Sounds like my 2009 W. Macbook isn't going to get much, if any multitouch love :-( . Guess I'll need to purchase a Magic Trackpad...
A Magic Trackpad to supplement an old laptop trackpad? Hmmm?
On my wish list?is a detached keyboard with an integrated trackpad for an iMac. Then, the Magic Mouse would serve as the supplemental precision pointer!
I don't have a tech blog to post these things on, so I'll just put my thoughts here and we can all debate about the validity thereof.
Regarding Mission Control:
I've noted from videos, what I believe is a significant flaw in the UI design for Mission Control.
With spaces enabled, Mission Control displays a list of available spaces with thumbnails of open windows in them, while at the same time also displaying Exposé views of the same windows. This results in two proxies for the same thing on the screen at one time - an Exposé window, and a Spaces thumbnail. I think there should never be two on screen proxies for a single element at any time, especially when in this case, a Thumbnail is easily confused for a minimized Window. (I'm talking conceptually here, which is what UI design is all about).
Furthermore, it appears to support dragging and dropping across the two contexts, from Exposé into a Space, wherein the window shrinks down to the size of a thumbnail (note that as this happens, there are two thumbnails for the same window) before it is dropped.
This visual shrinking of the window (usually a cue for minimizing) is jarring, because it denotes a change of mode (from Window to Thumbnail) even though no such mode change is actually taking place.
I do not have any solutions for what I perceive will be a problem, but I hope Apple designers are aware of this, and work to solve it before the release.
Regarding Dashboard:
Also, I don't like how they're giving Dashboard its own space in an environment where fullscreen apps get their own space (I think that's awesome) because that causes Dashboard to feel conceptually like another app, which isn't what it is - it's a space for mini apps, not a large app - I believe it also detracts from the Heads up Display concept it currently employs (to great effect too).
Regarding gestures:
Personally, I map 4 finger gestures to system scope commands like Exposé (swipe down), Show Desktop (swipe up), Change Spaces (swipe left/right), and Dashboard (click).
3 finger gestures application scoped, for example in Safari, Back and Forward (3 finger left/right) or next/previous tab (3 finger up/down), or Open in New Tab (3 finger click).
2 finger gestures are reserved for context sensitive commands, like scrolling and zooming.
I believe such clear delineation of scope for multi touch controls results in orderly and predictable modes of control - making this the system default, as opposed to the rather arbitrary gestures currently implemented would result in a far more usable and discoverable interface.
(I understand that the settings can be remapped, but know that the default system setting plays a huge part in determining how the average user will end up using the computer.)
After 25 years, will Mac OS finally do something about only being able to access the menu bar on the main display?
If an app displays all its windows on a separate monitor, there is no reason not to display that app's menu in that space.
The thing is that the feature you are requesting is only maturing now. In Lion it may become a natural to have multiple menus showing (when appropriate).
No matter how much Apple, or Jobs himself denies it, I think it's pretty obvious that all of these gestures aren't solely mean for a trackpad. This is definitately leading to a touch enabled iMac, or possibly a monitor.
By Apple, after other(s) failed.
The question remains, will Apple be able to market such a big touch-sensitive display at prices within reach of the average customer? (MS's big-ass table costs an arm and a leg and only seems to exist so they can lure TV news desks into buying one).
No matter how much Apple, or Jobs himself denies it, I think it's pretty obvious that all of these gestures aren't solely mean for a trackpad. This is definitately leading to a touch enabled iMac, or possibly a monitor.
You understand that this makes NO SENSE by the laws of physics and the laws of physiology, right?
We, humans, CAN'T USE a touch monitor for desktop work --it gets tiring to hold your hand up very very shortly.
This cannot change. So, no. The gestures are for the trackpad and the touch mouse solely, and they will remain so. The only other option is a future Mac tabled/desktop hybrid.
I don't mean to be a Scrooge but there was actually a recent statement from Apple saying that they have played with touchscreen iMac-type computers but the use of a large multi-touch pad perpendicular to the display is much more ergonomic. It would also require that Apple completely re-design the OS to be touch-friendly. That would mean 3 OS's. A fully mobile touch interface (iPad/iPhone), a touch interface that still contains the complexities of a full OS (purported touch-iMax) and the non-touch OS like on MacBook Pros. There would be WAY too much confusion for the common user. Also, such a device would cause confusion for consumers on which to buy, an iPad, TouchMac or Mac. Apple seems to love a well-defined line between their products so that you will buy ALL of them. A Mac for home, an iPad for the bus and and an iPhone for everything else.
Steve Jobs has always made tricky statements that require some reading in between the lines. This is a great article explaining some misleading quotes he's made in the past. http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2010/02/steve-jobs/
As for his statement about iMacs- imagine a stronger and more extendable version of the iMac G4, such that you can pull the display down to just above desk height, and face it upwards like a surface. Suddenly the ergonomics issue vanishes.
You'd be a bit of a fool not to realize that the reason Lion is *looking* more touch friendly, and behaving much more like an iPad is no accident. I must also say Final Cut Pro X looks touch friendly, as well.
I wouldn't put it past Apple to figure out a way to lay out a touch desktop experience that is simple as pie.
sorry, but the different mouse gestures get too confusing. i know people who can't even learn the four fingers swipe for expose. it is also a stupid idea to focus on such gestures as the typical mac/mac mini/imac user uses the mighty/magic or normal mouse, and it is a pain in the arse to make such gestures there!
also i think that a program should immediately get his own spaces-screen when in fullscreen mode and shall NOT go back when accidently clicked the ESC button. and oh, please: I WANT FULLSCREEN PHOTO VIEW WITHOUT USER INTERFACE IN IPHOTO!!!!
sorry, but the different mouse gestures get too confusing. i know people who can't even learn the four fingers swipe for expose. it is also a stupid idea to focus on such gestures as the typical mac/mac mini/imac user uses the mighty/magic or normal mouse, and it is a pain in the arse to make such gestures there!
I don't think the macs will be delivered with a mouse for much longer anymore..
And most of mac users use a macbook, with a trackpad...
As part of a trend that appears to feature multitouch gestures over mouse button clicks, the Exposé panel of System Preferences now presents a single hot key menu for each function (set by default to F9, F10, F11 and F12), with a list of options that no longer include invoking the various Exposé modes with the secondary or middle mouse button. Gestures for invoking Exposé features can be configured from the Trackpad pane.
WTF?!? For someone who doesn't use the Magic Trackpad (like me) that's a HUGE step back!
A Magic Trackpad to supplement an old laptop trackpad? Hmmm?
On my wish list?is a detached keyboard with an integrated trackpad for an iMac. Then, the Magic Mouse would serve as the supplemental precision pointer!
If they are driving the Touch Interface they better damn well include the bluetooth glide pad for everyone who buys a Mac Mini, iMac or Mac Pro.
Otherwise, expecting people to fork over another $69 for the magic trackpad to work with your vision I share is absurd.
Being left-handed though I use a mouse in my right hand I foresee the left-hand using the magic trackpad for the complex touch actions and the magic mouse for the precision work. But to not include both in the purchase of a new Mac to leverage these new features would be a hidden $69 to the cost of the OS.
Yeah I'm sorry but this Lion stuff is starting to look like a clusterf**k. Multitouch works different on Macs because you are not actually touching what you are seeing.
Let me repeat that. You touch a surface, which you then have to coordinate with what you see on a separate screen. Very different from iOS.
Apple is trying hard to bring everything great about iOS "Back to the Mac" indeed. But I think Lion will end up a little more convoluted than it should be and perhaps there is a big division between the OSX and iOS teams... This is a tough one to sort out.
Gestures work best, and remain reasonably intuitive, when you keep the number really small. Apple started off great with this but seem to have lost their sense of taste.
Two fingers means scroll - just leave it at that. There's nothing intuitive about a 2 finger gesture on an icon raising expose for that app. It's like an episode of Geeks Gone Wild.
Keep it simple - if you click on an app in the dock that is not running, it can start. If it's already running, then it can show you the active windows like Stacks does - consistent. Simple things done well, would win the day.
Yeah I'm sorry but this Lion stuff is starting to look like a clusterf**k. Multitouch works different on Macs because you are not actually touching what you are seeing.
Let me repeat that. You touch a surface, which you then have to coordinate with what you see on a separate screen. Very different from iOS.
Apple is trying hard to bring everything great about iOS "Back to the Mac" indeed. But I think Lion will end up a little more convoluted than it should be and perhaps there is a big division between the OSX and iOS teams... This is a tough one to sort out.
I'm afraid I agree. Apple did an immaculate job with the iPhone and it was what persuaded me to go iPhone, MobileMe and then switch to a Mac.
But Apple has not matched that quality of interaction on OSX and I think they are stuck. They need to sit back and think it through again. Look at the special keys on the bottom left of the keyboard, they don't have any meaning anymore - control clicks are not more controlling, the command key is not commanding, it's all a mess. The same applies with navigation - a 3 key combination for page down, etc. And there is little parallel between features accessible by keyboard and by pointer - you have to switch between them. I think they are transposing from iOS to OSX because they can see something is not right on OSX but they can't see what it is.
Instead of doing all these whacky things and talking about people needing cars instead of trucks, they just need to think it through and give us good, flexible, re-usable features, well-presented. At this point, I don't think it's even that difficult to improve.
Kiosking will be a neat way to go, if apple can build a industrial strength iMac/Monitor.
There is no reason not to move to a touch screen interface... fully eliminating the mouse/trackpad intermediate experience (It's more natural to touch a screen than it is to manipulate a mouse... easier to learn, and faster to master). The trade offs are the ergometrics, and most of that would be de-evolving from the 'computer workstation' mode to the 'human workstation' mode.
.
Hold your hand up to your screen for half an hour and see how your arm feels. It's one thing to use touch gestures on a horizontal surface and quite another to use them on a vertical surface. And if you emulate using touch gestures on a laptop screen, the gestures cause the screen to shake back and forth, so they'd have to engineer a way to lock the screen in the desired position (not a problem for the iMac). In addition (and even though Apple has "accepted" this for iPhones and iPads), fingerprints all over the screen makes it a little tough to do serious work. Marking text or navigating to a specific insertion point in a Word document is still faster and easier with a mouse.
What I see happening is that the touch pad will get larger and possibly turn into a screen of its own, although I don't know where one would rest their wrists if it got much larger than it is today.
As for the mouse, people who mainly surf the web, navigate to Facebook pages and send tweets won't need one. But people who still do serious work in complex applications creating spreadsheets, long documents, working in Video editors, Photoshop, etc., will continue to (want to) use a mouse. In spite of all the multi-touch gestures, I still go nuts when I don't have a mouse...it substantially decreases my efficiency.
Lion takes this a step further by renaming and enhancing Expose's F9 "all windows" mode under the new moniker Mission Control, which further integrates Spaces and Dashboard, showing both all open windows and all alternative desktops (including Dashboard) within any parallel Spaces being used.
It's still called All windows. Mission Control isn't mentioned anywhere in Lion.
I really like organizing my open windows that way. The convenience of tabs without having all the tabs get crammed into one window. They are also more logically organized when you can name the groupings. This would be a great expansion to Expose.
Comments
Sounds like my 2009 W. Macbook isn't going to get much, if any multitouch love :-( . Guess I'll need to purchase a Magic Trackpad...
A Magic Trackpad to supplement an old laptop trackpad? Hmmm?
On my wish list?is a detached keyboard with an integrated trackpad for an iMac. Then, the Magic Mouse would serve as the supplemental precision pointer!
Regarding Mission Control:
I've noted from videos, what I believe is a significant flaw in the UI design for Mission Control.
With spaces enabled, Mission Control displays a list of available spaces with thumbnails of open windows in them, while at the same time also displaying Exposé views of the same windows. This results in two proxies for the same thing on the screen at one time - an Exposé window, and a Spaces thumbnail. I think there should never be two on screen proxies for a single element at any time, especially when in this case, a Thumbnail is easily confused for a minimized Window. (I'm talking conceptually here, which is what UI design is all about).
Furthermore, it appears to support dragging and dropping across the two contexts, from Exposé into a Space, wherein the window shrinks down to the size of a thumbnail (note that as this happens, there are two thumbnails for the same window) before it is dropped.
This visual shrinking of the window (usually a cue for minimizing) is jarring, because it denotes a change of mode (from Window to Thumbnail) even though no such mode change is actually taking place.
I do not have any solutions for what I perceive will be a problem, but I hope Apple designers are aware of this, and work to solve it before the release.
Regarding Dashboard:
Also, I don't like how they're giving Dashboard its own space in an environment where fullscreen apps get their own space (I think that's awesome) because that causes Dashboard to feel conceptually like another app, which isn't what it is - it's a space for mini apps, not a large app - I believe it also detracts from the Heads up Display concept it currently employs (to great effect too).
Regarding gestures:
Personally, I map 4 finger gestures to system scope commands like Exposé (swipe down), Show Desktop (swipe up), Change Spaces (swipe left/right), and Dashboard (click).
3 finger gestures application scoped, for example in Safari, Back and Forward (3 finger left/right) or next/previous tab (3 finger up/down), or Open in New Tab (3 finger click).
2 finger gestures are reserved for context sensitive commands, like scrolling and zooming.
I believe such clear delineation of scope for multi touch controls results in orderly and predictable modes of control - making this the system default, as opposed to the rather arbitrary gestures currently implemented would result in a far more usable and discoverable interface.
(I understand that the settings can be remapped, but know that the default system setting plays a huge part in determining how the average user will end up using the computer.)
After 25 years, will Mac OS finally do something about only being able to access the menu bar on the main display?
If an app displays all its windows on a separate monitor, there is no reason not to display that app's menu in that space.
The thing is that the feature you are requesting is only maturing now. In Lion it may become a natural to have multiple menus showing (when appropriate).
No matter how much Apple, or Jobs himself denies it, I think it's pretty obvious that all of these gestures aren't solely mean for a trackpad. This is definitately leading to a touch enabled iMac, or possibly a monitor.
By Apple, after other(s) failed.
The question remains, will Apple be able to market such a big touch-sensitive display at prices within reach of the average customer? (MS's big-ass table costs an arm and a leg and only seems to exist so they can lure TV news desks into buying one).
No matter how much Apple, or Jobs himself denies it, I think it's pretty obvious that all of these gestures aren't solely mean for a trackpad. This is definitately leading to a touch enabled iMac, or possibly a monitor.
You understand that this makes NO SENSE by the laws of physics and the laws of physiology, right?
We, humans, CAN'T USE a touch monitor for desktop work --it gets tiring to hold your hand up very very shortly.
This cannot change. So, no. The gestures are for the trackpad and the touch mouse solely, and they will remain so. The only other option is a future Mac tabled/desktop hybrid.
But no touch iMac or monitor, ever. I mean, duh!
I don't mean to be a Scrooge but there was actually a recent statement from Apple saying that they have played with touchscreen iMac-type computers but the use of a large multi-touch pad perpendicular to the display is much more ergonomic. It would also require that Apple completely re-design the OS to be touch-friendly. That would mean 3 OS's. A fully mobile touch interface (iPad/iPhone), a touch interface that still contains the complexities of a full OS (purported touch-iMax) and the non-touch OS like on MacBook Pros. There would be WAY too much confusion for the common user. Also, such a device would cause confusion for consumers on which to buy, an iPad, TouchMac or Mac. Apple seems to love a well-defined line between their products so that you will buy ALL of them. A Mac for home, an iPad for the bus and and an iPhone for everything else.
Steve Jobs has always made tricky statements that require some reading in between the lines. This is a great article explaining some misleading quotes he's made in the past. http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2010/02/steve-jobs/
As for his statement about iMacs- imagine a stronger and more extendable version of the iMac G4, such that you can pull the display down to just above desk height, and face it upwards like a surface. Suddenly the ergonomics issue vanishes.
You'd be a bit of a fool not to realize that the reason Lion is *looking* more touch friendly, and behaving much more like an iPad is no accident. I must also say Final Cut Pro X looks touch friendly, as well.
I wouldn't put it past Apple to figure out a way to lay out a touch desktop experience that is simple as pie.
also i think that a program should immediately get his own spaces-screen when in fullscreen mode and shall NOT go back when accidently clicked the ESC button. and oh, please: I WANT FULLSCREEN PHOTO VIEW WITHOUT USER INTERFACE IN IPHOTO!!!!
sorry, but the different mouse gestures get too confusing. i know people who can't even learn the four fingers swipe for expose. it is also a stupid idea to focus on such gestures as the typical mac/mac mini/imac user uses the mighty/magic or normal mouse, and it is a pain in the arse to make such gestures there!
I don't think the macs will be delivered with a mouse for much longer anymore..
And most of mac users use a macbook, with a trackpad...
After 25 years, will Mac OS finally do something about only being able to access the menu bar on the main display?
buy an ipad. there is no such menu bar anymore.
Changes in Lion System Preferences
As part of a trend that appears to feature multitouch gestures over mouse button clicks, the Exposé panel of System Preferences now presents a single hot key menu for each function (set by default to F9, F10, F11 and F12), with a list of options that no longer include invoking the various Exposé modes with the secondary or middle mouse button. Gestures for invoking Exposé features can be configured from the Trackpad pane.
WTF?!? For someone who doesn't use the Magic Trackpad (like me) that's a HUGE step back!
A Magic Trackpad to supplement an old laptop trackpad? Hmmm?
On my wish list?is a detached keyboard with an integrated trackpad for an iMac. Then, the Magic Mouse would serve as the supplemental precision pointer!
If they are driving the Touch Interface they better damn well include the bluetooth glide pad for everyone who buys a Mac Mini, iMac or Mac Pro.
Otherwise, expecting people to fork over another $69 for the magic trackpad to work with your vision I share is absurd.
Being left-handed though I use a mouse in my right hand I foresee the left-hand using the magic trackpad for the complex touch actions and the magic mouse for the precision work. But to not include both in the purchase of a new Mac to leverage these new features would be a hidden $69 to the cost of the OS.
Let me repeat that. You touch a surface, which you then have to coordinate with what you see on a separate screen. Very different from iOS.
Apple is trying hard to bring everything great about iOS "Back to the Mac" indeed. But I think Lion will end up a little more convoluted than it should be and perhaps there is a big division between the OSX and iOS teams... This is a tough one to sort out.
That seems pretty neat.
BTW all this indeed promises a lot for iOS 5, or 6.
Two fingers means scroll - just leave it at that. There's nothing intuitive about a 2 finger gesture on an icon raising expose for that app. It's like an episode of Geeks Gone Wild.
Keep it simple - if you click on an app in the dock that is not running, it can start. If it's already running, then it can show you the active windows like Stacks does - consistent. Simple things done well, would win the day.
Yeah I'm sorry but this Lion stuff is starting to look like a clusterf**k. Multitouch works different on Macs because you are not actually touching what you are seeing.
Let me repeat that. You touch a surface, which you then have to coordinate with what you see on a separate screen. Very different from iOS.
Apple is trying hard to bring everything great about iOS "Back to the Mac" indeed. But I think Lion will end up a little more convoluted than it should be and perhaps there is a big division between the OSX and iOS teams... This is a tough one to sort out.
I'm afraid I agree. Apple did an immaculate job with the iPhone and it was what persuaded me to go iPhone, MobileMe and then switch to a Mac.
But Apple has not matched that quality of interaction on OSX and I think they are stuck. They need to sit back and think it through again. Look at the special keys on the bottom left of the keyboard, they don't have any meaning anymore - control clicks are not more controlling, the command key is not commanding, it's all a mess. The same applies with navigation - a 3 key combination for page down, etc. And there is little parallel between features accessible by keyboard and by pointer - you have to switch between them. I think they are transposing from iOS to OSX because they can see something is not right on OSX but they can't see what it is.
Instead of doing all these whacky things and talking about people needing cars instead of trucks, they just need to think it through and give us good, flexible, re-usable features, well-presented. At this point, I don't think it's even that difficult to improve.
Kiosking will be a neat way to go, if apple can build a industrial strength iMac/Monitor.
There is no reason not to move to a touch screen interface... fully eliminating the mouse/trackpad intermediate experience (It's more natural to touch a screen than it is to manipulate a mouse... easier to learn, and faster to master). The trade offs are the ergometrics, and most of that would be de-evolving from the 'computer workstation' mode to the 'human workstation' mode.
.
Hold your hand up to your screen for half an hour and see how your arm feels. It's one thing to use touch gestures on a horizontal surface and quite another to use them on a vertical surface. And if you emulate using touch gestures on a laptop screen, the gestures cause the screen to shake back and forth, so they'd have to engineer a way to lock the screen in the desired position (not a problem for the iMac). In addition (and even though Apple has "accepted" this for iPhones and iPads), fingerprints all over the screen makes it a little tough to do serious work. Marking text or navigating to a specific insertion point in a Word document is still faster and easier with a mouse.
What I see happening is that the touch pad will get larger and possibly turn into a screen of its own, although I don't know where one would rest their wrists if it got much larger than it is today.
As for the mouse, people who mainly surf the web, navigate to Facebook pages and send tweets won't need one. But people who still do serious work in complex applications creating spreadsheets, long documents, working in Video editors, Photoshop, etc., will continue to (want to) use a mouse. In spite of all the multi-touch gestures, I still go nuts when I don't have a mouse...it substantially decreases my efficiency.
Lion takes this a step further by renaming and enhancing Expose's F9 "all windows" mode under the new moniker Mission Control, which further integrates Spaces and Dashboard, showing both all open windows and all alternative desktops (including Dashboard) within any parallel Spaces being used.
It's still called All windows. Mission Control isn't mentioned anywhere in Lion.
It's still called All windows. Mission Control isn't mentioned anywhere in Lion.
They call it Mission Control in the trackpad/mouse preferences.Does All WIndows bring up various desktops, too?