however, Apple, like Sony of yesteryear, will continue to force us to spend £19.95 for a white adapter to convert one iDevice connector to another. Remember, in the garden of eden, humanity chose wrongly at the start. If we hadn't, and good had been embedded in us, light peak would have been introduced in the iPad, just as Apple used the excellent Wall Street and Lombard PowerBooks to introduce us to the wonderful world of WiFi. (And removable media bays...)
Light Peak won't be ready until the end of the year, if then.
Instead of being able to plug two devices (a monitor and a USB 3.0 device) to your Mac at the same time, with this you can plug only one!
No thank you.
Man people get worked up. Calm down for a minute & consider the real implications of this. This isn't necessarily a replacement of individual ports, could be more a design for a Docking port? Hmmmm? For a long time Apple has been dodging the Dock because current docking ports & designs are bulky & unreliable. However, with the throughput that USB 3 will bring & the daisy-chain capabilities of display port it makes a lot of sense for a design of a Dock port based on those 2 technologies. It would provide all the connections needed to connect a Dock device that would support Video, Audio, Drives, Gig Ethernet, so on & so-forth.
I may be way out here but this to me smells of Dock.
But it's never been about getting people to buy their own cables.
I think it is difficult to suss out the reasons behind Apple's decisions.
But I note that the 30 pin connector on their best-selling products is NOT available unless a manufacturer is able to cut a deal with Apple. We have seen a disappointing lack of devices able to connect with the 30 pin connector. And we saw third-party cables rendered inoperable by the switch to OS 2.1.
I think that Apple likes the control, and likes the royalties, and likes the high-margin accessory business.
The last thing we need is another proprietary cable type like ADC. I've got a $99 ADC to DVI converter brick sitting in a drawer to prove it. I like that Apple wants to reduce cable clutter, but making a new cable type that no one else will ever use is not the way to do it. The single cable that splits into two at the end that they use on current Cinema Displays is good the way it is.
I just assumed that Macs came equipped with them. I learn more and more all the time.
Why don't Macs come with eSATA ports? Is there anything better that is currently available?
On laptops, e-sata is clumsy because it doesn't as yet include power. The new standard does include power through the connector, but it hasn't been implemented as yet. So e-sata requires either that the device be plugged into a wall, or that it take power from either the Firewire port, or a high power USB port present on most laptop macs, both rarely on PC laptops.
Apple! Keep going with standards. Proprietary cables are not environmentally friendly. And they are more expensive because we need spares and so forth. Just stick with standards.
Steve! Greenpeace is just a phone call away. Don't tempt me! ;-/
You realize of course that having "1 cable to connect them all" (sorry couldn't resist) is actually better for the environment due to less manufacturing of various cables, retooling machines, etc.,
Please let this be an indication of MacBook docking stations on the way. Video out, plus a USB 3.0 hub to connect to wired networking and a bunch of devices... that's almost enough. I'd be more encouraged if they showed power being supplied to the device as well, though.
Awful docking stations have long been a huge gaping hole in Apple laptop technology. Having to plug and unplug a pile of cables each time you dock the MacBook Pro makes it a lot less portable.
they likely will. this sounds like a port that could be used with their displays which already have a hydra cord for the power, display and USB.
and then there would be one or two regular USBs.
now what I wonder is if I was using something not Apple for my display. what happens then. would i still have a DP to DVI adapter I could hook in.
and also keep in mind that patents mean nothing. As we know from all the lawsuits that folks patent all kinds of crazy things they never plan to use, unless someone else does and they can sue. or someone wants to and has to pay to play. Apple right now is playing and merely wants to keep control of the sandbox.
I think it is difficult to suss out the reasons behind Apple's decisions.
But I note that the 30 pin connector on their best-selling products is NOT available unless a manufacturer is able to cut a deal with Apple. We have seen a disappointing lack of devices able to connect with the 30 pin connector. And we saw third-party cables rendered inoperable by the switch to OS 2.1.
I think that Apple likes the control, and likes the royalties, and likes the high-margin accessory business.
How much do you think Apple gets for those cables? Very little. The 30 pin port is a special port which is rather complex. Apple has been approached by music player and phone manufacturers to license that port, but Apple wisely refused. That port gives Apple a major advantage over other companies. The amount they make from licensing it is minor. Licensing is a way of controlling who uses the design. Apple wants to do some QC over the manufacturing process. That's the only way they can do it. Otherwise we get $0.99 cent cables that fail quickly and can damage Apple's products.
Again I'll mention that they licensed the Mini Displayport to VESA for nothing.
People are getting worked up over a patent filing that may or may not come to be. Let's wait for a shipping or announced product before grabbing our torches and pitchforks.
The DP standard can already push USB at rates 50% faster than USB2.0. I hope that Apple turns this on in the next update, along with audio (the latter being the more important of the two, IMO).
In the long run, USB3.0 over DP is great for their (et al.) monitors with integrated speakers, mic, webcam and powered USB hubs. This could reduce the number of cables from the current LED ACD to two cables: MagSafe power and mDP.
While getting LightPeak would be great there will be hundreds of millions of devices still dependent upon USB singling over cooper for a long time to come, which means USB will be still be needed. Apple has no choice but to adopt USB3.0 even if it plans to drop FireWire altogether and eventually move to LightPeak as standard the spec isn't even completed last time i checked and it will an uphill battle to get devices to follow suit. Look how long USB3.0 has been ready and it's still on a long upward journey.
Instead of being able to plug two devices (a monitor and a USB 3.0 device) to your Mac at the same time, with this you can plug only one!
No thank you.
I think the idea is that if this is used on desktop/notebooks that it would actually add a USB connection to your computer. Say you have a macbook with DisplayPort and 2 USB3 connections and you want to use USB3 connections on the monitor then you would have to sacrifice one of the two USB3 connections on the Macbook to go to the monitor. If the USB3 is integrated into the Displayport then you would only need the one cable to the monitor that would provide video and USB3. The two USB3 connections on the Macbook are still free for other uses.
On laptops, e-sata is clumsy because it doesn't as yet include power. The new standard does include power through the connector, but it hasn't been implemented as yet. So e-sata requires either that the device be plugged into a wall, or that it take power from either the Firewire port, or a high power USB port present on most laptop macs, both rarely on PC laptops.
So we might see it later.
Thanks. I just skimmed some info on USB 3.0. Amazing throughput.
For fixed external HD applications, the extra power wire doesn't seem like a big deal. But for pocketable external drives, USB 3.0 seems MUCH better.
In addition to considering an external eSATA drive, I'm also thinking of looking into wireless N NAS storage solutions.
Do you have any opinions on that for a fixed-place application? ISTM that having the external storage separate from any particular computer has big advantages, and ISTM that wireless n is fairly fast. Am I ignoring any important considerations?
Ummmm...yes. Seriously. I was unaware that Apple neglected to include eSATA.
And I'm seriously wondering if there is a better, current solution. Mel clued me in on the extra power cable issue, which is relevant when using portable external drives. USB 3.0 seems superior in that application.
Anything else you want to throw in WRT eSATA vs. USB 3.0 vs. wireless n NAS?
Comments
however, Apple, like Sony of yesteryear, will continue to force us to spend £19.95 for a white adapter to convert one iDevice connector to another. Remember, in the garden of eden, humanity chose wrongly at the start. If we hadn't, and good had been embedded in us, light peak would have been introduced in the iPad, just as Apple used the excellent Wall Street and Lombard PowerBooks to introduce us to the wonderful world of WiFi. (And removable media bays...)
Light Peak won't be ready until the end of the year, if then.
Instead of being able to plug two devices (a monitor and a USB 3.0 device) to your Mac at the same time, with this you can plug only one!
No thank you.
Man people get worked up. Calm down for a minute & consider the real implications of this. This isn't necessarily a replacement of individual ports, could be more a design for a Docking port? Hmmmm? For a long time Apple has been dodging the Dock because current docking ports & designs are bulky & unreliable. However, with the throughput that USB 3 will bring & the daisy-chain capabilities of display port it makes a lot of sense for a design of a Dock port based on those 2 technologies. It would provide all the connections needed to connect a Dock device that would support Video, Audio, Drives, Gig Ethernet, so on & so-forth.
I may be way out here but this to me smells of Dock.
But it's never been about getting people to buy their own cables.
I think it is difficult to suss out the reasons behind Apple's decisions.
But I note that the 30 pin connector on their best-selling products is NOT available unless a manufacturer is able to cut a deal with Apple. We have seen a disappointing lack of devices able to connect with the 30 pin connector. And we saw third-party cables rendered inoperable by the switch to OS 2.1.
I think that Apple likes the control, and likes the royalties, and likes the high-margin accessory business.
The last thing we need is another proprietary cable type like ADC. I've got a $99 ADC to DVI converter brick sitting in a drawer to prove it. I like that Apple wants to reduce cable clutter, but making a new cable type that no one else will ever use is not the way to do it. The single cable that splits into two at the end that they use on current Cinema Displays is good the way it is.
Oops!
I just assumed that Macs came equipped with them. I learn more and more all the time.
Why don't Macs come with eSATA ports? Is there anything better that is currently available?
On laptops, e-sata is clumsy because it doesn't as yet include power. The new standard does include power through the connector, but it hasn't been implemented as yet. So e-sata requires either that the device be plugged into a wall, or that it take power from either the Firewire port, or a high power USB port present on most laptop macs, both rarely on PC laptops.
So we might see it later.
Apple! Keep going with standards. Proprietary cables are not environmentally friendly. And they are more expensive because we need spares and so forth. Just stick with standards.
Steve! Greenpeace is just a phone call away. Don't tempt me! ;-/
You realize of course that having "1 cable to connect them all" (sorry couldn't resist) is actually better for the environment due to less manufacturing of various cables, retooling machines, etc.,
Oops!
I just assumed that Macs came equipped with them. I learn more and more all the time.
Why don't Macs come with eSATA ports? Is there anything better that is currently available?
Come on, seriously?
Please let this be an indication of MacBook docking stations on the way. Video out, plus a USB 3.0 hub to connect to wired networking and a bunch of devices... that's almost enough. I'd be more encouraged if they showed power being supplied to the device as well, though.
Awful docking stations have long been a huge gaping hole in Apple laptop technology. Having to plug and unplug a pile of cables each time you dock the MacBook Pro makes it a lot less portable.
Standard connectors should be used.
they likely will. this sounds like a port that could be used with their displays which already have a hydra cord for the power, display and USB.
and then there would be one or two regular USBs.
now what I wonder is if I was using something not Apple for my display. what happens then. would i still have a DP to DVI adapter I could hook in.
and also keep in mind that patents mean nothing. As we know from all the lawsuits that folks patent all kinds of crazy things they never plan to use, unless someone else does and they can sue. or someone wants to and has to pay to play. Apple right now is playing and merely wants to keep control of the sandbox.
I think it is difficult to suss out the reasons behind Apple's decisions.
But I note that the 30 pin connector on their best-selling products is NOT available unless a manufacturer is able to cut a deal with Apple. We have seen a disappointing lack of devices able to connect with the 30 pin connector. And we saw third-party cables rendered inoperable by the switch to OS 2.1.
I think that Apple likes the control, and likes the royalties, and likes the high-margin accessory business.
How much do you think Apple gets for those cables? Very little. The 30 pin port is a special port which is rather complex. Apple has been approached by music player and phone manufacturers to license that port, but Apple wisely refused. That port gives Apple a major advantage over other companies. The amount they make from licensing it is minor. Licensing is a way of controlling who uses the design. Apple wants to do some QC over the manufacturing process. That's the only way they can do it. Otherwise we get $0.99 cent cables that fail quickly and can damage Apple's products.
Again I'll mention that they licensed the Mini Displayport to VESA for nothing.
You know any Macs with eSATA?
MBP 17" has Express Card Slot that you can plug in eSata adapters
http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Apiotek/EC0003D/
http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Apiotek/ECCR24/
Also Mac Pros can have eSata Cards check out OWC
It needs to be widely adopted or otherwise this is just ADC again.
MBP 17" has Express Card Slot that you can plug in eSata adapters
http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Apiotek/EC0003D/
http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Apiotek/ECCR24/
Also Mac Pros can have eSata Cards check out OWC
I realize that. I meant that I wasn't aware of any Mac that had them built in without resorting to a 3rd-party device.
The DP standard can already push USB at rates 50% faster than USB2.0. I hope that Apple turns this on in the next update, along with audio (the latter being the more important of the two, IMO).
In the long run, USB3.0 over DP is great for their (et al.) monitors with integrated speakers, mic, webcam and powered USB hubs. This could reduce the number of cables from the current LED ACD to two cables: MagSafe power and mDP.
While getting LightPeak would be great there will be hundreds of millions of devices still dependent upon USB singling over cooper for a long time to come, which means USB will be still be needed. Apple has no choice but to adopt USB3.0 even if it plans to drop FireWire altogether and eventually move to LightPeak as standard the spec isn't even completed last time i checked and it will an uphill battle to get devices to follow suit. Look how long USB3.0 has been ready and it's still on a long upward journey.
Instead of being able to plug two devices (a monitor and a USB 3.0 device) to your Mac at the same time, with this you can plug only one!
No thank you.
I think the idea is that if this is used on desktop/notebooks that it would actually add a USB connection to your computer. Say you have a macbook with DisplayPort and 2 USB3 connections and you want to use USB3 connections on the monitor then you would have to sacrifice one of the two USB3 connections on the Macbook to go to the monitor. If the USB3 is integrated into the Displayport then you would only need the one cable to the monitor that would provide video and USB3. The two USB3 connections on the Macbook are still free for other uses.
On laptops, e-sata is clumsy because it doesn't as yet include power. The new standard does include power through the connector, but it hasn't been implemented as yet. So e-sata requires either that the device be plugged into a wall, or that it take power from either the Firewire port, or a high power USB port present on most laptop macs, both rarely on PC laptops.
So we might see it later.
Thanks. I just skimmed some info on USB 3.0. Amazing throughput.
For fixed external HD applications, the extra power wire doesn't seem like a big deal. But for pocketable external drives, USB 3.0 seems MUCH better.
In addition to considering an external eSATA drive, I'm also thinking of looking into wireless N NAS storage solutions.
Do you have any opinions on that for a fixed-place application? ISTM that having the external storage separate from any particular computer has big advantages, and ISTM that wireless n is fairly fast. Am I ignoring any important considerations?
Give us esata
a port for usb 3
On a portable player (ipod ipad) maybe but please not on computers.
Come on, seriously?
Ummmm...yes. Seriously. I was unaware that Apple neglected to include eSATA.
And I'm seriously wondering if there is a better, current solution. Mel clued me in on the extra power cable issue, which is relevant when using portable external drives. USB 3.0 seems superior in that application.
Anything else you want to throw in WRT eSATA vs. USB 3.0 vs. wireless n NAS?
Advantages and disadvantages to any or all?