Im not a patent expert, but most of what you've wrote is counter to what I've been reading.
I'd suggest finding some new news sources. You'll see why below.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigdaddyguido
....and the gallery function is actually related to android, not samsung specifically....
Incorrect.
Samsung have modified the stock Android Gallery app so that a partial swipe of a picture ends up with the picture bouncing back into place. The stock Android gallery does not act in this manner and thus does not infringe (a partial swipe will always result in moving to the next picture).
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacekid
I'm confused. I thought a previous article said HTC was suing Apple but this one says Motorola is suing Apple. Unless money has changed hands and has gone through all approval hoops, then Google nor HTC does not own these patents. Sounds like Google is getting ahead of itself.
The patents in question were apparently acquired separately from Google takeover.
The four patents cited in the new lawsuit were initially held by Motorola, but apparently passed to Google sometime over the past year before being transferred to HTC.
Apple haven't had the bollocks to take on Google as yet despite plenty of opportunity. With Apple being as litigious as they have been as of late, why haven't they attacked Google directly?
It seems it's Apple who lack any type of testicles.
Same ignorant comments from Google losers.
Google is the indirect infringer.
HTC, Samsung, Motorola are the direct infringer because they manufacture the actual devices.
It's better to sue the direct infringer. i don't have time to explain it. look it up.
I'd suggest finding some new news sources. You'll see why below.
Incorrect.
Samsung have modified the stock Android Gallery app so that a partial swipe of a picture ends up with the picture bouncing back into place. The stock Android gallery does not act in this manner and thus does not infringe (a partial swipe will always result in moving to the next picture).
Thank you, I had been looking for a good summary of the infringing part of samsung gallery app. I had heard from multiple sources that it was largely similar to the stock android version. Would you happen to remember where you saw your summary as I'd life to follow this source?
. . .but no where states google bought any patents from palm.
At least one of the patents given to HTC by Google came from Palm, so apparently they did purchase some. Like you tho, I never saw mention of it until just a few days ago. It appears Google's been flying under the radar with some of their IP acquisitions, and that's a shock with both Apple and Google moves getting a lot of press.
You could have avoided the AdHom's. They don't serve any purpose unless you meant to sound a bit juvenile. A little courtesy usually gets the same from others.
Wow you don't know what you're talking about do you? If it were Android that Apple thought infringed on something they would sue Google. In the case of Samsung the only patents that have been upheld so far are the picture gallery and one other. This is a stall tactic spun by the author of the article. The Motorola patent portfolio is one of the strongest in the industry regarding mobile electronics. This smacks of desperation seizing an opportunity.
Motorola's patents are mostly encumbered by FRAND meaning they are next to useless as long as Apple pays the licence fee, the same licence fee everyone else pays. Thats why no one is scared of them, all the patents that would help Motorola against Apple have already been licenced to Apple. Motorola are now saying the patents licenced under FRAND arn't licenced under FRAND, their trying to pull the same stunt that Nokie tried and failed with (if you look at the amount of cash Nokie recived then devide it by the amount of phones Apple had sold it's clear Apple paid them the standard licence fee).
Thats why Apple, along with Microsoft, has felt able to sue Motorola. Basically Motorola has come to a gunfight without any bullets. As for Samsung, well it's had 3 of it's products banned from Germany, it's had a suspended judgmeant aginst it covering the rest of the EEA while the German court works out if it has competence to extend the ban and it's already agreed not to sell them in Australia.
Motorola's patents are mostly encumbered by FRAND meaning they are next to useless as long as Apple pays the licence fee, the same licence fee everyone else pays. Thats why no one is scared of them, all the patents that would help Motorola against Apple have already been licenced to Apple. Motorola are now saying the patents licenced under FRAND arn't licenced under FRAND, their trying to pull the same stunt that Nokie tried and failed with (if you look at the amount of cash Nokie recived then devide it by the amount of phones Apple had sold it's clear Apple paid them the standard licence fee).
Thats why Apple, along with Microsoft, has felt able to sue Motorola. Basically Motorola has come to a gunfight without any bullets. As for Samsung, well it's had 3 of it's products banned from Germany, it's had a suspended judgmeant aginst it covering the rest of the EEA while the German court works out if it has competence to extend the ban and it's already agreed not to sell them in Australia.
Actually the claims that Motorola has no bullets is pushed more by Florian Mueller at FOSSPatents than anyone else, and his objectivity is lacking IMO. For arguments sake, just assume he's somewhat correct. It only takes one strong patent that's difficult to engineer around to create problems for Apple (or Microsoft for that matter), enough that they may decide to negotiate. IMHO the lawsuits filed by Apple and Microsoft don't mean they're convinced that Moto has no weapons of their own. I think they're intended to create uncertainty for Android. Since both Apple and MS have plenty of disposable cash if they lose, making it no big deal, simply slowing Android's advance using as many legal tactics as they have could be viewed as a success.
Actually the claims that Motorola has no bullets is pushed more by Florian Mueller at FOSSPatents than anyone else, and his objectivity is lacking IMO. For arguments sake, just assume he's somewhat correct. It only takes one strong patent that's difficult to engineer around to create problems for Apple (or Microsoft for that matter), enough that they may decide to negotiate. IMHO the lawsuits filed by Apple and Microsoft don't mean they're convinced that Moto has no weapons of their own. I think they're intended to create uncertainty for Android. Since both Apple and MS have plenty of disposable cash if they lose, making it no big deal, simply slowing Android's advance using as many legal tactics as they have could be viewed as a success.
If the lawsuits are simply intended to create uncertainty I would have expected many more by now. Yes both Apple and Microsoft have the money if they lose but I don't think that's a factor. I think Apple is collecting the easy scalps right now.
edit:Why do you think Florian Mueller isn't objective?
Apple hasn't had to bait anyone. Google did this by buying the patents. It's only fair that right to sue goes to them with right to license. And it is only fair that Apple get the case dropped and refiled by the correct parties.
Spot on. Until a merger is fully consummated, we don't know who leaves, who stays, what gets assigned to whom, which division owns what, etc. Everyone has to wait for the dust to settle.
Apple is simply saying that they want to know against whom they are facing off.
For all we know, Google could decide to drop the matter as well, since they will have their hands full for a while, trying to integrate 19,000 new employees into a company with 28,000 employees.
Google only gave (or sold) 9 of the patents to HTC. So HTC can sue based on those 9 patents and Google can sue based on the rest.
...and the cases where Motorola is suing?
If Google is giving their patents away it implies that Motorola now longer owns them i.e. have surrendered rights over them to Google, in which case Apple is right in disputing the cases where Motorola continues to use them.
Google's complaint in the Microsoft vs Motorola case, where they objected to the possibility of one of Microsoft's expert witnesses revealing "highly proprietary" parts of "open" Android was thrown out on the grounds they were not a direct party to the case.
Apple haven't had the bollocks to take on Google as yet despite plenty of opportunity. With Apple being as litigious as they have been as of late, why haven't they attacked Google directly?
It seems it's Apple who lack any type of testicles.
Look, we all know you and your ilk want Apple to fail so bad you've become obsessed with it. But it isn't going to happen and you need to get your mind right. Trolling on an Apple centric web forum won't get it done either. In fact there's nothing any operating system or hardware manufacturer or troll can do to make Apple fail. Apple's been in the driver's seat for several years now. It hurts you to accept that but it is fact nonetheless. So do us and yourself a favor. Close your account here and move on to some Android fanboy site where you and your kindred spirits can rant away about Apple failing to your heart's content. There's security in numbers and you can fantasize all you want about taking Apple down without looking stupid.
If the lawsuits are simply intended to create uncertainty I would have expected many more by now. Yes both Apple and Microsoft have the money if they lose but I don't think that's a factor. I think Apple is collecting the easy scalps right now.
edit:Why do you think Florian Mueller isn't objective?
The more I've checked on him, the more comments I've seen from industry folk that he is/was bankrolled by Microsoft. From appearances, Apple may now be one of his clients. There's been a single muted complaint about them not being more clear about their plans for supporting the dev's, yet he claimed Google was "evil" for the same thing. Add not a single positive comment about HTC, Motorola, Samsung, Google or any other company on Apple's hit list, and the bias becomes more likely. Apple might even have the high ground in these lawsuits, but to not find a single flaw or mistake on their part isn't realistic.
The victory in Germany is laughable at best because it's not one. The physical "desgins" are too similar... . The break neck speed this one gets overturned will be record breaking. Even now in Australia the judge has asked for sales numbers to prove that if any infringement occurred that harm was done.
The reason Apple doesn't go after Google is the Palm patents. Those are the big money ones and the same reason Apple dropped all mention of suing Palm when the Pre was released.
I guess its moot to point out that you sound like a handroid troll! Wouldn't care to confirm that would you?
Even now in Australia the judge has asked for sales numbers to prove that if any infringement occurred that harm was done.
Since you brought up Australia?
The thing I have to wonder is what kind of model does this Aussie judge use to determine harm? There would seem to be an awful lot of variables involved in this (economy, time of introduction, world growth rate of smart phones vrs Aussie rate, devaluing of Aussie currency, changes in sales patterns from feature to smart, infrastructure for handling bandwidth as smart phones sales have grown, etc.). Some of the itms I cite may or may not have much relevance but I bring them up because I think it is going to take a lot more than sales figures for the iPhone and just samsung (remember there are a lot of other phones that as a whole make up the Android community).
I think it is going to take someone with some pretty serious economics experience to untangle that and I think it is a red herring anyway. If violation of a patent only cause 10 androids to be sold it would still be a violation -- is she really trying to decide how much the violated these patents. I can't think of any other reason for this info.
Look, we all know you and your ilk want Apple to fail so bad you've become obsessed with it. But it isn't going to happen and you need to get your mind right. Trolling on an Apple centric web forum won't get it done either. In fact there's nothing any operating system or hardware manufacturer or troll can do to make Apple fail. Apple's been in the driver's seat for several years now. It hurts you to accept that but it is fact nonetheless. So do us and yourself a favor. Close your account here and move on to some Android fanboy site where you and your kindred spirits can rant away about Apple failing to your heart's content. There's security in numbers and you can fantasize all you want about taking Apple down without looking stupid.
It's you and your ilk that want everything non-Apple to fail.
GalaxyTab was only responding in kind to the BS that you spouted FIRST. Don't try and twist the facts around.
"Apple has filed motions to temporarily halt two of its lawsuits with Motorola Mobility..."
...is worded in a confusing way. By stating that Apple has filed to halt two of "its lawsuits," you imply that Apple is the entity that filed the suits, which is not the case. They aren't Apple's lawsuits; they're Motorola's.
Clearer: "Apple has filed motions to temporarily halt two of Motorola Mobility's lawsuits."
Comments
Im not a patent expert, but most of what you've wrote is counter to what I've been reading.
I'd suggest finding some new news sources. You'll see why below.
....and the gallery function is actually related to android, not samsung specifically....
Incorrect.
Samsung have modified the stock Android Gallery app so that a partial swipe of a picture ends up with the picture bouncing back into place. The stock Android gallery does not act in this manner and thus does not infringe (a partial swipe will always result in moving to the next picture).
I'm confused. I thought a previous article said HTC was suing Apple but this one says Motorola is suing Apple. Unless money has changed hands and has gone through all approval hoops, then Google nor HTC does not own these patents. Sounds like Google is getting ahead of itself.
The patents in question were apparently acquired separately from Google takeover.
http://www.macrumors.com/2011/09/07/...against-apple/
The four patents cited in the new lawsuit were initially held by Motorola, but apparently passed to Google sometime over the past year before being transferred to HTC.
Apple haven't had the bollocks to take on Google as yet despite plenty of opportunity. With Apple being as litigious as they have been as of late, why haven't they attacked Google directly?
It seems it's Apple who lack any type of testicles.
Same ignorant comments from Google losers.
Google is the indirect infringer.
HTC, Samsung, Motorola are the direct infringer because they manufacture the actual devices.
It's better to sue the direct infringer. i don't have time to explain it. look it up.
Same ignorant comments from Google losers.
Google is the indirect infringer.
HTC, Samsung, Motorola are the direct infringer because they manufacture the actual devices.
It's better to sue the direct infringer. i don't have time to explain it. look it up.
You don't have time to explain it? Would be nice if you could. I'll file this one in "unfounded bollocks" until then.
I'd assume that a software creator would be the one most likely responsible for software patent infringement.
Even if Apple to successfully defended itself
Typo parade continues...
I'd suggest finding some new news sources. You'll see why below.
Incorrect.
Samsung have modified the stock Android Gallery app so that a partial swipe of a picture ends up with the picture bouncing back into place. The stock Android gallery does not act in this manner and thus does not infringe (a partial swipe will always result in moving to the next picture).
Thank you, I had been looking for a good summary of the infringing part of samsung gallery app. I had heard from multiple sources that it was largely similar to the stock android version. Would you happen to remember where you saw your summary as I'd life to follow this source?
. . .but no where states google bought any patents from palm.
At least one of the patents given to HTC by Google came from Palm, so apparently they did purchase some. Like you tho, I never saw mention of it until just a few days ago. It appears Google's been flying under the radar with some of their IP acquisitions, and that's a shock with both Apple and Google moves getting a lot of press.
Same ignorant comments from Google losers.
You could have avoided the AdHom's. They don't serve any purpose unless you meant to sound a bit juvenile. A little courtesy usually gets the same from others.
Wow you don't know what you're talking about do you?
Motorola's patents are mostly encumbered by FRAND meaning they are next to useless as long as Apple pays the licence fee, the same licence fee everyone else pays. Thats why no one is scared of them, all the patents that would help Motorola against Apple have already been licenced to Apple. Motorola are now saying the patents licenced under FRAND arn't licenced under FRAND, their trying to pull the same stunt that Nokie tried and failed with (if you look at the amount of cash Nokie recived then devide it by the amount of phones Apple had sold it's clear Apple paid them the standard licence fee).
Thats why Apple, along with Microsoft, has felt able to sue Motorola. Basically Motorola has come to a gunfight without any bullets. As for Samsung, well it's had 3 of it's products banned from Germany, it's had a suspended judgmeant aginst it covering the rest of the EEA while the German court works out if it has competence to extend the ban and it's already agreed not to sell them in Australia.
Motorola's patents are mostly encumbered by FRAND meaning they are next to useless as long as Apple pays the licence fee, the same licence fee everyone else pays. Thats why no one is scared of them, all the patents that would help Motorola against Apple have already been licenced to Apple. Motorola are now saying the patents licenced under FRAND arn't licenced under FRAND, their trying to pull the same stunt that Nokie tried and failed with (if you look at the amount of cash Nokie recived then devide it by the amount of phones Apple had sold it's clear Apple paid them the standard licence fee).
Thats why Apple, along with Microsoft, has felt able to sue Motorola. Basically Motorola has come to a gunfight without any bullets. As for Samsung, well it's had 3 of it's products banned from Germany, it's had a suspended judgmeant aginst it covering the rest of the EEA while the German court works out if it has competence to extend the ban and it's already agreed not to sell them in Australia.
Actually the claims that Motorola has no bullets is pushed more by Florian Mueller at FOSSPatents than anyone else, and his objectivity is lacking IMO. For arguments sake, just assume he's somewhat correct. It only takes one strong patent that's difficult to engineer around to create problems for Apple (or Microsoft for that matter), enough that they may decide to negotiate. IMHO the lawsuits filed by Apple and Microsoft don't mean they're convinced that Moto has no weapons of their own. I think they're intended to create uncertainty for Android. Since both Apple and MS have plenty of disposable cash if they lose, making it no big deal, simply slowing Android's advance using as many legal tactics as they have could be viewed as a success.
Actually the claims that Motorola has no bullets is pushed more by Florian Mueller at FOSSPatents than anyone else, and his objectivity is lacking IMO. For arguments sake, just assume he's somewhat correct. It only takes one strong patent that's difficult to engineer around to create problems for Apple (or Microsoft for that matter), enough that they may decide to negotiate. IMHO the lawsuits filed by Apple and Microsoft don't mean they're convinced that Moto has no weapons of their own. I think they're intended to create uncertainty for Android. Since both Apple and MS have plenty of disposable cash if they lose, making it no big deal, simply slowing Android's advance using as many legal tactics as they have could be viewed as a success.
If the lawsuits are simply intended to create uncertainty I would have expected many more by now. Yes both Apple and Microsoft have the money if they lose but I don't think that's a factor. I think Apple is collecting the easy scalps right now.
edit:Why do you think Florian Mueller isn't objective?
Hardly.
Apple hasn't had to bait anyone. Google did this by buying the patents. It's only fair that right to sue goes to them with right to license. And it is only fair that Apple get the case dropped and refiled by the correct parties.
Spot on. Until a merger is fully consummated, we don't know who leaves, who stays, what gets assigned to whom, which division owns what, etc. Everyone has to wait for the dust to settle.
Apple is simply saying that they want to know against whom they are facing off.
For all we know, Google could decide to drop the matter as well, since they will have their hands full for a while, trying to integrate 19,000 new employees into a company with 28,000 employees.
Google only gave (or sold) 9 of the patents to HTC. So HTC can sue based on those 9 patents and Google can sue based on the rest.
...and the cases where Motorola is suing?
If Google is giving their patents away it implies that Motorola now longer owns them i.e. have surrendered rights over them to Google, in which case Apple is right in disputing the cases where Motorola continues to use them.
Google's complaint in the Microsoft vs Motorola case, where they objected to the possibility of one of Microsoft's expert witnesses revealing "highly proprietary" parts of "open" Android was thrown out on the grounds they were not a direct party to the case.
Apple haven't had the bollocks to take on Google as yet despite plenty of opportunity. With Apple being as litigious as they have been as of late, why haven't they attacked Google directly?
It seems it's Apple who lack any type of testicles.
Look, we all know you and your ilk want Apple to fail so bad you've become obsessed with it. But it isn't going to happen and you need to get your mind right. Trolling on an Apple centric web forum won't get it done either. In fact there's nothing any operating system or hardware manufacturer or troll can do to make Apple fail. Apple's been in the driver's seat for several years now. It hurts you to accept that but it is fact nonetheless. So do us and yourself a favor. Close your account here and move on to some Android fanboy site where you and your kindred spirits can rant away about Apple failing to your heart's content. There's security in numbers and you can fantasize all you want about taking Apple down without looking stupid.
If the lawsuits are simply intended to create uncertainty I would have expected many more by now. Yes both Apple and Microsoft have the money if they lose but I don't think that's a factor. I think Apple is collecting the easy scalps right now.
edit:Why do you think Florian Mueller isn't objective?
The more I've checked on him, the more comments I've seen from industry folk that he is/was bankrolled by Microsoft. From appearances, Apple may now be one of his clients. There's been a single muted complaint about them not being more clear about their plans for supporting the dev's, yet he claimed Google was "evil" for the same thing. Add not a single positive comment about HTC, Motorola, Samsung, Google or any other company on Apple's hit list, and the bias becomes more likely. Apple might even have the high ground in these lawsuits, but to not find a single flaw or mistake on their part isn't realistic.
http://techrights.org/2011/01/26/loo...msft-scoracle/
http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?s...10122054409107
The victory in Germany is laughable at best because it's not one. The physical "desgins" are too similar...
The reason Apple doesn't go after Google is the Palm patents. Those are the big money ones and the same reason Apple dropped all mention of suing Palm when the Pre was released.
I guess its moot to point out that you sound like a handroid troll! Wouldn't care to confirm that would you?
Even now in Australia the judge has asked for sales numbers to prove that if any infringement occurred that harm was done.
Since you brought up Australia?
The thing I have to wonder is what kind of model does this Aussie judge use to determine harm? There would seem to be an awful lot of variables involved in this (economy, time of introduction, world growth rate of smart phones vrs Aussie rate, devaluing of Aussie currency, changes in sales patterns from feature to smart, infrastructure for handling bandwidth as smart phones sales have grown, etc.). Some of the itms I cite may or may not have much relevance but I bring them up because I think it is going to take a lot more than sales figures for the iPhone and just samsung (remember there are a lot of other phones that as a whole make up the Android community).
I think it is going to take someone with some pretty serious economics experience to untangle that and I think it is a red herring anyway. If violation of a patent only cause 10 androids to be sold it would still be a violation -- is she really trying to decide how much the violated these patents. I can't think of any other reason for this info.
Look, we all know you and your ilk want Apple to fail so bad you've become obsessed with it. But it isn't going to happen and you need to get your mind right. Trolling on an Apple centric web forum won't get it done either. In fact there's nothing any operating system or hardware manufacturer or troll can do to make Apple fail. Apple's been in the driver's seat for several years now. It hurts you to accept that but it is fact nonetheless. So do us and yourself a favor. Close your account here and move on to some Android fanboy site where you and your kindred spirits can rant away about Apple failing to your heart's content. There's security in numbers and you can fantasize all you want about taking Apple down without looking stupid.
It's you and your ilk that want everything non-Apple to fail.
GalaxyTab was only responding in kind to the BS that you spouted FIRST. Don't try and twist the facts around.
"Apple has filed motions to temporarily halt two of its lawsuits with Motorola Mobility..."
...is worded in a confusing way. By stating that Apple has filed to halt two of "its lawsuits," you imply that Apple is the entity that filed the suits, which is not the case. They aren't Apple's lawsuits; they're Motorola's.
Clearer: "Apple has filed motions to temporarily halt two of Motorola Mobility's lawsuits."