i am super pissed i just got a macbook in nov the white one... and now they upgrade it WTF, why does apple do this? i am gonna try to sell mine on craigslist, or something. this pisses me off...
Breaking news! Computers get faster all the time and what you buy now will be out of date soon. Get used to it!
Anyone know definitively if this new MB is still toxic or not?
I'd guess this hinges on whether they've upgraded the display or not. With this motherboard change (which doubtless is a toxic-free MB) they've most likely updated all the cabling to non-toxic as well. That would leave the display and backlight as a potential source of toxic chemicals.
i am super pissed i just got a macbook in nov the white one... and now they upgrade it WTF, why does apple do this? i am gonna try to sell mine on craigslist, or something. this pisses me off...
Yeah, Apple should keep the same old hardware for decades, just so they don't upset anyone who purchased the older hardware. They should have called you to make sure you were okay with them building a better computer.
Your lesson is this: don't ever buy a new computer, because after you do, a better one will come along. Just keep waiting.
Yeah, Apple should keep the same old hardware for decades, just so they don't upset anyone who purchased the older hardware. They should have called you to make sure you were okay with them building a better computer.
Your lesson is this: don't ever buy a new computer, because after you do, a better one will come along. Just keep waiting.
im just sayin that it should have all been introdced at once
The more I think about this (yes, I've been stewing over this all morning, can you tell?)...
I may just make one of these new whitebooks my "mini". I need better graphics than the X3100 in my Late 2007 blackbook so my kid can play games like Spore, etc. I'm thinking that he could use a new whitebook with better graphics in clamshell mode in the same way he's been using my blackbook in clamshell mode, but this way I'd get my MacBook back.
The current mini with 2.0 GHz Core2Duo, 1GB (no SR), SuperDrive, GMA950, and FW400 is eight benjamins; this has the option to be portable and has basically the same specs or better for two benjamins more (2.0 GHz, 2GB, SuperDrive, 9400M, 13" LCD, FW400).
OTOH, it'd be my luck that AAPL would update the mini 15 days after I bought one of these...
Regardless, I think they are going to sell truckloads of these at the $999 price point.
No. DDR3 uses a different voltage and has a different number of pins. Whilst the chipset can support DDR3, it has to be hard-wired on the motherboard as such, the correct power supply must be provided on the motherboard for the RAM, and the correct slots must be used.
The I/O data rate bumps from 333Mhz [DDR2-667Mhz] to 533Mhz [DDR3-1066Mhz], while the Power consumptions drops by 30% nominally. The Memory clock for DDR2-667Mhz is 166Mhz. The Memory clock for DDR3-1066Mhz is 133Mhz which can account for the reduction in power consumption.
You would think that anybody who has been complaining about the New MacBooks sans FireWire would be happy. But then who the hell would be so stupid to think that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_lha
A pretty nice upgrade really, especially if you don't care about the case and want Firewire..
I want FW and the better trackpad, dammit! And a personal jet pack. And a pony.
But seriously, I don't want a 15" notebook, I want all the rest of the new machine and fracking FW already.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2
I the "stupid conclusion" that was meant, was that this configuration was intentionally crippled by Apple.
Why do people always have to immediately assume Apple is "up to no good" when they have never shown any such indications throughout the entire life of the company? As far as corporations go, Apple is one of the most responsible and the most customer focussed, they have ridiculously high levels of customer service, excellent reviews by those same customers and are pretty good to their employees overall. I just don't understand why so many people's first reactions to something Apple has done is to assume some nefarious plot is in the works.
Apple is NOT up to NO good. They're up to Apple's good, and mgmt has long seen that as being served by "line differentiation" -- making you buy a bunch of features you don't want in order to get one or two you do, e.g., in this case, a bigger form factor, another video card, etc. to get Firewire.
It's like "packs" on cars. Want the heated seats? Sorry, only available with the moon roof and spoiler package. etc.
Not moral or immoral. More amoral. And has always PO'd me at Apple as they do it more than most hardware manufacturers.
The I/O data rate bumps from 333Mhz [DDR2-667Mhz] to 533Mhz [DDR3-1066Mhz], while the Power consumptions drops by 30% nominally. The Memory clock for DDR2-667Mhz is 166Mhz. The Memory clock for DDR3-1066Mhz is 133Mhz which can account for the reduction in power consumption.
Thanks for this. Hadn't fully appreciated that the memory clock is lower for 1066 DDR3 vs. 667 DDR2; whilst this does contribute to the lower power consumption, the main factor is the lower voltage (DDR2 =1.8 V, DDR3 = 1.5 V).
There's a typo in your post above - DDR3 is still "double data rate" (somewhat of a misnomer now), not "triple data rate".
Thanks for this. Hadn't fully appreciated that the memory clock is lower for 1066 DDR3 vs. 667 DDR2; whilst this does contribute to the lower power consumption, the main factor is the lower voltage (DDR2 =1.8 V, DDR3 = 1.5 V).
There's a typo in your post above - DDR3 is still "double data rate" (somewhat of a misnomer now), not "triple data rate".
My apologies. I thought I'd edited that portion. And since the Voltage rate is Periodic, the lower frequency means a longer period and thus they are mutually dependent variables on the power consumption.
I think this is a good sign that Apple sees it needs to be more competitive with it's low-end models.
Hopefully we will see a well specd Mac mini for $499 or $599.
I think that Apple should offer a black version of this model and NOT charge more. I think they would sell a lot of them. White is just not cool for most users who are not kids!
This would do a lot to make it more attractive to more people. If you can not afford the 1300-1600 bucks for a MacBook you might have the 925.00 ( discount) for an awesome black one WITH firewire 400!!!
im just sayin that it should have all been introdced at once
Yeah, that's a good point - it would have been better to improve the plastic MacBook at the same time as introducing the newer ones (just two months ago). I didn't think of that part of it.
... Apple is NOT up to NO good. They're up to Apple's good, and mgmt has long seen that as being served by "line differentiation" -- making you buy a bunch of features you don't want in order to get one or two you do, e.g., in this case, a bigger form factor, another video card, etc. to get Firewire.
It's like "packs" on cars. Want the heated seats? Sorry, only available with the moon roof and spoiler package. etc.
Not moral or immoral. More amoral. And has always PO'd me at Apple as they do it more than most hardware manufacturers.
We'll have to disagree on this one.
I don't buy the premise that "business is business" or some such and not morally or ethically concerned. If you are in the business of making consumer products and actively trying to screw the consumers for the single reason of more cash, then (IMO) you are "up to no good" and not being very smart business-wise to boot. In other words I don't believe that the presence of capitalism makes moral or ethical behaviour irrelevant.
I also have to disagree strongly that "Apple (does) it more than most hardware manufacturers." I've never seen any evidence of that, and have to assume this slight is in your own head, as opposed to anything objectively real.
The business of a business, is not just to make money, it's to do the work or provide the service or product that it's in business for. Originally, most businesses had creeds or mandates attached to them by the founders expressly for the purpose of making sure that all the workers *knew* what they were in business for.
People who think business is "just about the money" are missing a very basic point, (and a great deal of life in general), and are doomed (eventually) to a life of waste, corruption and loneliness IMO.
I don't buy the premise that "business is business" or some such and not morally or ethically concerned. If you are in the business of making consumer products and actively trying to screw the consumers for the single reason of more cash, then (IMO) you are "up to no good" and not being very smart business-wise to boot. In other words I don't believe that the presence of capitalism makes moral or ethical behaviour irrelevant.
I also have to disagree strongly that "Apple (does) it more than most hardware manufacturers." I've never seen any evidence of that, and have to assume this slight is in your own head, as opposed to anything objectively real.
The business of a business, is not just to make money, it's to do the work or provide the service or product that it's in business for. Originally, most businesses had creeds or mandates attached to them by the founders expressly for the purpose of making sure that all the workers *knew* what they were in business for.
People who think business is "just about the money" are missing a very basic point, (and a great deal of life in general), and are doomed (eventually) to a life of waste, corruption and loneliness IMO.
I agree with much of what you wrote. The desire to make money doing something is not a differentiator. Anyone can want to make money. It's having a vision to do something better and a passion to carry it out is what makes one better than a competitor. Without doubt you want to make money doing it, too.
I agree with much of what you wrote. The desire to make money doing something is not a differentiator. Anyone can want to make money. It's having a vision to do something better and a passion to carry it out is what makes one better than a competitor. Without doubt you want to make money doing it, too.
Thanks. On reflection I might have got a bit high-handed in some of my remarks, but the basic point is that if business were just about money and ethics be damned, then every business person should be a crack dealer.
We all have ethical lines we don't cross, it's just a matter of where they are. In the case of the car dealer example, the dealer is okay with screwing people over on price and features, but probably wouldn't actually sell them a defective car (whereas others would).
I find this a bit weird. It's a bit too extensive to just be an error on the site.
On the other hand, I don't think a new chipset+gfx is just a dropin replacement on the old mobo, but if it is a new mobo, the DDR2 seems a bit strange... does the GeForce 9400 even support DDR2?
If it is an entirely new mobo, one would thin the old MacBook design is here to stay...
it's not an error. I checked at the local store. it is real.
they couldn't comment but I think that the reason for the slow redo is that they had too many other parts still in the warehouses. so they are burning off bits and as they run out we will see slow silent upgrades into perhaps even the white body is gone.
that said, I wish they would shift back to firewire on all the MBs if only to shut folks up about it. although perhaps they are still burning off old processors and that's why still the fw400 and mini-dvi specs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hledgard
The white appears much more durable.
tell that to my roommate who had to replace his white macbook because his fat cat took a nap on it closed one day and put a pressure break in the screen. which by the by isn't covered by apple care cause it is accidental damage. they were nice enough since he was in the first year and basically had not used the apple care to let him transfer it to the new computer even though they didn't have to. but it was still a pain.
he tried several times to do the same damage to a demo at the store (they actually invited him to try it right in front of them) and couldn't do it. and i've got Porky on top of the machine a half dozen times and so far nothing
Where? The FSB is labelled as 1066MHz but the RAM itself appears to be 667... which seems pretty strange to me anyhow, must be a way of deliberately crippling this machine.
I don't think so, the RAM is probably in dual channel configuration, and is twice as wide as the FSB. So slower memory can still keep up with the FSB and then some.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigmc6000
I'd take the aluminum over the plastic anyday in terms of durability. The plastic may *look* more durable but I'd almost guarantee the unibody aluminum would mop the floor with it in durability tests (dropping, hitting, etc).
Polycarbonate should be more impact resistant, but that's assuming they still use it in the white model. Aluminum can be bent, dented and cracked, but it's much tougher to do same with equivalent weight of polycarbonate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sortarican4711
i am super pissed i just got a macbook in nov the white one... and now they upgrade it WTF, why does apple do this? i am gonna try to sell mine on craigslist, or something. this pisses me off...
It's been what, five months since the MacBook update? Sometimes product updates happen. The only way around it is to either not sell computers or not update them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpics
It's like "packs" on cars. Want the heated seats? Sorry, only available with the moon roof and spoiler package. etc.
Packages tend to reduce production and distribution complexity.
I had assumed that the white MacBooks had been kept around in recognition that the current economy could not have been forecasted at the time the unibody macbooks started design. So the whitey is a bridge to maintain the flow of switchers while money is tight. I imagine the whitey will stay around until people have more money to burn, and meanwhile get little upgrades as a combination of maintaining value for the dollar and managing parts in stock ( old vs new ). This is probably the kind of stuff that Tim Cook is great at. I bet he has some serious Numbers spreadsheets working it all out to the cent. Apple is in good hands.
Comments
Anyone know definitively if this new MB is still toxic or not?
No- but some posts on AI certainly are.
Remember: we have entered a new era of civility.
i am super pissed i just got a macbook in nov the white one... and now they upgrade it WTF, why does apple do this? i am gonna try to sell mine on craigslist, or something. this pisses me off...
Breaking news! Computers get faster all the time and what you buy now will be out of date soon. Get used to it!
Anyone know definitively if this new MB is still toxic or not?
I'd guess this hinges on whether they've upgraded the display or not. With this motherboard change (which doubtless is a toxic-free MB) they've most likely updated all the cabling to non-toxic as well. That would leave the display and backlight as a potential source of toxic chemicals.
i am super pissed i just got a macbook in nov the white one... and now they upgrade it WTF, why does apple do this? i am gonna try to sell mine on craigslist, or something. this pisses me off...
Yeah, Apple should keep the same old hardware for decades, just so they don't upset anyone who purchased the older hardware. They should have called you to make sure you were okay with them building a better computer.
Your lesson is this: don't ever buy a new computer, because after you do, a better one will come along. Just keep waiting.
Yeah, Apple should keep the same old hardware for decades, just so they don't upset anyone who purchased the older hardware. They should have called you to make sure you were okay with them building a better computer.
Your lesson is this: don't ever buy a new computer, because after you do, a better one will come along. Just keep waiting.
im just sayin that it should have all been introdced at once
Dammit, where is my updated mini?
The more I think about this (yes, I've been stewing over this all morning, can you tell?)...
I may just make one of these new whitebooks my "mini". I need better graphics than the X3100 in my Late 2007 blackbook so my kid can play games like Spore, etc. I'm thinking that he could use a new whitebook with better graphics in clamshell mode in the same way he's been using my blackbook in clamshell mode, but this way I'd get my MacBook back.
The current mini with 2.0 GHz Core2Duo, 1GB (no SR), SuperDrive, GMA950, and FW400 is eight benjamins; this has the option to be portable and has basically the same specs or better for two benjamins more (2.0 GHz, 2GB, SuperDrive, 9400M, 13" LCD, FW400).
OTOH, it'd be my luck that AAPL would update the mini 15 days after I bought one of these...
Regardless, I think they are going to sell truckloads of these at the $999 price point.
No. DDR3 uses a different voltage and has a different number of pins. Whilst the chipset can support DDR3, it has to be hard-wired on the motherboard as such, the correct power supply must be provided on the motherboard for the RAM, and the correct slots must be used.
To quantify what you have stated correctly:
DDR2 Double Data Rate DRAM are 200Pin DIMMS.
DDR3 Triple Data Rate DRAM are 204Pin DIMMS.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DDR3_SDRAM
The I/O data rate bumps from 333Mhz [DDR2-667Mhz] to 533Mhz [DDR3-1066Mhz], while the Power consumptions drops by 30% nominally. The Memory clock for DDR2-667Mhz is 166Mhz. The Memory clock for DDR3-1066Mhz is 133Mhz which can account for the reduction in power consumption.
You would think that anybody who has been complaining about the New MacBooks sans FireWire would be happy. But then who the hell would be so stupid to think that?
A pretty nice upgrade really, especially if you don't care about the case and want Firewire..
I want FW and the better trackpad, dammit! And a personal jet pack. And a pony.
But seriously, I don't want a 15" notebook, I want all the rest of the new machine and fracking FW already.
I the "stupid conclusion" that was meant, was that this configuration was intentionally crippled by Apple.
Why do people always have to immediately assume Apple is "up to no good" when they have never shown any such indications throughout the entire life of the company? As far as corporations go, Apple is one of the most responsible and the most customer focussed, they have ridiculously high levels of customer service, excellent reviews by those same customers and are pretty good to their employees overall. I just don't understand why so many people's first reactions to something Apple has done is to assume some nefarious plot is in the works.
Apple is NOT up to NO good. They're up to Apple's good, and mgmt has long seen that as being served by "line differentiation" -- making you buy a bunch of features you don't want in order to get one or two you do, e.g., in this case, a bigger form factor, another video card, etc. to get Firewire.
It's like "packs" on cars. Want the heated seats? Sorry, only available with the moon roof and spoiler package. etc.
Not moral or immoral. More amoral. And has always PO'd me at Apple as they do it more than most hardware manufacturers.
To quantify what you have stated correctly:
DDR2 Double Data Rate DRAM are 200Pin DIMMS.
DDR3 Triple Data Rate DRAM are 204Pin DIMMS.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DDR3_SDRAM
The I/O data rate bumps from 333Mhz [DDR2-667Mhz] to 533Mhz [DDR3-1066Mhz], while the Power consumptions drops by 30% nominally. The Memory clock for DDR2-667Mhz is 166Mhz. The Memory clock for DDR3-1066Mhz is 133Mhz which can account for the reduction in power consumption.
Thanks for this. Hadn't fully appreciated that the memory clock is lower for 1066 DDR3 vs. 667 DDR2; whilst this does contribute to the lower power consumption, the main factor is the lower voltage (DDR2 =1.8 V, DDR3 = 1.5 V).
There's a typo in your post above - DDR3 is still "double data rate" (somewhat of a misnomer now), not "triple data rate".
Thanks for this. Hadn't fully appreciated that the memory clock is lower for 1066 DDR3 vs. 667 DDR2; whilst this does contribute to the lower power consumption, the main factor is the lower voltage (DDR2 =1.8 V, DDR3 = 1.5 V).
There's a typo in your post above - DDR3 is still "double data rate" (somewhat of a misnomer now), not "triple data rate".
My apologies. I thought I'd edited that portion. And since the Voltage rate is Periodic, the lower frequency means a longer period and thus they are mutually dependent variables on the power consumption.
I always thought the black ones looked better than the white ones.
I think this is a good sign that Apple sees it needs to be more competitive with it's low-end models.
Hopefully we will see a well specd Mac mini for $499 or $599.
I think that Apple should offer a black version of this model and NOT charge more. I think they would sell a lot of them. White is just not cool for most users who are not kids!
This would do a lot to make it more attractive to more people. If you can not afford the 1300-1600 bucks for a MacBook you might have the 925.00 ( discount) for an awesome black one WITH firewire 400!!!
im just sayin that it should have all been introdced at once
Yeah, that's a good point - it would have been better to improve the plastic MacBook at the same time as introducing the newer ones (just two months ago). I didn't think of that part of it.
... Apple is NOT up to NO good. They're up to Apple's good, and mgmt has long seen that as being served by "line differentiation" -- making you buy a bunch of features you don't want in order to get one or two you do, e.g., in this case, a bigger form factor, another video card, etc. to get Firewire.
It's like "packs" on cars. Want the heated seats? Sorry, only available with the moon roof and spoiler package. etc.
Not moral or immoral. More amoral. And has always PO'd me at Apple as they do it more than most hardware manufacturers.
We'll have to disagree on this one.
I don't buy the premise that "business is business" or some such and not morally or ethically concerned. If you are in the business of making consumer products and actively trying to screw the consumers for the single reason of more cash, then (IMO) you are "up to no good" and not being very smart business-wise to boot. In other words I don't believe that the presence of capitalism makes moral or ethical behaviour irrelevant.
I also have to disagree strongly that "Apple (does) it more than most hardware manufacturers." I've never seen any evidence of that, and have to assume this slight is in your own head, as opposed to anything objectively real.
The business of a business, is not just to make money, it's to do the work or provide the service or product that it's in business for. Originally, most businesses had creeds or mandates attached to them by the founders expressly for the purpose of making sure that all the workers *knew* what they were in business for.
People who think business is "just about the money" are missing a very basic point, (and a great deal of life in general), and are doomed (eventually) to a life of waste, corruption and loneliness IMO.
We'll have to disagree on this one.
I don't buy the premise that "business is business" or some such and not morally or ethically concerned. If you are in the business of making consumer products and actively trying to screw the consumers for the single reason of more cash, then (IMO) you are "up to no good" and not being very smart business-wise to boot. In other words I don't believe that the presence of capitalism makes moral or ethical behaviour irrelevant.
I also have to disagree strongly that "Apple (does) it more than most hardware manufacturers." I've never seen any evidence of that, and have to assume this slight is in your own head, as opposed to anything objectively real.
The business of a business, is not just to make money, it's to do the work or provide the service or product that it's in business for. Originally, most businesses had creeds or mandates attached to them by the founders expressly for the purpose of making sure that all the workers *knew* what they were in business for.
People who think business is "just about the money" are missing a very basic point, (and a great deal of life in general), and are doomed (eventually) to a life of waste, corruption and loneliness IMO.
I agree with much of what you wrote. The desire to make money doing something is not a differentiator. Anyone can want to make money. It's having a vision to do something better and a passion to carry it out is what makes one better than a competitor. Without doubt you want to make money doing it, too.
I agree with much of what you wrote. The desire to make money doing something is not a differentiator. Anyone can want to make money. It's having a vision to do something better and a passion to carry it out is what makes one better than a competitor. Without doubt you want to make money doing it, too.
Thanks. On reflection I might have got a bit high-handed in some of my remarks, but the basic point is that if business were just about money and ethics be damned, then every business person should be a crack dealer.
We all have ethical lines we don't cross, it's just a matter of where they are. In the case of the car dealer example, the dealer is okay with screwing people over on price and features, but probably wouldn't actually sell them a defective car (whereas others would).
I find this a bit weird. It's a bit too extensive to just be an error on the site.
On the other hand, I don't think a new chipset+gfx is just a dropin replacement on the old mobo, but if it is a new mobo, the DDR2 seems a bit strange... does the GeForce 9400 even support DDR2?
If it is an entirely new mobo, one would thin the old MacBook design is here to stay...
it's not an error. I checked at the local store. it is real.
they couldn't comment but I think that the reason for the slow redo is that they had too many other parts still in the warehouses. so they are burning off bits and as they run out we will see slow silent upgrades into perhaps even the white body is gone.
that said, I wish they would shift back to firewire on all the MBs if only to shut folks up about it. although perhaps they are still burning off old processors and that's why still the fw400 and mini-dvi specs.
The white appears much more durable.
tell that to my roommate who had to replace his white macbook because his fat cat took a nap on it closed one day and put a pressure break in the screen. which by the by isn't covered by apple care cause it is accidental damage. they were nice enough since he was in the first year and basically had not used the apple care to let him transfer it to the new computer even though they didn't have to. but it was still a pain.
he tried several times to do the same damage to a demo at the store (they actually invited him to try it right in front of them) and couldn't do it. and i've got Porky on top of the machine a half dozen times and so far nothing
Where? The FSB is labelled as 1066MHz but the RAM itself appears to be 667... which seems pretty strange to me anyhow, must be a way of deliberately crippling this machine.
I don't think so, the RAM is probably in dual channel configuration, and is twice as wide as the FSB. So slower memory can still keep up with the FSB and then some.
I'd take the aluminum over the plastic anyday in terms of durability. The plastic may *look* more durable but I'd almost guarantee the unibody aluminum would mop the floor with it in durability tests (dropping, hitting, etc).
Polycarbonate should be more impact resistant, but that's assuming they still use it in the white model. Aluminum can be bent, dented and cracked, but it's much tougher to do same with equivalent weight of polycarbonate.
i am super pissed i just got a macbook in nov the white one... and now they upgrade it WTF, why does apple do this? i am gonna try to sell mine on craigslist, or something. this pisses me off...
It's been what, five months since the MacBook update? Sometimes product updates happen. The only way around it is to either not sell computers or not update them.
It's like "packs" on cars. Want the heated seats? Sorry, only available with the moon roof and spoiler package. etc.
Packages tend to reduce production and distribution complexity.