I don't like the tone of this article. It makes it sound like people are being "victimized" by Apple for pricing their handset at a price that makes it unaffordable to most.
In a related news item, I am launching a campaign against Bugatti for pricing the Veyron beyond the reaches of my meager income. How dare they!
Instead of $1.25 million, why not $12,500?
C'mon Apple, make something crappy and price it at $49.99 or, better yet, FREE!
At the rate the iPhone keeps priced droppig it won't be long before you can get damn near close to free. So much for Apple or SJ thinking a smart phone would ever be worth 600.00 to anyone other the koolaid drinkers. Even better then they get all pissed when the phone prices drops like a rock.
At the rate the iPhone keeps priced droppig it won't be long before you can get damn near close to free. So much for Apple or SJ thinking a smart phone would ever be worth 600.00 to anyone other the koolaid drinkers. Even better then they get all pissed when the phone prices drops like a rock.
the iphone 3G actually got more expensive! it's not gotten cheaper!!!
and used prices on ebay won't decline much either! since there's no grey marked for iphone 3G's anymore the iphone 2G will keep it's value!!!
the "cheaper" the iphone, the more expensive the plan you have to get with it, the more you will spend over the 24 months or so....!!!!!!
your one of those typical lease people that only see the "money down" and monthly rate, but fail to calculate the full cost for the contract... if you get an iphone for $1-199, and add the monthly cost, you will notice that the old plans for the iphone 2G will actually be cheaper than the iphone 3G...
my businnes info is my email signature. and i send photos with my iphone... next iphone osX releases will for sure include the ability to edit and send office/iwork documents... just a question of time... for the old and new iphone... since both have the same prozessor there's no need to fear that apple will not upgrade the "old" iphone with the new features....
Slight tap dance while hopeful for the future. I guess we will see what shakes down the tree. You say for sure. Do you know this for sure or are you hopeful, for sure? Which sort of proves my point about the iPhone not being much of a smart phone, at least in my opinion.
I Guess Myself, I Don't Know If I'm Happy That The Contract Price Went Down, Or The Prepaid Price Went Up? I Think One Of The Reason Jobs Looks Under The Weather Is That He Can't Figure Out How To Please Everyone. Which No Human Can.
By The Way, Many People Around The World Face Much Bigger Problems, No One Is Putting A Gun To Your Head And Forcing You To Buy An Iphone. If All Apple Products Turned Into Salt Tomorrow, The World Would (probably) Go On. For Better Or Worse, That's Up To The People.
'Fast and loose' is right. Since when did you, Nokia, and wikipedia (enough already) become experts on the term 'smartphone?'
It is simply a term that refers to a category of devices that goes (ok, slightly significantly) beyond being able to make, receive, and store phone calls.
'Fast and loose' is right. Since when did you, Nokia, and wikipedia (enough already) become experts on the term 'smartphone?'
The Wikipedia page, which he posted, does give a very objective definition of a smartphone. It even has a quote from David Wood, EVP at Symbian,giving a very diplomatic definition which places the iPhone within the smartphone category.
There is also plenty of comments on the Discussion page trying to figure out how it shoud be defined and what does and does not fall into the category. I bet we could go through the History and find some editing wars regarding the iPhone in this category.
'Fast and loose' is right. Since when did you, Nokia, and wikipedia (enough already) become experts on the term 'smartphone?'
It is simply a term that refers to a category of devices that goes (ok, slightly significantly) beyond being able to make, receive, and store phone calls.
Move on.....
Good thing, I do not take orders from you so I will stay put. I never said I was an expert, you seemed to have made that assumption all by yourself. I caveated (go look it up) my statements as opinions (which I am entitled to have last time I looked), and even went so far as to say that it appears the iPhone is many things to many people with the possible intention that Apple left it that way. With that being said, considering I have purchased, had purchased for me, had loaned to me, just about every smartphone on the market since their inception, I would say this makes me a fair judge of what does and does not constitute a smart phone (I did not say expert. I once again leave the jumping of conclusions to you). If this particular discussion is not to your liking, I kindly invite you to "move on" as you say. Thanks for stopping by.
Hmmmmm, another price gouge by Apple- not really surprising anymore. I am starting to think they may be worse than Msoft after all these ridiculous price increases. Jobs has really gone downhill.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mowenbrown
$600? That is insane. Although I guess it'll mean they'll have resalve value after a year when the new model comes out.
I'm going to assume you both live in the USA. Nearly every single phone purchased from a carrier is sold subsidized, whether you signing up for a a new contract or you are eligible for an "upgrade" after a year into your contract. If you buy a new phone from the carrier before you are eligible for an upgrade, or if you buy one from a third party provider, you will be paying the full retail price. Full retail prices for modern smartphones are much higher than subsidized contract pricing. $600 is certainly not unheard of for an iPhone 3G sold unsubsidized. Here's some data:
I averaged the prices from Google Product Search (4 stars or higher online stores):
HTC touch Diamond = $650 - $730
Sony Ericsson Xperia X1 = $899 - $999
HTC Touch Dual = $550 - $650
HTC TyTN II = $600 -$750
Nokia N95 8GB = $650 - $700
Samsung F700 = $475- $500
Blackberry 9000 (Bold) = $650-$700
Nokia E71 = $600 - $700
Nokia N78 = $500 - $600
Nokia E90 = $720-800
These are prices for popular smartphones sold from AT&T *WITHOUT CONTRACT*
BlackBerry 8820 = $500
Palm Treo 750 = $500
AT&T Tilt = $550
LG VU = $450
These prices are for popular smartphones sold from Verizon Wireless *WITHOUT CONTRACT*
Verizon Wireless
Palm 700WX = $600
VZW XV6800/ HTC Tytn = $540
Samsung SCH-i760 = $490
HTC Touch v1 = $450
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hutcho
Anyone that says this device is over priced at $600 simply doesn't know what they are talking about. $600 is an excellent price for such a phone, and is priced in my cases under it's inferior competitors, like the Blackberry and the Nokia N95 for example.
I'm going to assume you both live in the USA. Nearly every single phone purchased from a carrier is sold subsidized, whether you signing up for a a new contract or you are eligible for an "upgrade" after a year into your contract. If you buy a new phone from the carrier before you are eligible for an upgrade, or if you buy one from a third party provider, you will be paying the full retail price. Full retail prices for modern smartphones are much higher than subsidized contract pricing. $600 is certainly not unheard of for an iPhone 3G sold unsubsidized. Here's some data:
I averaged the prices from Google Product Search (4 stars or higher online stores):
HTC touch Diamond = $650 - $730
Sony Ericsson Xperia X1 = $899 - $999
HTC Touch Dual = $550 - $650
HTC TyTN II = $600 -$750
Nokia N95 8GB = $650 - $700
Samsung F700 = $475- $500
Blackberry 9000 (Bold) = $650-$700
Nokia E71 = $600 - $700
Nokia N78 = $500 - $600
Nokia E90 = $720-800
These are prices for popular smartphones sold from AT&T *WITHOUT CONTRACT*
BlackBerry 8820 = $500
Palm Treo 750 = $500
AT&T Tilt = $550
LG VU = $450
These prices are for popular smartphones sold from Verizon Wireless *WITHOUT CONTRACT*
Verizon Wireless
Palm 700WX = $600
VZW XV6800/ HTC Tytn = $540
Samsung SCH-i760 = $490
HTC Touch v1 = $450
exactly...
Nice catch winterspan. You can also go to www.verkkokauppa.com for the prices currently paid here in Finland. They give an approximate price across Europe. $600 for an iPhone. Hell, I might buy two of them if they can be unlocked or purchased that way in the first place.
Nice catch winterspan. You can also go to www.verkkokauppa.com for the prices currently paid here in Finland. They give an approximate price across Europe. $600 for an iPhone. Hell, I might buy two of them if they can be unlocked or purchased that way in the first place.
Ok cool. Oh, and I'm sure the new iPhone will continue to be hacked for unlocking. Even though in the USA there is not another compatible UMTS carrier than AT&T, people will still want to be able to use a local SIM card when traveling. And I'm sure some will want to use the iPhone on pay-as-you-go plans which will most likely not be offered by AT&T.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OriginalMacRat
Oh really? My Sony Ericsson P800, P910 and P990 "just work" with T-Mobile SIM cards.
I bet they won't connect to T-Mobiles 3G network however...
Ok cool. Oh, and I'm sure the new iPhone will continue to be hacked for unlocking. Even though in the USA there is not another compatible UMTS carrier than AT&T, people will still want to be able to use a local SIM card when traveling. And I'm sure some will want to use the iPhone on pay-as-you-go plans which will most likely not be offered by AT&T.
I bet they won't connect to T-Mobiles 3G network however...
If they are using the same technology, they should connect, unless there is an operator block going on. This is what is so stupid about the US market, which makes it look third world. GSM was supposed to make thing ubiquitous, not create more headaches for the consumer.
My reply had nothing to do with 3G. The original poster tried to claim that T-Mobile uses non-standard frequencies that phones don't support.
He specifically stated "non standard EDGE/GSM" which is wrong, but I am sure he meant UTMS. I've read many of his posts among varying boards and I'm certain it was just a brain fart (or whatever these cal it these days), not a lack of understanding.
If they are using the same technology, they should connect, unless there is an operator block going on. This is what is so stupid about the US market, which makes it look third world. GSM was supposed to make thing ubiquitous, not create more headaches for the consumer.
For GSM/EDGE, most newer phones support all the popular bands in use. However, T-mobile's 3G network uses the very rare UMTS "band IV" that runs the uplink over 1700mhz. This UMTS/HSPA band is NOT supported by 99% of UMTS phones, in fact I don't think there is any other major carrier in the world using 1700mhz UMTS.
For GSM/EDGE, most newer phones support all the popular bands in use. However, T-mobile's 3G network uses the very rare UMTS "band IV" that runs the uplink over 1700mhz. This UMTS/HSPA band is NOT supported by 99% of UMTS phones, in fact I don't think there is any other major carrier in the world using 1700mhz UMTS.
i agree, i even think there's not one phone out on the market that supports umts 1700 right now...
hopefully there will be a move to quad band umts chips... supporting all continents and GSM (EDGE/GPRS) & UMTS-bands...
My Sony Ericsson P800, P910 and P990 "just work" with T-Mobile SIM cards.
Quote:
Originally Posted by winterspan
I bet they won't connect to T-Mobiles 3G network however...
FYI,
Just found out that T-Mobile has turned on their 3G in the San Francisco bay area.
I dropped my SIM in the P990, called T-Mobile for their auto config SMS and the P990 "just works" on their 3G network. I did a speed test and got 200kps. (the previous GPRS was only 30kbs.
Just found out that T-Mobile has turned on their 3G in the San Francisco bay area.
I dropped my SIM in the P990, called T-Mobile for their auto config SMS and the P990 "just works" on their 3G network. I did a speed test and got 200kps. (the previous GPRS was only 30kbs.
Why do you think that is T-Mobile's 3G, and not their EDGE network. I consistently get 200kbps on EDGE on AT&T, with my 3G speeds being considerably faster. What network does the phone state you are on?
Comments
I don't like the tone of this article. It makes it sound like people are being "victimized" by Apple for pricing their handset at a price that makes it unaffordable to most.
In a related news item, I am launching a campaign against Bugatti for pricing the Veyron beyond the reaches of my meager income. How dare they!
Instead of $1.25 million, why not $12,500?
C'mon Apple, make something crappy and price it at $49.99 or, better yet, FREE!
At the rate the iPhone keeps priced droppig it won't be long before you can get damn near close to free. So much for Apple or SJ thinking a smart phone would ever be worth 600.00 to anyone other the koolaid drinkers. Even better then they get all pissed when the phone prices drops like a rock.
At the rate the iPhone keeps priced droppig it won't be long before you can get damn near close to free. So much for Apple or SJ thinking a smart phone would ever be worth 600.00 to anyone other the koolaid drinkers. Even better then they get all pissed when the phone prices drops like a rock.
the iphone 3G actually got more expensive! it's not gotten cheaper!!!
and used prices on ebay won't decline much either! since there's no grey marked for iphone 3G's anymore the iphone 2G will keep it's value!!!
the "cheaper" the iphone, the more expensive the plan you have to get with it, the more you will spend over the 24 months or so....!!!!!!
your one of those typical lease people that only see the "money down" and monthly rate, but fail to calculate the full cost for the contract... if you get an iphone for $1-199, and add the monthly cost, you will notice that the old plans for the iphone 2G will actually be cheaper than the iphone 3G...
my businnes info is my email signature. and i send photos with my iphone... next iphone osX releases will for sure include the ability to edit and send office/iwork documents... just a question of time... for the old and new iphone... since both have the same prozessor there's no need to fear that apple will not upgrade the "old" iphone with the new features....
Slight tap dance while hopeful for the future. I guess we will see what shakes down the tree. You say for sure. Do you know this for sure or are you hopeful, for sure? Which sort of proves my point about the iPhone not being much of a smart phone, at least in my opinion.
I Guess Myself, I Don't Know If I'm Happy That The Contract Price Went Down, Or The Prepaid Price Went Up? I Think One Of The Reason Jobs Looks Under The Weather Is That He Can't Figure Out How To Please Everyone. Which No Human Can.
By The Way, Many People Around The World Face Much Bigger Problems, No One Is Putting A Gun To Your Head And Forcing You To Buy An Iphone. If All Apple Products Turned Into Salt Tomorrow, The World Would (probably) Go On. For Better Or Worse, That's Up To The People.
Yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That is not insane you putz... If you remember correctly last June Apple was selling an inferior, slower, 8GB IPHONE without GPS for $599.
It makes sense for apple to make nice with AT&T since AT&T is paying them over $200 per phone.
$199 is the magic price for alot of people to buy an IPHONE.. .$600 is the price unlockers will have to pay.
Makes sense to me.
Reason number 326 I am sticking with T-Mobile! Poo on Apple and an extra helping of Poo for AT&T!
Here is a fast an loose definition of a smartphone:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smartphone
For me a smartphone is one that has similar features found here:
http://www.nokia.co.uk/A4688582
and here: http://www.nokia.co.uk/A4368371
finally here:
http://www.nokia.co.uk/A4353372
'Fast and loose' is right. Since when did you, Nokia, and wikipedia (enough already) become experts on the term 'smartphone?'
It is simply a term that refers to a category of devices that goes (ok, slightly significantly) beyond being able to make, receive, and store phone calls.
Move on.....
'Fast and loose' is right. Since when did you, Nokia, and wikipedia (enough already) become experts on the term 'smartphone?'
The Wikipedia page, which he posted, does give a very objective definition of a smartphone. It even has a quote from David Wood, EVP at Symbian,giving a very diplomatic definition which places the iPhone within the smartphone category.
There is also plenty of comments on the Discussion page trying to figure out how it shoud be defined and what does and does not fall into the category. I bet we could go through the History and find some editing wars regarding the iPhone in this category.
'Fast and loose' is right. Since when did you, Nokia, and wikipedia (enough already) become experts on the term 'smartphone?'
It is simply a term that refers to a category of devices that goes (ok, slightly significantly) beyond being able to make, receive, and store phone calls.
Move on.....
Good thing, I do not take orders from you so I will stay put. I never said I was an expert, you seemed to have made that assumption all by yourself. I caveated (go look it up) my statements as opinions (which I am entitled to have last time I looked), and even went so far as to say that it appears the iPhone is many things to many people with the possible intention that Apple left it that way. With that being said, considering I have purchased, had purchased for me, had loaned to me, just about every smartphone on the market since their inception, I would say this makes me a fair judge of what does and does not constitute a smart phone (I did not say expert. I once again leave the jumping of conclusions to you). If this particular discussion is not to your liking, I kindly invite you to "move on" as you say. Thanks for stopping by.
Hmmmmm, another price gouge by Apple- not really surprising anymore. I am starting to think they may be worse than Msoft after all these ridiculous price increases. Jobs has really gone downhill.
$600? That is insane. Although I guess it'll mean they'll have resalve value after a year when the new model comes out.
I'm going to assume you both live in the USA. Nearly every single phone purchased from a carrier is sold subsidized, whether you signing up for a a new contract or you are eligible for an "upgrade" after a year into your contract. If you buy a new phone from the carrier before you are eligible for an upgrade, or if you buy one from a third party provider, you will be paying the full retail price. Full retail prices for modern smartphones are much higher than subsidized contract pricing. $600 is certainly not unheard of for an iPhone 3G sold unsubsidized. Here's some data:
I averaged the prices from Google Product Search (4 stars or higher online stores):
HTC touch Diamond = $650 - $730
Sony Ericsson Xperia X1 = $899 - $999
HTC Touch Dual = $550 - $650
HTC TyTN II = $600 -$750
Nokia N95 8GB = $650 - $700
Samsung F700 = $475- $500
Blackberry 9000 (Bold) = $650-$700
Nokia E71 = $600 - $700
Nokia N78 = $500 - $600
Nokia E90 = $720-800
These are prices for popular smartphones sold from AT&T *WITHOUT CONTRACT*
BlackBerry 8820 = $500
Palm Treo 750 = $500
AT&T Tilt = $550
LG VU = $450
These prices are for popular smartphones sold from Verizon Wireless *WITHOUT CONTRACT*
Verizon Wireless
Palm 700WX = $600
VZW XV6800/ HTC Tytn = $540
Samsung SCH-i760 = $490
HTC Touch v1 = $450
Anyone that says this device is over priced at $600 simply doesn't know what they are talking about. $600 is an excellent price for such a phone, and is priced in my cases under it's inferior competitors, like the Blackberry and the Nokia N95 for example.
exactly...
I'm going to assume you both live in the USA. Nearly every single phone purchased from a carrier is sold subsidized, whether you signing up for a a new contract or you are eligible for an "upgrade" after a year into your contract. If you buy a new phone from the carrier before you are eligible for an upgrade, or if you buy one from a third party provider, you will be paying the full retail price. Full retail prices for modern smartphones are much higher than subsidized contract pricing. $600 is certainly not unheard of for an iPhone 3G sold unsubsidized. Here's some data:
I averaged the prices from Google Product Search (4 stars or higher online stores):
HTC touch Diamond = $650 - $730
Sony Ericsson Xperia X1 = $899 - $999
HTC Touch Dual = $550 - $650
HTC TyTN II = $600 -$750
Nokia N95 8GB = $650 - $700
Samsung F700 = $475- $500
Blackberry 9000 (Bold) = $650-$700
Nokia E71 = $600 - $700
Nokia N78 = $500 - $600
Nokia E90 = $720-800
These are prices for popular smartphones sold from AT&T *WITHOUT CONTRACT*
BlackBerry 8820 = $500
Palm Treo 750 = $500
AT&T Tilt = $550
LG VU = $450
These prices are for popular smartphones sold from Verizon Wireless *WITHOUT CONTRACT*
Verizon Wireless
Palm 700WX = $600
VZW XV6800/ HTC Tytn = $540
Samsung SCH-i760 = $490
HTC Touch v1 = $450
exactly...
Nice catch winterspan. You can also go to www.verkkokauppa.com for the prices currently paid here in Finland. They give an approximate price across Europe. $600 for an iPhone. Hell, I might buy two of them if they can be unlocked or purchased that way in the first place.
T-Mobile uses non-standard frequencies for their GSM/EDGE network
Oh really?
My Sony Ericsson P800, P910 and P990 "just work" with T-Mobile SIM cards.
Nice catch winterspan. You can also go to www.verkkokauppa.com for the prices currently paid here in Finland. They give an approximate price across Europe. $600 for an iPhone. Hell, I might buy two of them if they can be unlocked or purchased that way in the first place.
Ok cool. Oh, and I'm sure the new iPhone will continue to be hacked for unlocking. Even though in the USA there is not another compatible UMTS carrier than AT&T, people will still want to be able to use a local SIM card when traveling. And I'm sure some will want to use the iPhone on pay-as-you-go plans which will most likely not be offered by AT&T.
Oh really? My Sony Ericsson P800, P910 and P990 "just work" with T-Mobile SIM cards.
I bet they won't connect to T-Mobiles 3G network however...
Ok cool. Oh, and I'm sure the new iPhone will continue to be hacked for unlocking. Even though in the USA there is not another compatible UMTS carrier than AT&T, people will still want to be able to use a local SIM card when traveling. And I'm sure some will want to use the iPhone on pay-as-you-go plans which will most likely not be offered by AT&T.
I bet they won't connect to T-Mobiles 3G network however...
If they are using the same technology, they should connect, unless there is an operator block going on. This is what is so stupid about the US market, which makes it look third world. GSM was supposed to make thing ubiquitous, not create more headaches for the consumer.
Oh really?
My Sony Ericsson P800, P910 and P990 "just work" with T-Mobile SIM cards.
I bet they won't connect to T-Mobiles 3G network however...
My reply had nothing to do with 3G. The original poster tried to claim that T-Mobile uses non-standard frequencies that phones don't support.
My reply had nothing to do with 3G. The original poster tried to claim that T-Mobile uses non-standard frequencies that phones don't support.
He specifically stated "non standard EDGE/GSM" which is wrong, but I am sure he meant UTMS. I've read many of his posts among varying boards and I'm certain it was just a brain fart (or whatever these cal it these days), not a lack of understanding.
If they are using the same technology, they should connect, unless there is an operator block going on. This is what is so stupid about the US market, which makes it look third world. GSM was supposed to make thing ubiquitous, not create more headaches for the consumer.
For GSM/EDGE, most newer phones support all the popular bands in use. However, T-mobile's 3G network uses the very rare UMTS "band IV" that runs the uplink over 1700mhz. This UMTS/HSPA band is NOT supported by 99% of UMTS phones, in fact I don't think there is any other major carrier in the world using 1700mhz UMTS.
For GSM/EDGE, most newer phones support all the popular bands in use. However, T-mobile's 3G network uses the very rare UMTS "band IV" that runs the uplink over 1700mhz. This UMTS/HSPA band is NOT supported by 99% of UMTS phones, in fact I don't think there is any other major carrier in the world using 1700mhz UMTS.
i agree, i even think there's not one phone out on the market that supports umts 1700 right now...
hopefully there will be a move to quad band umts chips... supporting all continents and GSM (EDGE/GPRS) & UMTS-bands...
Oh really?
My Sony Ericsson P800, P910 and P990 "just work" with T-Mobile SIM cards.
I bet they won't connect to T-Mobiles 3G network however...
FYI,
Just found out that T-Mobile has turned on their 3G in the San Francisco bay area.
I dropped my SIM in the P990, called T-Mobile for their auto config SMS and the P990 "just works" on their 3G network. I did a speed test and got 200kps. (the previous GPRS was only 30kbs.
FYI,
Just found out that T-Mobile has turned on their 3G in the San Francisco bay area.
I dropped my SIM in the P990, called T-Mobile for their auto config SMS and the P990 "just works" on their 3G network. I did a speed test and got 200kps. (the previous GPRS was only 30kbs.
Why do you think that is T-Mobile's 3G, and not their EDGE network. I consistently get 200kbps on EDGE on AT&T, with my 3G speeds being considerably faster. What network does the phone state you are on?