Im by no means "tech savvy" but after watching the blog i cant help but feel that there must still be a lot of un-announced features on OS 4.0 that would be related to the possible new hardware features of the next gen iphone (if indeed it is coming). Would this be a fair comment?
Also i have an iphone 3G and im in no way disappointed at the announcement that the 3G wont have multitasking. I fully know that the phone would grind to a halt. Anyway im more excited about the possible new hardware which will make any disappointment irrelevant and anyone who has a 3G or earlier should be due their upgrade anyway.
P.S Would you expect windows 7 to work on your 3 year old PC running XP?
Comparing Windows 7 with iPhone OS is irrelevant, especially when Windows 7 can run on 3-year-old a.k.a. 2007 PCs with Core 2 Duo processors very well.
Do they really still sell iPhone 3G (without the s)? The 3G is as slow as the original iPhone. Time to move on... or haven't you made any money yet on their soaring stock?
19. You can turn off Cellular Data access and just have the phone on. I am thinking Unlimited Data might not be in the next AT&T iPhone plan or at least metered data usage may be an option.
This is great if you are going on vacation or just abroad, I thought this option already existed.
Single press of the home button quits the app and dumps you to the springboard like it works now.
Double press of the home button keeps the app open and provides you the dock-like app selector.
From the videos that have been posted it looks otherwise. Looks like they all go into the multitasking bar, and you have to quit them manually by tap-holding on the icons and then an option to kill them shows up.
The weird thing is that this works with apps that are not written for multitasking yet.
Just an observation: if it works like you describe, how would you start multitasking? By this I mean that double-tapping shows up the bar with running apps, but not the home screen, so it would be rather difficult to launch a new app and expand the pool of apps that are multitasking.
OK, if you two are so smart and there is no impact by having multiple applications running in the background, why don't desktop OS's just load every app on your machine as they start up so you can just switch at will?
RAM. If I run a ton of apps in the background I see my ram usage get up to around 90% on my phone. In a desktop OS, you don't want to run at 90% usage because you'd constantly be using your pagefile. Accessing a HDD is a lot slower than accessing ram (in fact someone explained to me one time that what takes 10 seconds in ram can translate to a year on the hdd or something absurd? I'll have to look it up) so if you needed extra space, your computer would be come slower.
The point here is about battery life and performance. Performance on my phone is a bit different than on a desktop because of the hardware differences. Unless I need to open up more apps which require more ram than available (and forces me to close some opened) I don't see any major difference in performance (depending on what the app in the background is doing.)
If I look at my task manager, there are plenty of processes running that take up a little ram, but use 0% cpu.
BTW, your comment reminded me of this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96dWOEa4Djs They took 24 SSD's, ran them in RAID, then as a test they run everything in the start menu. Pretty damn cool if you ask me
From the videos that have been posted it looks otherwise. Looks like they all go into the multitasking bar, and you have to quit them manually by tap-holding on the icons and then an option to kill them shows up.
The weird thing is that this works with apps that are not written for multitasking yet.
Just an observation: if it works like you describe, how would you start multitasking? By this I mean that double-tapping shows up the bar with running apps, but not the home screen, so it would be rather difficult to launch a new app and expand the pool of apps that are multitasking.
That multitasking bar we saw when he presses the Home Button twice is, at least so far, a list of all apps you've recently opened. It's not discerning between apps with or without the multitasking APIs in use.
It appears that multitasking is all on the devs. They have to apply the APIs and rehire is no Settings option to toggle the global service on/off or choose from a list of apps with the backgrounding option.
Then your phone must be powered by fairies and unicorns because even the android lovers on TWIT sheepishly admitted that multitasking seriously affected their battery life. Really, it's a pretty simple concept - use the CPU more, use more energy, less battery life. It's not magic, BS or marketing spin - it's physics!
But again, who want's "real" multitasking except for pedantic feature list watchers? Apple is delivering what people really want with multitasking - functionality! - while preserving the user experience - and part of that user experience includes battery life!
I don't own an Android phone, and I don't know which apps they are running to use up the cpu cycles so I can't comment on that, but while what you say is true, on my phone it's not the cpu usage that drains the battery but the radio usage. Cpu usage does in fact increase energy usage, but it does not have the kind of impact Jobs will have you believe.
If I load up coreplayer and open a video, I can pause it and put it in the background. From then on out, it uses 0% cpu usage and battery is unaffected. If I want to go back to my video, I can simply switch to it. (There are ways to tell the app to remember where I left off and load the previous playlist, so even running it in the bg isn't needed, but it's possible.)
Running a program like slacker radio, however, will definitely have an impact. It uses a constant internet stream which makes use of the radio. It's this kind of background process I see an impact from, and the iphone will not be immune. If you run Pandora in the background, expect an impact.
Work related apps in my mind are the ones that benefit the most. Things like MS Word, email, excel, or even powerpoint. None of them require anything when sitting in the background, so I can switch back and forth between these apps to build a quick document on the go.
Finally, I can run my SNES emulator in the background so if I get a call while playing super mario brothers, I can chat it up, then get right back into my game when I'm done. Or heck, if I want to google how to beat one of the levels, I can load up Opera Mobile and switch back and forth between my game and the cheat guide. I would see the same hit on battery life if I closed out of each app to get to the other. IN FACT, technically it might use slightly more energy to constantly load each app to switch back and forth.
Not sure what you're saying here. Obviously video streaming isn't going to be a background process, which is what we're talking about. An inefficient foreground process is another matter, but far more linked to user estimation of cause and effect.
When you are multitasking - how do you close an app?
I have iphone 3g. I was very tempted to upgrade to 3GS, not anymore. . . Rather just wait for 4th gen and have new firmware and hardware additions - front facing camera? nice!
Then your phone must be powered by fairies and unicorns because even the android lovers on TWIT sheepishly admitted that multitasking seriously affected their battery life. Really, it's a pretty simple concept - use the CPU more, use more energy, less battery life. It's not magic, BS or marketing spin - it's physics!
But again, who want's "real" multitasking except for pedantic feature list watchers? Apple is delivering what people really want with multitasking - functionality! - while preserving the user experience - and part of that user experience includes battery life!
You lot just don't get it. CPU is a small fraction of the power usage of a mobile device. The biggest drain is powering the radios. The reason Android users are complaining about battery drain is because they are all running Twitter apps in the background that are keeping the 3G radio going all the time.
Have you ever noticed your iPhone gets warm when you use it as a phone?!
Streaming is just as bad. Keeping the radio going all the time is going to eat your battery alive. A much better idea would be that the app buffers a reasonably large amount of data and then lets the radio go idle for a while before starting again.
OK, if you two are so smart and there is no impact by having multiple applications running in the background, why don't desktop OS's just load every app on your machine as they start up so you can just switch at will?
You mean you don't do that? What is the point of having all that RAM if you aren't going to use it.
Everyone I have ever seen who uses a mac rarely, if ever, closes an application. Most of them don't even understand that you need to quit an app, not just close all the windows. So they effectively end up running every app they have at the same time.
On my Windows 7 PC I have 8 individual apps running and there are 79 processes running with CPU usage of 4%. And that includes having Bittorrent going in the background. So don't tell me that multitasking doesn't work.
Obviously you have never looked at activity monitor on your Mac.
And just for comparison you can get a Bittorrent client for the Nokia N900. It runs perfectly in the background even if it does use the battery quite much.
I hate to tell you this, but every other phone can do MMS with only a GSM chipset . You don't need 3G. It was just an arbitrary decision by Apple that they didn't support MMS in the 2G.
Comments
Im by no means "tech savvy" but after watching the blog i cant help but feel that there must still be a lot of un-announced features on OS 4.0 that would be related to the possible new hardware features of the next gen iphone (if indeed it is coming). Would this be a fair comment?
Also i have an iphone 3G and im in no way disappointed at the announcement that the 3G wont have multitasking. I fully know that the phone would grind to a halt. Anyway im more excited about the possible new hardware which will make any disappointment irrelevant and anyone who has a 3G or earlier should be due their upgrade anyway.
P.S Would you expect windows 7 to work on your 3 year old PC running XP?
Comparing Windows 7 with iPhone OS is irrelevant, especially when Windows 7 can run on 3-year-old a.k.a. 2007 PCs with Core 2 Duo processors very well.
See, I was reading that completely wrong. I thought you were calling my comment shit.
On reading my post, I anticipated that and edited it to clarify that it was the wiki content.
.
On reading my post, I anticipated that and edited it to clarify that it was the wiki content.
.
Ah, didn't see the edit. BTW, who you calling a frag, Frag!
Ah, didn't see the edit. BTW, who you calling a frag, Frag!
Watch it, you'll be accused of homophobia. Or maybe its homogenphobia?
Ah, didn't see the edit. BTW, who you calling a frag, Frag!
Are you a troll... Or worse, a hobgoblin?
.
Do they really still sell iPhone 3G (without the s)? The 3G is as slow as the original iPhone. Time to move on... or haven't you made any money yet on their soaring stock?
Amen!
What hardware issues stops the original iPhone from doing MMS?
AFAIK, the lack of a 3G chip is the issue.
19. You can turn off Cellular Data access and just have the phone on. I am thinking Unlimited Data might not be in the next AT&T iPhone plan or at least metered data usage may be an option.
This is great if you are going on vacation or just abroad, I thought this option already existed.
Single press of the home button quits the app and dumps you to the springboard like it works now.
Double press of the home button keeps the app open and provides you the dock-like app selector.
From the videos that have been posted it looks otherwise. Looks like they all go into the multitasking bar, and you have to quit them manually by tap-holding on the icons and then an option to kill them shows up.
The weird thing is that this works with apps that are not written for multitasking yet.
Just an observation: if it works like you describe, how would you start multitasking? By this I mean that double-tapping shows up the bar with running apps, but not the home screen, so it would be rather difficult to launch a new app and expand the pool of apps that are multitasking.
This is great if you are going on vacation or just abroad, I thought this option already existed.
Yes it does but only for data roaming, not in general.
Settings->General->Network->Data Roaming On/Off
OK, if you two are so smart and there is no impact by having multiple applications running in the background, why don't desktop OS's just load every app on your machine as they start up so you can just switch at will?
RAM. If I run a ton of apps in the background I see my ram usage get up to around 90% on my phone. In a desktop OS, you don't want to run at 90% usage because you'd constantly be using your pagefile. Accessing a HDD is a lot slower than accessing ram (in fact someone explained to me one time that what takes 10 seconds in ram can translate to a year on the hdd or something absurd? I'll have to look it up) so if you needed extra space, your computer would be come slower.
The point here is about battery life and performance. Performance on my phone is a bit different than on a desktop because of the hardware differences. Unless I need to open up more apps which require more ram than available (and forces me to close some opened) I don't see any major difference in performance (depending on what the app in the background is doing.)
If I look at my task manager, there are plenty of processes running that take up a little ram, but use 0% cpu.
BTW, your comment reminded me of this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96dWOEa4Djs They took 24 SSD's, ran them in RAID, then as a test they run everything in the start menu. Pretty damn cool if you ask me
From the videos that have been posted it looks otherwise. Looks like they all go into the multitasking bar, and you have to quit them manually by tap-holding on the icons and then an option to kill them shows up.
The weird thing is that this works with apps that are not written for multitasking yet.
Just an observation: if it works like you describe, how would you start multitasking? By this I mean that double-tapping shows up the bar with running apps, but not the home screen, so it would be rather difficult to launch a new app and expand the pool of apps that are multitasking.
That multitasking bar we saw when he presses the Home Button twice is, at least so far, a list of all apps you've recently opened. It's not discerning between apps with or without the multitasking APIs in use.
It appears that multitasking is all on the devs. They have to apply the APIs and rehire is no Settings option to toggle the global service on/off or choose from a list of apps with the backgrounding option.
Then your phone must be powered by fairies and unicorns because even the android lovers on TWIT sheepishly admitted that multitasking seriously affected their battery life. Really, it's a pretty simple concept - use the CPU more, use more energy, less battery life. It's not magic, BS or marketing spin - it's physics!
But again, who want's "real" multitasking except for pedantic feature list watchers? Apple is delivering what people really want with multitasking - functionality! - while preserving the user experience - and part of that user experience includes battery life!
I don't own an Android phone, and I don't know which apps they are running to use up the cpu cycles so I can't comment on that, but while what you say is true, on my phone it's not the cpu usage that drains the battery but the radio usage. Cpu usage does in fact increase energy usage, but it does not have the kind of impact Jobs will have you believe.
If I load up coreplayer and open a video, I can pause it and put it in the background. From then on out, it uses 0% cpu usage and battery is unaffected. If I want to go back to my video, I can simply switch to it. (There are ways to tell the app to remember where I left off and load the previous playlist, so even running it in the bg isn't needed, but it's possible.)
Running a program like slacker radio, however, will definitely have an impact. It uses a constant internet stream which makes use of the radio. It's this kind of background process I see an impact from, and the iphone will not be immune. If you run Pandora in the background, expect an impact.
Work related apps in my mind are the ones that benefit the most. Things like MS Word, email, excel, or even powerpoint. None of them require anything when sitting in the background, so I can switch back and forth between these apps to build a quick document on the go.
Finally, I can run my SNES emulator in the background so if I get a call while playing super mario brothers, I can chat it up, then get right back into my game when I'm done. Or heck, if I want to google how to beat one of the levels, I can load up Opera Mobile and switch back and forth between my game and the cheat guide. I would see the same hit on battery life if I closed out of each app to get to the other. IN FACT, technically it might use slightly more energy to constantly load each app to switch back and forth.
AFAIK, the lack of a 3G chip is the issue.
That would be incorrect. All MMS needs is SMS + a data connection. Easily done with 2G.
Regs, Jarkko
Not sure what you're saying here. Obviously video streaming isn't going to be a background process, which is what we're talking about. An inefficient foreground process is another matter, but far more linked to user estimation of cause and effect.
Uh, OGG is an audio format.
I have iphone 3g. I was very tempted to upgrade to 3GS, not anymore. . . Rather just wait for 4th gen and have new firmware and hardware additions - front facing camera? nice!
C-
Then your phone must be powered by fairies and unicorns because even the android lovers on TWIT sheepishly admitted that multitasking seriously affected their battery life. Really, it's a pretty simple concept - use the CPU more, use more energy, less battery life. It's not magic, BS or marketing spin - it's physics!
But again, who want's "real" multitasking except for pedantic feature list watchers? Apple is delivering what people really want with multitasking - functionality! - while preserving the user experience - and part of that user experience includes battery life!
You lot just don't get it. CPU is a small fraction of the power usage of a mobile device. The biggest drain is powering the radios. The reason Android users are complaining about battery drain is because they are all running Twitter apps in the background that are keeping the 3G radio going all the time.
Have you ever noticed your iPhone gets warm when you use it as a phone?!
Streaming is just as bad. Keeping the radio going all the time is going to eat your battery alive. A much better idea would be that the app buffers a reasonably large amount of data and then lets the radio go idle for a while before starting again.
OK, if you two are so smart and there is no impact by having multiple applications running in the background, why don't desktop OS's just load every app on your machine as they start up so you can just switch at will?
You mean you don't do that? What is the point of having all that RAM if you aren't going to use it.
Everyone I have ever seen who uses a mac rarely, if ever, closes an application. Most of them don't even understand that you need to quit an app, not just close all the windows. So they effectively end up running every app they have at the same time.
On my Windows 7 PC I have 8 individual apps running and there are 79 processes running with CPU usage of 4%. And that includes having Bittorrent going in the background. So don't tell me that multitasking doesn't work.
Obviously you have never looked at activity monitor on your Mac.
And just for comparison you can get a Bittorrent client for the Nokia N900. It runs perfectly in the background even if it does use the battery quite much.
AFAIK, the lack of a 3G chip is the issue.
I hate to tell you this, but every other phone can do MMS with only a GSM chipset
Uh, OGG is an audio format.
Uh No.
Ogg includes video as well. Ogg Vorbis is a audio format that uses the Ogg container.
Simple mistake I suppose.