If Apple is pushing the new QT to be mainly a player then controls over the video, like with DVD Player.app, does seem likely. Though I'd like to point out that DVD Player still had a separate, non-overlay Controller you enable if you choose.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland
It's code I presume, not simply it's UI. A touch UI will look different to a regular UI. Though it could be why we're heading in this direction; cause Apple's trying to help blur those lines so it can ease people in the tablet when they make it, and try to make a singular UI that makes sense in both environments.
I agree that the big move with QT X is the underlying code, which Apple is pulling from the iPhone's efficient decoding, but I think Wobegon is correct in that Apple will use many of the overlays that are now present on the iPhone OS X's video viewer.
These look quite good to me. less is more. I always wonder why with every video I watch I need to see that huge metallic control surface and that big round pause button - its annoying, get rid of it.
Also, these look quite visible to me and actually why not make full screen controls and regular controls more consistent. The real thing I like here though is that we finally get a button for full-screen - that has been needed for a long time.
Folks who like consistent UI across programs won't like this! Personally I see no reason why each program can't be unique, it certainly makes Expose work better. The learning curve argument doesn't hold much water because even Apple's non-standard interfaces are very intuitive.
Apple hasn't been very good about keeping their user interfaces consistent. But this brings it to be more consistent with the iTunes video playback window. In the recent past, the look, feel, controls and usability between QuickTime app, DVD Player and iTunes video playback differed a lot more from each other than I thought was justified. It's almost as if different companies developed each app. It looks like Snow Leopard finally unifies them a lot better than they did in the past.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii
I think the idea of no controls (most of the time) is to emphasize the OS X idea that the menu bar represents a loaded program and the windows represent loaded document. If there are controls on a window you start to view it more as program than document.
I don't know if this really changes that much. Different media often means different means of accessing and controlling it.
It's code I presume, not simply it's UI. A touch UI will look different to a regular UI.
Ah, I should have said Snow Leopard's QuickTime X is derived from the iPhone's ultra efficient playback system, and that Apple, likewise, will probably standardize on a UI across platforms (likely inspired by the iPhone's video playback UI).
I use QT as my default audio player because I don't want every little thing added to the iTunes library. I wonder what it will look like when, say, an MP3 is being played.
Looks like the Windows Vista Aero theme with black transparency (assuming that it is... transparent). Anyway, the mock-up looks nice as it is as I do fancy Vista's Aero theme.
I think it would be if it stayed on the screen but I don't think it will be that way, it will probably be like the floating controls when you play videos in iTunes, those auto hide when you're not doing anything with the controls.
I think it would be best if the three aqua control bubbles at top left appeared and faded, but without the actual bar appearing at all. Then we'd have the best of both worlds with the controls there when needed, but the full video in view at all times.
I'd like the controls to match the layout of the Apple Remote and for this to be a design point across many other functions on the Mac. I really like sitting back and just cruising my Mac's content with the remote. And it's great for people who are less mobile and don't want to be sat up at a desk when they're meant to be relaxing.
No, it's not. What if you're trying to look at something in the video but the controls get in the way? Say for example, something catches your eye and you pause the video to take a closer look. And all you end up with is a control bar in your way. Floating controls make the most sense in Full Screen.
I got a feeling Apple has lost it. It happens to most companies that get too big.
Apple's breaking HIGs all over the place. The biggest one being Safari 4. Now it's toying around with windowless GUIs with the titlebar and controls only appearing when the mouse is inside moving inside the video window. And it seems like Apple doesn't have a clue that there's a worldwide recession and instead of dropping prices, they're UPPING them.
Apple is getting too smug...reminds me of the smugness it had back in the early 90s. I feel like when Steve Jobs is gone...Apple's going to go back making the same mistakes it did in the 90s.
No, it's not. What if you're trying to look at something in the video but the controls get in the way? Say for example, something catches your eye and you pause the video to take a closer look. And all you end up with is a control bar in your way. Floating controls make the most sense in Full Screen.
Start playing a video in iTunes, then hit the spacebar. The video pauses, but the controls remain invisible. I can't promise this is how QuickTime X will, but it seems logical to standardize on a look for video across all apps.
I got a feeling Apple has lost it. It happens to most companies that get too big.
Oh yes, they're a little too successful while having a tiny fraction of the workforce Microsoft does, and industry leading customer satisfaction ratings to boot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol
Apple's breaking HIGs all over the place.
HIGs?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol
The biggest one being Safari 4.
The only thing I'd change about Safari 4 is click-through. It is in beta, so that could very well be changed in the final version. In fact, just about everything is subject to change in a beta.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol
Now it's toying around with windowless GUIs with the titlebar and controls only appearing when the mouse is inside moving inside the video window.
That's...not...windowless. The video is a window. Perhaps you could say they're experimenting with borderless windows, but even then, a video has borders.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol
And it seems like Apple doesn't have a clue that there's a worldwide recession and instead of dropping prices, they're UPPING them.
1) What does the recession have to do with QuickTime X? 2) How the hell are they upping prices? They dropped the price of the entry Mac Pro by $300. They dropped the price of a 24" iMac by $300, replacing the 20" model originally at that price point. They didn't raise the price of the Mac mini. They dropped the price of the entry MacBook last Fall to $999.
When have they upped the price of anything?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol
Apple is getting too smug...reminds me of the smugness it had back in the early 90s. I feel like when Steve Jobs is gone...Apple's going to go back making the same mistakes it did in the 90s.
Don't personify companies. It really hurts an argument. Maybe you should actually explain what you mean...rather than trolling.
The only thing I'd change about Safari 4 is click-through. It is in beta, so that could very well be changed in the final version. In fact, just about everything is subject to change in a beta.
That's why I'm glad you don't design interfaces.
Quote:
That's...not...windowless. The video is a window. Perhaps you could say they're experimenting with borderless windows, but even then, a video has borders.
Windowless as in no window frames.
Quote:
1) What does the recession have to do with QuickTime X? 2) How the hell are they upping prices? They dropped the price of the entry Mac Pro by $300. They dropped the price of a 24" iMac by $300, replacing the 20" model originally at that price point. They didn't raise the price of the Mac mini. They dropped the price of the entry MacBook last Fall to $999.
When have they upped the price of anything?
The recession reference was a side not of other things Apple is doing wrong. They dropped the price of the entry Mac Pro but the bang for buck is not at all what it used to be before the new line up. So, Apple is essentially offering less for more.
Quote:
Don't personify companies. It really hurts an argument. Maybe you should actually explain what you mean...rather than trolling.
Does it really hurt an argument? Explain why personifying a company hurts an argument. Perhaps you should actually explain why it hurts an argument rather than troll back.
More Apple apologists like yourself is not what is needed.
Well you're right, your suggestions for how Safari 4 could be improved are so much better....oh right, you never provided any alternatives. In fact, you didn't even specify the qualms you had with Safari 4's UI. *clapping*
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol
Windowless as in no window frames.
What do you mean by that? The mockups show a frame around the window. The title bar is still at the top of the window, as always, it simply blends into the background when a video is playing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol
The recession reference was a side not of other things Apple is doing wrong.
Thanks for the clarification.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol
They dropped the price of the entry Mac Pro but the bang for buck is not at all what it used to be before the new line up. So, Apple is essentially offering less for more.
Examples?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol
Does it really hurt an argument? Explain why personifying a company hurts an argument. Perhaps you should actually explain why it hurts an argument rather than troll back.
So I have to explain myself, but you don't?
On it's face, personifying a company isn't bad I suppose. Not explaining those personifications is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol
More Apple apologists like yourself is not what is needed.
Yes, I'm an apologist because I questioned and/or pointed out the flaws in your flimsy argument.
Well you're right, you're suggestions for how Safari 4 could be improved are so much better....oh right, you never provided any alternatives. In fact, you didn't even specify the qualms you had with Safari 4's UI. *clapping*
Actually I did provide alternatives in the appropriate thread. Go read it. It's not my fault if you're too lazy. I'm not going to cut and paste the same alternative solutions over and over again every time some clown tells me to provide another solution.
Quote:
What do you mean by that? The mockups show a frame around the window. The title bar is still at the top of the window, as always, it simply blends into the background when a video is playing.
And thus the window becomes frameless.
Quote:
Thanks for the clarification. Examples?
Again, in the appropriate thread, I talk about how the low-end Mac Pro is poor value considering you could get an dual quad-core for the same price before the new line up.
Quote:
So I have to explain myself, but you don't?
I've explained myself before. All you have to do is use the search function.
Quote:
On it's face, personifying a company isn't bad I suppose. Not explaining those personifications is.
Yes, I'm an apologist because I questioned and/or pointed out the flaws in your flimsy argument.
I'm glad you at least admit to being an apologist. It's the first step to recovery.
No, it's not. What if you're trying to look at something in the video but the controls get in the way? Say for example, something catches your eye and you pause the video to take a closer look. And all you end up with is a control bar in your way. Floating controls make the most sense in Full Screen.
Seconded. Yes, it appears sometimes necessary to watch how the small scene detail evolves from frame to frame. It isn't that this task is frequent, yet it's reoccurring to someone who analyses evidence including videos. QTX clips that piece with its controls, and that's that.
Actually I did provide alternatives in the appropriate thread. Go read it. It's not my fault if you're too lazy. I'm not going to cut and paste the same alternative solutions over and over again every time some clown tells me to provide another solution.
Quote:
Again, in the appropriate thread, I talk about how the low-end Mac Pro is poor value considering you could get an dual quad-core for the same price before the new line up.
Quote:
I've explained myself before. All you have to do is use the search function.
So you expect me to look around for your answers in separate threads because why? You're too lazy to type them here, or you can't remember them off the top of your head? You can't even be bothered to provide links to the posts your talking about?
These are your arguments. It's your job to back them up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol
And thus the window becomes frameless.
The borders of the window frame the video being played. What is your point?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol
I'm glad you at least admit to being an apologist. It's the first step to recovery.
So you expect me to look around for your answers in separate threads because why? You're too lazy to type them here, or you can't remember them off the top of your head? You can't even be bothered to provide links to the posts your talking about?
No, I can't be bothered to do any of that because you're being an ass. I don't go out of my way to be friendly to people like that.
Quote:
These are your arguments. It's your job to back them up.
And I did. It's up to you to find them.
Quote:
The borders of the window frame the video being played. What is your point?
I gotta admire your obtuseness. I know you know what I'm talking about but you're simply arguing for the sake of arguing. But for shits and giggles I will explain what I mean by windowless/frameless (considering it wasn't explained in any other thread):
There is no titlebar (the only part of the window frame that can be considered visible) when the cursor isn't within the displayed video. Why can't the titlebar be displayed all the time? Not having that information up all the time can be detrimental to productivity. The titlebar provides important information when the content of the window itself isn't informative enough.
We're all using a GUI OS for a reason. Imagine if all windows had titlebars that would fade away when the cursor isn't on it. Content without a title -- a bad idea in some cases.
Apple's new war on dedicated title bars continues, but this time even more egregiously than the Safari 4 beta.
A translucent title bar that obscures a portion of its window's contents? Completely braindead.
This is an artist's mockup, so take it with a grain of salt.
The deceptive title of this article might make you think that this stuff is official, but it's not.
I do have to agree with you about some of Apple's recent UI choices. As good as they are as making things pretty, different UIs across Leopard are still inconsistent and Apple can't seem to decide what UI methods are most user friendly.
Maybe it's better that Apple try this kind of stuff rather than being like Microsoft and not really changing much of anything.
Comments
It's code I presume, not simply it's UI. A touch UI will look different to a regular UI. Though it could be why we're heading in this direction; cause Apple's trying to help blur those lines so it can ease people in the tablet when they make it, and try to make a singular UI that makes sense in both environments.
I agree that the big move with QT X is the underlying code, which Apple is pulling from the iPhone's efficient decoding, but I think Wobegon is correct in that Apple will use many of the overlays that are now present on the iPhone OS X's video viewer.
Also, these look quite visible to me and actually why not make full screen controls and regular controls more consistent. The real thing I like here though is that we finally get a button for full-screen - that has been needed for a long time.
Folks who like consistent UI across programs won't like this! Personally I see no reason why each program can't be unique, it certainly makes Expose work better. The learning curve argument doesn't hold much water because even Apple's non-standard interfaces are very intuitive.
Apple hasn't been very good about keeping their user interfaces consistent. But this brings it to be more consistent with the iTunes video playback window. In the recent past, the look, feel, controls and usability between QuickTime app, DVD Player and iTunes video playback differed a lot more from each other than I thought was justified. It's almost as if different companies developed each app. It looks like Snow Leopard finally unifies them a lot better than they did in the past.
I think the idea of no controls (most of the time) is to emphasize the OS X idea that the menu bar represents a loaded program and the windows represent loaded document. If there are controls on a window you start to view it more as program than document.
I don't know if this really changes that much. Different media often means different means of accessing and controlling it.
It's code I presume, not simply it's UI. A touch UI will look different to a regular UI.
Ah, I should have said Snow Leopard's QuickTime X is derived from the iPhone's ultra efficient playback system, and that Apple, likewise, will probably standardize on a UI across platforms (likely inspired by the iPhone's video playback UI).
I think it would be if it stayed on the screen but I don't think it will be that way, it will probably be like the floating controls when you play videos in iTunes, those auto hide when you're not doing anything with the controls.
I think it would be best if the three aqua control bubbles at top left appeared and faded, but without the actual bar appearing at all. Then we'd have the best of both worlds with the controls there when needed, but the full video in view at all times.
Nah, this is better.
No, it's not. What if you're trying to look at something in the video but the controls get in the way? Say for example, something catches your eye and you pause the video to take a closer look. And all you end up with is a control bar in your way. Floating controls make the most sense in Full Screen.
No, it's not. What if you're trying to look at something in the video but the controls get in the way?
Then move the controls. They are draggable, you know.
Apple's breaking HIGs all over the place. The biggest one being Safari 4. Now it's toying around with windowless GUIs with the titlebar and controls only appearing when the mouse is inside moving inside the video window. And it seems like Apple doesn't have a clue that there's a worldwide recession and instead of dropping prices, they're UPPING them.
Apple is getting too smug...reminds me of the smugness it had back in the early 90s. I feel like when Steve Jobs is gone...Apple's going to go back making the same mistakes it did in the 90s.
No, it's not. What if you're trying to look at something in the video but the controls get in the way? Say for example, something catches your eye and you pause the video to take a closer look. And all you end up with is a control bar in your way. Floating controls make the most sense in Full Screen.
Start playing a video in iTunes, then hit the spacebar. The video pauses, but the controls remain invisible. I can't promise this is how QuickTime X will, but it seems logical to standardize on a look for video across all apps.
I got a feeling Apple has lost it. It happens to most companies that get too big.
Oh yes, they're a little too successful while having a tiny fraction of the workforce Microsoft does, and industry leading customer satisfaction ratings to boot.
Apple's breaking HIGs all over the place.
HIGs?
The biggest one being Safari 4.
The only thing I'd change about Safari 4 is click-through. It is in beta, so that could very well be changed in the final version. In fact, just about everything is subject to change in a beta.
Now it's toying around with windowless GUIs with the titlebar and controls only appearing when the mouse is inside moving inside the video window.
That's...not...windowless. The video is a window. Perhaps you could say they're experimenting with borderless windows, but even then, a video has borders.
And it seems like Apple doesn't have a clue that there's a worldwide recession and instead of dropping prices, they're UPPING them.
1) What does the recession have to do with QuickTime X? 2) How the hell are they upping prices? They dropped the price of the entry Mac Pro by $300. They dropped the price of a 24" iMac by $300, replacing the 20" model originally at that price point. They didn't raise the price of the Mac mini. They dropped the price of the entry MacBook last Fall to $999.
When have they upped the price of anything?
Apple is getting too smug...reminds me of the smugness it had back in the early 90s. I feel like when Steve Jobs is gone...Apple's going to go back making the same mistakes it did in the 90s.
Don't personify companies. It really hurts an argument. Maybe you should actually explain what you mean...rather than trolling.
HIGs?
Human-Interface Guidelines.
The only thing I'd change about Safari 4 is click-through. It is in beta, so that could very well be changed in the final version. In fact, just about everything is subject to change in a beta.
That's why I'm glad you don't design interfaces.
That's...not...windowless. The video is a window. Perhaps you could say they're experimenting with borderless windows, but even then, a video has borders.
Windowless as in no window frames.
1) What does the recession have to do with QuickTime X? 2) How the hell are they upping prices? They dropped the price of the entry Mac Pro by $300. They dropped the price of a 24" iMac by $300, replacing the 20" model originally at that price point. They didn't raise the price of the Mac mini. They dropped the price of the entry MacBook last Fall to $999.
When have they upped the price of anything?
The recession reference was a side not of other things Apple is doing wrong. They dropped the price of the entry Mac Pro but the bang for buck is not at all what it used to be before the new line up. So, Apple is essentially offering less for more.
Don't personify companies. It really hurts an argument. Maybe you should actually explain what you mean...rather than trolling.
Does it really hurt an argument? Explain why personifying a company hurts an argument. Perhaps you should actually explain why it hurts an argument rather than troll back.
More Apple apologists like yourself is not what is needed.
That's why I'm glad you don't design interfaces.
Well you're right, your suggestions for how Safari 4 could be improved are so much better....oh right, you never provided any alternatives. In fact, you didn't even specify the qualms you had with Safari 4's UI. *clapping*
Windowless as in no window frames.
What do you mean by that? The mockups show a frame around the window. The title bar is still at the top of the window, as always, it simply blends into the background when a video is playing.
The recession reference was a side not of other things Apple is doing wrong.
Thanks for the clarification.
They dropped the price of the entry Mac Pro but the bang for buck is not at all what it used to be before the new line up. So, Apple is essentially offering less for more.
Examples?
Does it really hurt an argument? Explain why personifying a company hurts an argument. Perhaps you should actually explain why it hurts an argument rather than troll back.
So I have to explain myself, but you don't?
On it's face, personifying a company isn't bad I suppose. Not explaining those personifications is.
More Apple apologists like yourself is not what is needed.
Yes, I'm an apologist because I questioned and/or pointed out the flaws in your flimsy argument.
Well you're right, you're suggestions for how Safari 4 could be improved are so much better....oh right, you never provided any alternatives. In fact, you didn't even specify the qualms you had with Safari 4's UI. *clapping*
Actually I did provide alternatives in the appropriate thread. Go read it. It's not my fault if you're too lazy. I'm not going to cut and paste the same alternative solutions over and over again every time some clown tells me to provide another solution.
What do you mean by that? The mockups show a frame around the window. The title bar is still at the top of the window, as always, it simply blends into the background when a video is playing.
And thus the window becomes frameless.
Thanks for the clarification. Examples?
Again, in the appropriate thread, I talk about how the low-end Mac Pro is poor value considering you could get an dual quad-core for the same price before the new line up.
So I have to explain myself, but you don't?
I've explained myself before. All you have to do is use the search function.
On it's face, personifying a company isn't bad I suppose. Not explaining those personifications is.
Yes, I'm an apologist because I questioned and/or pointed out the flaws in your flimsy argument.
I'm glad you at least admit to being an apologist. It's the first step to recovery.
No, it's not. What if you're trying to look at something in the video but the controls get in the way? Say for example, something catches your eye and you pause the video to take a closer look. And all you end up with is a control bar in your way. Floating controls make the most sense in Full Screen.
Seconded. Yes, it appears sometimes necessary to watch how the small scene detail evolves from frame to frame. It isn't that this task is frequent, yet it's reoccurring to someone who analyses evidence including videos. QTX clips that piece with its controls, and that's that.
Actually I did provide alternatives in the appropriate thread. Go read it. It's not my fault if you're too lazy. I'm not going to cut and paste the same alternative solutions over and over again every time some clown tells me to provide another solution.
Again, in the appropriate thread, I talk about how the low-end Mac Pro is poor value considering you could get an dual quad-core for the same price before the new line up.
I've explained myself before. All you have to do is use the search function.
So you expect me to look around for your answers in separate threads because why? You're too lazy to type them here, or you can't remember them off the top of your head? You can't even be bothered to provide links to the posts your talking about?
These are your arguments. It's your job to back them up.
And thus the window becomes frameless.
The borders of the window frame the video being played. What is your point?
I'm glad you at least admit to being an apologist. It's the first step to recovery.
I guess they don't have sarcasm in your world.
So you expect me to look around for your answers in separate threads because why? You're too lazy to type them here, or you can't remember them off the top of your head? You can't even be bothered to provide links to the posts your talking about?
No, I can't be bothered to do any of that because you're being an ass. I don't go out of my way to be friendly to people like that.
These are your arguments. It's your job to back them up.
And I did. It's up to you to find them.
The borders of the window frame the video being played. What is your point?
I gotta admire your obtuseness. I know you know what I'm talking about but you're simply arguing for the sake of arguing. But for shits and giggles I will explain what I mean by windowless/frameless (considering it wasn't explained in any other thread):
There is no titlebar (the only part of the window frame that can be considered visible) when the cursor isn't within the displayed video. Why can't the titlebar be displayed all the time? Not having that information up all the time can be detrimental to productivity. The titlebar provides important information when the content of the window itself isn't informative enough.
We're all using a GUI OS for a reason. Imagine if all windows had titlebars that would fade away when the cursor isn't on it. Content without a title -- a bad idea in some cases.
I guess they don't have sarcasm in your world.
Apple's new war on dedicated title bars continues, but this time even more egregiously than the Safari 4 beta.
A translucent title bar that obscures a portion of its window's contents? Completely braindead.
This is an artist's mockup, so take it with a grain of salt.
The deceptive title of this article might make you think that this stuff is official, but it's not.
I do have to agree with you about some of Apple's recent UI choices. As good as they are as making things pretty, different UIs across Leopard are still inconsistent and Apple can't seem to decide what UI methods are most user friendly.
Maybe it's better that Apple try this kind of stuff rather than being like Microsoft and not really changing much of anything.