Apple manufacturer Foxconn may relocate some Chinese factories
Reply 61 of 67
June 13, 2010 1:27PM
What is happening at Foxconn is just one example of a culture that is now institutionalized throughout China. This is a country that can bulldoze entire neighbourhoods literally overnight to make way for roads, buildings, etc. This is a country where the government does not allow any dissenting voices - period.
The only reason why stories come out from Foxconn, is because of more intense scrutiny on Foxconn because of its massive relationship with Apple. If you dig deep into literally any facet of China, you will see similar things happening - and in a lot of cases, it will not be suicides - a lot worse. Former communist Europeans might have forgotten the dreaded midnight knock, but such things still happen in China, even today.
This is the ugly side of the marvel that is Chinese growth - if you are willing to ignore how growth is achieved, it looks good. But when you look at the whole picture you start to think if this is all worth it.
Sometimes, when I think about China and India, I am impressed a lot more by the India story. India has pathetic infrastructure compared to China. Companies in India have to make arrangements for EVERYTHING, starting from Power Supply, Water Supply, Commuting arrangements for employees, etc. Absolutely nothing provided by the government is of acceptable standard for business. Workers are organized into unions, and manage to extract better working conditions and wages under threat of strikes. Land acquisition for any project is a nightmare in India. Politically, there is always a lot of uncertainty. Despite all these hindrances, India comes close to Chinese growth already, and even surpasses China on some parameters. I wonder what India is capable of, if better infrastructure is in place! Even today, some Indian companies are able to successfully compete with the Chinese.
In a lot of ways, the China and India story is similar to the hare and tortoise story. The more China grows economically, its economic model gets incompatible with its political and social model. This is bound to create friction that will be difficult to manage. On the other hand, the more India grows economically, it is likely to reduce friction politically and socially. In the long run, India's model is more sustainable than China's.
Of course, this is not to say that everything is hunky dory in India. India also has its share of issues do deal with - just that India's issues look more manageable over a period of time than China's.
Reply 62 of 67
June 13, 2010 3:34PM
Originally Posted by
Deleterious only from the point of the employer. Beneficial from the perspective of the worker. Of course as a free-market economist, I could have expected you to see it as a net negative.
Deleterious from the point of view of both employer and employee. How are fewer/no jobs a good thing? As a function of a free market, jobs must reduce or disappear if there is no demand. No one enjoys unemployment, but without the ability to respond to market demand, you have... well... our
Reply 63 of 67
June 13, 2010 4:30PM
Check your history books or read a newspaper. It was China, it's inhabited by Chineese and it will again be part of China. Don't confuse political divisions with culture.
Taiwan was briefly part of China, but the colonization by Japan was much longer, although primarily, it was colonized by the Dutch. Yes, the former Dutch colony of Formosa is heavily Chinese (as many places are, including parts of New York and California). That does not mean it is in China. Will Taiwan join China someday, yes I believe so. But it's because of future ties, not past ties.
Reply 64 of 67
June 13, 2010 4:48PM
Originally Posted by
Where is the proof? Let's look at two societies with uncompetitive labor rates, Europe and the US. Both have high unemployment rates and large fiscal deficits. In our case, we have three employment pools. The government, construction and service businesses. Take a look at construction and service to get an idea how much value they add and how employment is doing. Take away credit availability from consumers and both of these businesses suffer. Without manufacturing -- creation of value people are willing to invest in -- you have an unsustainable economy.
I agree that a reduction in money affects all economic activity (including construction and services). You say though an economy is unsustainable without manufacturing and yet this very quick chart shows that services are adding more and more value. Jobs lost in manufacturing are often created here.
Reply 65 of 67
June 13, 2010 8:40PM
I suggest that everyone checks out this discussion at the NYT about this issue from experts in the field. It isn't as great as many of you seem to believe as evidenced by your overplayed "the suicide rates are lower" quotes.
Reply 66 of 67
June 13, 2010 8:52PM
Facing increasing scrutiny from the media and general public over a rash of employee suicides, Apple manufacturing partner Foxconn is rumored to be plotting an exodus from mainland China sometime in the future.
The Chinese-language ON.CC broke the news (translation) earlier this week, citing sources who attended the annual shareholders meeting of parent company Hon Hai. Those claims remain largely unverified, however.
Nevertheless, the report cited Hon Hai chairman Terry Gou as saying his firm was in the midst of planning a restructuring that would uproot its mainland China operations in favor of peppering them throughout other regions in Far Eastern such as Taiwan, Vietnam, and India.
Is slavery still legal outside of China???
And, presumably, large consumer oriented Western companies like Apple, Dell and HP would jump at the opportunity to make even more money for the sole benefit of their CEOs? I hope not.
Consumers will have the last word with companies who have no moral compass. Thankfully, there are still free media to report on working conditions in far away places.
Reply 67 of 67
June 14, 2010 9:22PM
These things are Chicom slave camps!
When are you people gonna stop enslaving people?