wait 10 more months, then you will be able to get even better specs for less...
</strong><hr></blockquote>
If I wait ten month, whatever version of iLife is around will have totally bogged down this sytem so I couldn't do what is important (you know... log on Appleinsider)
I've needed a new computer for two years now, and have only started considering the purchase in the past few months... (due to financial reasons, shotgun wedding proposals, jail, the military... you name it)
And hey, didn't the old iMacs have only 2 USB ports on the back, plus the 2 on the keyboard, for a total of 4? Or am I still drunk?
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I think they had 3 USB ports on the back, plus the 2 on the keyboard, for a total of 4 useable ports with the keyboard plugged in (or 3 useable ports with the keyboard and mouse plugged in).
One of the 3 USB ports on the back also shares its USB controller with the internal modem.
How much does incorporating FW2 into the motherboards, and the case design cost? What about Bluetooth and Airport Extreme? Does the small size and unusual shape of the hardware present any challenges?
<strong>Wow, i think i'm actually stupider for having read this thread. While there isn't enough time to combat all the drivel... </strong><hr></blockquote>
It's not health to even try, dfiler...
Try to look with a blind eye and say something positive.. like, you know "I can't wait for Murbot to get a new machine so I can buy his 12 powerbook!" or something... You know... positive...
Some people have come very close to hitting the nail on the head, but I'll come out and actually say it now:
There's two possibility's about the 15" iMac (both of which I think may very well be true).
1. The 15" wasn't selling pre-update, so they had a lot of stock left. So, rather than waiting any longer for the supply to thin out, they just repackaged it with a slightly larger hard drive and cut the price. Simple way to clear out supply.
2. (This is more of a stretch). If you'll notice, every Apple lineup prior to this update still has an OS 9 boot option (ie, the 15" tibooks and the 'OS 9' Power Macs). Given that the 15 inch iMac doesn't have Airport Extreme and appears to be using the same mobo as before, I wouldn't be surprised if it could boot into OS 9 (same goes for the eMac). Just a hunch though.
okay, my fever FINALLY broke after 2 friggin' days, and the splitting migraine seems to have left right alongside, so i can comment a bit more on all this in a SLIGHTLY more rational state of mind...
murbot, it isn't a bad way to look at it. hell, look at the bottom end imacs from yesterday and today. why is that a good comparison? because it is what apple considers the baseline, stripped-down model of any class.
if i were looking to buy the "bargain basement" apple consumer desktop, yesterday i would have spent CAN$1849. today, i spend CAN$1999. admittedly, that ain't much, especially in US dollars, but considering...
a.) how LONG we have been waiting and
b.) how MUCH the lcd prices dropped
this is NOT a good deal. the 1 ghz models should have been available in november, when they were available for the powerbooks, and people would have scooped them up for Xmas. but i guess i don't know how to run a computer company... and, am i crazy, or is the video the EXACT SAME as it was before (i.e. geforce 2mx for 15", 4mx for 17"?). at least they are a bit more future-proofed (which is what got me to buy my imac back when they first got firewire), so that helps.
but, hey, i'll let sales of the imac in the coming months prove me right.
You guys, for the most part, are a bunch of whining babies! The new 17" iMac is $200 cheaper and has 133mhz bus, DDR, and better graphics. What exactly were you guys expecting? Duals, 1.4Ghz, $400 price cuts? Yea I know apple has not updated the iMac in 13 months, but what can they do, really? Apple has to run on smoke until they get a better CPU. They have been running on smoke for the past 6 months and will continue to do so until the 970 comes out in september or so.
Also, I configured a dell with similar specs and it came to about 300 more. So this iMac really isn't that bad. You guys should stop crying before I get MAD!
rok, you are looking at the range of prices, and that's it? Why bother?
You're purposely ignoring what you get for that money.
Anyway, that $3668 model is just there to make it seem like there are more choices, IMO. They could have just as easily had a 17" model last time around with maxed out RAM, etc too.
I guess you could just say "oh my god top end iMacs are like $3700!!" if you really want to...
Personally, I think dropping a product by $350 and upgrading everything in it is a good thing. To each his own, I suppose.
<strong>rok, you are looking at the range of prices, and that's it? Why bother?
You're purposely ignoring what you get for that money.
Anyway, that $3668 model is just there to make it seem like there are more choices, IMO. They could have just as easily had a 17" model last time around with maxed out RAM, etc too.
I guess you could just say "oh my god top end iMacs are like $3700!!" if you really want to...
Personally, I think dropping a product by $350 and upgrading everything in it is a good thing. To each his own, I suppose.</strong><hr></blockquote>
well, maybe i should take some more time to come down from my sickness, but something about this "update" has got me annoyed. i expected something a bit more enticing than this. i don't think any single person expected them to release a 19" dual ghz ddr ram radeon 9000 imac for US$1500. if they did, they were totally insane.
but if i had the money, i would buy the mid-range tower, buy a sweet 17" lcd from formac (edit: i just noticed that formac hasn't lowered its prices yet on lcds, so apple's are the cheapest of the two... but i don't like apple's policy on "10 dead pixels" and "1-yr. warranty"), and get some cheaper ram from crucial or someplace, and have at least twice the computer for only a little more money.
[quote]if i were looking to buy the "bargain basement" apple consumer desktop, yesterday i would have spent CAN$1849. today, i spend CAN$1999. admittedly, that ain't much, especially in US dollars, but considering... <hr></blockquote>
Perhaps Apple is trying to distinguish the emac and imac. Seems like a good idea considering they were practicly the same price before. Right now the emac is an excellent entry level machine by both price and specs. Wal-Mart sells its Pc's for around $799-999 so any lower priced Mac's may do more harm to the Apple Image then good.
<strong>rok, you are looking at the range of prices, and that's it? Why bother?
You're purposely ignoring what you get for that money.
Anyway, that $3668 model is just there to make it seem like there are more choices, IMO. They could have just as easily had a 17" model last time around with maxed out RAM, etc too.
I guess you could just say "oh my god top end iMacs are like $3700!!" if you really want to...
Personally, I think dropping a product by $350 and upgrading everything in it is a good thing. To each his own, I suppose.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yea, I agree! I wish every one else would just go away. I can't stand all this whining! I like the new iMacs a lot more than the old ones. If you notice apple has been cutting all their prices by about US $200, which is really quite good. The PowerMacs are cheaper, the PowerBooks are cheaper, the iBooks are cheaper, the eMacs are cheaper, and the imacs are cheaper. When the 970 comes out we will see nice performance jumps, but until then just stop crying! GOSH!!!
One thing that would be nice is if Apple upgraded the components they have more control over... I mean, Apple obviously has a good supply of 1 GHz G4s, that's not the problem. And they could supply better graphics than the GeForce 2MX, that is just a slow, old, bad card. I don't think they're running low on 133 MHz motherboards either...
Anyway, it's good to see the iMac get a little refresh, but if Apple would concentrate on improving the components they have control over, then maybe they'd be doing a bit better. Putting a Radeon 9000 in their top end tower is kinda pathetic... I mean, it's almost $3000.
Maybe a boost to graphics cards on all models would be welcome. GeForce 4 Ti or Radeon 9700 on middle and top towers. Radeon 9000 on iMacs and low end PowerMac. Radeon 7500 or GeForce 4MX on eMacs. Why not?
I've been dogging Apple a lot lately (mostly because, much to my chagrin, my new Dell machine is so much better than anything Apple I've used lately). And when I saw the new iMacs this morning, my original impression was pretty negative. But now that I've thought about it, Apple did make some important improvements in these models, like 4X AGP (finally), DDR, 133 Bus, 7200 RPM drive. So maybe we're being just a
-tad- too harsh here.
So will I buy it? No. I think I'll sit tight with my 800 MHz TiBook for now, and possibly upgrade it with a Superdrive from MCE. I'll check in on Apple again when the 970 arrives.
The 15" iMac isn't Its the same damn computer from before only slightly cheaper. The problem is its not the cheapest iMac from before.
Apple has a bad tendency to make you buy features you dont want. Like the combo drive; for a low end model, I know plenty of people who would get by with a simply CD-RW and save the cash. The model may be cheaper than before, but the line is more expensive. I'll try to find a 700MHz if anyone still has them. The 800MHz isn't worth it and I can't afford the 17".
Comments
<strong>OK, I can see how this makes sense now.
A 17" 1GHz iMac is a bit less than a 1GHz Power Mac with 17" Apple Display.
So you choice whether you want AIO or expansion.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Hmm... I'd call $624 US more than "a bit less".
And hey, didn't the old iMacs have only 2 USB ports on the back, plus the 2 on the keyboard, for a total of 4? Or am I still drunk?
Here's a shot of the 17" rear:
Anyone?
[ 02-04-2003: Message edited by: murbot ]</p>
<strong>Hopefully the 970 will be hitting the towers this summer/fall and at that point you KNOW the iMac will be getting a whole lot better.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I hadn't thought of that, lets hope you are right, but do you think the iMacs will get a low end 970 or will they just end up with the 1.42 ghz g4? I mean it seems like they would have to go 970 in the iMac sooner or later but I think Apple will prolly milk it and put 1.42 ghz g4s in the imacs and then later put the 970 so like 6-12 months after the 970 hits power macs the iMac will get the trickle down effect.
<strong>
This whole board is absurb.
Personally, I like the $1799 model.
Ghz, 17inch, 4xSuperdrive, DDR, 7200RPM, 64MB.
That screen is so gorgeous, I could never be mad at you. It's okay baby, I think you have a wonderful price/performance ratio. And more importantly a price/value ratio.
The 17 inch is definitively a good buy with a decent prize. He is cheaper than the old 17 inch i mac and more powerfull.
<strong>
And hey, didn't the old iMacs have only 2 USB ports on the back, plus the 2 on the keyboard, for a total of 4? Or am I still drunk?
Here's a shot of the 17" rear:
</strong><hr></blockquote>
The old 17" iMac has 3 usb ports on the back but that audio in jack is new. <img src="graemlins/cancer.gif" border="0" alt="[cancer]" />
They also rearranged the ports, on the old one its power button, mini vga, usb, modem, power cord, ethernet, firewire, speakers, headphones, cable lock
[ 02-04-2003: Message edited by: Elric ]</p>
<strong>nosey, and if you wait 10 more months, then you will be able to get even better specs for less...
If I wait ten month, whatever version of iLife is around will have totally bogged down this sytem so I couldn't do what is important (you know... log on Appleinsider)
I've needed a new computer for two years now, and have only started considering the purchase in the past few months... (due to financial reasons, shotgun wedding proposals, jail, the military... you name it)
<strong>
And hey, didn't the old iMacs have only 2 USB ports on the back, plus the 2 on the keyboard, for a total of 4? Or am I still drunk?
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I think they had 3 USB ports on the back, plus the 2 on the keyboard, for a total of 4 useable ports with the keyboard plugged in (or 3 useable ports with the keyboard and mouse plugged in).
One of the 3 USB ports on the back also shares its USB controller with the internal modem.
<strong>Wow, i think i'm actually stupider for having read this thread. While there isn't enough time to combat all the drivel... </strong><hr></blockquote>
It's not health to even try, dfiler...
Try to look with a blind eye and say something positive.. like, you know "I can't wait for Murbot to get a new machine so I can buy his 12 powerbook!" or something... You know... positive...
[ 02-04-2003: Message edited by: BuonRotto ]</p>
There's two possibility's about the 15" iMac (both of which I think may very well be true).
1. The 15" wasn't selling pre-update, so they had a lot of stock left. So, rather than waiting any longer for the supply to thin out, they just repackaged it with a slightly larger hard drive and cut the price. Simple way to clear out supply.
2. (This is more of a stretch). If you'll notice, every Apple lineup prior to this update still has an OS 9 boot option (ie, the 15" tibooks and the 'OS 9' Power Macs). Given that the 15 inch iMac doesn't have Airport Extreme and appears to be using the same mobo as before, I wouldn't be surprised if it could boot into OS 9 (same goes for the eMac). Just a hunch though.
murbot, it isn't a bad way to look at it. hell, look at the bottom end imacs from yesterday and today. why is that a good comparison? because it is what apple considers the baseline, stripped-down model of any class.
if i were looking to buy the "bargain basement" apple consumer desktop, yesterday i would have spent CAN$1849. today, i spend CAN$1999. admittedly, that ain't much, especially in US dollars, but considering...
a.) how LONG we have been waiting and
b.) how MUCH the lcd prices dropped
this is NOT a good deal. the 1 ghz models should have been available in november, when they were available for the powerbooks, and people would have scooped them up for Xmas. but i guess i don't know how to run a computer company... and, am i crazy, or is the video the EXACT SAME as it was before (i.e. geforce 2mx for 15", 4mx for 17"?). at least they are a bit more future-proofed (which is what got me to buy my imac back when they first got firewire), so that helps.
but, hey, i'll let sales of the imac in the coming months prove me right.
[ 02-04-2003: Message edited by: rok ]</p>
Also, I configured a dell with similar specs and it came to about 300 more. So this iMac really isn't that bad. You guys should stop crying before I get MAD!
You're purposely ignoring what you get for that money.
Anyway, that $3668 model is just there to make it seem like there are more choices, IMO. They could have just as easily had a 17" model last time around with maxed out RAM, etc too.
I guess you could just say "oh my god top end iMacs are like $3700!!" if you really want to...
Personally, I think dropping a product by $350 and upgrading everything in it is a good thing. To each his own, I suppose.
<strong>rok, you are looking at the range of prices, and that's it? Why bother?
You're purposely ignoring what you get for that money.
Anyway, that $3668 model is just there to make it seem like there are more choices, IMO. They could have just as easily had a 17" model last time around with maxed out RAM, etc too.
I guess you could just say "oh my god top end iMacs are like $3700!!" if you really want to...
Personally, I think dropping a product by $350 and upgrading everything in it is a good thing. To each his own, I suppose.</strong><hr></blockquote>
well, maybe i should take some more time to come down from my sickness, but something about this "update" has got me annoyed. i expected something a bit more enticing than this. i don't think any single person expected them to release a 19" dual ghz ddr ram radeon 9000 imac for US$1500. if they did, they were totally insane.
but if i had the money, i would buy the mid-range tower, buy a sweet 17" lcd from formac (edit: i just noticed that formac hasn't lowered its prices yet on lcds, so apple's are the cheapest of the two... but i don't like apple's policy on "10 dead pixels" and "1-yr. warranty"), and get some cheaper ram from crucial or someplace, and have at least twice the computer for only a little more money.
[ 02-04-2003: Message edited by: rok ]</p>
[quote]if i were looking to buy the "bargain basement" apple consumer desktop, yesterday i would have spent CAN$1849. today, i spend CAN$1999. admittedly, that ain't much, especially in US dollars, but considering... <hr></blockquote>
Perhaps Apple is trying to distinguish the emac and imac. Seems like a good idea considering they were practicly the same price before. Right now the emac is an excellent entry level machine by both price and specs. Wal-Mart sells its Pc's for around $799-999 so any lower priced Mac's may do more harm to the Apple Image then good.
[ 02-04-2003: Message edited by: jayny ]</p>
<strong>rok, you are looking at the range of prices, and that's it? Why bother?
You're purposely ignoring what you get for that money.
Anyway, that $3668 model is just there to make it seem like there are more choices, IMO. They could have just as easily had a 17" model last time around with maxed out RAM, etc too.
I guess you could just say "oh my god top end iMacs are like $3700!!" if you really want to...
Personally, I think dropping a product by $350 and upgrading everything in it is a good thing. To each his own, I suppose.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yea, I agree! I wish every one else would just go away. I can't stand all this whining! I like the new iMacs a lot more than the old ones. If you notice apple has been cutting all their prices by about US $200, which is really quite good. The PowerMacs are cheaper, the PowerBooks are cheaper, the iBooks are cheaper, the eMacs are cheaper, and the imacs are cheaper. When the 970 comes out we will see nice performance jumps, but until then just stop crying! GOSH!!!
Anyway, it's good to see the iMac get a little refresh, but if Apple would concentrate on improving the components they have control over, then maybe they'd be doing a bit better. Putting a Radeon 9000 in their top end tower is kinda pathetic... I mean, it's almost $3000.
Maybe a boost to graphics cards on all models would be welcome. GeForce 4 Ti or Radeon 9700 on middle and top towers. Radeon 9000 on iMacs and low end PowerMac. Radeon 7500 or GeForce 4MX on eMacs. Why not?
[ 02-04-2003: Message edited by: Luca Rescigno ]</p>
-tad- too harsh here.
So will I buy it? No. I think I'll sit tight with my 800 MHz TiBook for now, and possibly upgrade it with a Superdrive from MCE. I'll check in on Apple again when the 970 arrives.
The 15" iMac isn't Its the same damn computer from before only slightly cheaper. The problem is its not the cheapest iMac from before.
Apple has a bad tendency to make you buy features you dont want. Like the combo drive; for a low end model, I know plenty of people who would get by with a simply CD-RW and save the cash. The model may be cheaper than before, but the line is more expensive. I'll try to find a 700MHz if anyone still has them. The 800MHz isn't worth it and I can't afford the 17".